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  #41  
Old 11-20-2017, 8:48 AM
HOGDOG1955 HOGDOG1955 is online now
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im wondering how many here agree with california banning the importation of all kangaroo products. if the country of origin allows it to be legally harvested and legally exported then should be a done deal in my opinion. same as the moronic law of not being able to bring a legally killed mountain lion into this state. and i agree fully with the idea /stance ..... if you vote democrat in todays world,especially in california then you are voting anti gun and anti hunting.
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  #42  
Old 11-20-2017, 9:42 AM
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Originally Posted by HOGDOG1955 View Post
im wondering how many here agree with california banning the importation of all kangaroo products. if the country of origin allows it to be legally harvested and legally exported then should be a done deal in my opinion. same as the moronic law of not being able to bring a legally killed mountain lion into this state. and i agree fully with the idea /stance ..... if you vote democrat in todays world,especially in california then you are voting anti gun and anti hunting.
That kangaroo law was just flat out emotional based crap. I bought a pair of Cabelas Kangaroo upland boots and had them shipped to my parents house in Michigan and then they mailed them to me. They shoot kangaroos down there for depredation so why can't I get a really good pair of boots that are lighter and tougher than leather?
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  #43  
Old 11-20-2017, 10:03 AM
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They used to make motorcycle gloves out of kangaroo hide. They were the best.
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  #44  
Old 11-20-2017, 11:07 AM
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Everyone thinks being in the middle is a good thing, as if it shows they are more intelligent by seeing the good in both arguments. Iíve always found people who lack critical thinking ability take the middle route. To be far on one side is not a bad thing. Itís called taking a stand. The middle ground people are all consequentialists: well, this is ok because it is does good and this is bad because it does bad, as if they can correctly predict the multitude of consequences of a law and apply it to every situation. Those on the far sides stand on principles: what is right is inherently right, and what is wrong is inherently wrong.


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  #45  
Old 11-20-2017, 12:07 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HOGDOG1955 View Post
im wondering how many here agree with california banning the importation of all kangaroo products. if the country of origin allows it to be legally harvested and legally exported then should be a done deal in my opinion. same as the moronic law of not being able to bring a legally killed mountain lion into this state. and i agree fully with the idea /stance ..... if you vote democrat in todays world,especially in california then you are voting anti gun and anti hunting.
Pretty much. There are more big cats here than ever, wayyyyy too many.
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  #46  
Old 11-20-2017, 1:05 PM
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Originally Posted by Jacobs18 View Post
Everyone thinks being in the middle is a good thing, as if it shows they are more intelligent by seeing the good in both arguments. Iíve always found people who lack critical thinking ability take the middle route. To be far on one side is not a bad thing. Itís called taking a stand. The middle ground people are all consequentialists: well, this is ok because it is does good and this is bad because it does bad, as if they can correctly predict the multitude of consequences of a law and apply it to every situation. Those on the far sides stand on principles: what is right is inherently right, and what is wrong is inherently wrong.
Yikes.

How about this: life isn't 2 dimensional. It's not left and right or up and down or black and white..

If you've bought in to the simplified version of us vs. them then you've already lost. You're in someone else's narrative.
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  #47  
Old 11-20-2017, 1:54 PM
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How about this: laws should be based on right and wrong, not the fickle consensus of the majority at the time.


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  #48  
Old 11-20-2017, 3:13 PM
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I'm middle of the road. My liberal friends think I'm a gun owning redneck, and my conservative friends think I'm a Berkeley liberal hippy. It's all good, I get to see the hipocracy of both sides.
Yep! Same here. I find it funny that nobody really knows what the hell I'm going to do until I do it.

I told them all that, like it or not, we're all voting for Hillary. This is CA and all our votes go to the Democratic nominee. My ballot was cast for a third party person. Not because they were going to win. But because it really doesn't matter here.
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  #49  
Old 11-20-2017, 3:22 PM
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Poachers who could care less for any laws here or abroad. Keep killing and very little is done to stop it...
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  #50  
Old 11-20-2017, 3:56 PM
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Originally Posted by Jacobs18 View Post
Everyone thinks being in the middle is a good thing, as if it shows they are more intelligent by seeing the good in both arguments. Iíve always found people who lack critical thinking ability take the middle route. To be far on one side is not a bad thing. Itís called taking a stand. The middle ground people are all consequentialists: well, this is ok because it is does good and this is bad because it does bad, as if they can correctly predict the multitude of consequences of a law and apply it to every situation. Those on the far sides stand on principles: what is right is inherently right, and what is wrong is inherently wrong.


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That logic.
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  #51  
Old 11-20-2017, 7:31 PM
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Originally Posted by drutledge79 View Post
Yikes.

How about this: life isn't 2 dimensional. It's not left and right or up and down or black and white..

If you've bought in to the simplified version of us vs. them then you've already lost. You're in someone else's narrative.
Sounds like "go along to get along" to me.
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  #52  
Old 11-20-2017, 7:35 PM
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Originally Posted by waterfern View Post
I'm middle of the road. My liberal friends think I'm a gun owning redneck, and my conservative friends think I'm a Berkeley liberal hippy. It's all good, I get to see the hipocracy of both sides.
Those aren't conservatives, those are moderates.

