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Centerfire Rifles - Semiautomatic or Gas Operated Centerfire rifles, carbines and other gas operated rifles.

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  #281  
Old 04-20-2017, 8:33 PM
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To begin, as has been said above, that doesn't make Bill Alexander a bad guy to my thinking. It does make him smarter than founding entrepreneurs or small business people however. As has been said above, generally you have to be a big business to be this smart.

I can attest to the above. In another lifetime i was in the hi bandwidth low noise floor home audio business. Lots of smart multinational 'low-fi' companies; Sony, Yamaha, 2000 on Harmon Kardon, would take universal, ubiquitous 'connectivity' interfaces, make the most tiny/simple alteration to these pieces of connectivity, and force you to buy their proprietary version of this 'connectivity'.

Example replacement AC cords. that same part from any good pre-internet electronics part house you called n 800 number and order it for $6-$8, they turn around and charge you $14-$19 for.

I don't take it as anything personal, that's just how the game works.

I'm an architect, I have a vocational predisposition toward well designed, well made things. The more I handle and manipulate this weapon, the more impressed with the design of it!

As has been stated, if spiffy perfect finish on the receiver is important purchase criteria for you, this is not the weapon for you. While a quality finish might have been on my list, it was mighty low on it.

My criteria were:
  1. Reasonable accuracy at range
  2. semi auto
  3. durability/reliability
  4. will eat any factory ammo
  5. designed and built with by a company with a track record. That I might reasonably be able to buy a part from dozen years from now if need be,

Now I have this weapon. and I have all this 'once fired' brass, I am fully committed to this path.

Whether its this Hornady or the Redding die suggested above, I'm buying another die capable of resizing all of this, as well as any further such once fired brass I may have.

I'm OK buying this die. Here;'s my feeling on this:
  1. Its an American owned, american made product
  2. I'm supporting American Manufacturing
  3. In buying more of the man's products, when I already bought a pricey rifle, it also makes him more accountable to me. I have a "Single Point Source" of information and service.

That, works for me.
In the "hi performance anything" world, its better to be a somebody to anyone, than a nobody to lots of vendors just so you can save seven percent sourcing from multiple sources
Did I spend a bit more than I might have strictly needed to, probably. . . I am not a wealthy person by any stretch, but to me, that $100 extra I may ave spent, isn't going to kill me and 'b' worth some small measure of peace of mind.

Lastly and most importantly, in so doing I'm solving(!) my, long term problem of ensuring I can use all of this 'once fired' Lapua brass I already bought.

Sign me up. . .GTG!

So here is my offer to CG:

In fact here, since the CG community has been so helpful to me, here is my small way of paying that back. This is the San Francisco 'communitarian liberal's" way of saying thank you CG. I have been the beneficiary of time and knowledge from the CG community, here's some small way of/measure toward paying that back.

Anyone else on CG have this problem? I'm willing to share my 338 LM sizing die with anyone else who"
  1. shoots 338 LM
  2. reloads
  3. buys once fired Lapua brass
  4. can get to SF or the reasonably proximity thereof

Even as I typed it out, that seems like a pretty small list. But I stand by my offer CG. Happy to help out any other 338LM reloader who has might want to buy 'once fired' Lapua Brass

I have a finite amount of time. I'm about solving a problem and going on to the next thing. I can only obsess, read and research about one thing so long before I need to go on to the next thing in life. I worked the problem and as far as I'm concerned solved one to the two problems I'm having. This solves the long term problem. I still have 'self-inflicted' short term problem of a round stuck in the chamber. Saturday.

Last edited by sfarchitect; 04-20-2017 at 9:13 PM..
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  #282  
Old 04-20-2017, 8:40 PM
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One difference in these examples. If you're not supporting "the whole package" then it's bad biz to do the proprietary thing.

If Sony sold a minidisc player but didn't provide support for the media...

Then again, sometimes you stray from the norm for whatever reason and that becomes popularized.
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  #283  
Old 04-20-2017, 9:19 PM
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In 21st Century America, the fact that Bill Alexander is willing to give me plain advice about removing this live(!!) round, and further(!) to offer reloading advice, purely from a liability standpoint, blows my f'ing mind frankly! I'm just amazed, thankful but amazed.

