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  #1  
Old 02-11-2018, 12:18 AM
corlandashiva corlandashiva is offline
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Default Glock 19 Gen 3 extractor issues

Just purchased a Glock 19 from a user here on calguns. Shot it for the first time today and about 20% of the time I am getting a failure to extract which is very troubling and the seller didn’t mention it. I use solely Winchester white box 115gr and my USP has had 0 problems shooting this particular ammo.

The gun had the following modifications done to it already that could possibly be a factor in the issue:

Steel guide rod installed
Apex extractor

I personally switched out the connector and the slide stop but I can’t imagine either of these are causing the issue.

I will likely be switching out the guide rod and the extractor for the stock parts to see if that fixes the problem.
Is there anything else that could be the cause of the problem?
To be clear, limp wristing is not the issue
It seems very odd to have an extraction/ejection issue so frequently.

Thanks for any help/guidance
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Old 02-11-2018, 12:24 AM
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I’m not that savvy but I’m willing to bet it has nothing to do with the guide rod and everything to do with the aftermarket extractor.
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Old 02-11-2018, 12:32 AM
corlandashiva corlandashiva is offline
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That definitely seems like the most logical place to check. Is it possible the apex extractor is just faulty? I would imagine they make quality products.
The first thing I will try is switching that out for a stock one
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Old 02-11-2018, 1:48 AM
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That's why the cat sold it to you ~ Sucks, sorry! The "extras" were trying to fix the underlying issues. I'd out the seller, he sold you a problem pistol without a disclaimer ~ SHADY!!!!!!!
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Old 02-11-2018, 4:22 AM
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My first step would be returning it to factory configuration, or at the very least, a factory extractor.
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  #6  
Old 02-11-2018, 6:38 AM
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Should you find that the extractor is causing the problem let Apex know. They are very proud of them and will more than likely replace it.

Good luck!
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Old 02-11-2018, 6:54 AM
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Default spring tension

Corlandashiva,

I would first check the recoil spring tension. If you have another spring handy your can swap it out and take it to the range to see if that solves your problem.
If not then it's probably better you swap the recoil spring anyway.

If that doesn't solve your problem then I'd suspect your extractor itself. Go to You Tube and watch a tutorial on how to remove it and check for possibly a broken extractor. Otherwise I'd change to spring assembly for that.


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Old 02-11-2018, 6:58 AM
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Factory 9mm extractors are cheap. So are recoil springs.
I would just buy both and swap one at a time.

Who knows how many rounds or what weight that spring is. I would put a new one just for peace of mind.

Maybe it's a .40 extractor or it's out of spec/defective.
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  #9  
Old 02-11-2018, 7:02 AM
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What do you mean by failure to extract, more detail please. Do you get stovepiped brass, or does the extractor fail to pull the brass from the chamber at all, ie it slips off the case rim, or ?? Get a pic if you cannot describe it.

Detail strip and clean the slide and all parts. Examine the extractor especially the claw, if it is not damaged, no need to replace it without further testing.

Clean the channel/tube for the extractor plunger. Be sure the extractor plunger spring is not munged and the extractor plunger bearing is intact and not damaged.

In short, disassemble and thoroughly inspect, then reassemble properly.

