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  #1  
Old 05-11-2018, 3:42 PM
Engine104 Engine104 is offline
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Default LAPD Issuing M&P 9s?

I was just watching today's LAPD graduation on Twitter. The guns issued to new officers look more like M&P 9mm than Glocks. The trigger guard and Picatinny rail are not Glock. I thought Glock was the standard issued firearm for new officers?

There is a pretty good photo of one on Chief Beck's Twitter feed right now. https://twitter.com/LAPDChiefBeck
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  #2  
Old 05-11-2018, 7:49 PM
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They have been issuing the M&P for a few years now.
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  #3  
Old 05-11-2018, 8:15 PM
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S & W went aggresively after many law enforcement agencies a few years ago. my dept switched to the MP as well. if I remember a conversation, the dept was offered each pistol at just over 300 each with 5 magazines each and lifetime repair. pretty good deal for most department's.
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  #4  
Old 05-11-2018, 8:17 PM
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Great sidearm, terrible "Chief"
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  #5  
Old 05-12-2018, 1:59 PM
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Originally Posted by seal20 View Post
Great sidearm, terrible "Chief"
lol isn't that the way it always seems to be?!
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  #6  
Old 05-12-2018, 8:46 PM
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Thanks, guys.

I'd thought they went exclusively with Glock after giving up the Beretta M92, as far as issued firearms, anyway.

So, not much love for Chief Beck?
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  #7  
Old 05-12-2018, 8:57 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by seal20 View Post
Great sidearm, terrible "Chief"
This
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  #8  
Old 05-13-2018, 7:20 AM
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Originally Posted by Engine104 View Post
Thanks, guys.

I'd thought they went exclusively with Glock after giving up the Beretta M92, as far as issued firearms, anyway.

So, not much love for Chief Beck?
They did issue Glock for a long time... Until around 2014 or so. Still lots of Glocks out there. They have a solid training program with lots of authorized guns and a great firearms cadre.
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  #9  
Old 05-13-2018, 8:40 AM
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And swivel holsters!
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  #10  
Old 05-13-2018, 9:04 AM
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And swivel holsters!
LOL!
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  #11  
Old 05-13-2018, 5:20 PM
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M&P is a horrible weapon, but Weapons Trainng swears by it. Now we have to have the guns “tested” by means of a trigger pull with a “finger” at the tip of the trigger itself. Numerous M&P’s have failed out of the box with LASD, by not going BANG when they are supposed to.

No thanks. I’ll stick with an old Beretta or a Glock. They can keep the boat anchor. S&W has never made any reliable semi autos from day one. Remember the POS “Sigma” series? Those are where nightmares come from. Then they had their “3rd gen” series which were either “acceptable” for some, yet a complete failure for a large amount of owners. No wonder they don’t make those guns anymore. Now, S&W doesn’t even make replacement parts for those 3rd gen models.

Just my opinion. You get what you pay for.
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  #12  
Old 05-13-2018, 8:00 PM
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I'd heard the LASD issue with the M&P 9 was accidental discharges, but that was 10 years ago or so, I think. Are there still issues with the firearm?

CHP still uses the S&W 4006.
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  #13  
Old 05-13-2018, 8:01 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TrailerparkTrash View Post
M&P is a horrible weapon, but Weapons Trainng swears by it. Now we have to have the guns “tested” by means of a trigger pull with a “finger” at the tip of the trigger itself. Numerous M&P’s have failed out of the box with LASD, by not going BANG when they are supposed to.

No thanks. I’ll stick with an old Beretta or a Glock. They can keep the boat anchor. S&W has never made any reliable semi autos from day one. Remember the POS “Sigma” series? Those are where nightmares come from. Then they had their “3rd gen” series which were either “acceptable” for some, yet a complete failure for a large amount of owners. No wonder they don’t make those guns anymore. Now, S&W doesn’t even make replacement parts for those 3rd gen models.

Just my opinion. You get what you pay for.

That’s quite the opinion. Do you have any personal experience with the m&p?

I have 6 different versions of the m&p with well over 30 rounds through them within the last 3 years. I have never had any sort of malfunction that wasn’t related to ammunition. Also, our SWAT team just went with 2.0 long slides and have shot the crap out of them with no issues whatsoever.
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  #14  
Old 05-13-2018, 8:10 PM
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Originally Posted by SoCalDep View Post
They did issue Glock for a long time... Until around 2014 or so. Still lots of Glocks out there. They have a solid training program with lots of authorized guns and a great firearms cadre.
Thanks for the info. I'd always thought the standard firearm for LAPD was a Glock.
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  #15  
Old 05-13-2018, 8:59 PM
TacopsDep417 TacopsDep417 is offline
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I was issued a gen 1 M&P 9. 20,000+ rounds and not one singles malfunction. Mine has run flawlessly till this day. I have a M&P compact, m2.0 full size also and have experience no issues with those either. I train with my all my M&Ps in dirt, grass, concrete, indoor, outdoor, in the rain and in the heat. I prefer Beretta’s on duty and M&Ps for concealed carry.
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  #16  
Old 05-13-2018, 10:04 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TrailerparkTrash View Post
M&P is a horrible weapon, but Weapons Trainng swears by it. Now we have to have the guns “tested” by means of a trigger pull with a “finger” at the tip of the trigger itself. Numerous M&P’s have failed out of the box with LASD, by not going BANG when they are supposed to.

