Calguns.net  

Home My iTrader Join the NRA Donate to CGSSA Sponsors CGN Google Search
CA Semiauto Ban(AW)ID Flowchart CA Handgun Ban ID Flowchart CA Shotgun Ban ID Flowchart
Go Back   Calguns.net > POLITICS, LITIGATION AND ACTIVISM > National 2nd Amend. Political & Legal Discussion
Register FAQ Members List Calendar Mark Forums Read

National 2nd Amend. Political & Legal Discussion Discuss national gun rights and 2A related political topics here. All advice given is NOT legal counsel.

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #161  
Old 08-07-2018, 7:02 AM
Exdc's Avatar
Exdc Exdc is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2011
Location: Northern CA
Posts: 760
iTrader: 0 / 0%
Default Senate Intel Committee Report Alleges NRA as Conduit for Russia Influence Campaign

Quote:
Originally Posted by Deedle View Post
Well, the door is open to all: https://www.etrade.com



Welcome.


I happen to invest with Robinhood. But that's beside the point. You have to have disposable income to invest. Many people don't. Most people don't. We probably fall between those who do and those who don't have much, considering gun ownership also requires disposable income. I have made the decision to invest what little I have instead of buying more guns. Even working full time, or multiple part time jobs, a person making only federal minimum wage can't support themselves in most of the country, and if they can, there's nothing left over to invest. It's not because of laziness or Avocado toast, it's because wages haven't kept pace with inflation, and corporate boards care more about profit margins than worker turnover and living wages they treat workers like a disposable resource (see Amazon).


Quote:
Originally Posted by dustoff31 View Post
I never said it was OK, only that is wasn't a crime.



You see, words mean things. A poster accused the President of perjury, not lying.



It is a low bar. It's much like people who profess to support gun rights but vote for democrats. That's a lie too, but it isn't perjury.


True. I acknowledge my poor choice of words and replace the term perjury with lying.
__________________
Radical Centerist (That's me) Philosophy:
Quote:
Originally Posted by Unknown
"I want gay married couples to be able to protect their marijuana plants with guns." -Unknown (possibly Tim Moen)
Quote:
Originally Posted by Allhailflintlocks View Post
Gun owners need to be the new illegals - undocumented firearm possessors if you will.
Legislator "logic":
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dezrat View Post
Before long, the Feds via A.D.A. will probably require manufacturers to include Braille markings to accommodate blind shooters.....

Last edited by Exdc; 08-07-2018 at 7:06 AM..
Reply With Quote
  #162  
Old 08-07-2018, 7:11 AM
njineermike's Avatar
njineermike njineermike is offline
Calguns Addict
 
Join Date: Dec 2010
Location: CO
Posts: 9,809
iTrader: 1 / 100%
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Exdc View Post
I happen to invest with Robinhood. But that's beside the point. You have to have disposable income to invest. Many people don't. Most people don't. We probably fall between those who do and those who don't have much, considering gun ownership also requires disposable income. I have made the decision to invest what little I have instead of buying more guns. Even working full time, or multiple part time jobs, a person making only federal minimum wage can't support themselves in most of the country, and if they can, there's nothing left over to invest. It's not because of laziness or Avocado toast, it's because wages haven't kept pace with inflation, and corporate boards care more about profit margins than worker turnover and living wages they treat workers like a disposable resource (see Amazon).


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
If you make federal minimum wage at any job, you're stupid. They offer $15 an hour to start flipping burgers. They're hiring waste water plant operators here with no education or experience at $19 an hour with full public employee bennies. A plumber makes in excess of $50 an hour.

And those CEO's? They're hired and fired by boards, who are elected by shareholders. Know who owns those shares? People, union pension funds, other businesses, etc. Those entities want a return actual money they invested. Money they earned and could have used buying property, improving business infrastructure or giving a raise to someone. But they chose to buy into a company. That company has one responsibility: make money for investors. They arent in business to keep any employee happy. That's the employee's responsibility. Dont like it? We have a worker gap in this country. Boeing alone expects over 80,000 jobs not being filled at current rates in the next 10 years. A&Ps, pilots, etc.

In short, of you're working for less than you should, that's YOUR fault.
__________________
NRA lifetime member
2AF Defender member

When did I go from being a "citizen" to a "taxpayer"?

Jon Lovitz: ‘I can’t wait to go to a hospital run by the DMV!’

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kestryll View Post
Dude went full CNN...
Reply With Quote
  #163  
Old 08-07-2018, 7:18 AM
Exdc's Avatar
Exdc Exdc is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2011
Location: Northern CA
Posts: 760
iTrader: 0 / 0%
Default Senate Intel Committee Report Alleges NRA as Conduit for Russia Influence Campaign

Quote:
Originally Posted by njineermike View Post
If you make federal minimum wage at any job, you're stupid. They offer $15 an hour to start flipping burgers. They're hiring waste water plant operators here with no education or experience at $19 an hour with full public employee bennies. A plumber makes in excess of $50 an hour.



And those CEO's? They're hired and fired by boards, who are elected by shareholders. Know who owns those shares? People, union pension funds, other businesses, etc. Those entities want a return actual money they invested. Money they earned and could have used buying property, improving business infrastructure or giving a raise to someone. But they chose to buy into a company. That company has one responsibility: make money for investors. They arent in business to keep any employee happy. That's the employee's responsibility. Dont like it? We have a worker gap in this country. Boeing alone expects over 80,000 jobs not being filled at current rates in the next 10 years. A&Ps, pilots, etc.



In short, of you're working for less than you should, that's YOUR fault.


So nobody is supposed to work minimum wage jobs then... Lol? You're seriously proposing that anyone who CAN'T AFFORD TO WORK FULL TIME get a better job? Do you even realize how absurd and illogical that is? Because then who does the minimum wage work? And even if your diagnosis of stupid did apply, how elitist is it to believe that the average person, due to the genetics, poverty, education, nutrition that they were born with/into/had access to, doesn't deserve to have food and shelter because the only job they can get or are qualified for pays them less than half of what it paid their grandparents?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
__________________
Radical Centerist (That's me) Philosophy:
Quote:
Originally Posted by Unknown
"I want gay married couples to be able to protect their marijuana plants with guns." -Unknown (possibly Tim Moen)
Quote:
Originally Posted by Allhailflintlocks View Post
Gun owners need to be the new illegals - undocumented firearm possessors if you will.
Legislator "logic":
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dezrat View Post
Before long, the Feds via A.D.A. will probably require manufacturers to include Braille markings to accommodate blind shooters.....
Reply With Quote
  #164  
Old 08-07-2018, 8:35 AM
Offwidth Offwidth is offline
Member
 
Join Date: May 2018
Posts: 152
iTrader: 0 / 0%
Default

Minimum wage is for people of minimal abilities or minimal ambition. Everybody else can make more. There is no hunger. Poor people can get Medicaid and other public assistance. It’s available. There are cheap areas of the coI try to live. Not everyone should be entitled for a cheap house in a fancy neighborhood.
Reply With Quote
  #165  
Old 08-07-2018, 8:45 AM
theLBC's Avatar
theLBC theLBC is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2017
Posts: 673
iTrader: 1 / 100%
Default

once, a long time ago, i got laid off...
i had a job lined up...but not starting for a few weeks.

instead of waiting around to start the new job, and spending savings, i went to some temp job place that puts you to work someplace and pays you at the end of the day (this was around minimum age at the time...something like $5/hr.)

