|
California 2nd Amend. Political Discussion & Activism Discuss gun rights activism and 2A related political topics here. All advice given is NOT legal counsel. |
|
Thread Tools | Display Modes |
#1
|
|||
|
|||
Big 5 in Lakewood Spreading Misinformation
First thread!
I went to the Lakewood Big 5 today to buy some knives and ended up impulse buying an M48 Mauser. All was good until the manager told me that California law states that all guns must be locked in your house. I told him that was not correct and there is no such law in California, to which he replies "Have you talked to the DOJ or ATF, because I have, and that is what they told me." I told him that I follow what the law says, not what someone tells me and that he should do the same before spreading misinformation to customers. He had a smug attitude, one that screamed know it all, and refused to listen to reason. He said that LEOs can confiscate your guns from your home if they are unlocked. I asked if he can state a specific penal code pertaining to his claim. He could not and kept resorting to his claim that the ATF says so. I wasn't sure whether to cancel my purchase, keep arguing with him, or what. The M48 was in pretty good condition so I went forward with the purchase and figured it wasn't the rifle's fault that the management at Big 5 spreads misinformation, but it will probably be my last purchase at this location. My question is, what do you guys do when an FFL spreads BS about firearm laws? Should I print this out: Link and bring it to him? The closest section I can find that relates to his claim is on page 48 "Safe Handling and Storage of Firearms" - Children’s Firearm Accident Prevention Act of 1991, which does not make it illegal to have unlocked firearms when a minor is present. This law is only punishable when a "child improperly uses it." Am I interpreting this correctly? Last edited by matt85; 11-18-2012 at 5:05 PM.. |
#3
|
||||
|
||||
If someone honestly doesn't know and will listen I will attempt to aid them and educate them with whatever tools and literature I can.
If they are a smug know it all, I give them 1 chance and if they blow it, their words become meaningless to me and I give no aid nor do I attempt to correct them.
__________________
Custom made Tail Gunner Trailer Hitch for sale. http://www.calguns.net/calgunforum/s...php?p=17820185 "Hokey religions and ancient weapons are no match for a good blaster at your side kid" -Han Solo "A dull knife is as useless as the man who would dare carry it" |
#4
|
|||
|
|||
All i can say is this: When i buy a firearm from someone i am not going there expecting them to be a firearms law expert. They can tell me what ever they want. I don't have to listen to it, get upset about it or angry about it. I go there to buy a gun and that's it. I think its great that Big 5 even sells guns in this state. You can't expect everyone to know every thing. YES even the guy at the gun counter at "BIG 5 SPORTING GOODS".
If they had experts working there, the guns wouldn't be so cheap as experts would demand more pay for their services. When you go to Big 5, smile, nod, and buy your gun of choice. JMHO |
#5
|
||||
|
||||
If the price was right, I can ignore the fine folks who work at the Big 5 type chains.
Like most Airline Ricket agents, they are not trained by their employers on firearm laws. They probably are given training on Federal Forms and the basics to keep Big 5 out of legal trouble in all US states This forum is a great resource to help knowledgable gun owners learn more and understand the 22,000+ firearm laws on the books. I would be more concerned on the headspacing on a vintage rifle purchased for under $200 from Big 5 than on the "laws" as explained by the employees. Many of the Big 5 rifles are packed in 50 year old cosmoline. They might or might not be safe to fire out the door. With the 50 year old cosmoline in the chamber, it is clear that no one has recently verified that they are in safe and working order. Enjoy your new firearm and politely nod at the idiots life presents..... Or fine a shop that specializes in the classics and give them your business Last edited by hermosabeach; 11-18-2012 at 5:26 PM.. |
#6
|
|||
|
|||
Thanks for the input guys. It irked me that a place that sells firearms would have such ignorant people working there, but it is Big 5 and I shouldn't expect them to employ experts. I'll avoid the legal talk with smug *******s in the future haha. This is my first Mauser and I'm pretty excited about it. Can't wait to get it home (after Big 5's 11 day waiting period policy!) and get the cosmoline off it and give it a good cleaning. Hermosabeach, I'll be sure to check the head space before firing it. I always do when buying a milsurp rifle. Thanks again.
|
#7
|
||||
|
||||
Quote:
__________________
My Opinion - Worth What You Paid For It... DO NOT Use Amazon Smile! Use Shop42A.com Quote:
|
#10
|
||||
|
||||
I try and give them correct information, if they don't want it then it is their problem. Arguing with morons is a lesson in futility.
OP you definitely did the right thing by saving that mauser from that moron.
__________________
Gun control is a 1" group at 500 yds! |
#11
|
|||
|
|||
Big 5 managers are turds. I got in a little debate with one over how many guns you can sell/buy. He was telling me to sell firearms you need an FFL, and if you do PPT you can only do a few rifles a month, and with that your asking for trouble. Man I wish I could show him the private firearms section on this forum! Let alone how many damn rifles I've sold in the past year alone!
|
#13
|
||||
|
||||
Lucky for you he came out of the Shoe Department to help ..