No thanks. I’ll stick with an old Beretta or a Glock. They can keep the boat anchor. S&W has never made any reliable semi autos from day one. Remember the POS “Sigma” series? Those are where nightmares come from. Then they had their “3rd gen” series which were either “acceptable” for some, yet a complete failure for a large amount of owners. No wonder they don’t make those guns anymore. Now, S&W doesn’t even make replacement parts for those 3rd gen models.

Just my opinion. You get what you pay for.
Numerous Berettas have failed. I have an injury report from a deputy that was hit in the face by the back of a Beretta slide. Glocks have their own MAJOR issues with numerous departments.

Your opinion is simply wrong.

I don't carry an M&P because it doesn't fit my hand, but if you want to see one that's been completely abused in a manner I would never do to one of my own Glocks or Berettas (and I carry a Beretta right now), and NEVER a 1911, then come on by... You know where I am. I'll show you the injury report too.

The M&P is a great gun that has been demonized by people with an agenda. I'm tired of it. I'd use stronger language but it would get me in trouble. Suffice it to say that if you have a problem, come talk to me face to face rather than trash it on the internet with a limited understanding of what is going on.

Sorry to be blunt, but this is crap. Every manufacturer has problems, and S&W isn't immune, nor are they the greatest thing for guns. That doesn't mean that it's "horrible", and the people pushing that opinion do so because they can't shoot it and don't like it.

I've shot it. I'll out shoot almost anyone on our department with it and I'm open to anyone's challenge. Bring it.

Last edited by SoCalDep; 05-14-2018 at 7:39 AM..
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  #17  
Old 05-13-2018, 10:05 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Engine104 View Post
I'd heard the LASD issue with the M&P 9 was accidental discharges, but that was 10 years ago or so, I think. Are there still issues with the firearm?

CHP still uses the S&W 4006.
CHP now issues the M&P40.
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  #18  
Old 05-14-2018, 5:17 PM
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I work in an environment (motor officer in an OHV area) that is extremely hard on weapons and have beat the crap out of my gun. My M&P 40 has been 100% reliable. I love that gun and if my department let us choose our own wepon I would choose the M&P.
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  #19  
Old 05-14-2018, 8:09 PM
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Originally Posted by SoCalDep View Post
CHP now issues the M&P40.
Nice!

Most of the CHP guys I see still have the 4006. Maybe they are issuing M&Ps at the academy.

I'll second the majority opinion on here about the quality of the M&P.
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  #20  
Old 05-14-2018, 11:10 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Engine104 View Post
Nice!

Most of the CHP guys I see still have the 4006. Maybe they are issuing M&Ps at the academy.

I'll second the majority opinion on here about the quality of the M&P.

Correct, the new classes are trained with and issued the M&P40 based on my conversation with a few recent and tenured troopers. I'm sure that "The Department" is rolling out the swaps already. I am not sure if troopers are given the option to continue using their 4006's. IIRC, the MDC is not present on the M&P's unlike the 4006, but I could be wrong.

Side note, but I know of a few agencies who've added AR15 and WML curriculum in addition to the POST mandate for firearms. The WML doesn't replace the handheld flashlight portion, but I'm sure that it is incorporated somehow. POST is usually behind the times, but that doesn't stop agencies from adding to their curriculum to ensure that their folks are trained to handle what's out there.
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  #21  
Old 05-15-2018, 9:18 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TrailerparkTrash View Post
M&P is a horrible weapon, but Weapons Trainng swears by it. Now we have to have the guns “tested” by means of a trigger pull with a “finger” at the tip of the trigger itself. Numerous M&P’s have failed out of the box with LASD, by not going BANG when they are supposed to.

No thanks. I’ll stick with an old Beretta or a Glock. They can keep the boat anchor. S&W has never made any reliable semi autos from day one. Remember the POS “Sigma” series? Those are where nightmares come from. Then they had their “3rd gen” series which were either “acceptable” for some, yet a complete failure for a large amount of owners. No wonder they don’t make those guns anymore. Now, S&W doesn’t even make replacement parts for those 3rd gen models.