I just wanted some spending money so i could have fun without using my savings, until my real job started....

after one day at some plastics factory in Anaheim, i was offered a full time job at double min wage.

if you work hard, there are opportunities everywhere.
Reply With Quote
  #166  
Old 08-07-2018, 9:52 AM
njineermike's Avatar
njineermike njineermike is offline
Calguns Addict
 
Join Date: Dec 2010
Location: CO
Posts: 9,809
iTrader: 1 / 100%
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Exdc View Post
So nobody is supposed to work minimum wage jobs then... Lol? You're seriously proposing that anyone who CAN'T AFFORD TO WORK FULL TIME get a better job? Do you even realize how absurd and illogical that is? Because then who does the minimum wage work? And even if your diagnosis of stupid did apply, how elitist is it to believe that the average person, due to the genetics, poverty, education, nutrition that they were born with/into/had access to, doesn't deserve to have food and shelter because the only job they can get or are qualified for pays them less than half of what it paid their grandparents?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

The bolded makes less than no sense.

Plenty of people do minimum wage work. Overwhelmingly, they chose that life. Your bad choices are your problem, not mine. If you're raising a family in this country on minimum wage work, you're stupid. Entirely too many opportunities to make more exist.
__________________
NRA lifetime member
2AF Defender member

When did I go from being a "citizen" to a "taxpayer"?

Jon Lovitz: ‘I can’t wait to go to a hospital run by the DMV!’

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kestryll View Post
Dude went full CNN...
Reply With Quote
  #167  
Old 08-07-2018, 9:57 AM
Exdc's Avatar
Exdc Exdc is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2011
Location: Northern CA
Posts: 760
iTrader: 0 / 0%
Default Senate Intel Committee Report Alleges NRA as Conduit for Russia Influence Campaign

Quote:
Originally Posted by njineermike View Post
The bolded makes less than no sense.

Plenty of people do minimum wage work. Overwhelmingly, they chose that life. Your bad choices are your problem, not mine. If you're raising a family in this country on minimum wage work, you're stupid. Entirely too many opportunities to make more exist.


Anyone who is working full time should be able to support themselves and hopefully a family near the area they work. If we disagree on that fundamental principle, I'm not going to try and change your mind. That's the same reason I told Noble I wasn't going to waste my time. We apparently disagree about the fundamental characteristics of a good leader, and what it means to be "successful".


You have no grounds for the claim that most people choose to live in poverty. That's a BS myth sold to you by the people who benefit from the labor of poor people.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
__________________
Radical Centerist (That's me) Philosophy:
Quote:
Originally Posted by Unknown
"I want gay married couples to be able to protect their marijuana plants with guns." -Unknown (possibly Tim Moen)
Quote:
Originally Posted by Allhailflintlocks View Post
Gun owners need to be the new illegals - undocumented firearm possessors if you will.
Legislator "logic":
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dezrat View Post
Before long, the Feds via A.D.A. will probably require manufacturers to include Braille markings to accommodate blind shooters.....

Last edited by Exdc; 08-07-2018 at 10:00 AM..
Reply With Quote
  #168  
Old 08-07-2018, 10:08 AM
njineermike's Avatar
njineermike njineermike is offline
Calguns Addict
 
Join Date: Dec 2010
Location: CO
Posts: 9,809
iTrader: 1 / 100%
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Exdc View Post
Anyone who is working full time should be able to support themselves and hopefully a family near the area they work. If we disagree on that fundamental principle, I'm not going to try and change your mind. That's the same reason I told Noble I wasn't going to waste my time. We apparently disagree about the fundamental characteristics of a good leader, and what it means to be "successful".


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
First off, you're speaking to someone whose grandfathers were dirt poor farmers who grew up in the depression. My paternal grandfather lost his home in a winter house fire and the entire family lived in a railroad car through a South Dakota winter. The family farmhouse didn't have indoor plumbing until almost 1980. My grandfather supported the family raising chickens and selling eggs.

My father joined the army in 1965 because going to Vietnam was an improvement in his life. He left his home town with entire belongings in a paper bag.

My maternal grandfather was part Osage, part jew, and all poor. He joined the army because that was an improvement, too.

My generation is the first on either side to go to college. We're also the first on either side to not pick vegetables in fields as children.

I had my first paying job at 12 because my family didn't have enough. If I wanted something, I had to earn it. I put myself through college working FULL TIME JOBS in sawmills, factories, and anywhere else I could.

I know what can be done because my entire family came from nothing. I have no sympathy for someone who chooses to not take opportunities that abound in this country.
__________________
NRA lifetime member
2AF Defender member

When did I go from being a "citizen" to a "taxpayer"?

Jon Lovitz: ‘I can’t wait to go to a hospital run by the DMV!’

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kestryll View Post
Dude went full CNN...
Reply With Quote
  #169  
Old 08-07-2018, 10:24 AM
Exdc's Avatar
Exdc Exdc is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2011
Location: Northern CA
Posts: 760
iTrader: 0 / 0%
Default Senate Intel Committee Report Alleges NRA as Conduit for Russia Influence Campaign

Quote:
Originally Posted by njineermike View Post
First off, you're speaking to someone whose grandfathers were dirt poor farmers who grew up in the depression. My paternal grandfather lost his home in a winter house fire and the entire family lived in a railroad car through a South Dakota winter. The family farmhouse didn't have indoor plumbing until almost 1980. My grandfather supported the family raising chickens and selling eggs.



My father joined the army in 1965 because going to Vietnam was an improvement in his life. He left his home town with entire belongings in a paper bag.



My maternal grandfather was part Osage, part jew, and all poor. He joined the army because that was an improvement, too.



My generation is the first on either side to go to college. We're also the first on either side to not pick vegetables in fields as children.



I had my first paying job at 12 because my family didn't have enough. If I wanted something, I had to earn it. I put myself through college working FULL TIME JOBS in sawmills, factories, and anywhere else I could.



I know what can be done because my entire family came from nothing. I have no sympathy for someone who chooses to not take opportunities that abound in this country.


Thanks for sharing your story. I grew up helping my dad with his contracting business, and helping my mom clean houses for income(since around middle school). That was "chores". I know manual labor. My dad grew up working in sugar cane fields in the Caribbean, and my mom picked in the fields. My mom was one of, if not the first in her family to go to college and I'm the first to get a graduate degree. The cost of tuition is significantly higher than when my mom went to college. The wages are not. I have worked in the IT departments of both my undergraduate college and my university. I can't say I haven't recieved any financial help to attend college, because my parents gave me $500 for required textbooks one semester. I payed rent to live in the house with my parents since I turned 18 until I moved out on my own.

