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Competition, Action Shooting And Training. Competition, Three gun, IPSC, IDPA , and Training discussion here.

View Poll Results: What are your feelings about Front Sight?
Great Training for Beginners Only. 74 8.05%
Great Training Beginner and Advanced. 620 67.46%
The Quality of Training is Going Down Hill. 20 2.18%
I paid too much for my Membership! 43 4.68%
They will go out of business this year! 22 2.39%
Don't want anything to do with them! 140 15.23%
Voters: 919. You may not vote on this poll

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  #10561  
Old 03-14-2019, 11:30 AM
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Originally Posted by JohnP View Post
before everybody on planet earth had front sight credits, i used to really enjoy going to the pro shop and buying something i didn't need but wanted anyway. If a Patronage Point restored some of that novelty, i would consider partaking.

It's going to get really confusing with FS credits and patronage points unless they end up meaning the same thing.
There is absolutely nothing worth buying in the Pro Shop Just how many Brad Ackman books do you need LOL

Wait..................... hmmm, maybe I'll get some of those 1911 or Glock disassembly rubber mats and cut them up for knee pads


I still need a President membership, PM me.
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  #10562  
Old 03-14-2019, 11:49 AM
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i beg to differ. way back when, i used credits for things like 511 clothing and backpacks. i've bought quite a few holsters and magazines. last few trips, i walked out of there with things like...chap stick.


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Originally Posted by beanz2 View Post
There is absolutely nothing worth buying in the Pro Shop Just how many Brad Ackman books do you need LOL

Wait..................... hmmm, maybe I'll get some of those 1911 or Glock disassembly rubber mats and cut them up for knee pads


I still need a President membership, PM me.
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  #10563  
Old 03-14-2019, 12:03 PM
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Im pretty sure the reason the Pro Shop isnt stocked now is because there are too many credits out there. The doubling doubling doubling inflated the supply. It would seem more unfair if they stocked the shop but said credits are no longer accepted. Just a slight of hand.
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  #10564  
Old 03-14-2019, 12:03 PM
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Originally Posted by JohnP View Post
i beg to differ. way back when, i used credits for things like 511 clothing and backpacks. i've bought quite a few holsters and magazines. last few trips, i walked out of there with things like...chap stick.
LOL, of course. I got a nice essentially free Front Sight logo'ed 5.11 jacket to remind me of those days too.

But as of Monday, nope. You're lucky to get some Chap Sticks. There was also some potato chips by the cashier. Probably costs you $7 in Iggy Bucks
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  #10565  
Old 03-14-2019, 12:07 PM
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Originally Posted by Citizen_B View Post
Im pretty sure the reason the Pro Shop isnt stocked now is because there are too many credits out there. The doubling doubling doubling inflated the supply. It would seem more unfair if they stocked the shop but said credits are no longer accepted. Just a slight of hand.
Like store shelves in Venezuela?

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  #10566  
Old 03-14-2019, 2:26 PM
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i miss those days. now we all have hundreds of iggy bucks and nothing to spend them on. if he ever offered a 4 for 1 deal to unrestricted iggy bucks, i'd do it. i was hoping this new coop would be something like that, but i think that's wishful thinking.

Quote:
Originally Posted by beanz2 View Post
LOL, of course. I got a nice essentially free Front Sight logo'ed 5.11 jacket to remind me of those days too.

But as of Monday, nope. You're lucky to get some Chap Sticks. There was also some potato chips by the cashier. Probably costs you $7 in Iggy Bucks
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  #10567  
Old 03-14-2019, 8:02 PM
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How much are the private training memberships. Resale? Weekend. Training would work best for me so I am interested.
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  #10568  
Old 03-15-2019, 8:21 AM
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Originally Posted by cxr View Post
How much are the private training memberships. Resale? Weekend. Training would work best for me so I am interested.
They average $795 each BUT if you trade them in on prepurchased timeshares they double in value.
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  #10569  
Old 03-15-2019, 9:04 AM
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Are the private training memberships transferable? I’d like to upgrade to president. I’m at commander level now.
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  #10570  
Old 03-15-2019, 9:06 AM
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Are the private training memberships transferable? Id like to upgrade to president. Im at commander level now.
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  #10571  
Old 03-15-2019, 9:06 AM
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Are the private training memberships transferable? Id like to upgrade to president. Im at commander level now.
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  #10572  
Old 03-15-2019, 9:23 AM
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They are transferable if you have extras. The all offer had them for 995 each since then they have been 2k. They do not double like the others do so if people have extras they paid for them so it prob wont be cheap.
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  #10573  
Old 03-15-2019, 11:00 AM
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Correct, between my wife and I we have 17 Presedents total, but @ $1500 trade in value each, they are worth a lot to us for timeshares trade in. So to sell them, we would have to charge that amount.