Oh..and WELCOME to CAL GUNS..!!!
__________________
May the Bridges I burn light the way. Life Is Not About Waiting For The Storm To Pass - Its About Learning To Dance In The Rain. Fewer people are killed with all rifles each year (323 in 2011) than with shotguns (356), hammers and clubs (496), and hands and feet (728). Last edited by Oceanbob; 11-18-2012 at 6:16 PM.. Reason: Welcome |
#14
|
|||
|
|||
I almost purchased the Umarex Hk-Walther Mp5-22 from them yesterday.
Decided to look around other Big 5 stores because the only one they had was gouged on the fake suppressor. Honestly when those guys talk about bs , I just ignore them and buy my stuff.
__________________
|
#16
|
||||
|
||||
Probably the best you can do is to prefer FFLs where the level of misinformation is lower.
You did with that manager all that you could; no point in talking to a wall. At some point I'd like to see some kind of certification organization that trains FFLs and their staff, and features the "good guys" prominently in advertising and neat little stickers on the entry doors. ......
__________________
ARCHIVED Calguns Foundation Wiki here: http://web.archive.org/web/201908310...itle=Main_Page "The object of life is not to be on the side of the majority, but to escape finding oneself in the ranks of the insane."Ann Althouse: “Begin with the hypothesis that what they did is what they wanted to do. If they postured that they wanted to do something else, regard that as a con. Work from there. The world will make much more sense.” Not a lawyer, just Some Guy On The Interwebs. |
#18
|
|||
|
|||
I was buying stuff ten yrs ago at big 5 in Daley City, there was a young African American gal be hind the counter & I mistakenly assumed she had no clue about firearms or the law...
She set me straight real quick, not everyone at big 5 or Wally world will be clueless - oh btw wally world in Reno are selling AR15's and so are big 5's .... awesome, eh?
__________________
NRA Life Member |
#19
|
||||
|
||||
What a mis informed moron
__________________
NRA MEMBER Originally Posted by ar15barrels Unscrew the lid. There is a foil seal there. Pull the seal off and screw the lid back on. Then you can squeeze the mustard and it will come out of the bottle.. Liberals are termites eating at the foundation of our constitution. Michael Reagan |
#20
|
|||
|
|||
Bain & Davis in SGV told me that I was not allowed to have ammo in a magazine, and the magazine in the same locked container with the handgun (not in the gun). I told them thanks for the advice, but I'm pretty confident with my knowledge of Ca gun laws.
Doesn't matter where you go... |
#21
|
||||
|
||||
The guy was obviously wrong but there is nothing unusual about someone else not knowing what you know. This site is great at making us super geniuses in the gun world. Sometimes I feel like us gun people turn into this guy:
Clearly you must know that the laws state.... I know I at least resemble him
__________________
The fox knows many things, but the hedgehog knows one big thing |
#22
|
||||
|
||||
Quote:
__________________
|
#23
|
||||
|
||||
Quote:
__________________
(\__/) (='.'=) (")_(") Copy and paste this bunny into your signature to help him gain world domination.!!! |
#24
|
|||
|
|||
So you're saying that Cerritos and the Traffic Circle stores are better? I work 2 blocks from the El Segundo HQ store - and it isn't any better there.
I won't buy a gun from Big5 - Ammo Brothers and Turner's have always been more than willing to match or beat any sale price I've found at Big5. Not that I'd want to take advice from those stores either. |
#25
|
||||
|
||||
I guess you're not married. If you were, you'd be equipped to handle a situation like that. Here's a hint: never, ever, ever try to be right if you want to get what you're looking for.
__________________
NRA Benefactor Member |
#27
|
||||
|
||||
did he just volunteer up that tidbit of misinformation all on his own, or, was there some convesation which lead up to him offering his 'expertise?'
i generally walk in, tell them which firearm im interested in buying, let them do their thing, and im done...that goes for any LGS if i have any questions about MY firearms, or their purchase, i'll do my own research before I step foot in the store
__________________
|
#28
|
||||
|
||||
We cannot expect a dealer to know all the laws. They don't. We don't know all the laws. Not even the DOJ and ATF know all their own laws. (Police, prosecutors, defenders, and judges don't know the laws. They will tell you their version of it, which is usually how they want the law interpreted).
Like TeddyBallgame has just said: "I'll do my own research before I set foot in the store." Good advice.
__________________
It doesn't matter how scary, ugly, uncomfortable, or inconvenient self defense can be. Like it or not, you will never, ever be relieved of your duty and responsibility to defend your life, your family, your country and your freedom. How much ammo do I need? Enough to last me the rest of my life, and then lot more for later. The government does not come knocking at your door. It comes knocking down your door. |
#30
|
||||
|
||||
I would really give him a piece of my mind, after I picked my gun up, and listen attentively and smile like the dummy he is until then.