Not everyone has the opportunity to be raised by parents who instilled the value of work. Frankly a lot of people who are poor have had poor parents who were working out of the home so they didn't really get the opportunity to be raised by their parents. You can't blame their parents, who were just trying to put food on the table. Many of these people are also living in a country that treats them as "less" simply because of their skin color. It's literally easier to get a job as an ex-con if you're White than as a Black man with a college degree, at least in some parts of the country. (If you are interested, and don't feel like looking that up, I may be convinced to find the video/study). Having the name "José" instead of "Joe" can mean your job application is ignored. Don't bring up affirmative action BS because it's always someone's friend's cousin who didn't get into college because of some minority. Nobody is saying you or your family had an easy time. But plenty of people have it worse, and you're blaming them for circumstances out of their control.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
__________________
Radical Centerist (That's me) Philosophy:
Quote:
Originally Posted by Unknown
"I want gay married couples to be able to protect their marijuana plants with guns." -Unknown (possibly Tim Moen)
Quote:
Originally Posted by Allhailflintlocks View Post
Gun owners need to be the new illegals - undocumented firearm possessors if you will.
Legislator "logic":
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dezrat View Post
Before long, the Feds via A.D.A. will probably require manufacturers to include Braille markings to accommodate blind shooters.....
Reply With Quote
  #170  
Old 08-07-2018, 10:25 AM
njineermike's Avatar
njineermike njineermike is offline
Calguns Addict
 
Join Date: Dec 2010
Location: CO
Posts: 9,809
iTrader: 1 / 100%
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Exdc View Post
Thanks for sharing your story. I grew up helping my dad with his contracting business, and helping my mom clean houses for income. I know manual labor. My dad grew up working in sugar cane fields in the Caribbean, and my mom picked in the fields. My mom was one of, if not the first in her family to go to college and I'm the first to get a graduate degree. The cost of tuition is significantly higher than when my mom went to college. The wages are not. I have worked in the IT departments of both my undergraduate college and my university. I can't say I haven't recieved any financial help to attend college, because my parents gave me $500 for required textbooks one semester. I payed rent to live in the house with my parents since I turned 18 until I moved out on my own.

Not everyone has the opportunity to be raised by parents who instilled the value of work. Frankly a lot of people who are poor have had poor parents who were working out of the home so they didn't really get the opportunity to be raised by their parents. You can't blame their parents, who were just trying to put food on the table. Many of these people are also living in a country that treats them as "less" simply because of their skin color. It's literally easier to get a job as an ex-con if you're White than as a Black man with a college degree, at least in some parts of the country. (If you are interested, and don't feel like looking that up, I may be convinced to find the video/study). Having the name "José" instead of "Joe" can mean your job application is ignored. Don't bring up affirmative action BS because it's always someone's friend's cousin who didn't get into college because of some minority. Nobody is saying you or your family had an easy time. But plenty of people have it worse, and you're blaming them for circumstances out of their control.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Not my problem.

Also has nothing to do with the NRA.
__________________
NRA lifetime member
2AF Defender member

When did I go from being a "citizen" to a "taxpayer"?

Jon Lovitz: ‘I can’t wait to go to a hospital run by the DMV!’

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kestryll View Post
Dude went full CNN...
Reply With Quote
  #171  
Old 08-07-2018, 10:27 AM
Exdc's Avatar
Exdc Exdc is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2011
Location: Northern CA
Posts: 760
iTrader: 0 / 0%
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by njineermike View Post
Not my problem.



Also has nothing to do with the NRA.


Not directly. But it does have to do with defending a president who is actively working against the wellbeing of the majority American people and who won the election by way of Russian electronic interference (hacking) and with the help of known Russian spies. 🤷🏽*♂️


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
__________________
Radical Centerist (That's me) Philosophy:
Quote:
Originally Posted by Unknown
"I want gay married couples to be able to protect their marijuana plants with guns." -Unknown (possibly Tim Moen)
Quote:
Originally Posted by Allhailflintlocks View Post
Gun owners need to be the new illegals - undocumented firearm possessors if you will.
Legislator "logic":
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dezrat View Post
Before long, the Feds via A.D.A. will probably require manufacturers to include Braille markings to accommodate blind shooters.....
Reply With Quote
  #172  
Old 08-07-2018, 10:37 AM
njineermike's Avatar
njineermike njineermike is offline
Calguns Addict
 
Join Date: Dec 2010
Location: CO
Posts: 9,809
iTrader: 1 / 100%
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Exdc View Post
Not directly. But it does have to do with defending a president who is actively working against the wellbeing of the majority American people and who won the election by way of Russian electronic interference (hacking) and with the help of known Russian spies. 🤷🏽*♂️


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
No, he won due to getting millions of American voters to support him. The electoral college and all that.
__________________
NRA lifetime member
2AF Defender member

When did I go from being a "citizen" to a "taxpayer"?

Jon Lovitz: ‘I can’t wait to go to a hospital run by the DMV!’

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kestryll View Post
Dude went full CNN...
Reply With Quote
  #173  
Old 08-07-2018, 3:11 PM
RozaShanina's Avatar
RozaShanina RozaShanina is offline
Formerly carlosdanger
 
Join Date: Jul 2013
Posts: 516
iTrader: 0 / 0%
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by MrTokarev View Post
None of which shows anything negative about the NRA.

A gun rights org helped someone that they thought was a gun rights supporter get into the country.

Just more smoke and mirrors from the left to make the NRA look evil.

I’ve yet to see anything that shows NRA leadership handing over state secrets or anything else illegal.
Nothing to see here folks, move along now!

I am sure lots of American organizations have helped spies for enemy nations get visas to come to the United States. Seriously?

What exactly did the NRA leadership do to vet Ms. Butina? She made no secret of the fact that she was connected to Russian oligarchs. Couldn't they see the obvious?

What were the NRA leadership doing going to Russia anyway? Not once but several times, I believe. Why Russia? Why not Australia, or Japan, or Honduras?

How stupid do you have to be to believe that in Putin's Russia the government would even entertain the private ownership of firearms by the general populace? And how incredibly stupid do you have to be to not know that any "Gun Rights Movement" in Russia is sponsored by Russian intelligence?

No, the NRA leadership probably did not hand over state secrets to Ms. Butina. But they did vouch for her and introduce her to people who could hand over state secrets. If that is not betraying your country, I don't know what is.
__________________
“It was miraculous. It was almost no trick at all, he saw, to turn vice into virtue and slander into truth, impotence into abstinence, arrogance into humility, plunder into philanthropy, thievery into honor, blasphemy into wisdom, brutality into patriotism, and sadism into justice. Anybody could do it; it required no brains at all. It merely required no character.”


― Joseph Heller, Catch 22
Reply With Quote
  #174  
Old 08-07-2018, 3:13 PM
njineermike's Avatar
njineermike njineermike is offline
Calguns Addict
 
Join Date: Dec 2010
Location: CO
Posts: 9,809
iTrader: 1 / 100%
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by carlosdanger View Post
Nothing to see here folks, move along now!

I am sure lots of American organizations have helped spies for enemy nations get visas to come to the United States. Seriously?

What exactly did the NRA leadership do to vet Ms. Butina? She made no secret of the fact that she was connected to Russian oligarchs. Couldn't they see the obvious?

What were the NRA leadership doing going to Russia anyway? Not once but several times, I believe. Why Russia? Why not Australia, or Japan, or Honduras?

How stupid do you have to be to believe that in Putin's Russia the government would even entertain the private ownership of firearms by the general populace? And how incredibly stupid do you have to be to not know that any "Gun Rights Movement" in Russia is sponsored by Russian intelligence?

No, the NRA leadership probably did not hand over state secrets to Ms. Butina. But they did vouch for her and introduce her to people who could hand over state secrets. If that is not betraying your country, I don't know what is.
Because they dont have a huge gun manufacturing industry in Japan, Honduras or Australia. You really are dense.
__________________
NRA lifetime member
2AF Defender member

When did I go from being a "citizen" to a "taxpayer"?

Jon Lovitz: ‘I can’t wait to go to a hospital run by the DMV!’

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kestryll View Post
Dude went full CNN...
Reply With Quote
  #175  
Old 08-07-2018, 6:12 PM
Doheny's Avatar
Doheny Doheny is offline
I need a LIFE!!
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Posts: 13,741
iTrader: 3 / 100%
Blog Entries: 1
Default

Today happens to be Robert Mueller’s birthday. Happy birthday and thank you for your service!