From where I'm coming from, new: LR shooter, and reloader, and having bought this weapon, as long as Bill Alexander is crazy enough to share his decades of knowledge on these subjects, I'm going to take full advantage of that arrangement.

I am a design professional. I also spent nearly a decade in very hi performance home audio. I can attest that the best practicioners, in any realm of specialized design, often stray far from the beaten path.

I'm a believer in explaining complicated ideas in simple analogies. McDonalds sells the most food nation, and I would suspect world wide on a daily basis, does that make it the best food?

Last edited by sfarchitect; 04-20-2017 at 9:31 PM..
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  #284  
Old 04-20-2017, 9:22 PM
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Or hes trying to keep you on board as a customer however he possibly can.

Yes, we all know you are an architect. What does that have to do with rifles?
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  #285  
Old 04-20-2017, 11:08 PM
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Slow learner.

I have a vocational predisposition toward well designed, well made things. Now how this effects the women that have been in my life is another conversation. But I have managed to hang on to a beautiful SF apartment, well made tools, light fixtures, flatware, furniture, camping equipment, knives and firearms.

Once I bought the rifle I was committed. That said I stand by all of the above.
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  #286  
Old 04-21-2017, 7:49 AM
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Quote:
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I have a vocational predisposition toward well designed, well made things.
One could argue that standardization is a valuable design trait as well.
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  #287  
Old 04-21-2017, 11:02 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CouchOperator View Post
Or hes trying to keep you on board as a customer however he possibly can.

Yes, we all know you are an architect. What does that have to do with rifles?
In the instance of this particular rifle. It has everything to do with it. Because it is OP's rifle. So realistically, his opinion on how to best proceed. Is the only opinion that counts.


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  #288  
Old 04-21-2017, 1:11 PM
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Default Voila!

Since there was a massive power failure in downtown SF today, I got the day off. The 5/16" x 3' brass rods got here yesterday. Soooooo

IMG_0890.jpg

I do not know how clearly you can see this. I had to pound the snot out of this to get it out. But I got it out!! The bullet itself is literally pounded into the cartridge deeper than the edge of the shoulder! The brass rod kept going deeper into the barrel, but the casing was NOT moving. By the end I was seriously hammering on the brass rod until, suddenly. . .

I got it out, Wuhoo!

I got pretty nervous as this required more and more force to pound it out. I'm ready for a beer!

Once again CG community, thank you all for your insights, observations and sound advice!!

as Peter Sellers once famously said; "problem sol-ved". I also shipped the pistol off to HK factory service today.

Last edited by sfarchitect; 04-21-2017 at 8:45 PM..
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  #289  
Old 04-21-2017, 1:22 PM
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Any damage to chamber or barrel?
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  #290  
Old 04-21-2017, 1:23 PM
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woo hooo!!! glad to hear it worked out.
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  #291  
Old 04-21-2017, 1:29 PM
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I don't think so. I have no way of knowing that really. You can't really get in there to see it without some specialized tool. I used a brass rod on a brass casing. I'm not saying its beyond the realm of possibility, but I'm hard pressed to think how brass, could hurt a hardened steel barrel. In the photo you can see the brass rod went nicely into the throat of the brass cartridge. I think I'm good.
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  #292  
Old 04-21-2017, 1:35 PM
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This thread





Inbeforethenextreloadingfailurethread
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  #293  
Old 04-21-2017, 1:36 PM
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$50 says the next round he fires gets stuck again.
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  #294  
Old 04-21-2017, 1:38 PM
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Laughing here Couch! Laughing because time may prove you right about that.

As one of my buddies who's been schooling me on this stuff said one night; "People don't start reloading with 338 Lapua"

It seemed like a fine idea to me.
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  #295  
Old 04-21-2017, 1:39 PM
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Next time once the bullet is clear of the case mouth, dump the powder out of the case. Use a cleaning rod and just jiggle the bullet while the barrel is pointing down and all the powder will fall out of the case.
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  #296  
Old 04-21-2017, 1:39 PM
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I would have just thrown the whole thing away.
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  #297  
Old 04-21-2017, 1:41 PM
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Good luck. Ive been down the .338 Lapua road. Nope, not for me. And yes, i still stand by that AI would have been a better pick. I also stand by that it was extreme user error. I stand by everything. But if you come out the other end learning something, then good on you. You perhaps bit off way more than you could chew. I give alot of people **** and they often dont read it in the same tone im meaning to say it. Ill give people **** but im never out to fully slam someone
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  #298  
Old 04-21-2017, 1:41 PM
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The difference between us is, while I may laugh and kid people, Its how guys interact right, I don't wish ill fortune upon others. There's no need for that.

