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Shotgun discussions Trap, Hunting, Defense and more. A place for enthusiasts to discuss the shotgun.

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  #1  
Old 12-04-2018, 4:14 PM
ekkthree ekkthree is offline
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Default another noob here, questions

picking up my first this week and i have questions with regard to legal capacity
a bit more confused because these things can take different shell sizes.
if in current form the capacity is 4+1 and i want to add an extension (i assume the max is 10) is it 10+1, same as any other gun? also, what size shell are you supposed to use when counting capacity? obviously i can fit more minishells than 3"
regardless, i assume that i can't put more than 10 in there at any one time?
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  #2  
Old 12-04-2018, 4:20 PM
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10+1 is the legal limit
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  #3  
Old 12-04-2018, 4:33 PM
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Good question. If the magazine holds 10 2.75" shells but 14 (or whatever) mini-shells, can I do that or just limit it to 10?

I believe the answer is, "limit it to 10", but need validation.
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  #4  
Old 12-04-2018, 5:20 PM
Yodaman Yodaman is offline
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Default another noob here, questions

Not a bad question. 10 is limit. Plus one in chamber
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  #5  
Old 12-04-2018, 5:31 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ekkthree View Post
picking up my first this week and i have questions with regard to legal capacity
a bit more confused because these things can take different shell sizes.
if in current form the capacity is 4+1 and i want to add an extension (i assume the max is 10) is it 10+1, same as any other gun? also, what size shell are you supposed to use when counting capacity? obviously i can fit more minishells than 3"
regardless, i assume that i can't put more than 10 in there at any one time?
CA large capacity magazine laws makes it CA illegal (felony) to increase the magazine capacity of a fixed tubular magazine, on a semi-auto shotgun or pump-action shotgun, to over 10 rounds. [PC 32310(a)]

CA large capacity magazine conversion kit laws makes it CA illegal (misdemeanor) to make, import, or transfer magazine parts that could be used to increase the magazine capacity of a fixed tubular magazine, on a semi-auto shotgun or pump-action shotgun, to over 10 rounds. [PC 32311(a)]

Which means as long as you are not increasing the magazine capacity to 11+ rounds, then it is CA legal to do so for a semi-auto shotgun and a pump-action shotgun.

CA DOJ measures magazine capacity on a fixed tubular magazine by using the shell length marked by the manufacturer.
Examples...
... The Mossberg Model 500 pump-action shotgun is marked for 12Gauge 3" shells, so 3" shells are used to determine that shotgun's magazine capacity.
... The Stoeger M3500 semi-auto shotgun is marked for 12Gauge 3.5" shells, so 3.5" shells are used to determine that shotgun's magazine capacity.

Lever-action shotguns with fixed tubular magazines are exempt from the CA large capacity magazine laws. [PC 16740(c)]
^So, a lever-action shotgun can legally have a fixed tubular magazine with a 11+ round capacity.
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Last edited by Quiet; 12-04-2018 at 5:35 PM..
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  #6  
Old 12-04-2018, 5:49 PM
ekkthree ekkthree is offline
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thank you. so once i pick it up then i should be able to get that specific model number and get a shell length determination from the mfg. take that to buy whatever extension? i haven't really gone over the gun yet so maybe it is, but i don't recall seeing any marking for 'native' shell length, only a 12ga designation on the gun itself.

in that scenario, is it legal then to have the extension tube in place even if i use shorter shells as long as i don't load more than 10 or do i have to remove the extension?
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  #7  
Old 12-05-2018, 9:57 AM
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KSG 25's are legal in CA because they only hold 10 3" shells.

The gun is marked 3" so that is the criteria.

It will hold 12 2 3/4 shells +1 hence the KSG 25 name However all the CA guns are marked 3" so the capacity is only 10 per mag.

