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  #1  
Old 05-16-2018, 12:39 PM
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Default consumer level - does it still make sense to buy large 3.5" drives?

was going to add another drive to my desktop. limiting only to 900gb-1tb else I may be paying for way too much than what I need and drive goes down with only 10-30% utilization.

and I already put a 250gb ssd as the main drive and moved the original drive as a extra storage (somewhere around 1tb iirc). dell xps 8700 (costco).

i opted for 10k rpm and price-wise, not that much less over a ssd. i figure even with 10k rpm, the ssd would be faster still overall? it seems prices are more expensive now the smaller the drive $/gb or $/tb
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Old 05-16-2018, 12:52 PM
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I'm having a hard time making sense of your post.

SSDs are faster storing and retrieving data than any platter based drives.

If you don't care about storage performance, get whatever drive meets your storage needs at a price you like. Your OS is already on an SSD.

I haven't purchased a platter drive personally in years. I don't have a lot of capacity needs however.
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Old 05-16-2018, 12:54 PM
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10k are not useful unless you need long term high read/write. ssd will be faster than 10k in most use cases.
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Old 05-16-2018, 1:40 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Fizz View Post
I'm having a hard time making sense of your post.

SSDs are faster storing and retrieving data than any platter based drives.

If you don't care about storage performance, get whatever drive meets your storage needs at a price you like. Your OS is already on an SSD.

I haven't purchased a platter drive personally in years. I don't have a lot of capacity needs however.
yeah.. was doing on phone and tyring to minimize typing. i guess platter drives don't make sense for smaller capacity vs. ssd.

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10k are not useful unless you need long term high read/write. ssd will be faster than 10k in most use cases.
guess i'll test out how a ssd does long term. i have msata on my laptop and it does a fair amount as the main os drive and storage. i turned the laptops sata platter drive as a storage drive.
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Old 05-16-2018, 1:44 PM
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Personally, I would go with SSD for the main OS for speed. And then have a spare larger capacity hard drive for storage.
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Old 05-16-2018, 2:39 PM
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For the sake of the health of your SSD:

Eliminate your Swapfile if you have better than 8gb/RAM (12/16/Etc.). You won't need it. IF you're a heavy gamer, just add 32gb/RAM if your motherboard/chipset can handle it, and if you have the $$$ for it.
Most likely, if you have 16gb/RAM, you won't need a swapfile, regardless of what game you're playing.

If you have 8gb, or less, move your swapfile to the mechanical drive.

Have your "personal" folders (My Documents/Downloads/Etc.), directed to your mechanical drive.

All your TEMP/TMP, and any other temporary files, should be directed to your mechanical drive.

If you're a gamer, this is important, as saved games being re-written will be offset by this. If you know how to do it, your save games files can be directed to the mechanical drive in some games.

Make sure TRIM is activated for your SSD.

If you think you need a 128gb SSD.. Get a 256gb SSD. They need room to "breathe". Don't crowd it.

Keep your O/S on the SSD. If you're a gamer looking for a speed boost, install your games on your SSD!

The above has a couple of things going for it:

Even though the average user probably won't wear out the average SSD, Bear this in mind.....

SSD's deteriorate as their data is "erased". The memory cells have a finite number of times they can be written to/erased. Doing the above decreases the rate of that deterioration exponentially! especially for Gamers.
Using TRIM, increases the life of your SSD, and keeps it healthy, by trimming off the "dead bits". Having extra room, really helps here.

IF YOU DON'T HAVE ROOM FOR A SECOND HDD, and no optical drive:

You probably have an SD card reader.... You can put a 64, or 128gb SD card in the reader, and use it for the same purpose. Do NOT remove the SDcard!!!

My wife has this setup because she wants to keep her optical drive. She doesn't want to resort to using and external OD.

The SDcard has been serving well, in that role, except for the swapfile. Add ram, eliminate it.

IF you have an NVMe DRIVE:

These are at least 5 times faster than an SSD, but they're a little more touchy at being crowded.

