9mm 115gr plated and unique

[09cs]

Today my powder and primers finally arrived to start loading 9mm and of course im out of town But while I've been away I've been looking for load data for 115gr plated bullets and unique, and haven't found much. I'll check my manuals when I'm back home, but until then, anyone have any leads or anything? I read I can take a FMJ starting point, and reduce that by 10% for a starting point for plated. I found 5.5 to be a starting load for unique and 115gr fmj, but not sure if that 10% thing is true.

Would appreciate any starting points!

[Mot Mi]

You can just to be safe but I would look for lead data as that is what plated bullets mimic. Better to be safe than sorry. Look for published data. I wish I was at home, I would get you data but at work right now so I cant be much use.

[peekay331]

I load the same combo of bullets and powder. I go anywhere from 5.5 to 6.0. 5.5 works well and cycles fine in my P226, G19, and XD9.

[dstiltner]

I use the same combo. 6.0 grains but I load them long compared to the published Alliant load data at 1.150" instead of 1.120". I get ~1300 fps on the chronograph out of a 5" 1911.

ETA: When developing this load several years ago, I did start at 5.5 grains and worked up to 6.0.

[09cs]

So from this, (after I compare to my published data) would assume 5gr at ~1.12" would be a safe starting point?

[09cs]

Originally Posted by Mot Mi

You can just to be safe but I would look for lead data as that is what plated bullets mimic. Better to be safe than sorry. Look for published data. I wish I was at home, I would get you data but at work right now so I cant be much use.

Would you mind posting when you get the chance?

I'm not going to be home for a while, and just want to get a jump start

[Mot Mi]

Speer #14 says, unique at 5.6 (1166 velocity) to 6.3 (1244 velocity) for both GDHP and TMJ RN at 1.125 COAL. I've tried these loads with xtreme plated on 124 rn bullets to the tee and never had any problems. I've used the following powders with plated bullets with no pressure signs or any problems whatsoever: Blue Dot, AA#9, Unique, AA#7, Power Pistol, Titegroup, AA#5, 700x, Bullseye, and W231/HP38.

this is published data for full metal jacket bullets so please use with caution. Like ive stated I have used these data for 45, 38/357, and 9mm xtreme plated bullets with no problems.

[the86d]

I started with the same combo (4# of it, as it was readily available when I started).

Work up, but I did notice that if I used over a certain amount, (I think it was like 5.4 or greater, but I can't remember that it was 115gr, or 124gr) I got powder-flake-splatter all over when shooting the M9 (4.9"), and SR-9 that appeared partially-burned (all over my arms, and I don't know why), so I reduced charge to a kosher cycle QTYs. (I document better now...)

[09cs]

Thanks guys,

forgot to mention they are Rainer plated bullets if that matters

[dstiltner]

I have used the same load with Berry's, Rainier and Xtreme plated RN bullets without any issues.

[09cs]

Originally Posted by dstiltner

I have used the same load with Berry's, Rainier and Xtreme plated RN bullets without any issues.

Good to know! I think I'll start a little below 5.5, around 5 and work up. Not looking for precision loads just plinking ones so if it cycles reliably etc i'll be happy

[09cs]

Ok I got home for a little and looked in my manual, but the only load listed using unique was 115 XTP bullets, nothing for lead or plated.

Thankfully it had the load listed for unique and the bullet weight I'm using for 45 acp

I found a thread on another site where the guy EMAILED Alliant and for 115gr LEAD bullet using unique, 4.5 starting load, 5 max according to them

So my question is, those who said they were using 5.5, seeing any pressure signs etc.?

should I go with the Alliant email and suggested load?

[ireload]

09cs I use this load for my Ruger P-95 and Beretta 92:
Berry's 115 grain plated flat point C.O.L 1.045"
Berry's 115 grain plated round nose C.O.L 1.135"
6 grains Unique, mixed brass trimmed at .748", small pistol primer.
Cycles well in both handguns and a buddy of mine has also used it in his
Sig 228.

Start at 5.6 grains (min) and 6.3 (max) per Speer Manual #13 or #14. Speer used an actual handgun (S&W M5906) and not a pressure barrel for the listed loads they have for the 115 grain bullet.
The reason why Alliant suggest 4.5 grains of Unique is plated bullets is close to bare lead bullet. The lead itself is soft and it's swaged then a very thin plating applied afterwards. If you go check the plated bullet manufactures websites time they will tell you to use a "light crimp" on their plated bullets. You can still go with Alliant's powder weight recommendation but keep in mind that depending on the pound rating of your recoil spring in your specific handgun it may cause it not to cycle the slide fully. I would load maybe 10 rounds initially to test.

[09cs]

Originally Posted by ireload

09cs I use this load for my Ruger P-95 and Beretta 92:
Berry's 115 grain plated flat point C.O.L 1.045"
Berry's 115 grain plated round nose C.O.L 1.135"
6 grains Unique, mixed brass trimmed at .748", small pistol primer.
Cycles well in both handguns and a buddy of mine has also used it in his
Sig 228.