Just my opinion. You get what you pay for.
My opinion of the M&P has been more favorable. I bought my own and went through the training about 8 years ago. Mine was an old gen with none of the recent improvements, and of course bone stock. It has always been a champ. I recall one light strike malfunction with questionable range ammo, cleared by slingshotting it out and continuing to shoot.

I do not care for the overly slick grips on the Gen 1 M&P. The Gen 2 is drastically improved in all ways, and I would prefer that over the Gen 1.

Of course, the Gen 4 Glock 17 trumps the entire lot and is my preferred carry gun nowadays. I have never shot a pistol better or had more confidence in anything else.
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Old 05-15-2018, 9:22 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Engine104 View Post
Thanks, guys.

I'd thought they went exclusively with Glock after giving up the Beretta M92, as far as issued firearms, anyway.

So, not much love for Chief Beck?
I think the continued presence of the Beretta 92 is a testimony to its reliability. Many of the "gun guys" still carry them and wouldn't consider anything else. An M9A1 or 92A1 with a good light and MecGar 20 round magazines is a real confidence builder.
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  #23  
Old 05-15-2018, 9:43 AM
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Those new beretta elite LTT 3s are sweet looking. Can’t wait to get mines ASAP.....
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  #24  
Old 05-15-2018, 10:25 AM
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Those new beretta elite LTT 3s are sweet looking. Can’t wait to get mines ASAP.....
Me neither! Beretta has a lot of my money this year.
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Old 05-15-2018, 10:28 AM
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Me neither! Beretta has a lot of my money this year.
Likewise!
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  #26  
Old 05-15-2018, 11:50 AM
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This is gonna be the longest 5 week wait of my life : (
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  #27  
Old 05-15-2018, 1:39 PM
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Ohman, you guys just had to go ahead and introduce me to the 92LTT...
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Old 05-15-2018, 2:03 PM
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Ooooh, that’s nice. I’ll probably be getting another G17 and CZ P10C next.
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Old 05-16-2018, 8:34 AM
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Originally Posted by TacopsDep417 View Post
Those new beretta elite LTT 3s are sweet looking. Can’t wait to get mines ASAP.....
I'd be happy with a CA friendly M9A3 with a factory non-threaded barrel.
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Old 05-16-2018, 11:20 PM
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I agree that the M&P 2.0 is vastly improved over the gen 1. I have one full size, which is in my duty gun rotation, and a compact.
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Old 05-17-2018, 8:28 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bobby Ricigliano View Post
I think the continued presence of the Beretta 92 is a testimony to its reliability. Many of the "gun guys" still carry them and wouldn't consider anything else. An M9A1 or 92A1 with a good light and MecGar 20 round magazines is a real confidence builder.
I liked my 92F so much that I bought it when I retired 15yrs. ago and still shoot it at the range. I have never had one malfunction with it. I recently had a different slide put on it that has a plug in it that prevents what I believe SoCalDep was referring to (the facial injury to the deputy hit by the rear of the slide). Please correct me if I'm wrong SoCalDep.

I can't attest to any problems with the M&P duty weapon since they weren't a duty weapon when I was on. I do carry the Shield 9mm as my CW and haven't had any problems with it.
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Old 05-17-2018, 11:03 AM
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You are correct. A 92FS slide can be retrofitted to a 92F frame along with the enlarged hammer pin which prevents the facial injury if the slide breaks. Make no mistake, the Beretta is an awesome gun and I love mine, including my 92F compact without the slide safety cut. I also really like Glocks and 1911s. The M&P feels too “round” in the grip for me but I picked up a 2.0 Compact that feels much better.
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Old 05-17-2018, 7:49 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bobby Ricigliano View Post
I think the continued presence of the Beretta 92 is a testimony to its reliability. Many of the "gun guys" still carry them and wouldn't consider anything else. An M9A1 or 92A1 with a good light and MecGar 20 round magazines is a real confidence builder.
It truly does build confidence. This M9A1 has had a few changes since this picture.



I picked up a Centurion Tactical and it's my off-duty carry gun now.



I'm still (not so) patiently waiting for a couple more Berettas I have on order. I'm hoping June will be a very good month!
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  #34  
Old 05-19-2018, 9:02 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SoCalDep View Post
Numerous Berettas have failed. I have an injury report from a deputy that was hit in the face by the back of a Beretta slide. Glocks have their own MAJOR issues with numerous departments.

Your opinion is simply wrong.

I don't carry an M&P because it doesn't fit my hand, but if you want to see one that's been completely abused in a manner I would never do to one of my own Glocks or Berettas (and I carry a Beretta right now), and NEVER a 1911, then come on by... You know where I am. I'll show you the injury report too.

The M&P is a great gun that has been demonized by people with an agenda. I'm tired of it. I'd use stronger language but it would get me in trouble. Suffice it to say that if you have a problem, come talk to me face to face rather than trash it on the internet with a limited understanding of what is going on.