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro
Reply With Quote
  #176  
Old 08-07-2018, 6:34 PM
Noble Cause Noble Cause is online now
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2013
Location: California
Posts: 2,475
iTrader: 0 / 0%
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by carlosdanger View Post
What is shocking is that anyone would be gullible enough to believe that private ownership of guns by the general public would be allowed in Putin's Russia or that a Russian "gun right' organization would not be a front for Russian intelligence.



I would not marry someone who lied to me constantly. I would not work for a boss who lied to me constantly. I would not vote for a candidate who lied to me constantly. Evidently you would.



Yup. I post that Trump supporters cannot defend Trump without referring to Hillary Clinton, President Obama or the Democrats and right on cue you throw in Dianne Feinstein (who I loathe by the way). LOL

Why do you I assume I am a "comrade" of David Hogg or that I am "happy" to see the NRA go down? I guess when you have nothing to support your position deflection and name calling is all you have. I have made my position on gun rights clear and I am diametrically opposed to David Hogg. As for the NRA it grieves me deeply that the organization through which I became acquainted with a lifelong love of guns and shooting might have sold themselves out to an enemy of America for money.

You provide Aid & Comfort to the Enemy by your continuing attacks on
the NRA, which are just Unsubstantiated Innuendos and your personal
negative opinions of them.

With your actions, you help support the Anti-NRA narrative that the Leftist
Mass Media keeps spewing out to demonize the NRA Any Way They Can.

If you don't want to be compared to Anti-Gun, Anti-NRA Zealot David Hogg,
stop attacking the NRA with Unproven Smears, otherwise your just
another part of the Anti-NRA Outrage Mobs whipped into a Frenzy by the
Anti-2A Media with their Propaganda spewing Talking Heads.

You refuse to give the NRA the Benefit of the Doubt, instead, you jump
to the worse possible conclusions each time, like your statements
implying the NRA is "betraying your country".

We have concept here in the USA, which you probably have never heard of
based on your constant rush to Declare the NRA Guilty of all kinds of
Malfeasance based on what the Anti-NRA Media told you:

Presumption of Innocence, meaning one is
considered Innocent until Proven Guilty.



If some officials within the NRA are PROVEN IN A COURT OF LAW
to have somehow deliberately helped the Russian Government
in some Illegal Activity, I will condemn them and take appropriate
action.


Until Then, I will give them the Benefit of the Doubt, unlike you who
have already decided to convict them based on your simplistic mantra
that the NRA is now somehow Bad.

If you were an NRA Voting member who voiced some criticism of the NRA
but still supported them overall, and voted to change the things you didn't
like, I would not have a problem with that.


Here is an article you should ponder:


Why It’s Total Bullsh#t You Don’t Join the NRA
Ammoland Inc. Posted on June 15, 2015 by Tom McHale
https://www.ammoland.com/2015/06/why...#ixzz5NY6S0Grn

Quote:
About 14 years ago, my wife and soulmate said something I disagreed with.

So I divorced her. As if that wasn’t enough, about a week later, my kid got
a detention at school. So I sold him into a life of slavery with Tusken Raider
Sand People. My actions may sound harsh, but I have principles.

There are certain issues where I simply won’t compromise!

What? You think that’s harsh? Or maybe ridiculous? You’d be right.
But that’s exactly the argument I hear from people all the time when the
proudly tell me they will never join the NRA again. Ever. So there.

Noble
Reply With Quote
  #177  
Old 08-07-2018, 11:03 PM
Cheburashka Cheburashka is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2014
Location: SF Bay Area
Posts: 217
iTrader: 5 / 100%
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by carlosdanger View Post
Nothing to see here folks, move along now!

I am sure lots of American organizations have helped spies for enemy nations get visas to come to the United States. Seriously?

What exactly did the NRA leadership do to vet Ms. Butina? She made no secret of the fact that she was connected to Russian oligarchs. Couldn't they see the obvious?

What were the NRA leadership doing going to Russia anyway? Not once but several times, I believe. Why Russia? Why not Australia, or Japan, or Honduras?

How stupid do you have to be to believe that in Putin's Russia the government would even entertain the private ownership of firearms by the general populace? And how incredibly stupid do you have to be to not know that any "Gun Rights Movement" in Russia is sponsored by Russian intelligence?

No, the NRA leadership probably did not hand over state secrets to Ms. Butina. But they did vouch for her and introduce her to people who could hand over state secrets. If that is not betraying your country, I don't know what is.
I'm from Russia (not a spy) and you can definitely own firearms, but it takes a lot of hoops to jump through and for handguns you only get to own calibers with non-lethal ammo, with long guns you can indeed own AKs that have been converted to semiauto.

Some of the rules I can remember off the bat are a psychologist evaluation, safe bolted to floor, and cop visit to verify the safe is present.

Haven't lived in Russia in a few years but there are plenty of gun enthusiasts, gun forums, ranges, etc.. it's wrong to assume all of them are somehow affiliated with the FSB or government.

Sent from my PH-1 using Tapatalk
Reply With Quote
  #178  
Old 08-08-2018, 9:52 AM
MrTokarev's Avatar
MrTokarev MrTokarev is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2012
Location: San Diego
Posts: 1,808
iTrader: 0 / 0%
Default

“What exactly did the NRA leadership do to vet Ms. Butina? She made no secret of the fact that she was connected to Russian oligarchs. Couldn't they see the obvious?”

Last I checked, the NRA is not a governmental organization and has no obligation to vet anyone.

It’s the NRA, not the pentagon. Seriously who gives a ****?

“But they did vouch for her and introduce her to people who could hand over state secrets. If that is not betraying your country, I don't know what is.”

Are you on drugs? Introducing people to politicians is not betrayal, it’s lobbying. That’s how Washington works. And of course you still have no evidence that anyone at the NRA thought she was an agent of the Russian government.

Of course you shouldn’t let that get in the way of your insane crusade against the NRA and Donald Trump. Two years of treason accusations and nothing meaningful to show for it.
Reply With Quote
  #179  
Old 08-08-2018, 12:48 PM
Offwidth Offwidth is offline
Member
 
Join Date: May 2018
Posts: 152
iTrader: 0 / 0%
Default

Бесполезно с этим долбоёбом спорить.
Reply With Quote
  #180  
Old 08-08-2018, 1:41 PM
Exdc's Avatar
Exdc Exdc is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2011
Location: Northern CA
Posts: 760
iTrader: 0 / 0%
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by MrTokarev View Post
“What exactly did the NRA leadership do to vet Ms. Butina? She made no secret of the fact that she was connected to Russian oligarchs. Couldn't they see the obvious?”



Last I checked, the NRA is not a governmental organization and has no obligation to vet anyone.



It’s the NRA, not the pentagon. Seriously who gives a ****?



“But they did vouch for her and introduce her to people who could hand over state secrets. If that is not betraying your country, I don't know what is.”



Are you on drugs? Introducing people to politicians is not betrayal, it’s lobbying. That’s how Washington works. And of course you still have no evidence that anyone at the NRA thought she was an agent of the Russian government.



Of course you shouldn’t let that get in the way of your insane crusade against the NRA and Donald Trump. Two years of treason accusations and nothing meaningful to show for it.