Keep the striker and striker channel clean and dry, no lube in there.
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  #10  
Old 02-11-2018, 7:10 AM
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I’m betting you can fix the problem by installing a stock recoil spring and extractor.
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  #11  
Old 02-11-2018, 7:17 AM
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Take it all back down to stock parts. Shoot, confirm function, then add 1 part back at a time if you even care to. I have a buddy who had mixed and matched aftermarket springs, some too light in places, others too heavy, caused issues each time he shot.
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  #12  
Old 02-11-2018, 7:56 AM
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I agree with everyone who mentioned return the pistol to stock and you should be good to go....it’s a simple thing to do you’ll be up and running in no time. Let us know how that goes.
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  #13  
Old 02-11-2018, 8:09 AM
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I love it! Taking a reliable gun and "upgrading" it until it doesn't work.
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  #14  
Old 02-11-2018, 8:24 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by alland View Post
I love it! Taking a reliable gun and "upgrading" it until it doesn't work.
Exactly. 90% of my work as a Glock trained armorer was removing aftermarket parts and returning guns to factory specs. Amazingly they ran like a well oiled machine again.
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Old 02-11-2018, 8:45 AM
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Just to add, if all else fails, make sure the chamber is thoroughly clean, then do a bullet drop test with a box of your WWB. Remove the barrel and drop each round into the chamber to make sure they drop fully with gravity only. If the chamber is filthy, rounds may be chambered with the force of the slide, but upon case expansion, may give enough resistance to hinder the extraction process.
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  #16  
Old 02-11-2018, 9:58 AM
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Probably didn’t use the apex spring. Apex will stand behind their products and while I can see upgrading a Glock trigger, I have never heard of upgrading an extractor on a Glock. Never heard of any issues with the stock extractor but there’s always money to be made.
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  #17  
Old 02-11-2018, 7:12 PM
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I appreciate all the information, have had a busy day and couldn’t contribute to conversation as it happened.
I left it with the gunsmith at my range and he told me “nothing was wrong” only to have an instructor on hand shoot it himself and say there is definitely an issue.
I was still forced to pay the gunsmith $45 dollars for his “expertise”.
Lesson learned I guess.
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  #18  
Old 02-11-2018, 7:37 PM
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It’s possible that when the previous owner replaced the extractor, he did not replace the SLB (spring-Loaded bearing) with older style used in non-LCI extractor Glocks. That part is a must. Also, some people make the mistake of reinstalling the extractor depressor plunger backwards when reassembling the slide.
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Old 02-11-2018, 8:51 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by solipsism View Post
Probably didn’t use the apex spring. Apex will stand behind their products and while I can see upgrading a Glock trigger, I have never heard of upgrading an extractor on a Glock. Never heard of any issues with the stock extractor but there’s always money to be made.
You've never heard of the infamous Glock BTF?
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  #20  
Old 02-11-2018, 9:16 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by alland View Post
I love it! Taking a reliable gun and "upgrading" it until it doesn't work.
^^^^^^^ This^^^^^^^^^^^^^
Why mess with a Glock . I can understand milling the slide for a RMR. But all this extra stuff
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  #21  
Old 02-11-2018, 11:13 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by corlandashiva View Post
I appreciate all the information, have had a busy day and couldn’t contribute to conversation as it happened.
I left it with the gunsmith at my range and he told me “nothing was wrong” only to have an instructor on hand shoot it himself and say there is definitely an issue.
I was still forced to pay the gunsmith $45 dollars for his “expertise”.
Lesson learned I guess.
SkyHawk asked very important questions above. I was actually waiting for you to reply to that post and those questions.

Right now it seems you spent some money, but problem persists, and you still haven't described it in enough detail imho.

I also may have missed it above, but have you tried different ammo? Just in case it is the chamber and not extractor related?
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  #22  
Old 02-11-2018, 11:19 PM
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The spent casing remains in the barrel and doesn’t get extracted.
I did all the cleaning Skyhawk requested and will be taking it to the range tomorrow after work to test.
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Old 02-11-2018, 11:32 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by corlandashiva View Post
The spent casing remains in the barrel and doesn’t get extracted.
I did all the cleaning Skyhawk requested and will be taking it to the range tomorrow after work to test.
How hard is it to get the casing out, and how do you get it out?

And thank you for answering.
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Old 02-12-2018, 12:05 AM
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The casing is not stuck inside. I’ll lock the slide back, release the magazine, and then either have to pull the casing out or it will fall out on its own when I release the mag.
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Old 02-12-2018, 12:34 AM
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Then it seems extractor is the cause.

And it appears they may not be as drop in as people think.
https://www.apextactical.com/blog/in...g-fre-fitting/
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Old 02-12-2018, 1:04 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MosinVirus View Post
Then it seems extractor is the cause.

And it appears they may not be as drop in as people think.
https://www.apextactical.com/blog/in...g-fre-fitting/
Replacing a working extractor for one that requires fitting is counter intuitive to me.

I just took out my own Ghost evo connector. It provides a break and a reset that amazing. Also causes the pistol to not go into battery 2% of the time.
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Old 02-12-2018, 1:13 AM
corlandashiva corlandashiva is offline
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I had no idea the apex connector required that much work and fine-tuning. Seems completely not worth it to me, hopefully when I shoot it tomorrow the problem should be gone then.
Thanks for finding that for me, guy who sold it to me must not have installed it correctly.
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Old 02-12-2018, 6:16 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by corlandashiva View Post
I had no idea the apex connector required that much work and fine-tuning. Seems completely not worth it to me, hopefully when I shoot it tomorrow the problem should be gone then.
Thanks for finding that for me, guy who sold it to me must not have installed it correctly.
There are tests they go over in the instructions. You could test yours and see if you have proper tension now that you have cleaned everything.

Also, as I was looking at differences between the extractors I found some interesting info that may or may not be applicable... There seems to be a LCI and Non-LCI Spring Loaded Bearing (SLB) for extractors. It is the smaller spring cap in the extractor channel. The Non-LCI (which this Apex seems to be) may need a different SLB to accompany it because it seems that non-LCI SLB will have a larger head and will provide more spring tension.

