|
FFL's Forum For open discussion between FFLs and polite questions for FFLs. |
|
Thread Tools | Display Modes |
#1
|
||||
|
||||
AB 2165 / PC 32000.(b)(6) ???
So does anyone know much about this? I'm hearing all kinds of things and we called the DOJ which would not answer any specific questions and just referred us to PC 3200 Sub B Paragraph 6 which didn't answer anything for us.
Could someone please explain this in plain English? Can LEO still ppt off roster firearms to non LEO? Are peace officers such as correctional officers also able to continue to ppt off roster firearms to non peace officers?
__________________
Elite Armory 3636 Castro Valley Blvd #1 Castro Valley, CA 94546 (510) 538-1686 Hours: Tues-Sat: 11:00am-6:30pm Elite Armory Plus 7601 W 11th Street Tracy, CA 95304 (209) 362-2010 Hours: Tues-Fri: 11:00am - 7:00pm Sat-Sun: 10:00am - 8:00pm *Follow us on Twitter and/or FaceBook for updates on what we have coming into the shop. |
#3
|
||||
|
||||
Quote:
OTOH, they may still PPT off-Roster guns they got by earlier PPT or by intrafamilial transfer or inheritance.
__________________
ARCHIVED Calguns Foundation Wiki here: http://web.archive.org/web/201908310...itle=Main_Page "The object of life is not to be on the side of the majority, but to escape finding oneself in the ranks of the insane."Ann Althouse: “Begin with the hypothesis that what they did is what they wanted to do. If they postured that they wanted to do something else, regard that as a con. Work from there. The world will make much more sense.” Not a lawyer, just Some Guy On The Interwebs. |
#4
|
|||
|
|||
Yep.
|
#5
|
||||
|
||||
Thanks for the clarification.
What specifically are the new qualified agents?
__________________
Elite Armory 3636 Castro Valley Blvd #1 Castro Valley, CA 94546 (510) 538-1686 Hours: Tues-Sat: 11:00am-6:30pm Elite Armory Plus 7601 W 11th Street Tracy, CA 95304 (209) 362-2010 Hours: Tues-Fri: 11:00am - 7:00pm Sat-Sun: 10:00am - 8:00pm *Follow us on Twitter and/or FaceBook for updates on what we have coming into the shop. |
#6
|
|||
|
|||
Quote:
(A) The Department of Parks and Recreation. (B) The Department of Alcoholic Beverage Control. (C) The Division of Investigation of the Department of Consumer Affairs. (D) The Department of Motor Vehicles. (E) The Fraud Division of the Department of Insurance. (F) The State Department of State Hospitals. (G) The Department of Fish and Wildlife. (H) The State Department of Developmental Services. (I) The Department of Forestry and Fire Protection. (J) A county probation department. (K) The Los Angeles World Airports, as defined in Section 830.15. (L) A K–12 public school district for use by a school police officer, as described in Section 830.32. (M) A municipal water district for use by a park ranger, as described in Section 830.34. (N) A county for use by a welfare fraud investigator or inspector, as described in Section 830.35. (O) A county for use by the coroner or the deputy coroner, as described in Section 830.35. (P) The Supreme Court and the courts of appeal for use by marshals of the Supreme Court and bailiffs of the courts of appeal, and coordinators of security for the judicial branch, as described in Section 830.36. (Q) A fire department or fire protection agency of a county, city, city and county, district, or the state for use by either of the following: (i) A member of an arson-investigating unit, regularly paid and employed in that capacity pursuant to Section 830.37. (ii) A member other than a member of an arson-investigating unit, regularly paid and employed in that capacity pursuant to Section 830.37. (R) The University of California Police Department, or the California State University Police Departments, as described in Section 830.2. (S) A California Community College police department, as described in Section 830.32. For LCM's here is the penal code (32405) applicable to the sale of such magazines to LEO's (pretty much covers all gun toting local/state/fed LEO regardless of agency name): Penal Code Section 32405. Section 32310 does not apply to the sale to, lending to, transfer to, purchase by, receipt of, possession of, or importation into this state of, a large-capacity magazine by a sworn peace officer, as defined in Chapter 4.5 (commencing with Section 830) of Title 3 of Part 2, or sworn federal law enforcement officer, who is authorized to carry a firearm in the course and scope of that officer’s duties. ^ Last edited by Patfishandshoot; 01-03-2017 at 6:28 PM.. |
#7
|
||||
|
||||
For this post 2017 PPT thing.. are we (FFLs) supposed to know this or will DOJ kick it back if one of these LEOs tries to PPT an off roster they recently received and didn't like? I just had an LEO (not in the above category) that purchased a Glock 43 that he didn't like as his carry piece (preferred his Ruger LC9s) and sold it off (in this case to his lucky brother). If he was in one of these new categories, how am I supposed know that? Especially, if they as the seller, don't have any reason to present me their exempt credentials in a sale scenario?