Nope, no Indictments of senior campaign officials. Nothing to look at over here. No admissions of guilt.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
__________________
Radical Centerist (That's me) Philosophy:
Quote:
Originally Posted by Unknown
"I want gay married couples to be able to protect their marijuana plants with guns." -Unknown (possibly Tim Moen)
Quote:
Originally Posted by Allhailflintlocks View Post
Gun owners need to be the new illegals - undocumented firearm possessors if you will.
Legislator "logic":
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dezrat View Post
Before long, the Feds via A.D.A. will probably require manufacturers to include Braille markings to accommodate blind shooters.....
Reply With Quote
  #181  
Old 08-08-2018, 2:14 PM
Offwidth Offwidth is offline
Member
 
Join Date: May 2018
Posts: 152
iTrader: 0 / 0%
Default

No, absolutely nothing remotely related to the campaign indeed.
Reply With Quote
  #182  
Old 08-08-2018, 4:53 PM
Noble Cause Noble Cause is online now
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2013
Location: California
Posts: 2,475
iTrader: 0 / 0%
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Offwidth View Post
Бесполезно с этим долбоёбом спорить.
Правда.
Но забавно наблюдать.
Кажется, что они страдают от эффекта Даннинга-Крюгера.




Noble
Reply With Quote
  #183  
Old 08-08-2018, 5:22 PM
Exdc's Avatar
Exdc Exdc is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2011
Location: Northern CA
Posts: 760
iTrader: 0 / 0%
Default

овец говорит о предполагаемой мудрости, но только фыркает.

Good thing you're practicing your Russian.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
__________________
Radical Centerist (That's me) Philosophy:
Quote:
Originally Posted by Unknown
"I want gay married couples to be able to protect their marijuana plants with guns." -Unknown (possibly Tim Moen)
Quote:
Originally Posted by Allhailflintlocks View Post
Gun owners need to be the new illegals - undocumented firearm possessors if you will.
Legislator "logic":
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dezrat View Post
Before long, the Feds via A.D.A. will probably require manufacturers to include Braille markings to accommodate blind shooters.....
Reply With Quote
  #184  
Old 08-08-2018, 5:28 PM
nick nick is offline
CGN/CGSSA Contributor
CGN Contributor
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Posts: 18,567
iTrader: 154 / 100%
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by carlosdanger View Post
How stupid do you have to be to believe that in Putin's Russia the government would even entertain the private ownership of firearms by the general populace? And how incredibly stupid do you have to be to not know that any "Gun Rights Movement" in Russia is sponsored by Russian intelligence?
Not nearly as stupid as someone arguing about things he knows nothing about. There are about 5 million legal gun owners in Russia, owning about 7 mln guns. To become a gun owner, one has to jump through hoops somewhat similar to the more restrictive states in the US or to European countries (for example, the guns are licensed and registered, one has to do drug and psych tests, and one has to have a safe). With that, most people who want to have a gun have one (or a few. I believe, the limit is 5 shotguns, 5 rifles, and 2 of those abominations they call "traumatic guns" that shoot rubber bullets. They're increasing it to 10 and 10, and you can have as many guns as you want with a collector's license), either legally or illegally.

As for the gun rights movement in Russia, unlike you I'm quite familiar with it and talk/meet with some of its leaders on a regular basis. While Russian intelligence keeps an eye on it, its leaders don't come from it or have any more ties to it than other Russians would. Everyone knows someone who knows someone who knows someone at the FSB, that's about it.

It appears you haven't updated your knowledge (for the lack of a better word) of Russia since the Soviet times. Provided, of course, you ever possessed it. After all, the lack of knowledge on a subject never prevented anybody with a certain mentality from arguing about it
__________________
"I would rather be exposed to the inconveniences attending too much liberty than to those attending too small a degree of it." - Thomas Jefferson
"Thou shalt not interfere with the Second Amendment rights of "law-abiding" citizens who want AK-47s only to protect hearth and home." - Paul Helmke finally gets it :)
Quote:
Originally Posted by SJgunguy24 View Post
Some people are so open minded, their brains have fallen out.


Selling a bunch of C&R and other rifles here: http://www.calguns.net/calgunforum/s...php?p=20061212

Last edited by nick; 08-08-2018 at 5:30 PM..
Reply With Quote
  #185  
Old 08-08-2018, 5:33 PM
Exdc's Avatar
Exdc Exdc is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2011
Location: Northern CA
Posts: 760
iTrader: 0 / 0%
Default Senate Intel Committee Report Alleges NRA as Conduit for Russia Influence Campaign

Quote:
Originally Posted by nick View Post
Not nearly as stupid as someone arguing about things he knows nothing about. There are about 5 million legal gun owners in Russia, owning about 7 mln guns. To become a gun owner, one has to jump through hoops somewhat similar to the more restrictive states in the US or to European countries (for example, the guns are licensed and registered, one has to do drug and psych tests, and one has to have a safe). With that, most people who want to have a gun have one (or a few. I believe, the limit is 5 shotguns, 5 rifles, and 2 of those abominations they call "traumatic guns" that shoot rubber bullets. They're increasing it to 10 and 10, and you can have as many guns as you want with a collector's license), either legally or illegally.

As for the gun rights movement in Russia, unlike you I'm quite familiar with it and talk/meet with some of its leaders on a regular basis. While Russian intelligence keeps an eye on it, its leaders don't come from it or have any more ties to it than other Russians would. Everyone knows someone who knows someone who knows someone at the FSB, that's about it.

It appears you haven't updated your knowledge (for the lack of a better word) of Russia since the Soviet times. Provided, of course, you ever possessed it. After all, the lack of knowledge on a subject never prevented anybody with a certain mentality from arguing about it


Thanks for sharing your updated knowledge. I mean that in the most genuine way. I still think the blind loyalty to Fox News and Trump around here is pretty frustrating, but that doesn't make me immune to new information.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
__________________
Radical Centerist (That's me) Philosophy:
Quote:
Originally Posted by Unknown
"I want gay married couples to be able to protect their marijuana plants with guns." -Unknown (possibly Tim Moen)
Quote:
Originally Posted by Allhailflintlocks View Post
Gun owners need to be the new illegals - undocumented firearm possessors if you will.
Legislator "logic":
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dezrat View Post
Before long, the Feds via A.D.A. will probably require manufacturers to include Braille markings to accommodate blind shooters.....
Reply With Quote
  #186  
Old 08-08-2018, 5:51 PM
nick nick is offline
CGN/CGSSA Contributor
CGN Contributor
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Posts: 18,567
iTrader: 154 / 100%
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Exdc View Post
Thanks for sharing your updated knowledge. I mean that in the most genuine way. I still think the blind loyalty to Fox News and Trump around here is pretty frustrating, but that doesn't make me immune to new information.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Well, frankly, Trump wasn't my preferred candidate by far (I voted against Hillary, and I'd probably have voted for almost anyone running against her), but I like him more and more as time goes by. He'll never be a likeable person (but he doesn't claim or aim to be one), but I like many of the things he's doing or trying to do far more than I liked what the 3 presidents before him tried to do or worse - did do. And, frankly, I find the whole scandal we're discussing disgusting, reaching, baseless, dishonest, and very reminiscent of the political infighting in the USSR. In fact, a lot of older Russians here in the US, the ones who lived in the USSR, find the Democrat rhetoric of the past 10-15 years very familiar - they've heard it in the USSR. Many of them are worried or outright scared.

The same goes for our media - I have zero respect for it at this point and I wouldn't trust them if they wrote that the sky is blue - there'd be a politicized lie and an agenda in there somewhere. There's CNN and MSNBC on TVs in my gym, and that led me to despise both networks. Looking at the others - they aren't much different. There hasn't been much integrity in journalism pretty much since its founding ("Remember the Maine!", anybody?), but these days newsies don't even pretend to have anything resembling integrity or lack of bias. In fact, it appears that in some perverted way they flaunt their bias, dishonesty, and lack of integrity. Not to mention the lack of knowledge on pretty much any subject they cover.

