Calguns.net  

Home My iTrader Join the NRA Donate to CGSSA Sponsors CGN Google Search
CA Semiauto Ban(AW)ID Flowchart CA Handgun Ban ID Flowchart CA Shotgun Ban ID Flowchart
Go Back   Calguns.net > SPECIALTY FORUMS > Discussions of Faith
Register FAQ Members List Calendar Mark Forums Read

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #1  
Old 09-24-2018, 8:11 PM
Wordupmybrotha's Avatar
Wordupmybrotha Wordupmybrotha is offline
From Anotha Motha
CGN Contributor
 
Join Date: Oct 2013
Location: Pasadena, CA
Posts: 3,918
iTrader: 50 / 100%
Default Why is online Bible verse different from printed version?

Check out Hebrews 12:1-2.
Why is it that my printed NIV is different from the online version of both Biblegateway and Bible Hub? Biblegateway and Bible Hub were the same.

The following is the printed version:
"Therefore, since we are surrounded by such a great cloud of witnesses, let us throw off everything that hinders and the sin that so easily entangles, and let us run with perseverance the race marked out for us. 2 Let us fix our eyes on Jesus, the author and perfecter of our faith, who for the joy set before him endured the cross, scorning its shame, and sat down at the right hand of the throne of God."

From Biblegateway and Bible Hub:
"Therefore, since we are surrounded by such a great cloud of witnesses, let us throw off everything that hinders and the sin that so easily entangles. And let us run with perseverance the race marked out for us, 2 fixing our eyes on Jesus, the pioneer and perfecter of faith. For the joy set before him he endured the cross, scorning its shame, and sat down at the right hand of the throne of God."

https://www.biblegateway.com/passage...-2&version=NIV
Reply With Quote
  #2  
Old 09-24-2018, 8:27 PM
Unbekannt Unbekannt is offline
Member
 
Join Date: May 2018
Posts: 204
iTrader: 0 / 0%
Default

Why does a gun forum have a "Discussions of Faith" section? They didn't have guns in the 10th Century.
Reply With Quote
  #3  
Old 09-24-2018, 8:56 PM
sbo80's Avatar
sbo80 sbo80 is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2014
Location: San Diego
Posts: 551
iTrader: 12 / 100%
Default

really odd comment, if you don't like don't read/post here.

Lots of "versions" of bibles. Some get updated/edited occasionally is my guess.
Reply With Quote
  #4  
Old 09-24-2018, 8:59 PM
Wordupmybrotha's Avatar
Wordupmybrotha Wordupmybrotha is offline
From Anotha Motha
CGN Contributor
 
Join Date: Oct 2013
Location: Pasadena, CA
Posts: 3,918
iTrader: 50 / 100%
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by sbo80 View Post

Lots of "versions" of bibles. Some get updated/edited occasionally is my guess.
Same NIV, same copyright dates. And why is there a need for revision?
Reply With Quote
  #5  
Old 09-24-2018, 9:04 PM
WorldSBK's Avatar
WorldSBK WorldSBK is offline
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2018
Posts: 16
iTrader: 0 / 0%
Default

It depends on which edition of the NIV translation you have: 1973, 1978, 1984, 2005, 2011. The translations are different.

In English alone, there are hundreds of translations/editions/revisions out there.
Reply With Quote
  #6  
Old 09-24-2018, 9:22 PM
Wordupmybrotha's Avatar
Wordupmybrotha Wordupmybrotha is offline
From Anotha Motha
CGN Contributor
 
Join Date: Oct 2013
Location: Pasadena, CA
Posts: 3,918
iTrader: 50 / 100%
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by WorldSBK View Post
It depends on which edition of the NIV translation you have: 1973, 1978, 1984, 2005, 2011. The translations are different.