__________________
UG Imports - Fremont, CA FFL - Transfers, New Gun Sales Closure Schedule: http://ugimports.com/closed web: http://ugimports.com/calguns / email: sales@ugimports.com phone: (510) 371-GUNS (4867) Crowdsourced 2A Calendar I AM THE MAJORITY!!! Amazon Links Posted May be Paid Links |
#8
|
||||
|
||||
Quote:
If the FFL has any exposure, then I guess you have to start asking every single person who PPT sells: 1) are you Leo (If yes) 2) are you one of the newly exempt Leos (If yes) 3) did you acquire this gun using the exemption Or you could just ask it as one long question. And you probably should collect affidavits of answers to those questions from every seller. If the FFL has no exposure, then I wouldn't bother asking anything. After all, you dont ask sellers if the guns are stolen. It's on them. I can't believe the DOJ has no guidance, but it is typical for them. They want everyone pro-gun to stumble into a crime. Last edited by SkyHawk; 01-03-2017 at 11:40 PM.. |
#9
|
||||
|
||||
Quote:
Old reference: http://www.latimes.com/local/lanow/l...928-story.html I don't recall what the results of that were.
__________________
UG Imports - Fremont, CA FFL - Transfers, New Gun Sales Closure Schedule: http://ugimports.com/closed web: http://ugimports.com/calguns / email: sales@ugimports.com phone: (510) 371-GUNS (4867) Crowdsourced 2A Calendar I AM THE MAJORITY!!! Amazon Links Posted May be Paid Links |
#10
|
||||
|
||||
Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
__________________
ARCHIVED Calguns Foundation Wiki here: http://web.archive.org/web/201908310...itle=Main_Page "The object of life is not to be on the side of the majority, but to escape finding oneself in the ranks of the insane."Ann Althouse: “Begin with the hypothesis that what they did is what they wanted to do. If they postured that they wanted to do something else, regard that as a con. Work from there. The world will make much more sense.” Not a lawyer, just Some Guy On The Interwebs. Last edited by Librarian; 01-04-2017 at 12:55 PM.. |
#11
|
|||
|
|||
Quote:
|
#13
|
||||
|
||||
I'm sure you all realize this but the DMV investigations unit has at least one 832 PC uninformed "investigator" (PEACE OFFICER) the Fire Dept.has arson inv. Officers. (PEACE OFFICER) etc even the post office has Ferdral Peace Officers and the Military has uniformed an UC Fed. Cops.
So I think someone is not seeing the broader picure...Could be me but I don't know what all the whoopla is about. I retired as an Los Angeles cop in 2014 and that does put me further out of the loop. Sent from my SM-N950U using Tapatalk |
#14
|
||||
|
||||
PC32000 has absolutely nothing to do with peace officer status or even law enforcement status (in a traditional sense) for that matter. The only requirement is for individuals to be "sworn" members of the listed agencies i.e. custodial deputies, correctional officers, and security officers with limited peace officer powers from an SO may purchase under the original exemption while full POST, full powered peace officers from other organizations are under the new, "lesser" class.
This statute has everything to do with control and nothing to do with logic. Last edited by code_blue; 02-12-2018 at 9:43 AM.. |
#15
|
|||
|
|||
Quote:
She was a civilian employee of the Sheriffs Dept. and I do not believe was allowed to carry even on the job. |
#17
|
||||
|
||||
Hmmm, this came back to life.