Sorry for the rant, I know we're talking about the Russians and NRA here
__________________
"I would rather be exposed to the inconveniences attending too much liberty than to those attending too small a degree of it." - Thomas Jefferson
"Thou shalt not interfere with the Second Amendment rights of "law-abiding" citizens who want AK-47s only to protect hearth and home." - Paul Helmke finally gets it :)
Quote:
Originally Posted by SJgunguy24 View Post
Some people are so open minded, their brains have fallen out.


Selling a bunch of C&R and other rifles here: http://www.calguns.net/calgunforum/s...php?p=20061212

Last edited by nick; 08-08-2018 at 5:54 PM..
Reply With Quote
  #187  
Old 08-08-2018, 6:05 PM
Exdc's Avatar
Exdc Exdc is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2011
Location: Northern CA
Posts: 760
iTrader: 0 / 0%
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by nick View Post
Well, frankly, Trump wasn't my preferred candidate by far (I voted against Hillary, and I'd probably have voted for almost anyone running against her), but I like him more and more as time goes by. He'll never be a likeable person (but he doesn't claim or aim to be one), but I like many of the things he's doing or trying to do far more than I liked what the 3 presidents before him tried to do or worse - did do. And, frankly, I find the whole scandal we're discussing disgusting, reaching, baseless, dishonest, and very reminiscent of the political infighting in the USSR. In fact, a lot of older Russians here in the US, the ones who lived in the USSR, find the Democrat rhetoric of the past 10-15 years very familiar - they've heard it in the USSR. Many of them are worried or outright scared.

The same goes for our media - I have zero respect for it at this point and I wouldn't trust them if they wrote that the sky is blue - there'd be a politicized lie and an agenda in there somewhere. There's CNN and MSNBC on TVs in my gym, and that led me to despise both networks. Looking at the others - they aren't much different. There hasn't been much integrity in journalism pretty much since its founding ("Remember the Maine!", anybody?), but these days newsies don't even pretend to have anything resembling integrity or lack of bias. In fact, it appears that in some perverted way they flaunt their lack of integrity and dishonesty. Not to mention the lack of knowledge on pretty much any subject they cover.

Sorry for the rant, I know we're talking about the Russians and NRA here


I appreciate your sharing your perspective in a respectful and clear way. While we disagree on several key points, I do dislike most "news" networks, though I prefer not to throw the baby out with the bath water, and rather to read between the lines. I am neither Democrat nor Republican, but I respect some people in both camps. We also agree that Hillary was not a good choice for president. One thing that really irritates me is that there doesn't seem to be an option for a party that supports human dignity and also the right to defend that dignity with the Second Amendment. It's either "I like guns and screw poor people and scientific data" or "I like big government and screw your ability to defend your rights". Where's the actual party that's working for the interests of the People? Then we have the NRA which is frankly in the pockets of the firearms lobby (more concerned with feeding fear to increase sales), and doesn't do a whole lot in terms of public education and actual outreach anymore. Where's the middle ground? And they back the party that gives handouts to the people at the top who don't need them, instead of small business owners. I'm tired of this broken system.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
__________________
Radical Centerist (That's me) Philosophy:
Quote:
Originally Posted by Unknown
"I want gay married couples to be able to protect their marijuana plants with guns." -Unknown (possibly Tim Moen)
Quote:
Originally Posted by Allhailflintlocks View Post
Gun owners need to be the new illegals - undocumented firearm possessors if you will.
Legislator "logic":
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dezrat View Post
Before long, the Feds via A.D.A. will probably require manufacturers to include Braille markings to accommodate blind shooters.....
Reply With Quote
  #188  
Old 08-09-2018, 10:32 PM
RozaShanina's Avatar
RozaShanina RozaShanina is offline
Formerly carlosdanger
 
Join Date: Jul 2013
Posts: 516
iTrader: 0 / 0%
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Noble Cause View Post
You provide Aid & Comfort to the Enemy by your continuing attacks on
the NRA, which are just Unsubstantiated Innuendos and your personal
negative opinions of them.

With your actions, you help support the Anti-NRA narrative that the Leftist
Mass Media keeps spewing out to demonize the NRA Any Way They Can.

If you don't want to be compared to Anti-Gun, Anti-NRA Zealot David Hogg,
stop attacking the NRA with Unproven Smears, otherwise your just
another part of the Anti-NRA Outrage Mobs whipped into a Frenzy by the
Anti-2A Media with their Propaganda spewing Talking Heads.

You refuse to give the NRA the Benefit of the Doubt, instead, you jump
to the worse possible conclusions each time, like your statements
implying the NRA is "betraying your country".

We have concept here in the USA, which you probably have never heard of
based on your constant rush to Declare the NRA Guilty of all kinds of
Malfeasance based on what the Anti-NRA Media told you:

Presumption of Innocence, meaning one is
considered Innocent until Proven Guilty.



If some officials within the NRA are PROVEN IN A COURT OF LAW
to have somehow deliberately helped the Russian Government
in some Illegal Activity, I will condemn them and take appropriate
action.


Until Then, I will give them the Benefit of the Doubt, unlike you who
have already decided to convict them based on your simplistic mantra
that the NRA is now somehow Bad.

If you were an NRA Voting member who voiced some criticism of the NRA
but still supported them overall, and voted to change the things you didn't
like, I would not have a problem with that.


Here is an article you should ponder:


Why It’s Total Bullsh#t You Don’t Join the NRA
Ammoland Inc. Posted on June 15, 2015 by Tom McHale
https://www.ammoland.com/2015/06/why...#ixzz5NY6S0Grn




Noble
So sorry you are having such a difficult time coping with reality.

Quote:
Originally Posted by MrTokarev View Post
“What exactly did the NRA leadership do to vet Ms. Butina? She made no secret of the fact that she was connected to Russian oligarchs. Couldn't they see the obvious?”

Last I checked, the NRA is not a governmental organization and has no obligation to vet anyone.

It’s the NRA, not the pentagon. Seriously who gives a ****?

“But they did vouch for her and introduce her to people who could hand over state secrets. If that is not betraying your country, I don't know what is.”

Are you on drugs? Introducing people to politicians is not betrayal, it’s lobbying. That’s how Washington works. And of course you still have no evidence that anyone at the NRA thought she was an agent of the Russian government.

Of course you shouldn’t let that get in the way of your insane crusade against the NRA and Donald Trump. Two years of treason accusations and nothing meaningful to show for it.
So I guess you write recommendations for people without knowing anything about them? Getting to know something about someone is called vetting.

No, I am not on drugs, I just don't believe everything the state sponsored media tells me. Introducing and vouching for someone who you know or should know is working for an enemy of the US is called betrayal of your country.

As far as nothing meaningful to show for 2 years of investigation, how about six felony guilty pleas and one upcoming multiple felony conviction. The Trump administration is the most corrupt administration in the history of the US.

Quote:
Originally Posted by nick View Post
Not nearly as stupid as someone arguing about things he knows nothing about. There are about 5 million legal gun owners in Russia, owning about 7 mln guns. To become a gun owner, one has to jump through hoops somewhat similar to the more restrictive states in the US or to European countries (for example, the guns are licensed and registered, one has to do drug and psych tests, and one has to have a safe). With that, most people who want to have a gun have one (or a few. I believe, the limit is 5 shotguns, 5 rifles, and 2 of those abominations they call "traumatic guns" that shoot rubber bullets. They're increasing it to 10 and 10, and you can have as many guns as you want with a collector's license), either legally or illegally.