In English alone, there are hundreds of translations/editions/revisions out there.
I think you're right.
This from Biblegateway:

"The 2011 update to the NIV is the latest fruit of this process. By working with input from pastors and Bible scholars, by grappling with the latest discoveries about biblical languages and the biblical world, and by using cutting-edge research on English usage, the Committee on Bible Translation has updated the text to ensure that the New International Version of the Bible remains faithful to Howard Long’s original inspiration."

https://www.biblegateway.com/version...ion-NIV-Bible/

My printed version is from 1984.
Reply With Quote
  #7  
Old 09-24-2018, 11:30 PM
mossy's Avatar
mossy mossy is online now
Calguns Addict
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: equestria
Posts: 6,313
iTrader: 2 / 100%
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Unbekannt View Post
Why does a gun forum have a "Discussions of Faith" section? They didn't have guns in the 10th Century.
religious threads got more than a little heated in OT. site owners created this place to keep faith stuff off the rest of calguns and create a safe space for people to talk about religious topics.
__________________
best troll thread in calguns history
http://www.calguns.net/calgunforum/s...d.php?t=406739



Quote:
Originally Posted by waterfern View Post
Not at all. Trump is a loser and will lose amazingly on Tuesday. It's going to be so big, we are all going to be sick and tired of how much he loses on Tuesday.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Doheny View Post
Nah, no sense in replying to the personal attacks/baiting.
Reply With Quote
  #8  
Old 09-25-2018, 6:50 AM
billvau's Avatar
billvau billvau is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2016
Location: Norcal mountains
Posts: 577
iTrader: 2 / 100%
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Wordupmybrotha View Post
Check out Hebrews 12:1-2.
Why is it that my printed NIV is different from the online version of both Biblegateway and Bible Hub? Biblegateway and Bible Hub were the same.

The following is the printed version:
"Therefore, since we are surrounded by such a great cloud of witnesses, let us throw off everything that hinders and the sin that so easily entangles, and let us run with perseverance the race marked out for us. 2 Let us fix our eyes on Jesus, the author and perfecter of our faith, who for the joy set before him endured the cross, scorning its shame, and sat down at the right hand of the throne of God."

From Biblegateway and Bible Hub:
"Therefore, since we are surrounded by such a great cloud of witnesses, let us throw off everything that hinders and the sin that so easily entangles. And let us run with perseverance the race marked out for us, 2 fixing our eyes on Jesus, the pioneer and perfecter of faith. For the joy set before him he endured the cross, scorning its shame, and sat down at the right hand of the throne of God."

https://www.biblegateway.com/passage...-2&version=NIV
I checked my language tools that I use for translating, and as others have pointed out, it's the difference between the 2011 version (latest) and your 1984 original version.

The NIV is known as a "dynamic equivalence" version. They are not trying to translate word-for-word from the Greek like the New American Standard (NASB), the English Standard Version (ESV), nor the New King James (NKJV) (although NKJV and the KJV use Greek texts that have additions (conflation) and aren't current best Greek texts). Dynamic equivalence means that the translators are paraphrasing the word-for-word text to make it easier to read. BUT, that makes into a pseudo commentary and forces their interpretation on you. Extreme example of this is the "The Message."

I recommend that first you find our what version your pastor is using. That tells you a lot about the accuracy of his teaching. then I recommend that you own several versions and when you study, read them all to compare how they translate. The three word-for-word versions above are great for study. Then, lastly you may want something like the NIV for simple devotions, but I don't like this approach as it makes learning Scripture harder. I find that I remember verses better when I stick to one version as my primary study and devotional Bible.

I study and preach from the 1995 New American Standard. Accuracy studies put it best. ESV is a close second and now very popular. The New King James often has verse translations that I think are better than the NASB, BUT the addition/conflation problem and the manuscript base issue keep me from using it as primary. I had heard that the NKJV translators were going to switch text bases, but don't know if that ever happened. Lastly, I don't use the King James (KJV) because I don't need to translate twice because of the archaic English used!