It will hold 41 Aguila's

Randy
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  #8  
Old 12-05-2018, 12:16 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ekkthree View Post
thank you. so once i pick it up then i should be able to get that specific model number and get a shell length determination from the mfg. take that to buy whatever extension? i haven't really gone over the gun yet so maybe it is, but i don't recall seeing any marking for 'native' shell length, only a 12ga designation on the gun itself.

in that scenario, is it legal then to have the extension tube in place even if i use shorter shells as long as i don't load more than 10 or do i have to remove the extension?
Just curious, why do you need extension? For hunting you need only 2+1,
For HD if you were not able to neutralize the bad guy with 3 shots you are a. dead already b. he ran away already. Also, usually for HD people want a shorter guns to get some maneuverability.
For zombie situation? you do not need any extension, you need a psihiater.
The only reason i see is:"because i can" which is very respectable and common nowadays.

On a serious note, just go and shoot it, after 2-3K rounds you will learn better what you need.
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  #9  
Old 12-06-2018, 1:07 PM
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I have yet to meet anyone who actually cares about how big your magazines are on AR's or pistols, let alone shotguns.

Don't worry about it.You just give liberals hope.

Randy
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  #10  
Old 12-06-2018, 10:24 PM
ekkthree ekkthree is offline
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Picked it up and asked this question to the counter guy at the shop. His answer was "there is no limit. Its not a removable mag"
He then asked the other counter guys to double check him and no one answered. Not sure if he was right or if they just didnt know.

So... theres that
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  #11  
Old 12-06-2018, 10:54 PM
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What shotgun? If imported it will take more than an extension.

10 shot mag is longer than most SD style shotgun barrels.
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  #12  
Old 12-07-2018, 7:22 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ekkthree View Post
Picked it up and asked this question to the counter guy at the shop. His answer was "there is no limit. Its not a removable mag"
He then asked the other counter guys to double check him and no one answered. Not sure if he was right or if they just didnt know.

So... theres that
His answer doesn't make any sense unless you're talking about a lever-action or rimfire firearm. Outside of that, the fact that it isn't removable doesn't exempt it from being a large capacity magazine as far as California is concerned.
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  #13  
Old 12-07-2018, 8:28 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ekkthree View Post
Picked it up and asked this question to the counter guy at the shop. His answer was "there is no limit. Its not a removable mag"
He then asked the other counter guys to double check him and no one answered. Not sure if he was right or if they just didnt know.

So... theres that
There's nothing, but what was already mentioned in this thread. Unless you have a lever action shotgun, you are limited to 10 rounds with a pump or semi-auto shotgun in this state.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Quiet View Post
CA large capacity magazine laws makes it CA illegal (felony) to increase the magazine capacity of a fixed tubular magazine, on a semi-auto shotgun or pump-action shotgun, to over 10 rounds. [PC 32310(a)]

CA large capacity magazine conversion kit laws makes it CA illegal (misdemeanor) to make, import, or transfer magazine parts that could be used to increase the magazine capacity of a fixed tubular magazine, on a semi-auto shotgun or pump-action shotgun, to over 10 rounds. [PC 32311(a)]

Which means as long as you are not increasing the magazine capacity to 11+ rounds, then it is CA legal to do so for a semi-auto shotgun and a pump-action shotgun.

CA DOJ measures magazine capacity on a fixed tubular magazine by using the shell length marked by the manufacturer.
Examples...
... The Mossberg Model 500 pump-action shotgun is marked for 12Gauge 3" shells, so 3" shells are used to determine that shotgun's magazine capacity.
... The Stoeger M3500 semi-auto shotgun is marked for 12Gauge 3.5" shells, so 3.5" shells are used to determine that shotgun's magazine capacity.