Start at 5.6 grains (min) and 6.3 (max) per Speer Manual #13 or #14. Speer used an actual handgun (S&W M5906) and not a pressure barrel for the listed loads they have for the 115 grain bullet.
The reason why Alliant suggest 4.5 grains of Unique is plated bullets is close to bare lead bullet. The lead itself is soft and it's swaged then a very thin plating applied afterwards. If you go check the plated bullet manufactures websites time they will tell you to use a "light crimp" on their plated bullets. You can still go with Alliant's powder weight recommendation but keep in mind that depending on the pound rating of your recoil spring in your specific handgun it may cause it not to cycle the slide fully. I would load maybe 10 rounds initially to test.

Thanks for the suggestions!

And that was the plan!

[ireload]

09cs let us know the result of your test.

[09cs]

Originally Posted by ireload

09cs let us know the result of your test.

Will do!

[Flyin Brian]

I loaded up a bunch of these a few months ago. I am using Berry's 115 plated bullets with 5.1 grains of Unique, OAL is 1.110". I don't shoot much 9mm but I've shot maybe 300 of them so far and they are accurate out of my STI Trojan 9mm. Cycle fine, no pressure signs, etc.

[09cs]

So I just heard back from Alliant after emailing them,

they informed me they have no load data for 115gr plated Rainer bullets and unique.

So should I just go with the lead data for 115gr and unique? Or cut my losses and just pick up some FMJ?

[dstiltner]

Plated bullets and Unique work well, no need to ditch them. Most component combinations are not provided by reloading manuals, so picking things that are close and starting low (at least 10% less than max) is a safe practice. Most plated bullet manufacturers recommend, lead or mid range jacketed data in general but nothing for any specific component combination.

As with working up any load, just start low and work up looking for pressure signs. A chronograph helps as well, if you are pushing a load faster than you expect, it can also be a good indicator of over pressure.

Loading cartridges to as long as the magazine will hold and your gun(s) will feed helps to keep pressure down as well.

Reloading is part science and part art. Load data in general is a reference source and is not definitive. You will need to be comfortable with your loading techniques and your component selection. At the end of the day, if getting FMJ bullets will make you more comfortable in reloading 9mm, I say get some. I would hang onto the plated bullets for when you get more comfortable with reloading, you will use them.

When I started reloading my father-in-law gave me about a dozen different weights and profiles of 9mm bullets of FMJ, plated and lead bullets. Most of them were not in any manual that I had so they sat in a cabinet for years. It was not until I started reloading and shooting a lot, that I decided to work up loads for all of them. I gained a good deal of experience and confidence in my reloading methods from doing this and saved several hundred dollars to boot using free bullets.

[JagerDog]

Plated bullets are for range fodder. Kinda counter-productive to "work up" once you've found a reliable and accurate recipe. Note that lead bullets typically give faster velocity that jacketed bullets with the same powder charge (go down barrel easier).

9mm is on the fast side for plated bullet recommendations...so stay toward the slow side. If you've lead data, just stick to that. I have older data listing 6gr w/125gr lead. By Alliant's protocol "starting loads" are reduced 10%. If I were tackling this, I'd start at 5 gr moving up in 0.2 gr increments up to 6 gr. Since the data was for 125gr, you have a built-in margin. You're establishing 2 things. Minimum charge to reliably cycle action and where the accuracy meets your requirement. If the 5gr reliably cycles, you might even consider reducing the charge.

[09cs]

Originally Posted by JagerDog

Plated bullets are for range fodder. Kinda counter-productive to "work up" once you've found a reliable and accurate recipe. Note that lead bullets typically give faster velocity that jacketed bullets with the same powder charge (go down barrel easier).

9mm is on the fast side for plated bullet recommendations...so stay toward the slow side. If you've lead data, just stick to that. I have older data listing 6gr w/125gr lead. By Alliant's protocol "starting loads" are reduced 10%. If I were tackling this, I'd start at 5 gr moving up in 0.2 gr increments up to 6 gr. Since the data was for 125gr, you have a built-in margin. You're establishing 2 things. Minimum charge to reliably cycle action and where the accuracy meets your requirement. If the 5gr reliably cycles, you might even consider reducing the charge.

The lead data I found for 115 and unique has 5 grains as a MAX! and a jacketed 115 as 5.5 max. That is straight from Alliant, so that's why I'm confused

[09cs]

Originally Posted by dstiltner

Plated bullets and Unique work well, no need to ditch them. Most component combinations are not provided by reloading manuals, so picking things that are close and starting low (at least 10% less than max) is a safe practice. Most plated bullet manufacturers recommend, lead or mid range jacketed data in general but nothing for any specific component combination.

As with working up any load, just start low and work up looking for pressure signs. A chronograph helps as well, if you are pushing a load faster than you expect, it can also be a good indicator of over pressure.

Loading cartridges to as long as the magazine will hold and your gun(s) will feed helps to keep pressure down as well.

Reloading is part science and part art. Load data in general is a reference source and is not definitive. You will need to be comfortable with your loading techniques and your component selection. At the end of the day, if getting FMJ bullets will make you more comfortable in reloading 9mm, I say get some. I would hang onto the plated bullets for when you get more comfortable with reloading, you will use them.