God bless,
__________________
Pastor Bill

“Unless I am convinced by Scripture and plain reason- I do not accept the authority of popes and councils [i.e. any man]- my conscience is captive to the Word of God…” Martin Luther
Reply With Quote
  #9  
Old 09-25-2018, 9:56 AM
Wordupmybrotha's Avatar
Wordupmybrotha Wordupmybrotha is offline
From Anotha Motha
CGN Contributor
 
Join Date: Oct 2013
Location: Pasadena, CA
Posts: 3,918
iTrader: 50 / 100%
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by billvau View Post
I checked my language tools that I use for translating, and as others have pointed out, it's the difference between the 2011 version (latest) and your 1984 original version.

The NIV is known as a "dynamic equivalence" version. They are not trying to translate word-for-word from the Greek like the New American Standard (NASB), the English Standard Version (ESV), nor the New King James (NKJV) (although NKJV and the KJV use Greek texts that have additions (conflation) and aren't current best Greek texts). Dynamic equivalence means that the translators are paraphrasing the word-for-word text to make it easier to read. BUT, that makes into a pseudo commentary and forces their interpretation on you. Extreme example of this is the "The Message."

I recommend that first you find our what version your pastor is using. That tells you a lot about the accuracy of his teaching. then I recommend that you own several versions and when you study, read them all to compare how they translate. The three word-for-word versions above are great for study. Then, lastly you may want something like the NIV for simple devotions, but I don't like this approach as it makes learning Scripture harder. I find that I remember verses better when I stick to one version as my primary study and devotional Bible.

I study and preach from the 1995 New American Standard. Accuracy studies put it best. ESV is a close second and now very popular. The New King James often has verse translations that I think are better than the NASB, BUT the addition/conflation problem and the manuscript base issue keep me from using it as primary. I had heard that the NKJV translators were going to switch text bases, but don't know if that ever happened. Lastly, I don't use the King James (KJV) because I don't need to translate twice because of the archaic English used!

God bless,
Thanks for the info Bill! I've been using NIV for readability, but do have NKJV as well as NASB. ESV reads a bit awkward for me. Point taken on your advice to study using the word for word version.

Our former pastor used ESV during sermons. The new pastor has used NLT and NIV.
Reply With Quote
  #10  
Old 09-28-2018, 6:44 AM
TrailerparkTrash's Avatar
TrailerparkTrash TrailerparkTrash is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: Democratic People’s Republic of Gavin
Posts: 2,481
iTrader: 0 / 0%
Default

I made a long post about the different bible translations a while ago, specifically the various editions of the NIV and how the 2011 in my opinion was “trash.” Again, just my opinion as many of my close friends completely and peaceably disagree with me.

One of the biggest causes of many churches and Christians having their own personal mass “exodus” away from the once beloved NIV, was the fact that Zondervan made the 2011 Version “gender neutral.” Zondervan said they “cleaned up” their old off-shoot TNIV (Biblica “international” publisher of the NIV) because many couldn’t stand the gender neutral change (neither can I). Zondervan decided to discontinue their most popular selling edition (1984) ever and put all their eggs into the latest 2011.

However, many just outright dumped the new NIV-2011 all together because it was still vastly different on gender language that their once great 1984 edition did not have. Some churches like to keep everyone reading off the “same sheet of music” (same bible translation/edition) and with the NIV printing just the 2011 Version, it was sure to cause a conflict with those in the pews reading out of their existing 1984 and earlier editions. So the search for a different translation all together had begun.

Sure the English language has changed over time, but Zondervan/Biblica changing the language so much in order to be more “gender neutral” or inclusive was just too PC and didn’t sit well for many.

Many switched back to the NKJV, NASB or the “newer” ESV translations. Even my old Lutheran church (Missouri Synod) from where I grew up, dumped the NIV-2011 and went to the ESV. John MacArthur refused to publish his study Bible any longer with the newest NIV-2011 edition. His church switched to the ESV according to an interview I saw him give. All three bibles mentioned above are NOT “gender neutral,” politically correct translations of God’s word.

The only NIV that I still read regularly is the NIV-1984 edition (when I’m not reading my favorite KJV). The 1984 edition by the way, was also the most popular from all of the NIV editions.