Lever-action shotguns with fixed tubular magazines are exempt from the CA large capacity magazine laws. [PC 16740(c)]
^So, a lever-action shotgun can legally have a fixed tubular magazine with a 11+ round capacity.
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  #14  
Old 12-07-2018, 9:21 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RandyCat View Post
...For hunting you need only 2+1...
Just to be a little more specific, when bird hunting the limit is 2 shells in the magazine and 1 in the chamber.
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  #15  
Old 12-07-2018, 4:57 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BOBGBA View Post
Just to be a little more specific, when bird hunting the limit is 2 shells in the magazine and 1 in the chamber.
For more technically answer, it's actually...

Under CA laws/regulations...
Non-game animals = shotgun capacity limit is 6 rounds. [FGC 2010(a)]
Big game, small game, and birds = shotgun capacity limit is 3 rounds. [FGC 2010(c); 14 CCR 311(a), 353(d), & 507(a)(4)]
Round limit includes rounds in the chamber.

So for a pump-action shotgun, when hunting:
A. non-game animals; the maximum capacity is 5+1.
B. big game, small game, and birds; the maximum capacity is 2+1.




CA Fish & Game Code 2010
(a) It is unlawful to use or possess a shotgun larger than 10-gauge, or to use or possess a shotgun capable of holding more than six cartridges at one time, to take a mammal or bird.
(b) A shotgun that has been modified with the insertion of a plug is deemed, for the purpose of this section, to have a cartridge capacity equal to the number of cartridges that can be loaded into the weapon as modified.
(c) After a public hearing, the commission may adopt regulations relative to the ammunition capacity of shotguns for taking mammals or birds that are more restrictive than the limits provided in subdivision (a), or that it determines may be needed to conform to federal law.

California Code of Regulations Title 14 Division 1 Chapter 2 Section 311
The take or attempted take of any resident small game with a firearm shall be in accordance with the use of nonlead projectiles and ammunition pursuant to Section 250.1. Only the following may be used to take resident small game:
(a) Shotguns 10 gauge or smaller using shot shells only and incapable of holding more than three shells in the magazine and chamber combined. If a plug is used to reduce the capacity of a magazine to fulfill the requirements of this section, the plug must be of one piece construction incapable of removal without disassembling the gun.
(b) Shotgun shells may not be used or possessed that contain shot size larger than No. BB, except that shot size larger than No. 2 may not be used or possessed when taking wild turkey. All shot shall be loose in the shell.

California Code of Regulations Title 14 Division 1 Chapter 3 Section 353
(d) Shotguns capable of holding not more than three shells firing single slugs may be used for the taking of deer, bear and wild pigs. In areas where the discharge of rifles or shotguns with slugs is prohibited by county ordinance, shotguns capable of holding not more than three shells firing size 0 or 00 buckshot may be used for the taking of deer only.

California Code of Regulations Title 14 Division 1 Chapter 7 Section 507
(a) Authorized Methods. Only the following methods may be used to take migratory game birds:
(4) Shotguns 10 Gauge or Smaller. Shotguns 10 gauge or smaller using shot shells only and incapable of holding more than three shells in the magazine and chamber combined may be used. except no shotgun larger than 12 gauge shall be used in areas open to hunting on, over or adjacent to the waters of Morro Bay, San Luis Obispo County. If a plug is used to reduce the capacity of a magazine to fulfill the requirements of this section, the plug must be of one piece construction incapable of removal without disassembling the gun. Shotgun shells may not be used or possessed that contain shot size larger than No. BB in lead or T shot in steel or other nontoxic shot approved by the U.S. Fish and Wildlife Service. All shot shall be loose in the shell.
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  #16  
Old 12-07-2018, 5:23 PM
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If you have a typical 18 to 20" bbl shotgun, you wouldn't like what it looks like with a 10 rd tube. Chances are it will extend past the muzzle.

The JM10 and the Stoeger 3 gun look goofy AF IMO. Longer than what is practical for HD. But they are guns meant to play a game.
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Old 12-17-2018, 6:18 PM
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If you have a typical 18 to 20" bbl shotgun, you wouldn't like what it looks like with a 10 rd tube.
Drool...

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