When I started reloading my father-in-law gave me about a dozen different weights and profiles of 9mm bullets of FMJ, plated and lead bullets. Most of them were not in any manual that I had so they sat in a cabinet for years. It was not until I started reloading and shooting a lot, that I decided to work up loads for all of them. I gained a good deal of experience and confidence in my reloading methods from doing this and saved several hundred dollars to boot using free bullets.

I'm still very new to reloading, only have loaded 223 and 308 before with FMJ
So I may buy some FMJ till I can get more comfortable or definite load data.

I've emailed Rainer (it's their bullets) so seeing what they say.

[09cs]

I found this listing from Rainer stating the load data for unique, but not sure how old it is/ still reliable.

I also heard that Rainer recommends using lead data for their plated bullets, but on their website it says:

Rainier recommends using commercially published jacketed bullet load data when loading our bullets. There is no need for adjustment when using jacketed bullet load data. Our bullets are jacketed using an electroplating process and are softer than traditionally jacketed bullets. Be sure to use only load data that is published in a reputable reloading manual.

We recommend a starting powder charge directly between the listed minimum and maximum load.

Not sure if they meant lead or ????

[JagerDog]

I notice in the screenshot (from Midway) it leaves 8kpsi off the table. Not untypical when a load is listed as a "target" load, but I don't see them specifying "target". What it does tell me though is that at 5.3 there's still significant headroom. It also indicates 4.3g works. So maybe start even lower than I suggested then work up looking for minimum firearm reliability and accuracy node.

Alliant's website is no help (seem to be pushing the new BE86). Obviously they had different web data a year ago before BE86 was introduced. I have some quite recent data around here somewhere, but the older data showed as I indicated above (6gr max for 125 cast). This rather aligns with your screenshot.

[09cs]

Originally Posted by JagerDog

I notice in the screenshot (from Midway) it leaves 8kpsi off the table. Not untypical when a load is listed as a "target" load, but I don't see them specifying "target". What it does tell me though is that at 5.3 there's still significant headroom. It also indicates 4.3g works. So maybe start even lower than I suggested then work up looking for minimum firearm reliability and accuracy node.

Alliant's website is no help (seem to be pushing the new BE86). Obviously they had different web data a year ago before BE86 was introduced. I have some quite recent data around here somewhere, but the older data showed as I indicated above (6gr max for 125 cast). This rather aligns with your screenshot.

I too noticed that Alliants websit sucks

I emailed Rainer so waiting to see what they say, but for now I'll follow that page, and start around 4.2 (.1 grains below min per screen shot) and work up to around 4.5 ish for now (because of limited cases)

[JagerDog]

Originally Posted by 09cs

I too noticed that Alliants websit sucks

I emailed Rainer so waiting to see what they say, but for now I'll follow that page, and start around 4.2 (.1 grains below min per screen shot) and work up to around 4.5 ish for now (because of limited cases)

I'd use 0.2g increments. Your ladder is conservative already. 1/10ths just aren't likely to reveal any additional information.

I'd look at 4.4, 4.6, 4.8, 5.0.........Everything I have shows you safe up to 6'ish.

[Mot Mi]

If you're concerned about the fmj data 09cs, start at 4.5 per your findings and use the 5.0 max. Do not shoot fast if you may end up with a squib (highly doubt it). You can do .2 or .1 increments, but personally I'd go .2.

[09cs]

Originally Posted by JagerDog

I'd use 0.2g increments. Your ladder is conservative already. 1/10ths just aren't likely to reveal any additional information.

I'd look at 4.4, 4.6, 4.8, 5.0.........Everything I have shows you safe up to 6'ish.

Ok, .2 it is. But 6ish? Everything I've found is showing between a 5-5.3 as a max

Originally Posted by Mot Mi

If you're concerned about the fmj data 09cs, start at 4.5 per your findings and use the 5.0 max. Do not shoot fast if you may end up with a squib (highly doubt it). You can do .2 or .1 increments, but personally I'd go .2.

Don't plan on shooting fast! lol My dies should be here wednesday, and only have about 50 pieces of brass. I'm always concerned about approaching max, and try to stay at least .1-.2 grains below to stay safe

[JagerDog]

Originally Posted by 09cs

Ok, .2 it is. But 6ish? Everything I've found is showing between a 5-5.3 as a max



Don't plan on shooting fast! lol My dies should be here wednesday, and only have about 50 pieces of brass. I'm always concerned about approaching max, and try to stay at least .1-.2 grains below to stay safe

That "max" (your screenshot) was 8kpsi under max.

My older data from alliant max's at 6. Several loadings at handloader.com are in the 6'ish.

But I suspect you'll find something the pistol likes well before that.

[09cs]

Originally Posted by JagerDog

That "max" (your screenshot) was 8kpsi under max.

My older data from alliant max's at 6. Several loadings at handloader.com are in the 6'ish.

But I suspect you'll find something the pistol likes well before that.

Ok thanks so much for all the help!