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  #1  
Old 09-30-2017, 6:46 AM
Benja455 Benja455 is offline
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Default Transfer of Rifle to Non-Resident 03 FFL?

Here’s the situation:

I am a Washington State resident with C&R license heading to CA. Father in law has a vintage bolt action 22LR he wants to give me.

As far as I can tell - he can hand it over to me, copy down his info in my bound book, declare it to the airline (cased and locked) and we’re good.

Is my understanding of the situation correct? I am having trouble cutting through a lot of the extra steps this would take if I were a resident of California.

Thanks!
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  #2  
Old 10-01-2017, 1:49 PM
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Yes.

It might be easier to just ship it to yourself. I have heard of no problems with the airlines and sometimes there are problems. It would cost around $20 or so to ship it to yourself. Then again, UPS can sometimes be a pain, but USPS would also work for a long gun.
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  #3  
Old 10-01-2017, 3:09 PM
Benja455 Benja455 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kemasa View Post
Yes.

It might be easier to just ship it to yourself. I have heard of no problems with the airlines and sometimes there are problems. It would cost around $20 or so to ship it to yourself. Then again, UPS can sometimes be a pain, but USPS would also work for a long gun.


Thanks for the reply.

I’ve had problems with airlines (and guns) in the past but I’ve also had problems with USPS (and guns) in the past. So I’ll probably stick with the solution that is less expensive and keeps the firearm under my control the longest (flight via SWA).
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  #4  
Old 10-10-2017, 1:33 PM
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Seems to me since the transaction is occurring in California, you would be required to have a COE to receive it from him personally. If he simply shipped it to you, it would be OK. This is why it is sometimes best to not think out loud in public forums.
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  #5  
Old 10-10-2017, 1:38 PM
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He is not a CA resident, so he can't get nor would I think he would need a COE.
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  #6  
Old 10-10-2017, 1:41 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kemasa View Post
He is not a CA resident, so he can't get nor would I think he would need a COE.
That's my point. Therefore his C&R license is presumably useless for face-to-face transactions in California.
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  #7  
Old 10-10-2017, 1:43 PM
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Originally Posted by Eddy's Shooting Sports View Post
That's my point. Therefore his C&R license is presumably useless for face-to-face transactions in California.
Why? What law prevents it?
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  #8  
Old 10-10-2017, 1:55 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kemasa View Post
Why? What law prevents it?


Yes, this.
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  #9  
Old 10-10-2017, 1:55 PM
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PC 27545.
Where neither party to the transaction holds a dealer’s license issued pursuant to Sections 26700 to 26915, inclusive, the parties to the transaction shall complete the sale, loan, or transfer of that firearm through a licensed firearms dealer pursuant to Chapter 5 (commencing with Section 28050).

He's not a dealer. He's not a CA collector (C&R & COE). He's not a CA resident. He simply cannot receive a firearm ->in California<-.

In Washington it's a different story.
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  #10  
Old 10-10-2017, 3:03 PM
Benja455 Benja455 is offline
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Okay, thanks for that - I’ll have it shipped.

It seems like CA has made gun ownership (even for an old bolt action 22LR) as difficult as possible. I don’t understand why you guys still live down there. I certainly wouldn’t for anything less than a 7 figure salary.

Thanks again for the help!
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  #11  
Old 10-10-2017, 6:02 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Eddy's Shooting Sports View Post
PC 27545.
Where neither party to the transaction holds a dealer’s license issued pursuant to Sections 26700 to 26915, inclusive, the parties to the transaction shall complete the sale, loan, or transfer of that firearm through a licensed firearms dealer pursuant to Chapter 5 (commencing with Section 28050).

He's not a dealer. He's not a CA collector (C&R & COE). He's not a CA resident. He simply cannot receive a firearm ->in California<-.

In Washington it's a different story.
I found an exemption for non-resident of CA with a FFL.

Exemption requires:
1. The transferor needs to be a CA resident. [PC 27895(a)]
2. The transferee needs to be a non-resident of CA with a valid FFL. [PC 27895(b)]
3. Transfer complies with Federal laws. [PC 27895(c)]

This means a non-resident with a valid C&R Type 03-FFL can travel to CA and acquire a C&R firearm from a CA resident without having to utilize a CA FFL dealer.
The non-resident will need to log the transaction into their log book.



