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Blades, Bows and Tools Discussion of non-firearm weapons and camping/survival tools.

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Old 04-08-2009, 5:05 PM
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=== UPDATED 4/11/16 with info on 'carry on your person ===

So, here are the State level knife laws.

As noted, there is no state pre-emption here - local jurisdictions are free to create their own regs. Cities and counties can create only infractions and misdemeanors. (Gov Code 25132(a), 36900).

CONCEALED FIXED BLADE KNIVES on your person, any length, are ALWAYS ILLEGAL, as ‘dirks or daggers’ – Penal Code 21310
Quote:
Except as provided in Chapter 1 (commencing with Section
17700) of Division 2 of Title 2, any person in this state who carries
concealed upon the person any dirk or dagger is punishable by
imprisonment in a county jail not exceeding one year or in the state
prison.
In a bag or briefcase that you carry is 'on your person'.See the CA Court of appeals case Pellecer 4/17/2013 where the court says 'no' to that.

But People v Wade in 2015 refused to adopt Pellecer, so back to square one.

In your car is NOT 'on your person'. Concealed in your car is not 'concealed on your person'.

On-duty LEO seem to be exempt from this:
Quote:
12020(b)(12) The sale to, possession of, or purchase of any weapon, device, or ammunition, other than a short-barreled rifle or short-barreled shotgun, by any federal, state, county, city and county, or city agency that is charged with the enforcement of any law for use in the discharge of their official duties,

or the possession of any weapon, device, or ammunition, other than a short-barreled rifle or short-barreled shotgun, by peace officers thereof when on duty and the use is authorized by the agency and is within the course and scope of their duties.
UN-CONCEALED FIXED BLADE KNIVES may be legal, depending on where you are.

A NON-LOCKING FOLDING KNIFE, or a closed FOLDING KNIFE, any length, is not a ‘dirk or dagger’ – PC 16470
Quote:
As used in this part, "dirk" or "dagger" means a knife or
other instrument with or without a handguard that is capable of ready
use as a stabbing weapon that may inflict great bodily injury or
death. A nonlocking folding knife, a folding knife that is not
prohibited by Section 21510, or a pocketknife is capable of ready use
as a stabbing weapon that may inflict great bodily injury or death
only if the blade of the knife is exposed and locked into position.
SWITCH BLADE KNIVES, blade length 2 inches or longer, are ILLEGAL TO CARRY – Penal Code 21510 (was 653k):
Quote:
Every person who does any of the following with a
switchblade knife having a blade two or more inches in length is
guilty of a misdemeanor:
(a) Possesses the knife in the passenger's or driver's area of any
motor vehicle in any public place or place open to the public.
(b) Carries the knife upon the person.
(c) Sells, offers for sale, exposes for sale, loans, transfers, or
gives the knife to any other person.
PC 17235
Quote:
For the purposes of this section, "switchblade knife" means a
knife having the appearance of a pocketknife and includes a
spring-blade knife, snap-blade knife, gravity knife or any other
similar type knife, the blade or blades of which are two or more
inches in length and which can be released automatically by a flick
of a button, pressure on the handle, flip of the wrist or other
mechanical device, or is released by the weight of the blade or by
any type of mechanism whatsoever. "Switchblade knife" does not
include a knife that opens with one hand utilizing thumb pressure
applied solely to the blade of the knife or a thumb stud attached to
the blade, provided that the knife has a detent or other mechanism
that provides resistance that must be overcome in opening the blade,
or that biases the blade back toward its closed position.
For purposes of this section, "passenger's or driver's area" means
that part of a motor vehicle which is designed to carry the driver
and passengers, including any interior compartment or space therein.
In public (government) buildings or at public meetings, fixed or folder with 4"+ blade is a wobbler:
Quote:
171b. (a) Any person who brings or possesses within any state or
local public building or at any meeting required to be open to the
public ... any of the following is guilty of a public offense
punishable by imprisonment in a county jail for not more than one
year, or in the state prison:
...
(3) Any knife with a blade length in excess of four inches, the
blade of which is fixed or is capable of being fixed in an unguarded
position by the use of one or two hands.
On K-12 school grounds, it is illegal to bring most knives: PC 626.10
Quote:
(a) Any person, … who brings or possesses any dirk, dagger, ice pick,