As for the gun rights movement in Russia, unlike you I'm quite familiar with it and talk/meet with some of its leaders on a regular basis. While Russian intelligence keeps an eye on it, its leaders don't come from it or have any more ties to it than other Russians would. Everyone knows someone who knows someone who knows someone at the FSB, that's about it.

It appears you haven't updated your knowledge (for the lack of a better word) of Russia since the Soviet times. Provided, of course, you ever possessed it. After all, the lack of knowledge on a subject never prevented anybody with a certain mentality from arguing about it
Mein Gott, how many Russian troll are on this forum? You see I don't believe everything people tell me even though they claim to be experts like you. Here is a summary of Russian firearms ownership laws:
Quote:
Russian citizens over 18 years of age can obtain a firearms licence after attending gun-safety classes and passing a federal test and background check. The licence is for five years and may be renewed. Firearms may be acquired for self-defense, hunting, or sports activities. Carrying permits may be issued for hunting firearms licensed for hunting purposes. Initially, purchase is limited to long smooth-bore firearms and pneumatic weapons with a muzzle energy of up to 25 joules (18 ft⋅lbf). After five years of shotgun ownership, rifles may be purchased. Handguns are generally not allowed. Rifles and shotguns with barrels less than 500 mm (20 in) long are prohibited, as are firearms that shoot in bursts and have more than a 10-cartridge capacity. Suppressors are prohibited. An individual cannot possess more than ten guns (up to five shotguns and up to five rifles) unless they are part of a registered gun collection. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Overvi..._nation#Russia
Here is another summary:
Quote:
The bureaucratic procedure to legally procure a gun is complicated.

Any Russian choosing to legally own a gun is initially limited to a single shotgun, which is subject to a permit. That permit is only granted after a citizen undergoes background checks, investigations into their criminal history, neighborhood circumstances, mental health and invasive home inspections. They also submit to future snap inspections by police. Five years after receiving a shotgun permit, they can then buy a hunting rifle. https://themoscowtimes.com/articles/...he-state-52720
So Mr. Expert, tell me which state requires a drug and psych test, requires ownership of a shotgun for five years before purchase of a long gun?

Now lets look at the gun rights movement in Russia:
Quote:
U.S. gun enthusiasts live in constant fear of the federal government confiscating their weapons. For Russian gun owners, such a fear may be about to become a reality. On April 14, President Vladimir Putin, announced the formation of a new National Guard, and declared one of its key fuctions would be to control firearms.

"We are creating the National Guard to limit the circulation of weapons in the country," he told the Russian people during his annual "direct line" national call-in show. What wasn't clear was whether Putin was referring to guns legally owned by law-abiding Russians or to the stockpiles of illegal weapons flowing throughout Russia, fueled by the numerous wars on its borders.
Now further down in the article there is an interesting paragraph:
Quote:
Maria Butina is the founder of Russia's first gun rights advocacy group. A tall, red-headed Siberian native in her late 20s, Butina called the group "The Right to Bear Arms," and it now boasts 10,000 members.

While the government looks at ways of increasing public safety by reducing gun onwnership, Butina's movement argues the opposite is the only answer. When crime increases, they say, ordinary people should be armed.

"We know a simple truth," says Butina. "More legal guns equal less crime. If a country bans guns, only criminals have access to them. We believe in evening the odds for the average Russian."
https://themoscowtimes.com/articles/...he-state-52720
Did you catch that? The founder of the Russian gun rights organization is a person named "Maria Butina". Now where have I heard that name before? Who does Ms. Butina work for and who does she serve?

Before you claim to be an expert and call others names you might want to actually research the garbage you are trying to sell. But then again that's what you are paid for, isn't it?
__________________
“It was miraculous. It was almost no trick at all, he saw, to turn vice into virtue and slander into truth, impotence into abstinence, arrogance into humility, plunder into philanthropy, thievery into honor, blasphemy into wisdom, brutality into patriotism, and sadism into justice. Anybody could do it; it required no brains at all. It merely required no character.”


― Joseph Heller, Catch 22
Reply With Quote
  #189  
Old 08-10-2018, 3:33 AM
Offwidth Offwidth is offline
Member
 
Join Date: May 2018
Posts: 152
iTrader: 0 / 0%
Default

Dude. Do your have any capacity for critical thinking, or do you just parrot CNN?
Reply With Quote
  #190  
Old 08-10-2018, 3:34 AM
Offwidth Offwidth is offline
Member
 
Join Date: May 2018
Posts: 152
iTrader: 0 / 0%
Default

Sad thing is that people like Carlos do exist, and many of them vote.
Reply With Quote
  #191  
Old 08-10-2018, 8:12 AM
njineermike's Avatar
njineermike njineermike is offline
Calguns Addict
 
Join Date: Dec 2010
Location: CO
Posts: 9,809
iTrader: 1 / 100%
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Offwidth View Post
Sad thing is that people like Carlos do exist, and many of them vote.
The fact that he's supposedly old enough to be able to critically think and yet still can't is horrifying. He admits the woman started a gun rights group, and then says a representative of a gun rights group meeting other representatives of a different gun rights group is somehow suspicious.

Seriously. This guy is just clueless.


BTW Carlos, this is so much nothing the major media outlets arent even bothering to cover it, and you're using wikipedia as source material. My kid knew at 10 years old that wasn't a reliable citation source. Congratulations. A kid who can't even drive yet knows more than you do.
__________________
NRA lifetime member
2AF Defender member

When did I go from being a "citizen" to a "taxpayer"?

Jon Lovitz: ‘I can’t wait to go to a hospital run by the DMV!’

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kestryll View Post
Dude went full CNN...
Reply With Quote
  #192  
Old 08-10-2018, 12:28 PM
mshill's Avatar
mshill mshill is offline
Veteran Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2012
Posts: 2,811
iTrader: 1 / 100%
Default

Quote:
The Trump administration is the most corrupt administration in the history of the US.
That's some funny **** right there.
__________________
Quote:
The American Republic will endure until the day Congress discovers that it can bribe the public with the public's money.
Reply With Quote
  #193  
Old 08-10-2018, 12:45 PM
dogrunner dogrunner is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2013
Location: E/Central Fl
Posts: 100
iTrader: 0 / 0%
Default

What a crock of utter BS the whole of the 'witch hunt' truly is!...........Hellfire, we screw with elections worldwide............and in this peculiar instance there is truly proof of foreign influence..............BRITISH foreign influence in the person of bro Steele!

But I'm biased, being of Irish extraction (mostly), I gotta kinda look at the cross of St. George in the same light a Jew perceives a swastica...



The whole of the matter is just distracting BS.
Reply With Quote
  #194  
Old 08-10-2018, 1:20 PM
Noble Cause Noble Cause is online now
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2013
Location: California
Posts: 2,475
iTrader: 0 / 0%
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Offwidth View Post
Dude. Do your have any capacity for critical thinking, or do you just parrot CNN?
Carlos should apply for a job at CNN, he has the skill sets
Jeff Zucker looks for:















Noble
Reply With Quote
  #195  
Old 08-10-2018, 5:54 PM
dustoff31 dustoff31 is offline
Calguns Addict
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: AZ
Posts: 8,315
iTrader: 0 / 0%
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by dogrunner View Post
What a crock of utter BS the whole of the 'witch hunt' truly is!...........Hellfire, we screw with elections worldwide............and in this peculiar instance there is truly proof of foreign influence..............BRITISH foreign influence in the person of bro Steele!