Penal Code 27895
Section 27545 does not apply to the sale, delivery, or transfer of firearms if all of the following requirements are satisfied:
(a) The sale, delivery, or transfer is made by a person who resides in this state.
(b) The sale, delivery, or transfer is made to a person who resides outside this state and is licensed pursuant to Chapter 44 (commencing with Section 921) of Title 18 of the United States Code and the regulations issued pursuant thereto.
(c) The sale, delivery, or transfer is in accordance with Chapter 44 (commencing with Section 921) of Title 18 of the United States Code and the regulations issued pursuant thereto.
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Last edited by Quiet; 10-10-2017 at 6:05 PM..
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  #12  
Old 10-10-2017, 7:02 PM
Benja455 Benja455 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Quiet View Post
I found an exemption for non-resident of CA with a FFL.

Exemption requires:
1. The transferor needs to be a CA resident. [PC 27895(a)]
2. The transferee needs to be a non-resident of CA with a valid FFL. [PC 27895(b)]
3. Transfer complies with Federal laws. [PC 27895(c)]

This means a non-resident with a valid C&R Type 03-FFL can travel to CA and acquire a C&R firearm from a CA resident without having to utilize a CA FFL dealer.
The non-resident will need to log the transaction into their log book.



Penal Code 27895
Section 27545 does not apply to the sale, delivery, or transfer of firearms if all of the following requirements are satisfied:
(a) The sale, delivery, or transfer is made by a person who resides in this state.
(b) The sale, delivery, or transfer is made to a person who resides outside this state and is licensed pursuant to Chapter 44 (commencing with Section 921) of Title 18 of the United States Code and the regulations issued pursuant thereto.
(c) The sale, delivery, or transfer is in accordance with Chapter 44 (commencing with Section 921) of Title 18 of the United States Code and the regulations issued pursuant thereto.


Ohhhh! Nice! Maybe CA isn’t so bad after all. Haha!
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  #13  
Old 10-10-2017, 7:49 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Benja455 View Post
Ohhhh! Nice! Maybe CA isn’t so bad after all. Haha!
Oh no... It is
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  #14  
Old 10-11-2017, 4:43 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Benja455 View Post
Okay, thanks for that - I’ll have it shipped.

It seems like CA has made gun ownership (even for an old bolt action 22LR) as difficult as possible. I don’t understand why you guys still live down there. I certainly wouldn’t for anything less than a 7 figure salary.

Thanks again for the help!
Hey, Washington isn't that much better. Not sure why you left coast guys are still out there.

Jeff

Sent from my XT1254 using Tapatalk
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  #15  
Old 10-11-2017, 5:27 AM
Benja455 Benja455 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by weaselfire View Post
Hey, Washington isn't that much better. Not sure why you left coast guys are still out there.

Jeff

Sent from my XT1254 using Tapatalk


It was good when I got here from PA but we’ve lost some major battles since then (but we’ve also gained SBRs and suppressors).

Nonetheless, I am already planning some recon of AZ for a future move.
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  #16  
Old 10-12-2017, 3:01 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Quiet View Post
I found an exemption for non-resident of CA with a FFL.

Exemption requires:
1. The transferor needs to be a CA resident. [PC 27895(a)]
2. The transferee needs to be a non-resident of CA with a valid FFL. [PC 27895(b)]
3. Transfer complies with Federal laws. [PC 27895(c)]

This means a non-resident with a valid C&R Type 03-FFL can travel to CA and acquire a C&R firearm from a CA resident without having to utilize a CA FFL dealer.
The non-resident will need to log the transaction into their log book.



Penal Code 27895
Section 27545 does not apply to the sale, delivery, or transfer of firearms if all of the following requirements are satisfied:
(a) The sale, delivery, or transfer is made by a person who resides in this state.
(b) The sale, delivery, or transfer is made to a person who resides outside this state and is licensed pursuant to Chapter 44 (commencing with Section 921) of Title 18 of the United States Code and the regulations issued pursuant thereto.
(c) The sale, delivery, or transfer is in accordance with Chapter 44 (commencing with Section 921) of Title 18 of the United States Code and the regulations issued pursuant thereto.
Good catch.

Is the C&R license covered under Chapter 44?
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  #17  
Old 10-15-2017, 4:19 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Eddy's Shooting Sports View Post
Good catch.

Is the C&R license covered under Chapter 44?
Yes. [18 USC 921(a)(13)]



United States Code Title 18 Part 1 Chapter 44 Section 921
(a) As used in this chapter—
(13) The term “collector” means any person who acquires, holds, or disposes of firearms as curios or relics, as the Attorney General shall by regulation define, and the term “licensed collector” means any such person licensed under the provisions of this chapter.
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