Conservatives don't have Berkeley liberal hippy friends.
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  #53  
Old 11-20-2017, 8:05 PM
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Those aren't conservatives, those are moderates.

Conservatives don't have Berkeley liberal hippy friends.
Conservatives today are very different than conservatives from only 20 years ago. This nationalistic nonsense wouldn't have gotten very far back then.
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  #54  
Old 11-20-2017, 9:15 PM
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Because we were all under the impression both parties still loved this country. Now itís become apparent that one party hates it and the other is full of traitors disguised as conservatives.


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  #55  
Old 11-20-2017, 9:38 PM
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Because we were all under the impression both parties still loved this country. Now it’s become apparent that one party hates it and the other is full of traitors disguised as conservatives.


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Nonsense, you have no idea what your talking about. Just because you say its so doesnt make it true.

You seem to be posting inflammatory comments trying to goad people into arguements. I suspect this is an account used to hide your identity from the gate keepers. Have you been kicked out of calguns before or is it something else?
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  #56  
Old 11-20-2017, 9:49 PM
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Originally Posted by waterfern View Post
Nonsense, you have no idea what your talking about. Just because you say its so doesnt make it true.

You seem to be posting inflammatory comments trying to goad people into arguements. I suspect this is an account used to hide your identity from the gate keepers. Have you been kicked out of calguns before or is it something else?
Deny everything, admit nothing, make counter claims.
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  #57  
Old 11-20-2017, 10:13 PM
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Deny everything, admit nothing, make counter claims.
Is that your strategy or his?
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  #58  
Old 11-20-2017, 10:18 PM
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Is that your strategy or his?

It's my acknowledging straight up Alinsky tactics when i see them.
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  #59  
Old 11-21-2017, 8:09 AM
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Originally Posted by Bull Elk View Post
Nope. Probably affects less than one-one thousand of one percent of calgun members. Personally,Trump should have left this law unchanged.
Considering majority of calgun members are not hunters should we also make it difficult or impossible for people to hunt period?

This kind of "me only" thinking is what got us into eroding 2A rights.
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  #60  
Old 11-21-2017, 8:26 AM
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Considering majority of calgun members are not hunters should we also make it difficult or impossible for people to hunt period?

This kind of "me only" thinking is what got us into eroding 2A rights.
No, but having an open dialogue and letting people speak their thoughts on subjects and trying to come up with a compromise if possible is one way not to lose the battle before it's even started. There is far too much of the " my way or the highway" nonsense that is the status quo in the world that makes everything so polarizing.
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  #61  
Old 11-21-2017, 8:41 AM
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Default Nothing about the ivory ban?

A compromise involves both parties giving up theirs own goals to reach a middle ground. When the left wants to ban all guns, and ends up only banning such and such, thatís not a compromise. What have we gained? If it was like:

We want a 30 day waiting period.
Ok well we want national reciprocity.
Ok sounds good.

Thatís a compromise.

We want a 30 day waiting period.
Ok well we want national reciprocity.
Ok we will take 15 days and give you no reciprocity.

That is not a compromise. The left never gives anything, they only take.

Sorry for simplicity of argument, Iím at work.


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Last edited by Jacobs18; 11-21-2017 at 8:44 AM..
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  #62  
Old 11-22-2017, 10:18 AM
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Originally Posted by stonefly-2 View Post
Sounds like "go along to get along" to me.
Hmm I didn't explain myself well enough. I'm not saying to "pick the middle and try to make everyone happy." I'm saying there is no middle. It's a false dichotomy. The "left" and "right" don't represent the broad spectrum of everyone. In fact they don't represent most people.

If it is inline with your values to stand in the far right or middle or left then that's what you should do. If, though, you find yourself not on that two-dimensional line defined by the mass-media and those who've gotten themselves into power: then you should stand where you need to stand.

It's silly and limiting to call out people because they dare to not toe the party line. Republicans are downright evil and stupid on some things. As are the dems. They also do some things right. It doesn't mean you have to fall on your damn sword for them.

Like you imply in your quote above: I'd rather people disagree with me and be standing firmly for their values than parroting the nonsense they pick up on their 24-hr news channel of choice.

As for the ivory ban issue: I don't know enough to have an educated opinion. Seems like small-potatoes. If there is no clear harm from it (or most anything for that matter) I lean to "let it be."
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  #63  
Old 11-22-2017, 10:30 AM
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Since this thread is way off the rails anyway I'll put this here. Our "winner take all" voting system is to blame for a large number of the issues we face in the people of this country not feeling adequately represented and having our politicians pit us against one another in useless bickering rather than working together.

Check out this video to see some of the limitations of "winner take all" ("first past the post") voting systems and how the STV (single transferrable vote - ranked-choice voting) ends up with a more democratic government:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l8XOZJkozfI

Keep this in mind: the present political parties don't want STV because it threatens their power immensely. Big corps enjoy the consolidated power because it makes their lobbying more effective. You won't see either of them pushing for this because it transfers power away from them and to the average citizen.
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