It's probably cheaper for you to have a front sight membership, then pay for an upgrade to President when it's offered.
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  #10574  
Old 03-15-2019, 11:04 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LCU1670 View Post
Correct, between my wife and I we have 17 Presedents total, but @ $1500 trade in value each, they are worth a lot to us for timeshares trade in. So to sell them, we would have to charge that amount.

It's probably cheaper for you to have a front sight membership, then pay for an upgrade to President when it's offered.
the upgrade is 2k right now. one of my pals just upgraded a week ago
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  #10575  
Old 03-15-2019, 11:06 AM
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Wow, I am glad I got mine when I did.

Amy thoughts on the new CO OP?

I am on the fence, don't see the benefit. Am I missing something?
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  #10576  
Old 03-15-2019, 11:16 AM
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I'm in the same boat, but might do it just so the emails stop...
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  #10577  
Old 03-15-2019, 11:17 AM
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New email this morning on the Co-Op with answers to questions. The end result, credits are points. You can use the new ones the same way you used the credits. The only reason to pull the trigger now is if you a trade a membership it would be worth somewhere between 2 or 3k in points. Do it later and it is worth 1 point. However if you are a Heritage and thinking about actually buying the timeshare (if they are built), you will not have any memberships to trade for your activation fees unless you keep some in reserve.

I don't really see the benefit of the Co-Op other than unloading a bunch of certs and memberships and hotel vouchers, etc for points. Which based on his conversion chart is going to put me over 1M.

Back to that joke about the number of credits from the Knight upgrade. How much machine gun ammo can you shoot at lunchtime..... or 20,000 background checks...
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  #10578  
Old 03-15-2019, 4:31 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NorthBay Shooter View Post
Back to that joke about the number of credits from the Knight upgrade. How much machine gun ammo can you shoot at lunchtime..... or 20,000 background checks...
How much does it cost to shoot the machine guns at lunchtime if i am paying with Iggy Bucks? Are there any other limitations on the machine gun shoot?
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  #10579  
Old 03-15-2019, 4:39 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TooFewPews View Post
How much does it cost to shoot the machine guns at lunchtime if i am paying with Iggy Bucks? Are there any other limitations on the machine gun shoot?
$30 Iggy Dollars per magazine. No limit. :-)
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  #10580  
Old 03-15-2019, 4:41 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TooFewPews View Post
How much does it cost to shoot the machine guns at lunchtime if i am paying with Iggy Bucks? Are there any other limitations on the machine gun shoot?
I have not done it for a couple of years, but it is $xx per mag. It's credits and the only thing you need is your member number if paying with credits. I don't think they limit you as far as I know. I think I did about $500 the last time. I remember calling my wife and saying I just spent $500 in about 15 minutes. She asked if FS now had a casino..I said it was worse, they had machine guns...

I recall a buddy going with his son and they shot about 1 or 2k in credits. No one even blinked.

It's a lot of fun if you have not done it. There are worse ways to spend credits.

Last edited by NorthBay Shooter; 03-15-2019 at 4:44 PM..
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  #10581  
Old 03-15-2019, 4:48 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TooFewPews View Post
How much does it cost to shoot the machine guns at lunchtime if i am paying with Iggy Bucks? Are there any other limitations on the machine gun shoot?
A couple of years ago it was $40/mag. I don't know if it still is.
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  #10582  
Old 03-15-2019, 4:57 PM
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Still $40 a mag. Fun way to burn money.
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  #10583  
Old 03-15-2019, 5:51 PM
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For $40 per magazine, I'd go for the M16, not the Uzi

Do they have any select fires that shoot .308 or anything that costs more?
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  #10584  
Old 03-15-2019, 6:12 PM
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It all depends on what they have out. Sometimes a Tommy gun and uzi and M16. Just depends
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  #10585  
Old 03-15-2019, 6:23 PM
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When I was there two weeks ago insteuctor made a comment that they only have the uzis. Working. Now
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  #10586  
Old 03-16-2019, 2:55 PM
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Asked the same question there. The MP5s and Thompsons are apparently busted and they save the M16s for the classes.
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  #10587  
Old 03-20-2019, 11:09 AM
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Haven't been here for a while, wanted to see what everyone was thinking on the new co-op offer. Still not sure what to think... My son and I will be at FS that last week of May taking a one day private, Tac HG & Adv Tac HG. Looks like some of you will be there too, should be fun and hopefully not too hot!
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  #10588  
Old 03-20-2019, 2:58 PM
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Just bought into it. Sounds like everyone will be converted eventually. Those who opt in will get double their value so might as well get more Piazza credits


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
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  #10589  
Old 03-20-2019, 3:20 PM
damon1272 damon1272 is online now
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I bought in. Had a bunch of low grade memberships. Worth more to turn them in. Gave a few away but not much interest from folks.
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  #10590  
Old 03-20-2019, 4:38 PM
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Well, I guess I'll buy in too. The eventual auto future conversion is the reason.