Sorry to be blunt, but this is crap. Every manufacturer has problems, and S&W isn't immune, nor are they the greatest thing for guns. That doesn't mean that it's "horrible", and the people pushing that opinion do so because they can't shoot it and don't like it.

I've shot it. I'll out shoot almost anyone on our department with it and I'm open to anyone's challenge. Bring it.
You seem to be “challenging” a lot lately. That still doesn’t negate the fact that the Dept chose a junk gun and figures they can’t go back. How many recalls did the M&P have again? Again in my opinion, it’s a Frankenstein’d Sigma with a facelift. That’s my opinion and I won’t change it.

I have no “agenda,” here when it comes to the M&P. That claim is really laughable. Thanks for the offer but I have no desire to provide you with an audience while you’re shooting a gun on the range. That just doesn’t impress me much. ...if I may be blunt.

Lastly, I make the comparison that S&W along with their M&P, also brought us another little cancerous gem called the “Bodyguard .380.” Another POS (my opinion) that regularly fails on the range. I have yet to talk to any dep that own’s one who can praise its reliability.

Back to the M&P and like I said before, I don’t trust any gun where the “expert” staff directs us all, to have our M&P’s “tested” with a finger-tip trigger test on the bottom edge of the trigger itself, in order to determine it’s functioning reliability.

How many of those M&P’s have failed that test by the way and right out of the box? I was told the number several months ago when I had to have my gun tested by someone’s “calibrated index finger.” Needless to say, the trust in that M&P went out the window. When we were all told that all of our M&P’s had to be tested for functioning reliability, that was a let down. Then when we all saw and experienced what this technical stellar test of reliability actually entailed, well that was the proverbial “nail in the coffin” for me. Why didn’t you all demand that S&W get to the main issue of it and fix the specific design problem itself?

What’s the number up to now of the M&P’s that have failed that stellar reliability test? What’s the number up to on the NIB M&P’s that also failed the finger test?

Lastly, you admit you don’t even carry the M&P yourself because how it “fits your hand.” Seriously? It fits better than any other gun authorized, I’ll even admit to that. With the back strap changes, it is very comfortable for all hand sizes. But I’ll surmise that you’ll carry that 1911 on your side at the range, right? Kinda like all of the fellas at weapons training do, no?. You push for one gun, yet you carry a different one. My point being is you’re not displaying confidence in a gun that you don’t even carry, yet you tell others how wonderful it is. That doesn’t really make a credible witness to one’s claim.

Since you mentioned it, who’s the deputy that had the Beretta slide come off and hit him in the face? What year was that when it occurred and what unit was he assigned to at the time? Was it a 92F or FS model? The F model hasn’t been made since what, 30+ years ago? Now that slide injury story really interests me. Thanks.
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  #35  
Old 05-19-2018, 10:05 AM
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Oh dear.......
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Old 05-19-2018, 6:22 PM
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I offered to talk to you face to face - or on the phone, or via email. You’d rather have an anonymous and public internet battle. You’re an idiot and quite frankly a wimp. You think it’s cool to have this battle here but refuse to talk face to face or in official correspondence to discuss the issue. Anyone else who wants an explanation or to talk or whatever is welcome to PM me and I’m more than willing to talk about it, which is more than I can say for our friend here... I’m always available, unlike those who always seem to be down “due to weather”.
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Old 05-19-2018, 6:57 PM
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Yea... just shooting a gun on the range...



You could always come see it... in person... it still has mud on it. It stilll shoots. I have video and witness proof. Or don't... because at this point that's what I'd expect.
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  #38  
Old 05-19-2018, 11:03 PM
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Yea... just shooting a gun on the range...



You could always come see it... in person... it still has mud on it. It stilll shoots. I have video and witness proof. Or don't... because at this point that's what I'd expect.
Well, the way the BC Range looks now, this wouldn’t be unusual. I was up there last Thursday for my HR218 qualification and was very disappointed. Ju st because it’s non operational, doesn’t mean the weeds should take over.
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Old 05-20-2018, 7:17 AM
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I am with Glick 17 9mm since 1994. Gen2/3/4/5 . Carry G19 off duty. In the last few days I got to shoot M&P 2.0 compact 9mm. Like it very much. Very easy to shoot fast and accurately. Fired about 600 rounds through it last week. ZERO problems . Will be getting one for sure. What common problems did people experience with M&P 2.0 9mm? I would like to know before I buy one.
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Old 05-20-2018, 10:01 AM
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Samuelx Samuelx is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ron-Solo View Post
Well, the way the BC Range looks now, this wouldn’t be unusual. I was up there last Thursday for my HR218 qualification and was very disappointed. Ju st because it’s non operational, doesn’t mean the weeds should take over.
Oh but the landscaping everywhere else looks Great!!
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