knife having a blade longer than 2 1/2 inches,

folding knife with a blade that locks into place,

a razor with an unguarded blade,

upon the grounds of, or within, any public or private school providing instruction in kindergarten or any of grades 1 to 12, inclusive,

is guilty of a public offense, punishable by imprisonment in a county jail not exceeding one year, or by imprisonment in the state prison.
NON-LOCKING FOLDERS with a blade 2 ½ inches or smaller are not illegal.

Colleges and universities restrict fixed-blades, but not folders, and impose no length limit on folders PC 626.10:
Quote:
(b) Any person, … who brings or possesses any dirk, dagger, ice pick, or

knife having a fixed blade longer than 2 1/2 inches

upon the grounds of, or within,
any private university, the University of California, the California State University, or the California Community Colleges

is guilty of a public offense, punishable by imprisonment in a
county jail not exceeding one year, or by imprisonment in the state
prison.
EXCEPT University of California, which is now like K-12 for non-students/employees – 5 CCR § 100015
Quote:
[[5 CCR § 100000]] Violation of regulations promulgated under section 92440.5 is punishable as a misdemeanor. Pursuant to section 92440.5, these regulations do not apply to the conduct of students, officers, or employees of the University; their conduct is governed by other University regulations.

[[Misdemeanor to carry or possess]]
B. Any knife having a blade two and one-half inches or more in length.
C. Any folding knife with a blade that locks into place.
EXCEPTIONS from PC 626.10
Quote:
(c) Subdivisions (a) and (b) do not apply to any person who brings
or possesses a knife having a blade longer than 2 1/2 inches or a
razor with an unguarded blade upon the grounds of, or within,
a public or private school providing instruction in kindergarten or any
of grades 1 to 12, inclusive, or
any private university, state university, or community college

at the direction of a faculty member
of the private university, state university, or community college,

or a certificated or classified employee of the school

for use in a private university, state university, community college, or
school-sponsored activity or class.

(d) Subdivisions (a) and (b) do not apply to any person who brings
or possesses an ice pick, a knife having a blade longer than 21/2
inches, or a razor with an unguarded blade upon the grounds of, or
within,

a public or private school providing instruction in kindergarten or any of grades 1 to 12, inclusive,

or any private university, state university, or community college

for a lawful purpose within the scope of the person's employment.

(e) Subdivision (b) does not apply to any person who brings or
possesses an ice pick or a knife having a fixed blade longer than
21/2 inches upon the grounds of, or within, any private university,
state university, or community college

for lawful use in or around a residence or residential facility located upon those grounds or

for lawful use in food preparation or consumption.
I'll leave out the prohibition of dirks/daggers from those in prison ...

==============================================

new member wrdavis, in this thread adds a link to http://handgunlaw.us/documents/USKnife.pdf.

Some nice person has produced a list, with links to the municipal or county codes, of the local knife restrictions he/she could find.

For example, Marin County actually does prohibit some blades concealed in vehicles:
Quote:
6.52.010 - Carrying prohibited—Penalty—Exceptions.

Every person who within the unincorporated territory of the county of Marin carries concealed upon his person, or concealed within any vehicle which is under his control or direction, any knife with a blade three inches or more in length; and snap-blade knife, regardless of the length of the blade; any springblade knife, regardless of the length of the blade; any ice pick or similar sharp stabbing tool; any straight-edge razor; any razor blade fitted to a handle; or any cutting, stabbing or bludgeoning weapon or device capable of inflicting grievous bodily harm, is guilty of a misdemeanor ...
and they make no distinctions between fixed or folder. Open carry evidently is OK.

City of Oakland has a three-inch limit at Code of Ordinances 9.36.010.

=== Social Engineering and Enforcement ===

The bulk of anecdotes suggests that enforcement is more like 'arrest for something, find something to charge, oh, look, a knife!'.

We don't regularly hear about hikers arrested for "dirk or dagger", nor picnickers, nor cooking school students with a roll of chef's knives.

