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California 2nd Amend. Political Discussion & Activism Discuss gun rights activism and 2A related political topics here. All advice given is NOT legal counsel.

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  #801  
Old 07-22-2010, 5:44 PM
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lmao @ slotown

troll or crooked cop ?

you be the judge

i guess the oath taken to defend the constitution are just empty words
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  #802  
Old 07-22-2010, 6:02 PM
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Originally Posted by SLOTOWN View Post
As for this whole affair I am sure everything will come out, including what else was on the 5 hours of video footage that was edited down to 22 minutes by Mr. Blackburn.

I am betting the other 4 hours and 38 minutes puts this case in a different light. And while we are on the subject maybe I will do a documentary featuring Mr. Hart's neighbors, who have put up with his unsafe shooting for years.

I'm not defending Deputy Murphy he acted like a real knucklehead, but lets not canonize Mr. Hart just yet. There is a long history between him, his neighbors and the county sheriff's office and you might want to get those facts straight before you make him your "poster child" for gun rights...
This is not about what Mr. Hart may have done (other than the things he was wrongfully charged with in this incident), it is about what crimes were clearly committed by the criminal thugs in this video - criminal thugs who hide behind their badges and uniforms even as they criminally conspire to violate their sworn oaths, and undermine the law, the Constitution, and the legitimacy of all other LEOS.

Deputy Murphy did not act like a "knucklehead" - he acted like a traitor to his profession, a traitor to the uniform, a traitor to the badge, a traitor to the Constitution, a betrayer of his oath of office, and a criminal thug of the lowest form.

There is absolutely nothing that he could have done in the remainder of the video footage that would make what he and the other deputies did legal or right.
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  #803  
Old 07-22-2010, 6:10 PM
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Originally Posted by SLOTOWN View Post
One last note, I understand Mr. Murphy, Esquire, now works as a public defender, which is why he retired from law enforcement.

I don't know if this is his form of a mea culpa, or if he just came up with a more creative way to put criminals behind bars; by representing them!

Also, I have spoken to my county supervisor and he supports a county ordinance making it illegal to discharge a firearm in the unincorporated areas, the exceptions being firearms ranges and parcels over 40 acres. He said he will speak to supervisor Hill and Supervisor Gibson about getting one on the next BOS agenda. That type of ordinance would have prevented this whole sordid affair because Mr. Hart surely would not have violated the law and been "plinking" on his 2 acres if such a county ordinance had been the law..

I checked and Kern, Santa Barbara and Ventura counties have similar ordinances.
Why not propose a law that provides more opportunities for citizen oversight of government employees?
Why not propose a law that allows citizens to defend themselves - either physically or legally - against such abuses, so that they do not occur in the future?


Your "solution" is to create a new law that makes Hart's legal behavior illegal after the fact. That wouldn't resolve this situation, since ex-post facto laws are unconstitutional. It also wouldn't waive Mr. Hart's constitutional rights and make it legal or right for these terrorist thugs to harass him in the manner displayed in the video taken from their own patrol vehicle cameras.
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  #804  
Old 07-22-2010, 6:25 PM
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Here is my point to all of this; these deputies acted stupidly, deputy murphy was especially out of control and yes the matter merits looking into. However, this is not on the same level as deputy sheriffs who killed civil rights workers, buried them and then covered it up. Where is the cover up here? If they wanted to cover this up the video would never have been placed into evidence for trial. To prove a criminal civil right violation you need some act to cover up or omit information that shows that you knew what you were doing was a violation of a persons civil rights. To the guy who thought I must be crooked cop; no just a retired lawyer who hates the pulling of hair, the knashing of teeth and the wailing that these types of incidents cause among my fellow gun owners. I own a large collection of martial arms and if they were taken without a search warrant I would address my grievances in the civil court, not on Mr. Blackburn's web site. Unless I was looking for my 15 minutes of fame..
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  #805  
Old 07-22-2010, 6:27 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SLOTOWN View Post
"These cops acted like criminals, the only difference between a criminals actions and their's were badges and 'authority'."

When was the last time a bunch of criminals stood around and debated whether they needed a search warrant to take someone else's property?

They acted stupidly; yes. But, to compare this case to Kristalnacht, or to call all deputies in slo county jackbooted thugs is a little over the top.

