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Centerfire Rifles - Manually Operated Lever action, bolt action or other non gas operated centerfire rifles.

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  #1  
Old 06-16-2018, 11:01 PM
pipeline1 pipeline1 is offline
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Default Winchester 94, help figuring out price

Was looking to pick up a pre 64 to add to the collection, I plan to use it regularly.

Is this price way off base for the rifle? Also does that stock look like it was glued back together or do my eyes deceive me (very possible)

https://www.gunbroker.com/item/771500854


Just any general reasons to avoid this?

Last edited by pipeline1; 06-17-2018 at 11:27 AM..
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  #2  
Old 06-16-2018, 11:34 PM
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I'm pretty sure that's just the grains in the wood. Not sure about the price though. I guess it would depend on how pre 64 it is.
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Old 06-17-2018, 12:02 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pipeline1 View Post
Was looking to pick up a pre 64 to add to the collection, I plan to use it regularly.

Is this price way off base for the rifle? Also does that stock look like it was glued back together or do my eyes deceive me (very possible)

https://www.gunbroker.com/item/771500854


Just any general reasons to avoid this?
You're referring to photo #9, yes? I can't tell for sure, but photo #6 close-up looks OK. Regarding value, my few years old BB puts a 30% gun at $675.00. Whether this gun is 30% or less, not sure. The addition of the sling swivels would bug me alot more than the wear. The one on the magazine tube probably comes off easily, on the stock there will be a hole left behind.

The screws on the tang look messy and not proper for the gun, I'd be concerned about the action and ask about the bore condition.

Last edited by dfletcher; 06-17-2018 at 12:05 AM..
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Old 06-17-2018, 8:01 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pipeline1 View Post
Was looking to pick up a pre 64 to add to the collection, I plan to use it regularly.

Is this price way off base for the rifle? Also does that stock look like it was glued back together or do my eyes deceive me (very possible)

https://www.gunbroker.com/item/771500854


Just any general reasons to avoid this?

Quote:
Originally Posted by dfletcher View Post
You're referring to photo #9, yes? I can't tell for sure, but photo #6 close-up looks OK. Regarding value, my few years old BB puts a 30% gun at $675.00. Whether this gun is 30% or less, not sure. The addition of the sling swivels would bug me alot more than the wear. The one on the magazine tube probably comes off easily, on the stock there will be a hole left behind.

The screws on the tang look messy and not proper for the gun, I'd be concerned about the action and ask about the bore condition.
I concur with dfletcher above.... It looks like it is a model 94 SRC (saddle ring carbine). If it left the factory as a SRC it will command a little more $$ than a regular carbine. Unfortunately if you want to make it a "shooter" you need to know what condition the bore is in. Some of these old Winchesters are well used over the many decades and the barrels accuracy compromised with the wear. I think the gun is in questionable condition, with the addition of the slings, the poor condition of the front sight, the mismatched screws on the tang all add up to a well worn rifle that I would pass on. There are waaaaay too many of these rifles out there to settle on this one.

If you are looking for a "shooter", I would look for a "pre '64" from the 1950's. I have a few model 94's and I personally like the SRC version and will continue to pick up good honest examples of those when I come across them

Model 94, ser.# 3,208,xxx. Mfg in 1969 Saddle ring carbine in .44 magnum (NIB / complete set)
Model 94, ser.# 3,201,xxx. Mfg in 1969 Saddle ring carbine in .44 magnum
Model 94, ser.# 1,936,xxx. Mfg in 1952 Carbine in .32 WCF
Model 94, ser.# 1,764,xxx. Mfg in 1950 Carbine in 30-30
Model 94, ser.# 969,xxx. Mfg in 1925 Saddle ring carbine in .30 WCF
Model 94, ser.# 727,xxx. Mfg in 1915 Saddle ring carbine in .30 WFC
Model 94, ser.# 558,xxx. Mfg in 1912 Saddle ring carbine in .30 WCF

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Last edited by OCEquestrian; 06-17-2018 at 8:21 AM..
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Old 06-17-2018, 8:50 AM
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The rifle is being sold as is with no inspection or refund available. The seller also doesn’t have that many transactions. With those criteria and not being able to inspect the internals I’d definitely pass.
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Old 06-17-2018, 9:24 AM
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Good calls all around. I’m new to gun broker and didn’t notice that inspection policy tab. I’ll keep looking, if any of you happen upon a good example of a 94, please let me know!

Thank you all
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Old 06-17-2018, 11:27 AM
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If I may bug you all again,

https://www.gunbroker.com/item/775855692
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Old 06-17-2018, 11:48 AM
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Originally Posted by pipeline1 View Post
If I may bug you all again,

https://www.gunbroker.com/item/775855692
That one looks pretty clean and assuming the blue is original (judging by the machining marks and stamps, it appears to be) and the bore is in good condition that is a fair price, I have paid more for a pre-64 and paid less for similar condition, the market on lever guns seems to be dying though sadly, atleast from my experience working at gunshops.
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Old 06-17-2018, 1:25 PM
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Originally Posted by adamkdoiron View Post
That one looks pretty clean and assuming the blue is original (judging by the machining marks and stamps, it appears to be) and the bore is in good condition that is a fair price, I have paid more for a pre-64 and paid less for similar condition, the market on lever guns seems to be dying though sadly, atleast from my experience working at gunshops.