Did he let you file the safe affadavit? It used to be that Century (CAI) from which Big 5 gets all its guns, headspaced everything. They may still. I have never fired a new surplus rifle without using a glove with my head under the table, just for sure.
__________________
*REMOVE THIS PART BEFORE POSTING* |
#31
|
|||
|
|||
Quote:
Last edited by matt85; 11-19-2012 at 9:34 AM.. |
#32
|
|||
|
|||
Quote:
|
#33
|
||||
|
||||
Welcome to Calguns. I agree with those saying you can't expect much from Big-5, you know what to expect going to a store like this. I bought two 870's last year during a Black Friday sale at a local Big-5. While chit-chatting with the sales guy he asked me what I was going to be using them for, and I mentioned that I'd be using the 12g and my g/f would be using the 20g, to which he replied that they had to refuse the sale of the 20g as a straw purchase. I argued with him for awhile telling him that they would both be mine, in my possession and in my safe, that I just wanted something she could use, but he said they couldn't sell it. I was trying to buy them both on the same DROS, and I asked if I could just DROS them separately, or come in the next day or something to buy the 20g. He told me that since I had made the comment that she would be using the 20g that they could never sell one to me, basically I was banned for life from buying that specific gun from that store. Ridiculous. I also saw this same guy at another time and I told him it was nice that Big-5 was selling BB AR's, he told me they only just started carrying them because their had been no demand for them before...
I will say that when calling their customer service line they were very helpful and seemed pretty knowledgable. They told the store to allow the sale.
__________________
There are some who call me....Tim? |
#35
|
||||
|
||||
Quote:
For rifles, it's one or the other, not both. And no, it need not be locked for transport, unless you are going through a school zone. In the trunk of your car will cover that. See the wiki -- http://wiki.calgunsfoundation.org/Bu...es.2C_and_Laws
__________________
ARCHIVED Calguns Foundation Wiki here: http://web.archive.org/web/201908310...itle=Main_Page "The object of life is not to be on the side of the majority, but to escape finding oneself in the ranks of the insane."Ann Althouse: “Begin with the hypothesis that what they did is what they wanted to do. If they postured that they wanted to do something else, regard that as a con. Work from there. The world will make much more sense.” Not a lawyer, just Some Guy On The Interwebs. Last edited by Librarian; 11-19-2012 at 11:10 AM.. |
#36
|
||||
|
||||
Quote:
__________________
Quote:
|
#37
|
||||
|
||||
CA gun law ignorance and mis-information (I prefer to save FUD for intentional lying) is rampant among FFL's and their employees. The truth of the matter is all you really need from them is someone who can execute the transaction paperwork and computer input sufficiently to complete your purchase. I don't care what the hell they say or talk about while they do that, I haven't met anyone working at Big 5 that I care to engage in a meaningful conversation.
Now, if they are botching up the transaction so that I get screwed (I don't care how screwed up their paperwork ends up - not my problem), then we have a problem. The lock/safe thing is so mis-understood and I have seen nearly every possible way of screwing it up. I've been sold a lock for 1 cent for a 10-22 & yes I have a safe because "that's the way we do all of them" (Not Big 5, a very well known and respected range/FFL/gun store in the Bay Area) As for Big 5, I have actually had good luck getting transactions completed and even had them receive a replacement rifle from Sig without charging me any FFL fee. A phone call to their customer service seems to get things on track pretty quickly. Just my experience, YMMV.
__________________
"As soon as we burn 'em," Chinn said, "more come in." Ignatius Chinn, a FORMER veteran firearms agent. CONTRA COSTA TIMES 03/04/2008 "please guys please no ridiculous offers....Im a girl, not an idiot" Mistisa242 |
#38
|
|||
|
|||
Meh, why you wasted time trying to convince him, and are still worrying about it, are both beyond me.
Like Ron White says, "you can be right, or you can be happy". At the end of the day, does the fact that this employee has a different view really matter to you? Now, before you get all Hough and mighty, and start quoting PC, hear me out... Is it possible that he really did speak with DOJ? Yes, it is. Is it really possible that the same DOJ gave him their opinion, rather than quote PC? Yes, it is. Given all of the retail items that he needs to manage, do you really think they make enough $ on milsurp guns to spend all day combing cgn, DOJ websites, etc, mining them for pertinent PC that is relative to only about 2% of gross sales? Highly doubt it. I highly recommend that you spend some time, pull together the relevant info and pc. Once collected, go and give it to him, in the spirit of cooperation, that you pave the way for those who follow you. Or, just complain about it here. Your choice. |
#39
|
|||
|
|||
Quote:
|
Thread Tools | |
Display Modes | |
|
|