What happened here was one out of control "knucklehead" with a badge and a couple of others who didn't seem to have read up on search and seizure laws made a bad decision. They didn't pull Mr. Hart's name out of a phone book and decide to go harass him "just for something to do".
You are correct on one issue... They didn't pull his name out of a phone book. I guess you don't understand what the word vendeta means. There is a history here, you were correct about that as well. I just don't think you know the entire history! And you talk about the entire video. Have you seen or heard it? If you think what Mr. Blackburn pulled out of that was bad... Maybe you should see the WHOLE thing. Nobody here is saying that Mr. Hart is perfect, but ALL of those officers present acted with total disregard!!! Are you seriously sitting here telling me that the other officers were just tagging along??? Come on! And as for the neighbors, Why did they all support Matt in court if they are so against him??? Maybe you need to get out from behind the desk your sitting at and get some real information!
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  #806  
Old 07-22-2010, 6:37 PM
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Originally Posted by SLOTOWN View Post
this is not on the same level as deputy sheriffs who killed civil rights workers, buried them and then covered it up.
What is your point? Are we not allowed to be dismayed about a violation of constitutional rights simply because this is not the worst incident?

The rest of your post isn't really addressing why you were getting grief from some members. They were jumping on you (myself included) because your solution to preventing this problem from happening again is less "Bringing the offenders to justice" and more "Let's restrict shooting even more. If we make what he was doing illegal then it isn't a violation, right?" You may be a lawyer, but convincing argument is not your friend today.
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  #807  
Old 07-22-2010, 6:40 PM
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SLOTOWN, look, your words are very dangerous to the freedom of everybody in these united states. Your attitude seems to be that it is ok for police to overstep the Bill of Rights as long as its for the greater good. I don't care if you come from a left/right background, you, as an American Citizen need to defend the Constitution and Bill of Rights with all your words and actions. YOU. Everyone of us does. This isn't even about a vendetta between an officer and another citizen, it's about what our culture thinks of Government Authority vs Personal Responsibility. If you think the gov should take care of our personal safety and every little need... then by all means continue, but I would call that un-American and very dangerous to our liberty. Mr. Hart's case may be an example of an LEO using his authority to act on his vendetta, and yes that's terrible, and yes that is one of the risks of giving citizens that kind of authority... but the issue is the Bill of Rights. Officer Murphy completely disregarded it, raped it, and honestly, for that I think he should be in prison for the rest of his life or worse.

I think our gov should take care of it's people, we give it a hell of a lot of money, it ought to do something with it. But passing laws does not count as 'doing something'