ETA 8/28/12 In fact, People v Mitchell, COURT OF APPEAL, FOURTH APPELLATE DISTRICT DIVISION ONE (Super. Ct. No. SCD229968) 2012 says
Quote:
In addition to incorporating a knowledge element, the California Supreme Court has generally recognized that when a defendant is charged with an offense that penalizes possession of an instrument that is ordinarily usable for peaceful purposes, the defendant may justify the possession by showing the possession was "in accordance with [the instrument's] ordinary legitimate design." (People v. Grubb (1965) 63 Cal.2d 614, 621, fn. 9; see Rubalcava, supra, 23 Cal.4th at p. 329 ["the surrounding circumstances of possession—including defendant's intended use—were relevant to the issue of whether the [object] was a prohibited weapon"].) Consistent with this principle, the standard CALCRIM instruction for the offense of carrying a concealed dirk or dagger directs that when the instrument may have innocent uses, the jury should be given an instruction stating: "When deciding whether the defendant knew the object . . . could be used as a
stabbing weapon, consider all the surrounding circumstances, including the time and place of possession. Consider also the destination of the defendant, the alteration of the object from standard form, and other facts, if any." (CALCRIM No. 2501, parentheses and bracketed punctuation omitted; see also CALJIC 12.41 [the "mental state with which a knife or other instrument is carried may be inferred from the evidence, including the attendant circumstances, the time, place, destination of the possessor . . . and any other relevant facts established by the evidence"].)

...

In Rubalcava, supra, 23 Cal.4th at page 333, the California Supreme Court acknowledged that the statute "may seem overbroad as a matter of common sense" if it was applied to such innocuous circumstances as a tailor who places a pair of scissors in his jacket, a shopper who walks out of a store with a recently purchased steak knife in his pocket, or a parent who wraps a sharp knife in a paper towel and places it in his coat to take to a PTA potluck dinner. (Id. at pp. 331, 333.) However, the court concluded that it would not find the statute "unconstitutionally overbroad without some concrete impairment of constitutionally protected conduct." (Id. at p. 333.)
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I've been saying that for years ...

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Last edited by Librarian; 04-11-2016 at 3:39 PM..
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Old 08-30-2013, 12:18 PM
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Just to re-emphasize, the State does NOT pre-empt local governments from making their own laws, so you must check with the local city and county codes.
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I've been saying that for years ...

There is no value at all complaining or analyzing or reading tea leaves to decide what these bills really mean or actually do; any bill with a chance to pass will be bad for gun owners.

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Last edited by Librarian; 09-06-2018 at 11:43 AM..
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Old 11-12-2013, 7:56 AM
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Nit picking a little, but the wording in the switchblade section should be changed from:

SWITCH BLADE KNIVES, blade length greater than 2 inches, are ILLEGAL TO CARRY – Penal Code 21510 (was 653k):

to

SWITCH BLADE KNIVES, blade length 2 inches or longer, are ILLEGAL TO CARRY – Penal Code 21510 (was 653k):

We don't need someone getting popped for a swithcblade that is exactly 2" long.
1.99" legal.
2.0" or greater ILLEGAL.
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Old 11-12-2013, 9:47 AM
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Good point; fixed.

Thanks.
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I've been saying that for years ...

There is no value at all complaining or analyzing or reading tea leaves to decide what these bills really mean or actually do; any bill with a chance to pass will be bad for gun owners.

The details only count after the Governor signs the bills.

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Old 11-12-2013, 9:53 AM
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Great resource here.

http://www.knifeup.com/knife-laws/
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Old 11-12-2013, 12:13 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by xrayoneone View Post
Not very good for CA.

"Carrying knives concealed is legal in California for most knives." -- only if 'most' means 'folded folders'.

"Dirks, daggers, and stilettos are illegal." -- No, they're not. As in the first post, it's concealed dirks/daggers that are illegal - owning/buying/selling the knives is fine, and carrying openly can be. CA law mentions 'stiletto' only in the definition of a 'cane sword' in 16340.