O/S ONLY! Unless you can afford one over 512Gb. The slowdown is quite noticeable, as you add programs to it.
I've installed quite a few of these, and my advice is to go 128gb, and use it for your O/S only.

Make SURE your computer is NVMe compatible, BEFORE purchasing one.

Last edited by Dragunov; 05-16-2018 at 3:04 PM..
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Old 05-16-2018, 6:50 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by high_revs View Post
was going to add another drive to my desktop. limiting only to 900gb-1tb else I may be paying for way too much than what I need and drive goes down with only 10-30% utilization.

and I already put a 250gb ssd as the main drive and moved the original drive as a extra storage (somewhere around 1tb iirc). dell xps 8700 (costco).

i opted for 10k rpm and price-wise, not that much less over a ssd. i figure even with 10k rpm, the ssd would be faster still overall? it seems prices are more expensive now the smaller the drive $/gb or $/tb
I have a similar drive setup. Imo, you'd be better off upgrading your main drive rather than adding more backup. I'm constantly running low on space on my main and really need to upgrade to a minimum of 500GB.
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Old 05-16-2018, 10:00 PM
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Pretty much the only thing that HDs are good for nowadays is for back up and or storage unless you are on a really low budget.
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Old 05-17-2018, 3:35 AM
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I personally have an SSD as my main OS drive (256GB), an SSD as my data drive (512GB), and a 1TB platter drive that I backup the data drive to. I also, when I get a whild-hare, backup data-drive to a drive that is not generally plugged in, unless doing said data-drive backup, which I SHOULD store in an anti-static bag, in an ammo can...

(You really need to keep data you care about on at least 2 physical devices, in case one physical dies...)
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Last edited by the86d; 05-17-2018 at 3:40 AM..
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  #10  
Old 05-17-2018, 5:45 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by the86d View Post
I personally have an SSD as my main OS drive (256GB), an SSD as my data drive (512GB), and a 1TB platter drive that I backup the data drive to. I also, when I get a whild-hare, backup data-drive to a drive that is not generally plugged in, unless doing said data-drive backup, which I SHOULD store in an anti-static bag, in an ammo can...

(You really need to keep data you care about on at least 2 physical devices, in case one physical dies...)
Good advice!
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Old 05-17-2018, 1:22 PM
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thanks Dragunov & 86D...

I already ahve the main drive as ssd. I don't store anything in the ssd. Never thought about the swapfile though, and I do have 16gb of ram. no issues with RAM as I literally just bought this as a media server in a sense.

I only wanted to add one more 1TB drive for extra space. Not looking for more more, else it break only having low utilization in the future. hence keeping it 1TB only. I've had 2TB drive break with low usage (maybe 30%) connected to my old router as a pseudo-NAS and it didn't even last 2 yrs. whereas my netgear NAS has lasted 4 yrs I think and that receives/sends data more than the one attached to router.

i guess having another 1tb will all a triple redundancy (already backing up to NAS) though I was thinking of buying a separate NAS (vs. building it).

was just surprised on pricing like my refrigerator - i had to pay more for a smaller one than a larger one - when I moved into the new place. I had to get a smaller one because that's all the kitchen was sized for.
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Old 05-17-2018, 4:23 PM
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It does make sense if you are budget minded. In that case, storage is storage.

You can find 3.5"/1tb 7200rpm HDD's on Ebay, for as little as $25. VERY cheap storage!!! I even bought a couple of 10,000RPM, 600gb drives for $25 each. Outstanding performance!

Need a web browser, that's more than a Chrome Book? Runs Office? a few games, even?

$50-80 will get you a couple of drives, and a massive amount of storage! Three matching ones will give you RAID capabilities! Slap those Bad Boys in a 3rdGen i7 tower, with 16gb/RAM, and a halfway decent video card on the cheap? You're GTG!

You can have a decent computer for under 250 ducketts, if you're patient.