But yes, I did naively bite off a bit more than I could chew on this. That is a totally fair criticism Couch. Too many variables to deal with lead to a serious user error.

Now what I need to do is:
  1. attempt to chamber each loaded round individually
  2. any others that do not chamber need to be taken apart
  3. wait for this Hornady die (10-12 weeks I was told)
  4. buy a 12 pack of beer for one of my buddies with a single stage press so I can use that
  5. run every empty case through that giant 1-1/4" thread sizing die.

Last edited by sfarchitect; 04-21-2017 at 2:00 PM..
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  #299  
Old 04-21-2017, 1:42 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sfarchitect View Post
I don't think so. I have no way of knowing that really. You can't really get in there to see it without some specialized tool. I used a brass rod on a brass casing. I'm not saying its beyond the realm of possibility, but I'm hard pressed to think how brass, could hurt a hardened steel barrel. In the photo you can see the brass rod went nicely into the throat of the brass cartridge. I think I'm good.
You cant remove the stock and bolt carrier and see directly into the chamber with a flashlight?
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Old 04-21-2017, 1:53 PM
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Nope, this is not an AR. This is a one piece receiver. Through the ejection port I can see a little ways into the chamber. What little bit I can see seems fine.
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  #301  
Old 04-21-2017, 1:56 PM
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Sweet! Dump the powder and keep that bullet displayed prominently.
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Old 04-21-2017, 1:56 PM
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Couch, it is all good sir. No offense taken. Should I ever make your acquaintance, I would be delighted to buy you a beer or two.
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Old 04-21-2017, 1:57 PM
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Macallan or GTFO
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  #304  
Old 04-21-2017, 2:01 PM
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I'm more of an Asahi or Zinfandel guy. To each his own sir. I do still love the new Avatar Couch.

Last edited by sfarchitect; 04-21-2017 at 2:05 PM..
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  #305  
Old 04-21-2017, 2:12 PM
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Congrats on getting the round out.
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  #306  
Old 04-21-2017, 2:13 PM
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Quote:
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I'm more of an Asahi or Zinfandel guy. To each his own sir. I do still love the new Avatar Couch.
I like cabernet as far as wine goes
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Old 04-21-2017, 3:47 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sfarchitect View Post

Now what I need to do is:
  1. [1]attempt to chamber each loaded round individually
    [2]any others that do not chamber need to be taken apart
    [3]wait for this Hornady die (10-12 weeks I was told)
    [4]buy a 12 pack of beer for one of my buddies with a single stage press so I can use that
    [5]run every empty case through that giant 1-1/4" thread sizing die.
Suggestions

[1]...(a) Remove FP first. (b) Do not allow action to slam bolt forward on rounds being tested. Or you may be beating out another loaded round. (c) Chamber a factory round, then make index marks on bolt/reciever, before testing reloads. So as to check for full battery of rounds tested. And "ride" the bolt down gently.

[2]...Not Necessarily. The aforementioned modified Redding "Push Through Die" allows "safely sizing" the web of loaded rounds.
Which can be done Loooong before your anticipated 10-12 wk delivery date. And precludes the tedious task of break down, resizing, and then re-reloading already assembled ammo.

[3]...See underlined in (2)

(4)...Sharing beers with reloading buddies is always a good move.

(5)...Can't hurt after paying through the nose and you wait 3 months for it.

Since you are reloading, I'm guessing you have some sort of precision measuring tools. Please measure the web area of the offending round and compare it to SAAMI specs. If me, I would also do a chamber cast, of both the rifle chamber, and your case gage. And measure them for comparison. The offending round "may" be one that passed the gage but not the chamber. That happens more often than you might suspect.

Remember, NOT ALL HOLES ARE CREATED EQUAL.

I don't remember it being asked. Does your original dies, include a "Small Base" FL sizing die? Acquisition of a SB-FL die is pretty much SOP for guys that reload for shell shuckers.

Glad you got it cleared.