And their switchblade discussion is a bit too narrow; so long as one does not do any of the things in 21510, switchblades are legal to own and possess, even if the blade is longer than 2 inches. Can't buy them in CA, because it's illegal to sell in CA.
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I've been saying that for years ...

There is no value at all complaining or analyzing or reading tea leaves to decide what these bills really mean or actually do; any bill with a chance to pass will be bad for gun owners.

The details only count after the Governor signs the bills.

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Old 03-26-2014, 12:42 PM
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Since this comes up all the time:

Los Angeles: it's both city and county.

Los Angeles County Ordinance
Quote:
13.62.010 Knives and daggers defined.

As used in this chapter, the terms "knives and daggers" shall include any knife having a blade of three inches or more in length; any spring-blade, switch-blade or snap-blade knife; any knife any blade of which is automatically released by a spring mechanism or other mechanical device; any ice pick or similar sharp stabbing tool; any straight-edge razor or any razor blade fitted to a handle.

(Ord. 11915 § 1, 1979.)

13.62.020 Carrying knives and daggers in plain view prohibited.

It is unlawful for any person to carry on his person, in plain view, any knife or dagger.
Los Angeles City Ordinance
Quote:
SEC. 55.10. CARRY KNIVES OR DAGGERS IN PLAIN VIEW PROHIBITED.
(Added by Ord. No. 162,995, Eff. 1/7/88.)

(a) As used in this section, the term “knife ” or “dagger” shall include any knife , dirk or dagger having a blade 3 inches or more in length, any ice pick or similar sharp tool, any straight edge razor or any razor blade fitted to a handle.

(b) No person shall wear or carry in plain view any knife or dagger upon any public street or other public place or in any place open to the public.

(c) The prohibitions of this section shall not apply where a person is wearing or carrying a knife or dagger for use in a lawful occupation, for lawful recreational purposes, or as a recognized religious practice, or while the person is traveling to or returning from participation in such activity.
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No one will really understand politics until they understand that politicians are not trying to solve our problems. They are trying to solve their own problems - of which getting elected and re-elected are number one and number two. Whatever is number three is far behind.
- Thomas Sowell
I've been saying that for years ...

There is no value at all complaining or analyzing or reading tea leaves to decide what these bills really mean or actually do; any bill with a chance to pass will be bad for gun owners.

The details only count after the Governor signs the bills.

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Old 01-01-2015, 12:25 PM
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Default Measuring Length

Was asked how blade length was measured.

I didn't know, so asked in the LEO Forum.

One reply there suggested he used this:
AKTI Protocol for Measuring Knife Blade Length

No guarantee that any agency would follow that, but at least it makes sense.
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I've been saying that for years ...

There is no value at all complaining or analyzing or reading tea leaves to decide what these bills really mean or actually do; any bill with a chance to pass will be bad for gun owners.

The details only count after the Governor signs the bills.

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Old 11-16-2016, 10:54 PM
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I'm hitting a mental block on "A NON-LOCKING FOLDING KNIFE, or a closed FOLDING KNIFE".

Pretty much every plain old pocket knife I've ever carried has the main blade lock open to prevent it accidentally closing while your using it. And you have to push a button or lever to unlock it to fold it up. Do they literally mean a pocket knife that has a safety latch to prevent it from inadvertently closing on your finger is illegal??
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Old 11-17-2016, 12:44 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ElDub1950 View Post
I'm hitting a mental block on "A NON-LOCKING FOLDING KNIFE, or a closed FOLDING KNIFE".

Pretty much every plain old pocket knife I've ever carried has the main blade lock open to prevent it accidentally closing while your using it. And you have to push a button or lever to unlock it to fold it up. Do they literally mean a pocket knife that has a safety latch to prevent it from inadvertently closing on your finger is illegal??
Yes.

Think Swiss Army Knife and similar - non-locking blades.
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No one will really understand politics until they understand that politicians are not trying to solve our problems. They are trying to solve their own problems - of which getting elected and re-elected are number one and number two. Whatever is number three is far behind.
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I've been saying that for years ...

There is no value at all complaining or analyzing or reading tea leaves to decide what these bills really mean or actually do; any bill with a chance to pass will be bad for gun owners.