Last edited by Dragunov; 05-17-2018 at 4:35 PM..
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Old 05-17-2018, 6:58 PM
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I remember back when the first gen i7 920 first hit the market I jumped on it and built a new PC around it, turned out to be a complete dog for overclocking. Anyway I also had 2 WD raptor 10k RPM drives in RAID 0 as the OS partition. I thought that was fast, and it was compared to coming from a 7200 RPM spindle. Likewise, I thought the first SSD I had in my laptop years ago was fast, then we set up a new Dell R720 at work for a client with I think 12 or 16 15k SAS drives in RAID 6, ran Crystal Disk Mark on it and it just demolished my SSD performance. I was like, man, lol.

Anyway good advice above regarding an SSD for the OS partition and another SSD for a data partition, then spindle drives for extra storage and backup, and YES you need backup! Don't skimp on that. I currently have a Samsung Pro 500 GB OS SSD and a WD blue 500 GB SSD in my desktop, store data and backups on a 3 TB USB external drive, and replicate much of that to a 5-bay NAS filled with 3.5" HDDs. Multiple copies of your data is good. I like to keep at least 3 copies of everything I really don't want to lose. You really shouldn't store more data than you can reasonably back up. Many people don't think about that when they buy a 10 TB HDD to store all their data with no backups, then get mad at the manufacturer when the drive fails.

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Old 05-18-2018, 2:23 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dragunov View Post
Good advice!
Well when you lose your best pr0n, before pr0nhub or the site that has no hamsters at all... existed, you learn to back things up...

It is hard for people to ransomware data that is in an ammo-can, too!
(Although I have never been hit with ransomware, I know people who have... but if you do... pay it, then do a charge-back.)
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Old 05-18-2018, 5:59 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by the86d View Post
Well when you lose your best pr0n, before pr0nhub or the site that has no hamsters at all... existed, you learn to back things up...

It is hard for people to ransomware data that is in an ammo-can, too!
(Although I have never been hit with ransomware, I know people who have... but if you do... pay it, then do a charge-back.)
I don't worry about ransomware (never had it). I just reload an image. Done. Had to clean a few of my customers computers who had it though.

Last edited by Dragunov; 05-20-2018 at 4:13 PM..
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Old 05-18-2018, 4:00 PM
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If you have all your data backed up regularly, ransomware is a non issue. Reload OS, restore back up, pay nothing.
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Originally Posted by the86d View Post
Well when you lose your best pr0n, before pr0nhub or the site that has no hamsters at all... existed, you learn to back things up...

It is hard for people to ransomware data that is in an ammo-can, too!
(Although I have never been hit with ransomware, I know people who have... but if you do... pay it, then do a charge-back.)
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Old 05-18-2018, 4:15 PM
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Originally Posted by MrFancyPants View Post
If you have all your data backed up regularly, ransomware is a non issue. Reload OS, restore back up, pay nothing.

Sent from my SM-G935P using Tapatalk
^^^This!^^^ Exactly! These days, there's no excuse for not having backups. This is NO LONGER the days, where your only option for backing up, was an expensive external drive, Norton Ghost (complicated/ very expensive/easy to screw up), Acronis (flaky/easy to screw up), and Clonezilla (complicated for noobs/easy to screw up).

Now, you have Macrium Reflect (free, reliable and easy), Aomei one key recovery (easy, convenient, and free, but doesn't work on all computers), and Windows 7, and 10, come with their own BKUP utilities, both easy to use, and pretty reliable.
You can get a $60 backup solution (drive) from Wal-Mart, for Pete's sake!