Thanks for the reply, here is the response from the owner:



I am not the original owner and I believe the finish may have been touched up on wood and metal,but it looks very good.It has been test fired and it has all original parts i very good mechanical condition and should be a great daily shooter.
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Old 06-17-2018, 2:08 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pipeline1 View Post
Thanks for the reply, here is the response from the owner:

I am not the original owner and I believe the finish may have been touched up on wood and metal,but it looks very good.It has been test fired and it has all original parts i very good mechanical condition and should be a great daily shooter.
The rifle has what is called a "flat band" - the barrel band just behind the front sight is flat rather than profiled on the sides. I don't see a price distinction made in the Blue Book for flat bands, I do know relatively few were made in 25.35 and command a premium. It may add some value in the more common 30 WCF chambering.

The rifle appears clean but a couple of things jump out. If the seller doesn't know about the flat band what else may he not know about the gun? And I'd be surprised to learn a pawn shop had test fired the rifle, although the copy doesn't explicitly state they test fired it. And I'd take "may have been" touched up to mean it has definitely been touched up.

I've bought a fair number of guns off GB and have learned that unless the photographs are near professional quality it can be very difficult to determine condition with much degree of specificity. Especially on long guns because there's so much more to cover and long shots are more distant. I'd be much more inclined to buy if pictures are crystal clear and up tight, cover 100% of the gun. Otherwise I'd go to a LGS and but after handling.
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Old 06-17-2018, 2:15 PM
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Pasadina - worth the drive to see it. Id rather pay to get a new Henry. But thats just me. Why 30-30? Just curious. 44mag is cheaper to shoot. 357 much cheaper to shoot.

.
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Old 06-17-2018, 2:15 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dfletcher View Post
The rifle has what is called a "flat band" - the barrel band just behind the front sight is flat rather than profiled on the sides. I don't see a price distinction made in the Blue Book for flat bands, I do know relatively few were made in 25.35 and command a premium. It may add some value in the more common 30 WCF chambering.

The rifle appears clean but a couple of things jump out. If the seller doesn't know about the flat band what else may he not know about the gun? And I'd be surprised to learn a pawn shop had test fired the rifle, although the copy doesn't explicitly state they test fired it. And I'd take "may have been" touched up to mean it has definitely been touched up.

I've bought a fair number of guns off GB and have learned that unless the photographs are near professional quality it can be very difficult to determine condition with much degree of specificity. Especially on long guns because there's so much more to cover and long shots are more distant. I'd be much more inclined to buy if pictures are crystal clear and up tight, cover 100% of the gun. Otherwise I'd go to a LGS and but after handling.
Thank you for the reply, Iím a newbie to buying used gun on the net. Do you think the price is in line with any possibility, (being touched up) vs not touched up, where either condition would be palatable for the price? Iím sure there is a bit of preference, but curious for your thoughts.
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Old 06-17-2018, 2:15 PM
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Originally Posted by orangeusa View Post
Pasadina - worth the drive to see it. Id rather pay that and get a new Henry. But thats just me. Why 30-30? Just curious. 44mag is cheaper to shoot. 357 much cheaper to shoot.

.

Pasadena MD
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Old 06-17-2018, 2:17 PM
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Pasadena MD
Oops. haha
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Old 06-17-2018, 2:22 PM
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Oops. haha
Nostalgia mostly on why 30-30, and then Iíve always wanted a win 1894, lots of history behind the line and a pre 64 seems super solid
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Old 06-17-2018, 7:02 PM
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I have a similar condition and year 94 as the second Gunbroker example.

While the metal patina and wear is about the same the GB gun's wood is almost new/refinished as compared to mine. The colors are very bright and the wood at the tang is lower than the metal.

So I believe the stock and forearm have been refinished.

Just my .02

irh
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Old 06-17-2018, 7:41 PM
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Originally Posted by ironhorse1 View Post
I have a similar condition and year 94 as the second Gunbroker example.

While the metal patina and wear is about the same the GB gun's wood is almost new/refinished as compared to mine. The colors are very bright and the wood at the tang is lower than the metal.

So I believe the stock and forearm have been refinished.

Just my .02

irh
Thank you for the info. What do you think about this stock, which does have a little damage?

https://www.gunbroker.com/item/772708220
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Old 06-17-2018, 7:50 PM
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The second stock is the way unmolested wood should appear. Scratched, worn and faded.

As mentioned in my first post when metal is above the wood that area has been over sanded and now the metal stands proud above the wood.

Easy to see the difference in the wood, at the tang, when you compare pictures of both stocks.

Just another way to tell if original or refinished.

irh
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Old 06-20-2018, 10:19 PM
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Just keep searching the Calguns classifieds... the pop up pretty frequently in No. and So Calif.
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Old 06-21-2018, 11:59 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pipeline1 View Post
Thank you for the reply, Iím a newbie to buying used gun on the net. Do you think the price is in line with any possibility, (being touched up) vs not touched up, where either condition would be palatable for the price? Iím sure there is a bit of preference, but curious for your thoughts.
If the gun were not refinished I'd say that's a good price. The observation about the wood stock on the tang being lower is a good point (I didn't catch it) and shows how difficult it can be to catch all the points.

If the stock & forend are refinished and the bluing is touched up extensively I'd say $700.00 is a bit proud. And unlike well refinished wood, cold blue touch up doesn't last very long. It generally rubs off very quickly, even a light oiling starts to clear it off.
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