The details only count after the Governor signs the bills.

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Old 12-07-2016, 10:15 PM
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Does carrying in a pants pocket (with pocket clip exposed) mean it is NOT concealed? I want to clarify this from old hearsay from a few years ago.

Also... it IS legal to carry a switchblade on your person (perhaps with a pocket clip as mentioned above) if the blade is UNDER 2".... correct?

Finally... there seems to be no distinguishing between automatic folding knives and automatic out-the-front knives. Both are the same under the law's definition?
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Old 12-07-2016, 10:47 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by steelcore View Post
1) Does carrying in a pants pocket (with pocket clip exposed) mean it is NOT concealed? I want to clarify this from old hearsay from a few years ago.

2) Also... it IS legal to carry a switchblade on your person (perhaps with a pocket clip as mentioned above) if the blade is UNDER 2".... correct?

3) Finally... there seems to be no distinguishing between automatic folding knives and automatic out-the-front knives. Both are the same under the law's definition?
1) that's a judgement call on the part of an interested LEO - no legal definition.

2) yes. Don't count on every LEO to know that.

3) since the context is 'switchblade' I'll assume that is what you mean by "automatic folding knives"; if that's the case, yes, both are kinds of switchblades for CA.
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No one will really understand politics until they understand that politicians are not trying to solve our problems. They are trying to solve their own problems - of which getting elected and re-elected are number one and number two. Whatever is number three is far behind.
- Thomas Sowell
I've been saying that for years ...

There is no value at all complaining or analyzing or reading tea leaves to decide what these bills really mean or actually do; any bill with a chance to pass will be bad for gun owners.

The details only count after the Governor signs the bills.

Not a lawyer, just Some Guy On The Interwebs.


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Old 12-07-2016, 11:04 PM
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So the LA County law supersedes all local city laws...

So no 3"+ folders in all cities in LA County?
---

Since this comes up all the time:

Los Angeles: it's both city and county.

Los Angeles County Ordinance
Quote:
13.62.010 Knives and daggers defined.

As used in this chapter, the terms "knives and daggers" shall include any knife having a blade of three inches or more in length; any spring-blade, switch-blade or snap-blade knife; any knife any blade of which is automatically released by a spring mechanism or other mechanical device; any ice pick or similar sharp stabbing tool; any straight-edge razor or any razor blade fitted to a handle.

(Ord. 11915 § 1, 1979.)

13.62.020 Carrying knives and daggers in plain view prohibited.

It is unlawful for any person to carry on his person, in plain view, any knife or dagger.
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Old 12-07-2016, 11:24 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hermosabeach View Post
So the LA County law supersedes all local city laws...

So no 3"+ folders in all cities in LA County?
No, county law stops at the city limits.

But both LA City and LA County have equivalent laws; without looking at the city codes for other cities in LA County, no idea.
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No one will really understand politics until they understand that politicians are not trying to solve our problems. They are trying to solve their own problems - of which getting elected and re-elected are number one and number two. Whatever is number three is far behind.
- Thomas Sowell
I've been saying that for years ...

There is no value at all complaining or analyzing or reading tea leaves to decide what these bills really mean or actually do; any bill with a chance to pass will be bad for gun owners.

The details only count after the Governor signs the bills.

Not a lawyer, just Some Guy On The Interwebs.


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Old 12-07-2016, 11:26 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DeusExMachina View Post
I just ordered the BCM Colonel Lo Viz. w/free trainer. $150
So this is no go?
http://www.bravocompanyusa.com/Colon...lv-pro-blk.htm


It's a fixed blade. Don't conceal it. I don't personally believe the finger hole in it turns it into 'metal knuckles' but not being in LE, my belief is not dispositive.

ETA: why not the TDI?
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No one will really understand politics until they understand that politicians are not trying to solve our problems. They are trying to solve their own problems - of which getting elected and re-elected are number one and number two. Whatever is number three is far behind.
- Thomas Sowell
I've been saying that for years ...

There is no value at all complaining or analyzing or reading tea leaves to decide what these bills really mean or actually do; any bill with a chance to pass will be bad for gun owners.