But I'm biased, being of Irish extraction (mostly), I gotta kinda look at the cross of St. George in the same light a Jew perceives a swastica...



The whole of the matter is just distracting BS.
It is indeed. The worst part though is that this sort of nonsense is the best the libs can come up with.
__________________
"Did I say "republic?" By God, yes, I said "republic!" Long live the glorious republic of the United States of America. Damn democracy. It is a fraudulent term used, often by ignorant persons but no less often by intellectual fakers, to describe an infamous mixture of socialism, miscegenation, graft, confiscation of property and denial of personal rights to individuals whose virtuous principles make them offensive." - Westbrook Pegler
Reply With Quote
  #196  
Old 08-11-2018, 1:05 PM
Doheny's Avatar
Doheny Doheny is offline
I need a LIFE!!
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Posts: 13,741
iTrader: 3 / 100%
Blog Entries: 1
Default

Looks like Comrade Clarke left his Bedazzle pins home when he and the NRA leadership went to the homeland to get their orders. Butina’s arm around him is a nice touch. They got played big time.




Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro
Reply With Quote
  #197  
Old 08-20-2018, 1:46 PM
RozaShanina's Avatar
RozaShanina RozaShanina is offline
Formerly carlosdanger
 
Join Date: Jul 2013
Posts: 516
iTrader: 0 / 0%
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by dogrunner View Post
What a crock of utter BS the whole of the 'witch hunt' truly is!...........Hellfire, we screw with elections worldwide............and in this peculiar instance there is truly proof of foreign influence..............BRITISH foreign influence in the person of bro Steele!

But I'm biased, being of Irish extraction (mostly), I gotta kinda look at the cross of St. George in the same light a Jew perceives a swastica...

The whole of the matter is just distracting BS.
So champ here is the difference: Steele was not working for British Intelligence when he produced the report, he was paid for his work first by a right wing website, The Washington Free Beacon, and then by the Clinton Campaign, who no doubt declared it as a campaign expenditure. Maybe you need some critical thinking lessons from Offwidth or njineermike.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Offwidth View Post
Dude. Do your have any capacity for critical thinking, or do you just parrot CNN?
Quote:
Originally Posted by njineermike View Post
The fact that he's supposedly old enough to be able to critically think and yet still can't is horrifying. He admits the woman started a gun rights group, and then says a representative of a gun rights group meeting other representatives of a different gun rights group is somehow suspicious.

Seriously. This guy is just clueless.

BTW Carlos, this is so much nothing the major media outlets arent even bothering to cover it, and you're using wikipedia as source material. My kid knew at 10 years old that wasn't a reliable citation source. Congratulations. A kid who can't even drive yet knows more than you do.
One would assume that with your self proclaimed superior critical thinking skills and your uncanny ability to tell truth from falsehood based solely on the source, that one of you, sooner or later, would be capable of posting a comment that was not a childish insult. Alas.

Meanwhile here are some pictures to brighten your day. Yeah, they are ugly but not as ugly as Noble's meme's, most of which do not make sense.

Maria Butina Wayne La Pierre.jpg

Trump Butina (2).jpg
__________________
“It was miraculous. It was almost no trick at all, he saw, to turn vice into virtue and slander into truth, impotence into abstinence, arrogance into humility, plunder into philanthropy, thievery into honor, blasphemy into wisdom, brutality into patriotism, and sadism into justice. Anybody could do it; it required no brains at all. It merely required no character.”


― Joseph Heller, Catch 22

Last edited by RozaShanina; 08-20-2018 at 1:55 PM..
Reply With Quote
  #198  
Old 08-20-2018, 2:03 PM
njineermike's Avatar
njineermike njineermike is offline
Calguns Addict
 
Join Date: Dec 2010
Location: CO
Posts: 9,809
iTrader: 1 / 100%
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by carlosdanger View Post
So champ here is the difference: Steele was not working for British Intelligence when he produced the report, he was paid for his work first by a right wing website, The Washington Free Beacon, and then by the Clinton Campaign, who no doubt declared it as a campaign expenditure. Maybe you need some critical thinking lessons from Offwidth or njineermike.





One would assume that with your self proclaimed superior critical thinking skills and your uncanny ability to tell truth from falsehood based solely on the source, that one of you, sooner or later, would be capable of posting a comment that was not a childish insult. Alas.

Meanwhile here are some pictures to brighten your day. Yeah, they are ugly but not as ugly as Noble's meme's, most of which do not make sense.

Attachment 732304

Attachment 732305
When you made the assertion that a second hand introduction of someone in a gun rights organization was tantamount to treason, you stopped warranting anything remotely akin to considering you smart. At this point you're comic relief at best. This isn't even trump derangement, it's just plain old deranged. Citing wikipedia was a hoot. You sure you're not Pierre Salinger?


BTW, that wasn't an insult. Calling you stupid or deranged is a compliment. Tell your nurse she shouldn't allow you to post while senile.
__________________
NRA lifetime member
2AF Defender member

When did I go from being a "citizen" to a "taxpayer"?

Jon Lovitz: ‘I can’t wait to go to a hospital run by the DMV!’

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kestryll View Post
Dude went full CNN...

Last edited by njineermike; 08-20-2018 at 2:12 PM..
Reply With Quote
  #199  
Old 08-20-2018, 2:07 PM
Offwidth Offwidth is offline
Member
 
Join Date: May 2018
Posts: 152
iTrader: 0 / 0%
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Doheny View Post
Looks like Comrade Clarke left his Bedazzle pins home when he and the NRA leadership went to the homeland to get their orders. Butina’s arm around him is a nice touch. They got played big time.

OMG, that proves everything.


Seriously, just how dumb are you conspiracy theorists are?
Reply With Quote
  #200  
Old 08-20-2018, 3:30 PM
madjack956's Avatar
madjack956 madjack956 is offline
Veteran Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: ORANGE COUNTY
Posts: 2,524
iTrader: 9 / 100%
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Exdc View Post
I appreciate your sharing your perspective in a respectful and clear way. While we disagree on several key points, I do dislike most "news" networks, though I prefer not to throw the baby out with the bath water, and rather to read between the lines. I am neither Democrat nor Republican, but I respect some people in both camps. We also agree that Hillary was not a good choice for president. One thing that really irritates me is that there doesn't seem to be an option for a party that supports human dignity and also the right to defend that dignity with the Second Amendment. It's either "I like guns and screw poor people and scientific data" or "I like big government and screw your ability to defend your rights". Where's the actual party that's working for the interests of the People? Then we have the NRA which is frankly in the pockets of the firearms lobby (more concerned with feeding fear to increase sales), and doesn't do a whole lot in terms of public education and actual outreach anymore. Where's the middle ground? And they back the party that gives handouts to the people at the top who don't need them, instead of small business owners. I'm tired of this broken system.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
So, you think that the party that supports gun rights doesn't care about poor people.

That's laughable on so many fronts.

You think the dems throwing poor people a bone with benefits (not their money) helps them in the long run. Because its been one hell of a long run and they are still on the plantation.
__________________
Paralyzed Veterans of America www.pva.org
Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump



All times are GMT -8. The time now is 2:18 AM.




Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.9
Copyright ©2000 - 2018, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Proudly hosted by GeoVario the Premier 2A host.
Calguns.net, the 'Calguns' name and all associated variants and logos are ® Trademark and © Copyright 2002-2018, Calguns.net an Incorporated Company All Rights Reserved.
Calguns.net and The Calguns Foundation have no affiliation and are in no way related to each other.
All opinions, statements and remarks made by Calguns.net on this web site and elsewhere are solely attributable to Calguns.net.