On a side note, a freind wanted a membership from me, made a brand new account for his wife, when I went to transfer the membership into this new account, it was denied because the account already had a membership. The husband checked the new account, and low and behold it had a Patriot membership in it.

Is that a new ploy, so when people make a new account, it is auto filled with a patriot membership so all outstanding memberships become untransferable and worthless?
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  #10591  
Old 03-20-2019, 4:51 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LCU1670 View Post
Well, I guess I'll buy in too. The eventual auto future conversion is the reason.

On a side note, a freind wanted a membership from me, made a brand new account for his wife, when I went to transfer the membership into this new account, it was denied because the account already had a membership. The husband checked the new account, and low and behold it had a Patriot membership in it.

Is that a new ploy, so when people make a new account, it is auto filled with a patriot membership so all outstanding memberships become untransferable and worthless?
It does not appear so. I tried setting one up no membership there
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  #10592  
Old 03-21-2019, 4:22 AM
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Wonder why a PATRIOT appeared in hers? Lucky coincidence?
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  #10593  
Old 03-21-2019, 4:59 AM
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My account just changed to patriot points.

I noticed I have:

1 private training certificate, it's 1 person and 1 guest

And

1 private training certificate with 1 person and 4 guests

If anyone needs one, make me an offer.
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  #10594  
Old 03-21-2019, 1:49 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by beanz2 View Post
I just finished the four day rifle marksmanship class. Wow, all I can say. Lots of fun, lots of new stuff learned. Too bad this is considered a “beginners “class that they have to go over the usual safety stuff, and basic rifle parts, and malfunctions come etc.

The skills tests has changed somewhat from what million_ants described above. The 4 inch target on the top right is now shot at 35 yards offhand, the 5” target on the middle left is at 50yds standing offhand. The 6” target on the middle left is shot at 75 yds in any position, including prone without any mechanical support other than your sling. The 4 inch target in the right upper corner is again shot at 100 yards from any position, again with no mechanical support other than the sling. At 150 yards, The 6 inch target on the right middle this shot with any support, including broods, tripods or magazine monopods in any position. At 200 yards, the 7 inch upper middle target with the central diamond a shot, again in any position, any support. The lower large 9 inch target with the grids was shot at 250 yards. The large target with the grids is again shot at 350 yards. Two shots each time.

The scoring system is exactly like million_ants described.

Yes, the positions standing offhand is a score killer. With a 6X or 8X scope, your hands move around that much more,

I still managed to get a G, however. That 350 yard target which I had been hitting most of the day, I managed to miss two shots. I got 5 down. This class set a record of the number of graduates. Five of us got a G. Still, nobody got a DG. There was another class in Range 48 that I do not know the outcome.

The class was a combined 2-day and 4-days classes. The 2-day guys left on Saturday. At the end of the second day, we shot behind the Wilson wall at 200 yards at steel targets. As usual, if you miss one position you have to move onto the next. Then you come back after you’re done with position 6, and so on until you’ve hit all six positions.

At the end of the fourth day after the skills test, we shot at the large playing card targets they used on the precision rifle class. Except that, instead of shooting from 400, we only shot them at 200. Another game was having the loaded rifles lying on the ground, each student stands from the width of the Astroturf strips and when the timer sounds, he is to get the rifle and shoot at a steel target 200 yds away in any position. The one with shortest time wins. I think each range master comes up with his own game.

My Larue PredatOBR was awesome accurate with IMI 69gr Razor Core. Impressed the heck out of me and the instructors, one kept asking if it was a 5.56 and not a .308. This is a pic of my 50yd ragged hole is below. Too bad the shooter sucked LOL

On practice runs, we shot 4 round strings instead of two as in the test.

Gotta go, plane taking off...
consarnit... well now I've gotta go back and nail it.

can you clarify the 75 and 100 yard targets? I copied what you typed and formatted a little for clarity,

4" top right = 35 yards offhand
5” middle left = 50yds standing offhand
6” middle left = 75 yds in any position including prone without any mechanical support other than your sling.
4" top right = 100 yards from any position, no mechanical support other than the sling.
6" right middle = 150 yards with any support, including broods, tripods or magazine monopods in any position.
7" upper middle = 200 yards any position, any support.
9" with the grids = 250 yards
9" with the grids = 350 yards

Last edited by million_ants; 03-21-2019 at 2:37 PM..
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  #10595  
Old 03-21-2019, 2:35 PM
mtenenhaus mtenenhaus is offline
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Can anyone confirm?