The details only count after the Governor signs the bills.

Not a lawyer, just Some Guy On The Interwebs.



Last edited by Librarian; 12-07-2016 at 11:56 PM..
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Old 12-08-2016, 8:38 AM
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Does the "Emerson Wave" classify as anything other than a folding blade? No spring assist on the knife....was told by an LEO it was a switchblade


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Old 12-08-2016, 12:34 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by target_shot View Post
Does the "Emerson Wave" classify as anything other than a folding blade? No spring assist on the knife....was told by an LEO it was a switchblade


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http://emersonknives.com/ek_faq/wave/

I suspect those knives have a 'bias towards closure' when closed; the wave feature on its own does not create a 'switchblade'. Pockets are not part of the knife.
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Old 12-08-2016, 12:35 PM
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Does the "Emerson Wave" classify as anything other than a folding blade? No spring assist on the knife....was told by an LEO it was a switchblade


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Old 12-08-2016, 12:43 PM
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Your first mistake was taking legal advice from an LEO and not a LAWYER.


He is a coworker of mine, which is why I was surprised. Not a gun guy though....
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Old 12-08-2016, 12:46 PM
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On my Karambit, that's not a finger hole, it's a lanyard loop.


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Old 12-08-2016, 1:17 PM
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He is a coworker of mine, which is why I was surprised. Not a gun guy though....
Regardless, LEO's have a specific job as do lawyers. Do not confuse the jobs they do--many have and are behind bars because of it.

Think of it this way you wouldn't use a hammer to chop wood you would use a hatchet. Just because they look similar and sometimes the hammer will break off a piece of wood doesn't mean it should be used in that situation.
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Old 12-08-2016, 1:18 PM
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Good to know, thanks guys


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Old 12-23-2016, 10:14 PM
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Yes.

Think Swiss Army Knife and similar - non-locking blades.
But this only pertains to knives carried in the open position? A locking folder carried in the closed position should be legal. The dirk/dagger clause is referring to readily available stabbing weapons, not folded knives, correct?
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Old 12-23-2016, 10:44 PM
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But this only pertains to knives carried in the open position? A locking folder carried in the closed position should be legal. The dirk/dagger clause is referring to readily available stabbing weapons, not folded knives, correct?
Yes - but that's 'general' carry; have to obey different law for schools: k-12 bans folders than can lock.
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There is no value at all complaining or analyzing or reading tea leaves to decide what these bills really mean or actually do; any bill with a chance to pass will be bad for gun owners.

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Old 01-13-2017, 10:28 AM
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:

On K-12 school grounds, it is illegal to bring most knives: PC 626.10

NON-LOCKING FOLDERS with a blade 2 ½ inches or smaller are not illegal.

Colleges and universities restrict fixed-blades, but not folders, and impose no length limit on folders PC 626.10:

EXCEPT University of California, which is now like K-12 for non-students/employees – 5 CCR § 100015

EXCEPTIONS from PC 626.10


I'll leave out the prohibition of dirks/daggers from those in prison ...

[COLOR="Red"]==============================================


Im a Bit confused here. So Can I take my 2.5 Inch Ken Onion Knife while dropping of my Kid at school or not. It uses thumb pressure to open.
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Old 01-13-2017, 11:44 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sizzlechest View Post
:

Quote:
On K-12 school grounds, it is illegal to bring most knives: PC 626.10

NON-LOCKING FOLDERS with a blade 2 ½ inches or smaller are not illegal.

Colleges and universities restrict fixed-blades, but not folders, and impose no length limit on folders PC 626.10:

EXCEPT University of California, which is now like K-12 for non-students/employees – 5 CCR § 100015

EXCEPTIONS from PC 626.10


I'll leave out the prohibition of dirks/daggers from those in prison ...

[COLOR="Red"]==============================================

Im a Bit confused here. So Can I take my 2.5 Inch Ken Onion Knife while dropping of my Kid at school or not. It uses thumb pressure to open.
You quoted the rule: "NON-LOCKING FOLDERS with a blade 2 ½ inches or smaller are not illegal."

You say the blade of the KO is 2.5 inches.