__________________
Kemasa. False signature edited by Paul: Banned from the FFL forum due to being rude and insulting. Doing this continues his abuse. Don't tell someone to read the rules he wrote or tell him that he is wrong. Never try to teach a pig to sing. You waste your time and you annoy the pig. - Robert A. Heinlein |
#18
|
||||
|
||||
Quote:
A CA FFL has no means of knowing that the firearm was transferred using a LEO exemption, nor what type of LEO the person is/was. The CA DOJ does not ask for the type of LEO for the DROS, so it is not directly recorded by means of the DES. I don't trust the courts to accept that the FFL did not know nor had no means of confirming how the firearm was transferred previously. At least if the FFL asks, then it shows that they attempted to ensure that they were not violating the law.
__________________
Kemasa. False signature edited by Paul: Banned from the FFL forum due to being rude and insulting. Doing this continues his abuse. Don't tell someone to read the rules he wrote or tell him that he is wrong. Never try to teach a pig to sing. You waste your time and you annoy the pig. - Robert A. Heinlein |
#20
|
||||
|
||||
DOJ just released a form as well too.
__________________
UG Imports - Fremont, CA FFL - Transfers, New Gun Sales Closure Schedule: http://ugimports.com/closed web: http://ugimports.com/calguns / email: sales@ugimports.com phone: (510) 371-GUNS (4867) Crowdsourced 2A Calendar I AM THE MAJORITY!!! Amazon Links Posted May be Paid Links |
#22
|
||||
|
||||
5th page of bulletin sent out this morning.
Title of Bulletin: Assembly Bill 2165 BOF 1009 (Rev 01/2018)
__________________
UG Imports - Fremont, CA FFL - Transfers, New Gun Sales Closure Schedule: http://ugimports.com/closed web: http://ugimports.com/calguns / email: sales@ugimports.com phone: (510) 371-GUNS (4867) Crowdsourced 2A Calendar I AM THE MAJORITY!!! Amazon Links Posted May be Paid Links Last edited by ugimports; 03-28-2018 at 10:23 AM.. Reason: added title and form info |
#23
|
|||
|
|||
I don't see where that "gets us off the hook" if the person does not identify their duties in a ppt situation
|
#24
|
||||
|
||||
Correct, I meant that it was a form to document that type of PPT. I probably didn't read this thread properly when I responded since it's the exact opposite of what was being discussed.
__________________
UG Imports - Fremont, CA FFL - Transfers, New Gun Sales Closure Schedule: http://ugimports.com/closed web: http://ugimports.com/calguns / email: sales@ugimports.com phone: (510) 371-GUNS (4867) Crowdsourced 2A Calendar I AM THE MAJORITY!!! Amazon Links Posted May be Paid Links |
#25
|
|||
|
|||
The form does not. It's not a bad idea to have a lawyer right up a document like OCARMORY did or have the seller sign something saying they did not acquire the firearm through the AB2165 exemption.
|
#26
|
||||
|
||||
How is a FFL supposed to know to use the CA DOJ form? The seller has to admit how they got the firearm and they only way that they might admit it is if they are asked, which means that a FFL has to question anyone selling an off-roster firearm to see how they got it. Not a good position to be in because if you don't think that the person is telling the truth or refuses to say, what is to be done?
__________________
Kemasa. False signature edited by Paul: Banned from the FFL forum due to being rude and insulting. Doing this continues his abuse. Don't tell someone to read the rules he wrote or tell him that he is wrong. Never try to teach a pig to sing. You waste your time and you annoy the pig. - Robert A. Heinlein |
#27
|
|||
|
|||
Useless form. If I identify a non-compliant transfer, we STOP. If the transfer is legit, then the form is not applicable.
I saw one other person say it, but I love telling members of these agencies that The State of California considers them Second Class Law Enforcement, and that their right to sell personally owned property is being infringed. With a nearly 100% response rate is "I don't care, I'll sell it if I want" and "my chief said they were gonna fix that". |
#29
|
||||
|
||||
yes
__________________
UG Imports - Fremont, CA FFL - Transfers, New Gun Sales Closure Schedule: http://ugimports.com/closed web: http://ugimports.com/calguns / email: sales@ugimports.com phone: (510) 371-GUNS (4867) Crowdsourced 2A Calendar I AM THE MAJORITY!!! Amazon Links Posted May be Paid Links |
Thread Tools | |
Display Modes | |
|
|