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Old 04-21-2017, 4:02 PM
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Quote:
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...attempt to chamber each loaded round individually...
You already know some rounds are problematic, no need to re-prove that. Fix the issue first.
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Old 04-21-2017, 4:46 PM
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I bet this thread has a solid 2 pages left in the gas tank. I want to thank everyone for the entertainment this thread provided and will continue to do so.


Quote:
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This thread





Inbeforethenextreloadingfailurethread
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  #310  
Old 04-21-2017, 5:35 PM
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Why are you against getting a 1 1/4" reloading press of your own? If it's a space issue why not just get a Inline Fabrication quick change system?
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Old 04-21-2017, 6:04 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sfarchitect View Post
Soooooo, I do not know how clearly you can see this. I had to pound the snot out of this to get it out. But I got it out!! The bullet itself is literally pounded into the cartridge deeper than the edge of the shoulder! The brass rod kept going deeper into the barrel, but the casing was NOT moving. By the end I was seriously hammering on the brass rod unit suddenly. . .

I got it out, Wuhoo!
Congratulations! Keep that cartridge as a trophy of your victory.

Thanks for sharing your experience here. Regardless of viewpoint on the rifle itself, it was an entertaining story to read. And participate in!

I haven't seen a thread this fun since "I'm stuck to my chair. I'm so very scared. Help."
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Old 04-21-2017, 6:30 PM
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Just a question, what tool / comparator / gauge are you using to measure your fired cases' shoulder so you know how much you are resizing (bumping) the cases shoulders when you F/L size?
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Old 04-21-2017, 6:45 PM
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If you want to look at chamber. probably to wide to go down barrel. but you should be able to peak at the chamber from ejection port.

They do sell smaller diameter models.
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Old 04-21-2017, 6:51 PM
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Flight 762: Its an LE Wilson gauge.

Citizen One ""I'm stuck to my chair. I'm so very scared. Help." sounds like a story!

To all:

The way this weapon is designed is to break it down the entire rear trunnion/truncheon (language matters) comes off, you slide the BCG which is attached to the 2.4Lb piston out the rear trunnion/truncheon.

I had taken the FP out of the BCG upon getting the round stuck. I just removed the piston, & BCG to transport it.

Hey if you found it entertaining someone give us more than 2 stars. I have endeavored to make this entertaining while I have learned so much.

Last edited by sfarchitect; 04-21-2017 at 8:17 PM..
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Old 04-21-2017, 6:52 PM
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Old 04-21-2017, 6:54 PM
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Cool tool Gawker, but this sojourn/learning curve has cost me quite enough money. Why buy that? If I did damage it the damage is done. I could however buy more of this "once fired" Lupua brass
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Old 04-21-2017, 7:10 PM
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That rifle is pretty awesome. Hopefully it's just the ammo that caused the jam and not the chamber..

My current issue with a magnum ar is gas not feeding the next round. Mine is short stroking, not going back far enough to get another round from the mag. It has a adjustable block and it was almost all the way out of the block. So maybe the gas port hole is blocked or not drilled big enough on mine. No doubt bolt action is better. Hopefully mine will cycle to. lol!
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Old 04-21-2017, 7:10 PM
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pacrat:

1 - FP came out, along with BCG & piston since this round was caught.

2-I went looking for this; modified Redding "Push Through Die", and could not find it. If there is a stock part that will work, I'm all for the idea. I have the Redding Competition Neck sizing & FL Body sizing die. Again however, its all about that last 3/16"-1/4" at the base of the case.

Quote:
I'm guessing you have some sort of precision measuring tools. Please measure the web area of the offending round and compare it to SAAMI specs. If me, I would also do a chamber cast, of both the rifle chamber, and your case gage. And measure them for comparison. The offending round "may" be one that passed the gage but not the chamber. That happens more often than you might suspect.
Wow, never even thought about that.
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  #319  
Old 04-21-2017, 7:12 PM
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Glad its out. I`ve been following this thread with interest to see how things were going to go.
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  #320  
Old 04-21-2017, 7:14 PM
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Russ69: not sure what you mean? Are you suggesting I tear apart the the other hundred rounds I had loaded for this class but didn't use?

Here's my thinking on this. Chamber each round individually. Pull the bullets out of the ten to twenty percent of that remaining hundred rounds of loaded ammo. Seem reasonable?
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