Is it a folder? If NO, illegal. Answer seems to be YES - "It uses thumb pressure to open."

Does it lock? If YES - illegal.
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I've been saying that for years ...

There is no value at all complaining or analyzing or reading tea leaves to decide what these bills really mean or actually do; any bill with a chance to pass will be bad for gun owners.

The details only count after the Governor signs the bills.

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Old 01-13-2017, 5:16 PM
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The switchblade definition is hard to follow, for me
Is a Benchmade folding knife the locks open and has a lever that can be engaged to flip open the knife considered a switchblade?
Is it reasonable to assume a knife purchased retail in CA is legal in CA?
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Old 01-13-2017, 6:06 PM
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The switchblade definition is hard to follow, for me

1) Is a Benchmade folding knife the locks open and has a lever that can be engaged to flip open the knife considered a switchblade?

2) Is it reasonable to assume a knife purchased retail in CA is legal in CA?
1) No. Close it, and just before you get all the way to the handle, let the blade go. It'll continue to drop back to the closed position - that's the 'bias towards closure' that makes it NOT a switchblade. (If yours doesn't do that, leave it at home!)

2) Mostly. Switchblades are legal to own, and 1.99" blade switchblades are legal to sell. But sellers can be prosecuted for selling illegal stuff, so almost none of them do that knowingly.
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I've been saying that for years ...

There is no value at all complaining or analyzing or reading tea leaves to decide what these bills really mean or actually do; any bill with a chance to pass will be bad for gun owners.

The details only count after the Governor signs the bills.

Not a lawyer, just Some Guy On The Interwebs.


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Old 01-14-2017, 4:49 AM
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Great description. Thank you. Mine has a bias towards closure as you described
I went to visit the USS Constituion in Cambridge Mass last fall. security wouldn't let me in with my knife. They said it was illegal because it was over 2" - a concealed weapon
Later we visited the USS Nautilus on a Navy base. They had no problem with my knife. So you can't see a wooden sailboat with a knife, but you can have free run of a nuclear sub.
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Old 01-24-2017, 10:55 AM
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I read on some knife site that it's legal to have a switchblade/butterfly/OTF knife in your home. As long as it's not on your person. Is this true?
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Old 01-24-2017, 4:05 PM
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I read on some knife site that it's legal to have a switchblade/butterfly/OTF knife in your home. As long as it's not on your person. Is this true?
True. PC 21510 tells us what is prohibited; possession in the home is not included. And that is quoted in the first post in this thread ...
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I've been saying that for years ...

There is no value at all complaining or analyzing or reading tea leaves to decide what these bills really mean or actually do; any bill with a chance to pass will be bad for gun owners.

The details only count after the Governor signs the bills.

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Old 01-24-2017, 6:47 PM
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Thanks librarian!!!
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Old 04-09-2017, 7:51 PM
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Librarian you are the wealth of information. Thanks!!!
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Old 06-12-2017, 5:16 PM
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I just talked to a police officer at my local station with 20 years on the force and she said (as far as she is concerned) it is okay to carry a fixed blade knife, be it 4" or 8" or whatever, on your person so long as.....it is secure in a sheath and is not concealed..... i.e. is in open view.

She said she interacts with citizens all the time who carry openly and has never arrested a law abiding citizen for open carry of a fixed blade knife. She said that on the contrary she obviously has arrested suspects and felon's who carry concealed dirks, daggers, knives as well as brass knuckles etc.

She said almost everyone they talk to has a pocket knife on them and they really make little distinction between a 3" folder or a 6" fixed blade. Either one could cause serious injury or death. But if you are not a danger to anyone, not up to anything illegal etc etc use your imagination.....it doesn't bother them that much. Certainly not enough to get arrested for.

She also said the laws have changed in the last 2 years or so and knife infractions that used to be a felony have been downgraded to misdemeanor.

However, even though she spent a good amount of time with me....people were coming in she needed to help and she had to get going before she was able to look up the exact penal code etc. She did ask a couple officers close by and they said what she said.

So after that long intro......... what is the "official" take here?