Then again, I have never looked into it myself and have no idea if that is something that should be considered. However, even looking at the description of the OEM part it mentions the "must use" of the new SLB.
http://www.rockyourglock.com/custom/GLSP01895.htm

One would think that the person that sold the gun to you installed the Apex extractor as a solution to a problem, in which case going back to original extractor may not fix or may increase rate of failure extracting... in which case the gun may need to go in for waranty. But they may have also not replaced the SLB or have improperly fit the extractor in the first place.

You probably have this SLB in yours, but here is the description of the part:
http://www.rockyourglock.com/custom/GLSP02714.htm

The chances are the guy just got this extractor "because upgrade, bro" and going back to factory glock extractor will solve all issues with extraction, especially since I believe the SLB in your glock is the new LCI type already.

So, this may very well be a case of "if it ain't broke, why in the world did you change it". That is how awesome marketing is...

For reference, here are pics of SLBs - LCI (top) and non-LCI (bottom). Not sure if the foot is different (one of the pics may be cut off), but the head definitely is.



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Old 02-12-2018, 8:03 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by alland View Post
I love it! Taking a reliable gun and "upgrading" it until it doesn't work.
the seller had to have known about the problems, he sold him a messed with unreliable gun

I keep mine stock, OEM sights, magazines, recoil springs, no modifications necessary
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Old 02-12-2018, 8:08 AM
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This is invaluable information for me, really appreciate it.
From what I remember the SLB I have is the bottom one - non-LCI

This would mean I shouldn’t have a problem going back to stock I believe.
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Old 02-12-2018, 10:51 AM
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The current Glocks ship with LCI extractors, for a while now. I would get a stock LCI extractor, a matching bearing, and a new plunger spring just in case. Good news is they are cheap. Install them and call it a day.

This is an LCI extractor

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Old 02-12-2018, 1:13 PM
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Here's a test I do when when I have a gun that has extraction issues. Take the slide off the gun and remove the barrel. Slide an empty case under the extractor claw. The case should stay there even if you shake slide a bit. You don't want the extractor to be clamped down on the shell, but just holding it the semi firmly so it doesn't just fall free. If you don't have an empty case try it with a loaded round, it should stay put too.
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Old 02-12-2018, 1:53 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SkyHawk View Post
The current Glocks ship with LCI extractors, for a while now. I would get a stock LCI extractor, a matching bearing, and a new plunger spring just in case. Good news is they are cheap. Install them and call it a day.
Yup, this is the way I would go too. Never had one of my Glocks fail to extract using the original extractors.
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Old 02-12-2018, 4:50 PM
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I think the original owner was probably having BTF issues. I’ve had this happen with two Gen3 19’s. Apex extractors fixed them both so that they now eject like my Gen2 19’s. I think the previous owner either installed parts incorrectly, or took the cheap way out and didn’t replace the SLB as recommended by APEX. Both my Apex extractors dropped right in. I’m willing to bet dollars to donuts the SLB was not replaced with the required one.
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Old 02-12-2018, 5:32 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 5.56Geo View Post
Should you find that the extractor is causing the problem let Apex know. They are very proud of them and will more than likely replace it.

Good luck!
Yeah...with one that will malfunction less often. Quite amusing how a gun manufacturer spends millions on design, research & testing, then along comes a gun owner who thinks he's "improving" the product with a $20.00 part.
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Old 02-12-2018, 5:33 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 5.56Geo View Post
Should you find that the extractor is causing the problem let Apex know. They are very proud of them and will more than likely replace it.

Good luck!
Yeah...with one that will malfunction less often. Quite amusing how a gun manufacturer spends millions on design, research & testing, then along comes a gun owner who thinks he's "improving" the product with a $20.00 part. And, who knows what other "polishing," "smoothing," customizing was done to the gun. That's why he sold it.
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Old 02-13-2018, 6:54 AM
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I want to hear how this turns out!
Let us know what the original owner says when you contact him
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Old 02-13-2018, 7:10 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Michael777 View Post
I’m not that savvy but I’m willing to bet it has nothing to do with the guide rod and everything to do with the aftermarket extractor.
Precisely..!!!
Go to stock extractor, and make sure it's for the 9mm, not the 40S&W. Different geometry.
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Old 02-13-2018, 7:33 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by porky View Post
I want to hear how this turns out!
Let us know what the original owner says when you contact him
Rather predictable. "Hey, dude...you bought the gun as is. I didn't do nuthin' to it. You must be gripping it wrong."
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Old 02-13-2018, 10:27 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 9mmepiphany View Post
You've never heard of the infamous Glock BTF?
I have but that always seemed more of an ejector issue, not extractor. I have only heard about the Gen4s having that issue not Gen3s.

OP, I'd check with Apex and see if they will supply you with a spring, I am willing to bet the previous owner didn't put the Apex spring in.
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