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California 2nd Amend. Political Discussion & Activism Discuss gun rights activism and 2A related political topics here. All advice given is NOT legal counsel. |
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#1
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Audit my idea re: rocket launchers
I'm looking for the legal opinions of the lawyer-minded folks here on Calguns. I came across this thread yesterday: http://www.calguns.net/calgunforum/s...=1#post9732474
I'd very much like one for the single unashamed reason of the "cool" factor. However, after doing some research into acquiring the ammunition, I realized the supply is very limited and financially prohibitive. So that got me thinking about my own idea: What I'd like to build is a single shot 12 gauge shotgun with a full length 18" barrel that resides inside a demilled at-4 rocket launcher shell with an overall length >26", with the intention of firing 12 gauge incendiary slugs such as these. Anything that you guys see as being illegal with this set up? Also, before I get anyone trying to spread FUD, 12301(a)(1) exempts shotgun ammo from tracer or incendiary prohibitions. |
#4
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You can own a launcher all day, just the live rounds that are a can of worms.
IIRC the DoJ DD permit is even shall issue, I've been lusting after an RPG7 and a sub caliber trainer for years. |
#5
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It wouldn't be a zip gun because there is a tax exemption from Section 4181 and Subchapters F (commencing with Section 4216) and G (commencing with Section 4221) of Chapter 32 of Title 26 of the United States Code.
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#6
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Thats only if you paid a tax on it (if it were registered as NFA, which AOW is possible here in california, but DD is not)
AJAX didn't run into this issue because he made a "not-a-gun" by making something can can only fire emergency signaling flares. As soon as you make it 12ga you run into all kinds of more complex things. |
#7
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http://www.gunauction.com/buy/110497...er-w-2fo-scope |
#9
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I believe that the ammo would fall within the permit. The thing is, the permit costs more per item in your collection. So, if you have a collection of DDs and DD classified ammo, it's going to cost you a pretty penny every year.
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NRA Certified Pistol, Rifle, Shotgun and Metallic Cartridge Reloading Instructor California DOJ Certified Fingerprint Roller Ventura County approved CCW Instructor Utah CCW Instructor Offering low cost multi state CCW, private basic shooting and reloading classes for calgunners. CCW SAFE MEMBERSHIPS HERE KM6WLV |
#10
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Don't recollect which countries produced them, but there are OEM dummy rockets that conceal a single shot 9mm. |
#11
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#12
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Has the DOJ opined they consider the training rounds DDs instead of signaling devices like the ATF considers them?
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#14
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What if you just put an existing single shot shotgun of some sort INSIDE the rocket tube? The tube just becomes an accessory stock
It's not a zip gun- it's a perfectly legal gun inside a fluffed up housing. The incendiary rounds sound illegal as hell to me though. -Dave |
#16
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We have some contacts at Saab-Bofors, so I bet they might be able to locate a bunch of used AT4s. If they are not DDs, then I would think they should be easily importable. If they are easy enough to import, then it would not be hard to create a 12 gauge insert and bring this to market as a transferable firearm with an 07/FFL.
It is interesting if the DD permit is "shall issue." That might make it worthwhile to upgrade to an 09/FFL. We have a half dozen legal projects in process already. Now this comes up! It looks like we'll have to do a bit more research!!! Compliments to Ajax for bringing this up!
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www.franklinarmory.com info@franklinarmory.com ONLINE STORE: http://franklinarmory.com Franklin Armory - Manufacturer of Quality, California Legal AR's, the F17 Series rimfire rifles in 17 WSM, the Drop-in Fixed Magazine (DFM), and the CA7, CA11, and CA12 Rostered AR Pistols! |
#17
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(1)Any projectile containing any explosive or incendiary material or any other chemical substance, including, but not limited to, that which is commonly known as tracer or incendiary ammunition, except tracer ammunition manufactured for use in shotguns. per Jason Davis, that shall issue DD collector's permit does NOT allow for you to use the DD, just to collect it. So, I'm not sure how much demand you'd have for DD's that nobody can actually use in CA.
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Jack Do you want an AOW or C&R SBS/SBR in CA? No posts of mine are to be construed as legal advice, which can only be given by a lawyer. |
#18
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Think of it as cheap life insurance. Why not have (I mean collect) a legal DD in the safe?
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www.franklinarmory.com info@franklinarmory.com ONLINE STORE: http://franklinarmory.com Franklin Armory - Manufacturer of Quality, California Legal AR's, the F17 Series rimfire rifles in 17 WSM, the Drop-in Fixed Magazine (DFM), and the CA7, CA11, and CA12 Rostered AR Pistols! |
#19
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#20
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May all your enemies be on full-auto Jeff Cooper
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#21
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I would think that just getting a used tube would be cheaper than the training model -- you're going to have to reinvent the wheel with the firing mechanism anyway, and mechanically the trainers are crap. Even if you got the appropriate DD permit, your DA would probably charge you under [whatever 12020(c)(9) turned into] as if it was a camouflaging firearm container. After all, they are OD green. Plus, it would be an operable shotgun concealed inside an inert milsurp novelty.
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Nationwide Master List of Current 2A Cases, courtesy of Al Norris @ TFL. Reloading Clubs: SF, East Bay Case Status: Peña v. Cid (Handgun Roster). SF v. 44Mag (Mag Parts Kits). Bauer v. Harris (DROS Fees). Davis v. LA (CCW policy). Jackson v. SF (Ammo/Storage). Teixeira (FFL Zoning). First Unitarian v. NSA (Privacy). Silvester (Waiting Period). Schoepf (DROS Delay). Haynie (AW ban). SFVPOA v. SF (10+ mag possession ban). Bear in Public: Drake (3CA); Moore (7CA); Richards, Peruta, McKay (9CA). |
#22
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The California Code of regulations actually has a lot of info on the 'collectors' DD permit. In fact, it states that a good cause to be issued this permit is collection of a DD. (Perhaps that causes them to be less subjective with issuing, hence the rumors of shall issues)
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You think you know, but you have no idea. The information posted here is not legal advice. If you seek legal advice hire an attorney who is familiar with all the facts of your case. Last edited by lorax3; 11-18-2012 at 5:06 PM.. |
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