Can I legally carry a 6" fixed blade knife on my person in Los Angeles and surrounds, if it is in a sheath and carried openly....not concealed? Is the police officer incorrect?

Just to say......she did say..."why would you want to carry such a knife on you? Are you going hunting?" which I thought was funny, but I get the point. I very politely replied that if it is my right, I'd like to exercise that from time to time and besides, sometimes I forget I have a knife on my belt, since I wear a knife and other tools every day on my tool belt. Sometimes I pare down to a lighter carry and go with one tool pouch and a knife and tape measure on my regular pants belt. It is then I sometimes forget to get everything off me.....and that I just wanted to know so I am not breaking any laws. What I didn't say was that if some religious nut job wanted to cut my head off or stab me and others around me....that I would have the means to defend myself to a degree, since it is almost impossible to get a carry permit for a firearm in Los Angeles. It was a pleasant conversation, no attitude.

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Old 06-12-2017, 6:42 PM
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Can I legally carry a 6" fixed blade knife on my person in Los Angeles and surrounds, if it is in a sheath and carried openly....not concealed? Is the police officer incorrect?
The text of the LA City and LA County ordinances is posted above; based on that, if that officer meant Los Angeles, she was wrong.

But LE are free (required, actually, if they care to keep their jobs) to enforce laws the way they are trained, and if that's what her agency wants, that's how it will go.

If a local DA says 'don't bring me those unless there are special circumstances', LE agencies may implement training that way.

But knowing enforcement would be significantly different from the text of the laws is hard.
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I've been saying that for years ...

There is no value at all complaining or analyzing or reading tea leaves to decide what these bills really mean or actually do; any bill with a chance to pass will be bad for gun owners.

The details only count after the Governor signs the bills.

Not a lawyer, just Some Guy On The Interwebs.



Last edited by Librarian; 06-12-2017 at 6:48 PM..
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Old 06-13-2017, 3:05 PM
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I am so confused after reading all of this. I am interested in getting a KaBar TDI and carrying it concealed so I came into here to read up on the laws. Now I am second guessing if I am even legally able to carry my folding pocket knife, an H&K assisted open Blitz knife...
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Old 06-13-2017, 3:57 PM
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TDI is a fixed blade, and illegal to conceal.

In most places, Blitz should be OK, but can't know all the different jurisdictions and definitions.
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I've been saying that for years ...

There is no value at all complaining or analyzing or reading tea leaves to decide what these bills really mean or actually do; any bill with a chance to pass will be bad for gun owners.

The details only count after the Governor signs the bills.

Not a lawyer, just Some Guy On The Interwebs.


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Old 09-12-2018, 10:04 AM
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So the Wade decision has undone the Pellecer ruling that said carrying a fixed blade in a backpack was OK.

Does this mean that as long as I'm not carrying the backpack it's ok to store my fixed blade in it even if the backpack is in close proximity to me, e.g., I'm "leaning against it?"

Can I carry my fixed blade attached to the outside of my backpack/tactical briefcase, and then when I set the backpack/tactical briefcase down, put the fixed blade inside of it?

Thanks for the help.

God Bless,
David
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Old 09-14-2018, 1:43 PM
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Librarian,

Your opinion on my aforementioned questions would be greatly appreciated. I understand that it is not legal counsel but just your opinion. Thank you for your contribution.

God Bless,
David
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Old 09-14-2018, 4:17 PM
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Can I carry my fixed blade attached to the outside of my backpack/tactical briefcase, and then when I set the backpack/tactical briefcase down, put the fixed blade inside of it?
My personal opinion? That would probably be illegal. Back when I was commuting via BART I used to have a fixed blade in my bag, and when I found the concealed fixed blade law, I switched to a folder.

As far as enforcement goes, I expect one must fail the 'attitude test'. I have fixed blades in my car emergency bags and my more comprehensive medical bag (Swedish Moras) and I'd would not hesitate to use those bags in public as intended.
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I've been saying that for years ...

There is no value at all complaining or analyzing or reading tea leaves to decide what these bills really mean or actually do; any bill with a chance to pass will be bad for gun owners.

The details only count after the Governor signs the bills.

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