erghgh... /rant off
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  #808  
Old 07-22-2010, 6:41 PM
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Originally Posted by SLOTOWN View Post
I checked and Kern, Santa Barbara and Ventura counties have similar ordinances.
Since you already did the research, please post those ordinances so everyone can see how "similar" they are.
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  #809  
Old 07-22-2010, 6:44 PM
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"vendetta"? The entire sheriff's office? Maybe deputy Murphy but the rest looked like they were trying to figure out how to get out of their with the least amount of work possible, hence not writing a search warrant, which given the nature of the allegations a judge would have signed. Again if Mr. Hart has suffered damages he should pursue civil action in Federal Court. If the court finds the officers acted maliciously they will award treble damages; three times the jury award, plus punitive damages that the officers have to pay personally.
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  #810  
Old 07-22-2010, 6:58 PM
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172: Does anyone know if there was a complaint made against these officers or if so were they disciplined? Is the Sheriff only now learning of these acts? Their is a rush to judgement to condemn an entire department. Surly there must be some honest deputies? As for the county ordinance I confess I through out to make a point, which was missed. Come off like a bunch of gun nuts and the liberal controlled BOS will enact a shooting ban. The Los Padres Natl Forest just enacted one for everything west of Hi Mountain Road. Mr. Hart should address this through the courts civilly if he has a case.
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  #811  
Old 07-22-2010, 7:01 PM
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172: Does anyone know if there was a complaint made against these officers or if so were they disciplined? Is the Sheriff only now learning of these acts? Their is a rush to judgement to condemn an entire department. Surly there must be some honest deputies? As for the county ordinance I confess I through out to make a point, which was missed. Come off like a bunch of gun nuts and the liberal controlled BOS will enact a shooting ban. The Los Padres Natl Forest just enacted one for everything west of Hi Mountain Road. Mr. Hart should address this through the courts civilly if he has a case and I think he does. Let's see if the media runs the story and if the sheriff department has any explanation.
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  #812  
Old 07-22-2010, 7:04 PM
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Originally Posted by SLOTOWN View Post
172: Does anyone know if there was a complaint made against these officers or if so were they disciplined? Is the Sheriff only now learning of these acts? Their is a rush to judgement to condemn an entire department. Surly there must be some honest deputies? As for the county ordinance I confess I through out to make a point, which was missed. Come off like a bunch of gun nuts and the liberal controlled BOS will enact a shooting ban. The Los Padres Natl Forest just enacted one for everything west of Hi Mountain Road. Mr. Hart should address this through the courts civilly if he has a case.
You should read the rest of the posts on here if you are worried about people condemning an entire police force. A few here and there were, but the majority of us were not. However this SD apparently has a reputation already, which is what some posters were trying to express. As for the rest of your response, anything we do will come off as "gun nuts" to many liberals. That doesn't mean we should give up fighting. Them thinking we look like gun nuts is THEIR problem, not ours.
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  #813  
Old 07-22-2010, 7:10 PM
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Originally Posted by SLOTOWN View Post
172: Does anyone know if there was a complaint made against these officers or if so were they disciplined? Is the Sheriff only now learning of these acts? Their is a rush to judgement to condemn an entire department. Surly there must be some honest deputies? As for the county ordinance I confess I through out to make a point, which was missed. Come off like a bunch of gun nuts and the liberal controlled BOS will enact a shooting ban. The Los Padres Natl Forest just enacted one for everything west of Hi Mountain Road. Mr. Hart should address this through the courts civilly if he has a case and I think he does. Let's see if the media runs the story and if the sheriff department has any explanation.
Oh, guess we'd all better shutup and toe the line then. Between this and your previous post about resolving the issue by enacting stricter bans of rural shooting I'm thinking you might want to move on.
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  #814  
Old 07-22-2010, 7:30 PM
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Oh, guess we'd all better shut up and toe the line then. Between this and your previous post about resolving the issue by enacting stricter bans of rural shooting I'm thinking you might want to move on.
If we all "shut up and toed the line" the liberals would have already taken our guns! Who cares if we are labeled "gun nuts", it's a liberal label. They can all kiss my ace!!!
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  #815  
Old 07-22-2010, 7:45 PM
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Originally Posted by SLOTOWN View Post
One last note, I understand Mr. Murphy, Esquire, now works as a public defender, which is why he retired from law enforcement.

I don't know if this is his form of a mea culpa, or if he just came up with a more creative way to put criminals behind bars; by representing them!

Also, I have spoken to my county supervisor and he supports a county ordinance making it illegal to discharge a firearm in the unincorporated areas, the exceptions being firearms ranges and parcels over 40 acres. He said he will speak to supervisor Hill and Supervisor Gibson about getting one on the next BOS agenda. That type of ordinance would have prevented this whole sordid affair because Mr. Hart surely would not have violated the law and been "plinking" on his 2 acres if such a county ordinance had been the law..

I checked and Kern, Santa Barbara and Ventura counties have similar ordinances.
Another supporter of the wealthy having more rights than the rest of us. Great! Welcome! You're sure to find a lot of friends here.
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  #816  
Old 07-22-2010, 7:50 PM
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http://freedomwatch.uservoice.com/fo...ry-t?ref=title

For those who just found this thread, we are voting to get this story picked up by Andrew Napolitano and his show Freedom Watch....

...You can submit three votes at once (per browser, per computer) and DO NOT NEED TO REGISTER. It only takes about 10 seconds to vote, so click the link now!
Bump.
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  #817  
Old 07-22-2010, 8:12 PM
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Originally Posted by SLOTOWN View Post
"These cops acted like criminals, the only difference between a criminals actions and their's were badges and 'authority'."

When was the last time a bunch of criminals stood around and debated whether they needed a search warrant to take someone else's property?

They acted stupidly; yes. But, to compare this case to Kristalnacht, or to call all deputies in slo county jackbooted thugs is a little over the top.

