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Shotgun discussions Trap, Hunting, Defense and more. A place for enthusiasts to discuss the shotgun. |
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#1
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Saiga 12 FTE
Anyone have excessive FTE on their Saiga 12? Not broken in yet and probably have less than 100 rds through it. Cycles fine on the first 15 rds using military grade 00 buck then FTE's. Using factory 5 rd mags but I do have Promag 10rds and a 10rd drum as well. I dont believe its the mags since I used more of the factory 5rd mag to test. Selector set at 1. FTE's everytime on deer slugs. Extractor works fine. Cleaned every time I shoot. Well lubricated. Dont think the Kvar handguard I installed is blocking the ports. Also put the original guard but still had cycling issues. How many rounds before I break this in and have it stop doing FTE's or does buying the after market auto plug work like this one http://www.mississippiautoarms.com/s...ck-p-1531.html . Getting frustrated on this and I want it to work since Saiga 12's are bad*****! I appreciate any experience and solutions you may have.
Last edited by carval23; 07-21-2013 at 12:06 PM.. |
#2
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fte's are usually an under gassed problem, you'll need to see how many ports are in the gas block/barrel and what size they are. an auto plug will not do anything for this problem, usually people have issues with the lower end target stuff not the high brass slugs and buck.
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#3
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Are you not cycling with the 00 buck or are you not cycling with birdshot?
If its birdshot, have you tried setting the gas plug on 2? Also, take out your plug and make sure the puck is moving freely and not gummed up inside. A lot of people talk about the port problem or "vodka specials" but that is an old problem that went away years ago with a bad production run of Saiga 12s that was mis-drilled as Saiga 20s. I myself have thought of the autoplug but its just another complicated device that can go sour on you. Try the MDArms plug or the Gunfixxers plug. Its a simple replacement of the stock plug and has 4 settings that routes the gas better towards the puck than the stock plug. |
#4
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#5
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#6
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Then you should try a new plug like this one.
http://www.carolinashooterssupply.co...h-gas-plug.htm |
#7
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Last edited by carval23; 07-21-2013 at 1:48 PM.. |
#9
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just because the gun has 3 ports dpesn't mean they are the correct size, my old 3 port needed to be drilled up a bit to operate correctly. the correct port size for a 3 port gun is between .008 and .009 if memory serves.
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#10
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Yup, thats the plan. I plan to drill the ports using the video I saw here on calguns. He actually just used a 3/32 drill bit I believe. I also purchased the dph arms plug. Hoping to do this project before the weekend so I can test it.
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#11
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The selector should tighten all the way closed and then backed out to where the detent would lock in at the slot marked 1.
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#12
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Try the plug first before drilling.
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#13
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It looks like your ports is covered with that grey gunk. Get some solvent and clean that grey gunk out. After shooting mine all these years, mine had so much build up of that stuff that it caked up around the puck. I think it has something to do with lead fouling.
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#14
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#15
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Got it. I am doing it right then but still didn't cycle through fine. Hopefully the dph plug will resolve this. If not, I'm drilling those ports. I am also racking the handle 500 times or until my arms fall off to save me from having to waste ammo just to break it in. This is one of the suggestions in the Saiga 12 forums.
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#16
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I believe my S12 has 4 ports. You may have one more that's plugged up with gunk. It may be at the other end of the opening opposite the one up top near the muzzle end. I clean the ports with a right angle pick and brass 12 g bore brush in the gas tube after every range trip. I just checked and that's exactly where the 4th port is on mine, you just cant see it since it's against that lip but I can insert the tip of a right angle pick in that port.
Last edited by CAGLS; 07-22-2013 at 2:35 PM.. |
#17
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some S 12s have 3 some have 4, the holes are different sizes depending on the number you have, most the guns i've seen are 3 port and usually with under sized holes. Carval a 3/32 bit will do the trick. you'll probably have to open up the gas block a little also, theres a ton of info on how to do this.
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#18
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#19
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my S12 had only one port half blocked - "Vodka Special" opened up all 4 ports changed puck and gas block -> runs so smooth shoots all low brass with out any failures
__________________
I mainly shoot .22lr, 9mm,45 acp, 357 & 38, 12G, 7.62x39, .308, .223/556, 7.62x54r, 300 win mag, 8x57 God Bless USA |
#21
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Nope. Nothing. Never believed in recoil buffers. The only thing I installed in it since I got it was the tromix oversized handle and the Kvar handguard. I also took out the handguard and put the stock one in just in case and still didn't cycle through. I am definitely sure it's those ports.
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#22
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Which puck did you use? Also, how big should the ports be if it is 4 ports? I know on the 3 ports it should be .007 or .008.
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#23
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I would remove the Tromix handle for now until you get things sorted out. You're able to get 15 shots off then you encounter FTE's? You don't have lube on the puck or tube it fits in do you (it should be dry)? Lube up all friction points for the bolt, rails and hammer and then hand cycle it while you watch TV or break it in with more buck & slugs. If the shells swell up in the chamber and get stuck, try different ammo.
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#24
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#25
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Send you fcg and bolt to Pauly for his glass bolt job.
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#26
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the puck shouldn't be lubed. it'll cause it to get gummed up and stick. i had Pauly do a glass bolt when he first started doing that and it was top notch work, i've talked to him for a few hours about the S12 and its short comings and its strong points, he knows what he's doing with these guns, he also provided me with some port guages to measure the port sizes.
Last edited by Sam .223; 07-23-2013 at 6:08 PM.. |
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#28
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#29
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Pauly's work is the best out there, but the wait time may be very long to get your stuff back. Your Saiga shoots ok with slugs & buck shot, you just have to run the puck dry and it should not gum up after 15 rounds or so.
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#30
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Will do that. Thanks for the advice.
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#31
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He was backed up earlier this year but has hired someone to help him which has helped his turn around times. I'd call him to see what the wait times are now.
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#32
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Still FTE after drilling the ports and putting the dps arms plug. Suspecting its the ejector or there too much tension on the spring. Any issues like this happening even with all these fixes? Its converted and drilled so not sure if RAA will take it for warranty repair. Any suggestions?
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#34
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Shooting 00 buck. Cycled through fine before I even drilled the ports then started getting worst. Went downhill after shooting deer slugs. Empty's wont even eject at all. Bolt just racks it back in the chamber. I think its something else besides the ports. I dont think its undergassed at this point. Its more of the chamber being too tight for the shells to eject. Actually when I chamber a round, sometimes the shells gets stuck halfway in the chamber and I have to push the bolt in. It gets worst once I shot a few rounds. Rifle is cleaned during the shoot. Basically, its not smooth going in and I believe going out as well hence the fte. Id have to inquire about the warranty. What a bummer.
Last edited by carval23; 08-03-2013 at 6:00 AM.. |
#36
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send it in for warrenty, there is some sanding and polishing that can be done in there to get the shell to slide through correctly but thats best left to someone that has expierence with doing that so its not over done and then stops the gun from working all together, i did a little sanding work on the S12 i owned but iwas super conservative with it and i wouldn't recommend anyone just try it and see what happens.
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#37
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#39
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The manager for Legion USA warranty repair sounded like he's confident that its a very minor one. I cant wait to get it and shoot the crap out of it until my shoulders turn black and blue!
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