....i'm told that Frontsight drop tests pistols at the time of registration if there is any suggestion of an after market trigger.

If so, how do they do this, won't it bugger up the muzzle/barrel?

Thanks
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  #10596  
Old 03-21-2019, 3:40 PM
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No,they don't drop peoples weapons.
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  #10597  
Old 03-21-2019, 6:02 PM
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So, I have a few misc. low level memberships and some certs. If I convert them now just to get more than 1:1 later why do I have to pay "A one time, single payment of only $197, saving you $103."

This makes no sense. I have to pay to play his game?
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  #10598  
Old 03-21-2019, 6:07 PM
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Instructors at weapon inspection will take all Glocks with aftermarket triggers to the armorer for a simulated drop test.
They basically bang the weapon on a rubber mat to see if the weapon goes click.

They've started doing this because many aftermarket triggers disable the internal safety features so they want to ensure the weapon is still safe.

No harm will come to the weapon.
What are you planning on shooting? Any modifications?
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  #10599  
Old 03-21-2019, 9:26 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by million_ants View Post
consarnit... well now I've gotta go back and nail it.

can you clarify the 75 and 100 yard targets? I copied what you typed and formatted a little for clarity,

4" top right = 35 yards offhand
5 middle left = 50yds standing offhand
6 middle left = 75 yds in any position including prone without any mechanical support other than your sling.
4" top right = 100 yards from any position, no mechanical support other than the sling.
6" right middle = 150 yards with any support, including broods, tripods or magazine monopods in any position.
7" upper middle = 200 yards any position, any support.
9" with the grids = 250 yards
9" with the grids = 350 yards
If I can recall correctly, it was this:


4" top right = 35 yards offhand
5 middle left = 50yds standing offhand
3 upper left = 75 yds in any position including prone without any mechanical support other than your sling.
4" top right (again)= 100 yards from any position, no mechanical support other than the sling.
6" right middle = 150 yards with any support, including broods, tripods or magazine monopods in any position.
7" upper middle = 200 yards any position, any support.
9" with the grids = 250 yards
9" with the grids = 350 yards

Im forgetting if we shot from 300. I think we did.

Man, 10 straight days of 10-12 hour workdays are sure effective at erasing memory!
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  #10600  
Old 03-21-2019, 9:26 PM
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I just finished the 4-day Marksmanship course and thought I'd give a report since it seems the course is still evolving and it seems some things are different from what others experienced.

First, we were on range 49 and at this range, there were no ammo cans and/or sand bags available for use. Fortunately I had a small gym bag in the truck and I stuffed it with whatever I could find, tarps, rags, etc. Even though it was near 80 deg on the first day of the course, I didn't stuff it with my cold weather gear because the forecast was for rain toward the end of the course and unfortunately... the forecast was correct.

The first two days were as others described with max shooting out to 200. Day 3 the rain, wind and cold came in and we started shooting out to 350. Shooting after lunch on day 3 went fairly quickly because many folks didn't come back!

Day 4 it was cold but fortunately no rain. We took the test, which as best I can remember was 2 shots each (see target that million_ants posted earlier in this thread):
35 yards off hand - 4" target top right
50 yards off hand - 5" target middle left
75 yards any position unsupported - 3" target top left
100 yards any position unsupported - 4" target top right
150 yards supported - 5" target middle left
200 yards supported - 6" target middle right
250 yards supported - 7" target upper middle
300 & 350 yards supported - 9" target lower middle

In our class we had one DG, which we heard was only the third DG of the course. He was an experienced precision rifle shooter who was a fantastic shot. He was using a 223 bolt gun shooting 55gr bullets! Pretty impressive he DG'd with those light bullets because when we took the test, the wind picked up and seemed to be around 10-12mph varying between 3/4 and full value. I managed to somehow G (someone must have shot my target...) and there were two other G's as well. I'm not sure what the other G's were shooting but I had a 308 bolt gun shooting 170gr bullets.

After the test we shot the playing card targets at 200 as someone else described. Then the real fun began. We got to shoot the steel half silhouettes from 400 and then shoot the small steel hanging gongs from 300. For the steel shooting we teamed up, with one person shooting and the other spotting for him/her. Lotsa fun.

As others have mentioned, the killer for the test is the off-hand shooting at 35 & 50 yards. Additionally I found going into the prone unsupported at 75 & 100 yards difficult because my 308 is so barrel heavy with a bull barrel. Much different from going into the prone with my AR.

Overall, another great course!
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