What happened here was one out of control "knucklehead" with a badge and a couple of others who didn't seem to have read up on search and seizure laws made a bad decision. They didn't pull Mr. Hart's name out of a phone book and decide to go harass him "just for something to do".
So, let me get this straight: blatantly violating his 4th Amendment rights to a degree that even non-LEOs here can recognize as outside the scope of well-established law, and then trying to come up with some lame excuses as to why they did it, as well as filing several false felony charges against him, isn't a crime because Mr. Hart may not have been a model citizen (according to you), even though what he was doing was not a crime. Does that about sum it up?

As a former LEO myself, like several others who have posted here, I can tell you that what they did was well beyond the scope of well-established 4th Amendment law, and they all should have known this. This isn't just "bad judgement", it's criminal behavior. The badge and the uniform don't transform one into the other. Whatever else was on the tape (we don't even know how much of that "5 hours" had anything to do with the incident, and how much was just time the tape was running before Murphy got the call, or after they finished with Mr. Hart - probably the vast majority of it), they really didn't have legitimate reason to enter his house, and they absolutely had no excuse at all for opening his safe or seizing his guns. Nothing that could have been edited out would excuse what wasn't.

It doesn't matter what their history with him was, or how much of a pain he might have been to his neighbors (not that I necessarily accept that your version is true). A person's rights aren't reduced because people, including the police, don't like him. If anything, that works against the deputies in this case, because it indicates that they had a credible motive for violating his rights, and at the same time gives them no excuse.

By the way, this isn't about gun rights, it's about 4th Amendment rights and due process. These jack-booted thugs thought (according to you, simply because they didn't like him) that they could abuse their authority to teach him a lesson and ruin his life. They illegally broke into his home and stole his property. The fact that they might have already disliked him personally just makes them more guilty, not less.
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  #818  
Old 07-22-2010, 8:25 PM
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Maybe deputy Murphy but the rest looked like they were trying to figure out how to get out of their with the least amount of work possible, hence not writing a search warrant, which given the nature of the allegations a judge would have signed.
What allegations? The most they could say before they illegally entered his house was that he was outside in his yard shooting his .22 at some targets (which is not illegal). Even if they could make the charges of "negligent discharge" and "brandishing" stick, how does that lead to probable cause of any other crime, let alone one that they would need to enter his house to investigate? There is no reasonable explanation of why they would need to enter his home to gather evidence in support of either of those two charges.

They had absolutely zero probable cause to enter the house. They themselves make it clear they know this, right on the tape, because they don't even try to use that as their excuse. Instead they claim "exigent circumstances" (which didn't exist either, but are easier to invent, and are only necessary when you lack probable cause to secure a warrant), because they have no probable cause, or even evidence of a crime outside the house. The entry and search of the house was illegal, as was the search of the safe and the confiscation of the guns. Had they gone to a judge for a warrant, they would have been laughed out of his/her office.

Last edited by GaryV; 07-22-2010 at 8:29 PM..
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  #819  
Old 07-22-2010, 8:38 PM
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"vendetta"? The entire sheriff's office? Maybe deputy Murphy but the rest looked like they were trying to figure out how to get out of their with the least amount of work possible, hence not writing a search warrant, which given the nature of the allegations a judge would have signed.
Really? A judge would've signed the warrant? Why? For what?

Sheriff's Deputy: See here judge, there's this guy that was legally shooting on his property and we want to arrest him for something.

Judge: Arrest him for what?

Sheriff's Deputy: Oh I don't know. But I'm sure I can invent something even if I don't find anything. I just flat out don't like the guy so I need to nail him somehow. We just need a search warrant to dig around and see if we can find something.

Judge: Oh ok. That sounds good enough for me! Here's your warrant.


Uh yeah, sure. They would get the warrant. Sure.
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  #820  
Old 07-22-2010, 8:52 PM
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Imagine the justice!
It's not like he really cared or had some incentive to protect the car, your tax dollars paid for it!

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  #821  
Old 07-22-2010, 8:53 PM
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blb24:
As for this whole affair I am sure everything will come out, including what else was on the 5 hours of video footage that was edited down to 22 minutes by Mr. Blackburn. I am betting the other 4 hours and 38 minutes puts this case in a different light.
I await the discovery, whichever way it goes.

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blb24:
And while we are on the subject maybe I will do a documentary featuring Mr. Hart's neighbors, who have put up with his unsafe shooting for years.
Prior identified dirtbag? Hence the comment by Dep. Murphy that he was going to bust him even before he arrived on the scene? Hmmmmmm ...