Last edited by Dragunov; 05-20-2018 at 4:16 PM..
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Old 05-18-2018, 6:53 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by high_revs View Post
was going to add another drive to my desktop. limiting only to 900gb-1tb else I may be paying for way too much than what I need and drive goes down with only 10-30% utilization.

and I already put a 250gb ssd as the main drive and moved the original drive as a extra storage (somewhere around 1tb iirc). dell xps 8700 (costco).

i opted for 10k rpm and price-wise, not that much less over a ssd. i figure even with 10k rpm, the ssd would be faster still overall? it seems prices are more expensive now the smaller the drive $/gb or $/tb
As long as your OS and applications are on an SSD then unless you are doing something really I/O intensive like video editing then there really isn't much of a need for 7200RPM drives much less 10,000 RPM data drives. On my desktop PC I use a 500GB PCIe (4x) SSD for my OS and apps and a pair of 5TB 7200RPM in RAID1 for data. Honestly, for data 5200RPM is fine.
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Old 05-19-2018, 5:54 PM
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As long as your OS and applications are on an SSD then unless you are doing something really I/O intensive like video editing then there really isn't much of a need for 7200RPM drives much less 10,000 RPM data drives. On my desktop PC I use a 500GB PCIe (4x) SSD for my OS and apps and a pair of 5TB 7200RPM in RAID1 for data. Honestly, for data 5200RPM is fine.
Maybe, however, for those with a 128/256 SSD, a faster HDD is better, especially if they play a lot of games, and keep some software on their HDD. Trust me, there IS a difference in loading time between 7200, and 5400 RPM.

If it's just DATA, a 5400rpm is fine, but if you keep images, and some applications on the mechanical drive, go with a 7200.

Besides that, there is only $5-10 difference between the two.
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Old 05-19-2018, 6:05 PM
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I agree about data vs applications + data. Just keep in mind that some people object to the cost of spinning a 7200rpm drive vs a 5400rpm drive. That said, I'm running a pair of 5TB 7200rpm RAID friendly drives for data only. As for SSDs there is absolutely no reason to run a 128GB SSD when fast 500GB drives can be had for less than $130. For one thing 500GB drives are faster and fill an SSD much past 50-60% full.

https://www.bestbuy.com/site/samsung...tops/6178650.p
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  #21  
Old 05-20-2018, 2:54 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sholling View Post
I agree about data vs applications + data. Just keep in mind that some people object to the cost of spinning a 7200rpm drive vs a 5400rpm drive. That said, I'm running a pair of 5TB 7200rpm RAID friendly drives for data only. As for SSDs there is absolutely no reason to run a 128GB SSD when fast 500GB drives can be had for less than $130. For one thing 500GB drives are faster and fill an SSD much past 50-60% full.

https://www.bestbuy.com/site/samsung...tops/6178650.p
I agree with you, but I have customers who are on a tight budget. Combining a 128/256gb SSD with a 7200 RPM, 500gb HDD is still cheaper than a 500gb SSD. Keep in mind that I get a lot of parts at no cost. MANY of my customers are older, and on a fixed income. Sometimes they have to combine the SSD/HDD, and RAM upgrade. They need to cut costs when they can.

I buy 90% of my parts from Ebay, and have almost no issues. Best place for computer parts, if you know what you're doing.

I work hard to get the best upgrades, as cheaply as possible for the people I deal with.

I like the SSD/7200rpm HDD for myself because I direct personal folders, Temp folders to the HDD, to save write cycles on my SSD. For example, The computer I'm on right now, has a 960gb SanDisk UltraII SSD, and an HGST, 1tb, 7200rpm HDD.

The HDD is used to keep Macrium Reflect images of my SSD, Data files, and my utility programs. My SSD, contains only my O/S, my games, and the "My Documents" folder. I also store some ripped movies on the mechanical drive.

BOTH drives are backed up to a 6tb external drive.

For example, last month I upgraded a companies new laptops with NIB SSD's. In turn, since they were replacing new, 500gb 7200rpm HDD's with them, I got the mechanical drives for free. That's 20, 500gb 7200rpm HDD's, that will be re-allocated, and installed into customers computers, for $15/each. A HUGE savings, for a NEW HDD!

I can get 128gb SSD's for between $25, and $35. I sell them for $40-50. Combine that with a $15 HDD, and your paying $65 MAX, for the combo. Way cheaper than a 500gb SSD.

Last edited by Dragunov; 05-20-2018 at 3:31 PM..
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