In 2012-2013, buying a new “1984” edition was almost impossible. So I went on eBay and found a few different NIV-1984’s that at the time would soon be hard to ever come by again, like the NIV-1984/1983 Thompson Chain-Reference bible and the Archeologists NIV-1984 Bible. You can still find the NIV-1984 now and then on eBay.

In my opinion, the NIV “died” and became extinct when the 2011 came out. The 1984 or even the 1983 NIV editions are cherished by many like its their own living dinosaur.
__________________



-I hate being bipolar its awesome.

-Life member, NRA
-Trump’s SCOTUS: 2 / Dems: 0
-ΙΧΘΥΣ <><
Reply With Quote
  #11  
Old 09-28-2018, 6:52 AM
TrailerparkTrash's Avatar
TrailerparkTrash TrailerparkTrash is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: Democratic People’s Republic of Gavin
Posts: 2,481
iTrader: 0 / 0%
Default

I forgot to add... The publisher of the NIV does NOT allow any older versions of their bible to be published, either in print or digital media, unless it’s the 2011 edition. Hence the noticeable change between the website version the OP read and his printed personal copy version.

There was a large letter/email writing campaign around 2012-2013 to the publisher and from people all over. They begged the publisher to continue printing the 1984 edition to allow people to have a choice. However that campaign failed and we’re all stuck now with only the 2011 “rag.” Just my opinion.
Reply With Quote
  #12  
Old 09-28-2018, 8:29 AM
RAMCLAP's Avatar
RAMCLAP RAMCLAP is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2012
Location: Orange, CA
Posts: 2,088
iTrader: 2 / 100%
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by TrailerparkTrash View Post
I forgot to add... The publisher of the NIV does NOT allow any older versions of their bible to be published, either in print or digital media, unless it’s the 2011 edition. Hence the noticeable change between the website version the OP read and his printed personal copy version.

There was a large letter/email writing campaign around 2012-2013 to the publisher and from people all over. They begged the publisher to continue printing the 1984 edition to allow people to have a choice. However that campaign failed and we’re all stuck now with only the 2011 “rag.” Just my opinion.
Some of our Elders are so old that we have to use the 1984 in order for them to see the letters when they read Scripture.
__________________
John 2:5
Reply With Quote
  #13  
Old 09-28-2018, 11:53 PM
TrailerparkTrash's Avatar
TrailerparkTrash TrailerparkTrash is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: Democratic People’s Republic of Gavin
Posts: 2,481
iTrader: 0 / 0%
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by RAMCLAP View Post
Some of our Elders are so old that we have to use the 1984 in order for them to see the letters when they read Scripture.
Hahahahaha. Giant print editions????? Well they make them in the 2011 edition as well.
__________________



-I hate being bipolar its awesome.

-Life member, NRA
-Trump’s SCOTUS: 2 / Dems: 0
-ΙΧΘΥΣ <><
Reply With Quote
  #14  
Old 09-29-2018, 6:19 AM
The War Wagon's Avatar
The War Wagon The War Wagon is offline
Calguns Addict
 
Join Date: Apr 2011
Location: da' 'BURGH
Posts: 5,265
iTrader: 11 / 100%
Exclamation

It's the New NEW International Version - with all the non-masculine pronouns you can stomach!


NEVER trust a translation, that monkeys with the pronouns; the editors are more worried about POLITICS, than fidelity to the original language. It's the FIRST sign, of a BAD... 'translation'...
__________________
Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump



All times are GMT -8. The time now is 5:15 PM.




Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.9
Copyright ©2000 - 2018, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Proudly hosted by GeoVario the Premier 2A host.
Calguns.net, the 'Calguns' name and all associated variants and logos are ® Trademark and © Copyright 2002-2018, Calguns.net an Incorporated Company All Rights Reserved.
Calguns.net and The Calguns Foundation have no affiliation and are in no way related to each other.
All opinions, statements and remarks made by Calguns.net on this web site and elsewhere are solely attributable to Calguns.net.