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blb24:
I'm not defending Deputy Murphy he acted like a real knucklehead, but lets not canonize Mr. Hart just yet. There is a long history between him, his neighbors and the county sheriff's office and you might want to get those facts straight before you make him your "poster child" for gun rights...
Yup, prior identified dirtbag. No holds barred, go for it? He should perhaps just consider himself lucky that he didn't end up like Bernales, Vestal, Maithen and Yecny?
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Old 07-22-2010, 9:10 PM
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blb24:

The Deputy Murphy you were told still works at the sheriff's office is ANOTHER Deputy Murphy; there were two. One retired and one still works there. They are not related and the one still on the job had nothing to do with anything depicted in the video.

As for this whole affair I am sure everything will come out, including what else was on the 5 hours of video footage that was edited down to 22 minutes by Mr. Blackburn.

I am betting the other 4 hours and 38 minutes puts this case in a different light. And while we are on the subject maybe I will do a documentary featuring Mr. Hart's neighbors, who have put up with his unsafe shooting for years.

I'm not defending Deputy Murphy he acted like a real knucklehead, but lets not canonize Mr. Hart just yet. There is a long history between him, his neighbors and the county sheriff's office and you might want to get those facts straight before you make him your "poster child" for gun rights...
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  #823  
Old 07-22-2010, 9:12 PM
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This is disgusting. It looks like all officials in slo are onboard with the violation of this man's basic rights. Sad when things like this happen to law abiding citizens.More proof our country is headed in the wrong direction. One of these days.........history repeats itself.
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  #824  
Old 07-22-2010, 9:26 PM
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Here is my point to all of this; these deputies acted stupidly, deputy murphy was especially out of control and yes the matter merits looking into. However, this is not on the same level as deputy sheriffs who killed civil rights workers, buried them and then covered it up. Where is the cover up here?
When a group of officers conspire to falsify information in their reports by using "flowery language" (code for "not truthful") it is a coverup.

They were not just acting "stupidly", they were knowingly and willfully violating the law and violating a citizen's civil rights. They know they crossed the line, and discuss how they are going to avoid getting prosecuted for it.
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Old 07-22-2010, 9:28 PM
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Mr SLOTOWN:
I think you better re-read my post!!! I did not call ALL deputies jackbooted savages! I was referring to the incident. There are some good deputies out there, unfortunately in our county they are few and far between.
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Old 07-22-2010, 9:34 PM
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"vendetta"? The entire sheriff's office? Maybe deputy Murphy but the rest looked like they were trying to figure out how to get out of their with the least amount of work possible, hence not writing a search warrant, which given the nature of the allegations a judge would have signed.
What judge would have signed a warrant to search a man's house - including the contents of his safe, based on a report that he had been firing a rifle on his own property, in an unincorporated, rural area where it is legal for him to do so?
What would be the point of such a search? To find the rifle that citizen Hart had already shown to police?

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Again if Mr. Hart has suffered damages he should pursue civil action in Federal Court. If the court finds the officers acted maliciously they will award treble damages; three times the jury award, plus punitive damages that the officers have to pay personally.
Citizen Hart might not have ready access to the tens of thousands of dollars that such a case might cost. This is why it is important for citizens like him, who have had their rights violated, to get their stories out - so that civil rights groups - like the ACLU or the CalGuns Foundation - can assist with the suit.
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Old 07-22-2010, 9:41 PM
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Question: Can't Mr. Hart, the victim of a crime, go to the Grand Jury and swear out/issue a warrant on all of the Deputy's involved, accusing them of felonies. Won't the Grand Jury then, if the case has merit, set up a preliminary hearing before a district Judge, bypassing the DA's office? Being that this is a case of a Civil Rights abuse under the color of authority, and a violation of the public trust, I believe it definitely has merit. Feel free to correct me if I am mistaken, it has been a long time since I have had a civics class, but I believe a citizen has the ability to swear out/issue a warrant just like LE can, and I believe the Grand Jury must take some sort of action.
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  #828  
Old 07-22-2010, 9:43 PM
greasemonkey greasemonkey is offline
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Slotown, great to see you have a gun collection that you tried to hide behind when making your comments about how if shooting had been banned none of this would've come about. If bank robbing had been banned sooner, maybe Wells Fargo would not have lost so many stagecoaches.

Did you go to a dinner in San Francisco recently? Your buddies at LCAV had a big hoopla, you can go on down the road and take your fundamental rights-grabbing lunacy to bat with them...but FYI, they're losing, a lot, they're really good at losing. And it's to the Calguns Foundation and Second Amendment Foundation attorneys, some would say they're in the major league.

And Kern County? Do you honestly mean to tell me that Kern County has an ordinance saying you can not shoot in unincorporated areas?! Are you high? You clearly haven't spent much time in the country in Kern County.
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Originally Posted by slotown
As for the county ordinance I confess I through out to make a point, which was missed.
"Um, I made something up to try to make a point and no one agreed with me cause you're all gun nuts"...lol, you is one smart feller. Have any other imaginary ordinances you'd like to share with us?
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  #829  
Old 07-22-2010, 9:45 PM
joedogboy joedogboy is offline
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You know, even if Hart were a total dirtbag, the deputies were still breaking the law, and need to be punished to the full extent of the law for their infractions.

Actually, if Hart were a total dirtbag, it would be even more important for the deputies to stay within the law and ensure that the bust wasn't thrown out due to their lack of professionalism and outright criminal behavior.

Please note that I am not accusing citizen Hart of being a dirtbag - we have seen no convincing evidence that he actually broke any laws, and I assume that he is just a law abiding citizen who got in the way of some crooked cops.

Last edited by joedogboy; 07-22-2010 at 10:05 PM..
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  #830  
Old 07-22-2010, 9:52 PM
joedogboy joedogboy is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SLOTOWN View Post
172: Does anyone know if there was a complaint made against these officers or if so were they disciplined? Is the Sheriff only now learning of these acts? Their is a rush to judgement to condemn an entire department. Surly there must be some honest deputies?
The honest deputies within that organization have been "condemned" by the behavior of the criminals who have tarnished the reputation of the entire department.
This incident seems to be just one of several that show a pattern - from the top down - of civil rights abuses. These include other members of their own department who have sued due to 4th Amendment violations.
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  #831  
Old 07-22-2010, 9:56 PM
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Is that you, Hedges?
HAHA. Probally.
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Old 07-22-2010, 10:02 PM
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Here is my point to all of this; these deputies acted stupidly, deputy murphy was especially out of control and yes the matter merits looking into. However, this is not on the same level as deputy sheriffs who killed civil rights workers, buried them and then covered it up. Where is the cover up here? If they wanted to cover this up the video would never have been placed into evidence for trial. To prove a criminal civil right violation you need some act to cover up or omit information that shows that you knew what you were doing was a violation of a persons civil rights. To the guy who thought I must be crooked cop; no just a retired lawyer who hates the pulling of hair, the knashing of teeth and the wailing that these types of incidents cause among my fellow gun owners. I own a large collection of martial arms and if they were taken without a search warrant I would address my grievances in the civil court, not on Mr. Blackburn's web site. Unless I was looking for my 15 minutes of fame..
Fifteen minutes of fame? Are you kidding me? Who's to say he didn't spend the last two years OUT OF THE LIMELIGHT trying to figure out how to get his guns (and rights) back? Everyone knows that the media is a very powerful force to get action taken, and it almost seems to me that if anything, Mr. Hart used this as a last resort. I don't know what his motivations were, but since we're all speculating, it sure seems that waiting two years isn't trying to get his "15 minutes." That's just plain ignorant.
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Old 07-22-2010, 10:03 PM
GuyW GuyW is offline
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Originally Posted by SLOTOWN View Post

a search warrant, which given the nature of the allegations a judge would have signed.
Then SLO not only has stupid, lying deputies, it has stupid judges...
.
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Old 07-22-2010, 10:08 PM
guayuque guayuque is offline
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Originally Posted by SLOTOWN View Post
blb24:

The Deputy Murphy you were told still works at the sheriff's office is ANOTHER Deputy Murphy; there were two. One retired and one still works there. They are not related and the one still on the job had nothing to do with anything depicted in the video.

As for this whole affair I am sure everything will come out, including what else was on the 5 hours of video footage that was edited down to 22 minutes by Mr. Blackburn.

I am betting the other 4 hours and 38 minutes puts this case in a different light. And while we are on the subject maybe I will do a documentary featuring Mr. Hart's neighbors, who have put up with his unsafe shooting for years.

I'm not defending Deputy Murphy he acted like a real knucklehead, but lets not canonize Mr. Hart just yet. There is a long history between him, his neighbors and the county sheriff's office and you might want to get those facts straight before you make him your "poster child" for gun rights...
You may be missing the point. it is irrelevant who Mr. Hart is or what he has done. His Constitution rights are not subject to a sliding scale based on unsubstantiated comments about his firing weapons. The simpel fact of the matter is that there was no Constitution basis (state or federal) for this invasion. Attempting to vilify Mr. hart does not change the equation. Cops manufacturing PC after the fact is illegal, criminal, unethical, against their oath, and un-American, period.
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  #835  
Old 07-22-2010, 10:10 PM
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choprzrul choprzrul is offline
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Is that you, Hedges?
...Hedges...Parkinson...Murphy...DA...fanboy of all of the above...

Sure seems plain enough to the rest of use. Easy to ID.

.
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  #836  
Old 07-22-2010, 10:13 PM
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choprzrul choprzrul is offline
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Originally Posted by guayuque View Post
You may be missing the point. it is irrelevant who Mr. Hart is or what he has done. His Constitution rights are not subject to a sliding scale based on unsubstantiated comments about his firing weapons. The simpel fact of the matter is that there was no Constitution basis (state or federal) for this invasion. Attempting to vilify Mr. hart does not change the equation. Cops manufacturing PC after the fact is illegal, criminal, unethical, against their oath, and un-American, period.
Isn't it just terrible when gun owners have the Constitution on their side? The socialist fanboys are beside themselves.

Is this whole incident an example of state (gov entity) sponsored terror?

.
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  #837  
Old 07-22-2010, 10:13 PM
guayuque guayuque is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SLOTOWN View Post
Here is my point to all of this; these deputies acted stupidly, deputy murphy was especially out of control and yes the matter merits looking into. However, this is not on the same level as deputy sheriffs who killed civil rights workers, buried them and then covered it up. Where is the cover up here? If they wanted to cover this up the video would never have been placed into evidence for trial. To prove a criminal civil right violation you need some act to cover up or omit information that shows that you knew what you were doing was a violation of a persons civil rights. To the guy who thought I must be crooked cop; no just a retired lawyer who hates the pulling of hair, the knashing of teeth and the wailing that these types of incidents cause among my fellow gun owners. I own a large collection of martial arms and if they were taken without a search warrant I would address my grievances in the civil court, not on Mr. Blackburn's web site. Unless I was looking for my 15 minutes of fame..
Wrong. it is precisrly on that level. A violation of the Constitution is no less egregious because of the end result. the minute we tale about a sliding scale is the minute you give license to ignoring the Consitution for "minor" violations. There are no minor violations, just as there is no minor pregancy. Either it is or it is not. There is no justification for this behavior and referencing murders does not diminish the crime these bad cops committed.
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  #838  
Old 07-22-2010, 10:14 PM
guayuque guayuque is offline
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Originally Posted by choprzrul View Post
Isn't it just terrible when gun owners have the Constitution on their side? The socialist fanboys are beside themselves.

Is this whole incident an example of state (gov entity) sponsored terror?

.
What? Not sure what you mean here.
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  #839  
Old 07-22-2010, 10:16 PM
greasemonkey greasemonkey is offline
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Then SLO not only has stupid, lying deputies, it has stupid judges...
.
I guess conspiring how to not be prosecuted for intentionally and knowingly violating someone's civil rights is the new stupid. With so much stupid running around the upper echelon of SLO, it's no wonder slotown-hedges is saying some of the things he is. I call that trickle-down stupid, it's kinda like trickle-down economics.
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Old 07-22-2010, 10:19 PM
greasemonkey greasemonkey is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by guayuque View Post
You may be missing the point. it is irrelevant who Mr. Hart is or what he has done. His Constitution rights are not subject to a sliding scale based on unsubstantiated comments about his firing weapons. The simpel fact of the matter is that there was no Constitution basis (state or federal) for this invasion. Attempting to vilify Mr. hart does not change the equation. Cops manufacturing PC after the fact is illegal, criminal, unethical, against their oath, and un-American, period.
I'm waiting for slotown to come out with the "but think of the children" argument, he's getting close.
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