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California 2nd Amend. Political Discussion & Activism Discuss gun rights activism and 2A related political topics here. All advice given is NOT legal counsel.

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  #201  
Old 04-04-2017, 11:56 AM
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Is this on again tonight?https://cupertino.legistar.com/Depar...AB732D 
See today's agenda。item8, Staff Report, last item. Gun Safety Ordinance

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  #202  
Old 04-04-2017, 2:02 PM
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Originally Posted by jconfus View Post
Is this on again tonight?https://cupertino.legistar.com/Depar...AB732D 
See today's agenda。item8, Staff Report, last item. Gun Safety Ordinance

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Thanks for finding that! I looked at the upcoming agendas last week but if it was posted then I missed it. They may discuss this item briefly before just saying "Yes, write a draft targeting gun storage at retailers", but we can request to speak on that topic.

I may only be able to record this remotely for later viewing, so I'm hoping others will appear and make the case that this area is also already covered state law (and not just recent law) and that this duplication would be a preemption conflict just like the previous draft.

If not, or if they ignore us, we'll have to make that case at a future PSC meeting when they receive the new draft ordinance.
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  #203  
Old 04-04-2017, 2:05 PM
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I'm surprised they do the PLEDGE OF ALLEGIANCE at the meetings. Which flag do they have up? Is it red with a hammer and sickle???
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  #204  
Old 04-04-2017, 2:19 PM
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Owned by apple
This. Did Apple ever pay their taxes to the city?
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  #205  
Old 04-05-2017, 5:05 PM
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As most of you know, last month the Cupertino city council decided to drop the previous gun ordinance draft to avoid preemption issues, but then decided to focus instead on strengthing storage requirements on the last gun store in town. At last night's meeting, they officially directed city staff to proceed with that new draft.

I couldn't be there, but I recorded it thanks to jconfus' alert. The council and staff still seemed to have no information on existing law, and there really wasn't a good way to comment before their decision even if any of us were there. Still, really sorry I couldn't make it. As a resident I will do my best to inform staff and council members of existing law in the hopes that they will drop this too, and I'm sure others will as well. But city staff will be drafting this new ordinance unless they become convinced through their own research that this too would violate the state constitution.

Any draft they produce would be sent to the Public Safety Commission with the direction to make a recommendation back to the city council. Or not. Last time it was a big "not", because they were handed a big mess. Although this draft would concern only our one remaining friendly neighborhood gun store, I hope the community will turn out in force once again to support them if needed.
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  #206  
Old 04-05-2017, 10:09 PM
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What kind of new rules do they want to put in place? Is Kerley's aware and have any interest in showing up to explain?
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  #207  
Old 04-05-2017, 10:49 PM
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What kind of new rules do they want to put in place? Is Kerley's aware and have any interest in showing up to explain?
They don't know exactly what new rules they want, and they are just now discovering that state laws on this have been in place for years. There may not be anything they can add that wouldn't be a preemption problem.

I can't speak for Kerleys, but the owner and his key staff are well aware of all this. They attended and spoke at most of the previous relevant meetings. I don't know what they plan to do now, but it's often far more effective to do private meetings or calls rather than make speeches in public meetings. Failing that, just keep quiet and work on your legal strategy.
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  #208  
Old 06-05-2017, 4:08 PM
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Another new month with no sign of a gun store ordinance on the PSC agenda: https://cupertino.legistar.com/Dep... If they ever do proceed with this, by then Cupertino won't even have a local gun store to worry about.

Yes, Kerley's, established 1969, is closing. I'm amazed to find no other posts about this on CalGuns...though maybe that's a sign of the times. The new generation of gun owners in town never seemed to take to the old place.

It would be easy to say this possible new ordinance was the last straw for Harry, but I'm told he's moving his business to Sunnyvale. Sunnyvale! Talk about "out of the frying pan and into the fire". So that can't be it. He has an association with U.S. Firearms there, but has long seemed like he wanted to focus on gunsmithing and other non-retail aspects of the business, so I don't know what exactly they'll be doing there. Best of luck to the whole Kerley's crew.
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  #209  
Old 06-05-2017, 4:58 PM
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What about Ezell? Is that not controlling precedent???
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  #210  
Old 06-05-2017, 5:26 PM
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Originally Posted by LeftHand-Fu View Post
Another new month with no sign of a gun store ordinance on the PSC agenda: https://cupertino.legistar.com/Dep... If they ever do proceed with this, by then Cupertino won't even have a local gun store to worry about.

Yes, Kerley's, established 1969, is closing. I'm amazed to find no other posts about this on CalGuns...though maybe that's a sign of the times. The new generation of gun owners in town never seemed to take to the old place.

It would be easy to say this possible new ordinance was the last straw for Harry, but I'm told he's moving his business to Sunnyvale. Sunnyvale! Talk about "out of the frying pan and into the fire". So that can't be it. He has an association with U.S. Firearms there, but has long seemed like he wanted to focus on gunsmithing and other non-retail aspects of the business, so I don't know what exactly they'll be doing there. Best of luck to the whole Kerley's crew.
This is the first I've heard of Kerley's closing - I have a rifle there on consignment, haven't picked up my $$$ from the last gun I sold there. I suppose I should visit. Any idea whatthey're doing with their retail inventory?
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  #211  
Old 06-05-2017, 5:33 PM
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What about Ezell? Is that not controlling precedent???
Just to catch you up: the City Council dropped the entire "firearms safety ordinance", and then directed their staff to draft something targeting only gun retailers.

Ezell vs. the City of Chicago, which concerned gun ranges, no longer applies. It's debatable whether it ever did, as Cupertino has had an ordinance since about 1962 requiring permits for recreational shooting, that ordinance has never been used to restrict ranges, and the proposed new ordinance did not change that language. But as I said, they dropped the entire proposal.

All that's left is a possible new ordinance imposing new security requirements on gun retailers.
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  #212  
Old 06-05-2017, 5:40 PM
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This is the first I've heard of Kerley's closing - I have a rifle there on consignment, haven't picked up my $$$ from the last gun I sold there. I suppose I should visit. Any idea whatthey're doing with their retail inventory?
We should probably make a new thread just on Kerley's. And you should call them, pronto. By mid-May I saw very little inventory left, and the display cases were for sale. Last time I drove by, a week or two ago, it looked like they'd shuttered the whole retail front and were only working out of the back. I have not been near there since, but as I understand it the lease runs out this month.
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  #213  
Old 06-05-2017, 6:28 PM
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What about Ezell? Is that not controlling precedent???
Only in the 7th Circuit.
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  #214  
Old 06-05-2017, 6:51 PM
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No doubt. But based on the response of Cupertino's new generation, I'd say they're not succeeding. Or as someone else put it here: "It was standing room only, mostly Cupertino residents, which is to say mostly Asians and a few older white guys. Interestingly, practically everyone took the opportunity to speak, and opposition was completely unanimous."
Who spoke in favor of it? That would have to be the Bloomberg operative. There should have been at least one there, if they are keeping track of their local efforts.
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Old 06-05-2017, 8:00 PM
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A husband and wife, from San Francisco, were pro ordinance,,,, but they had not read the ordinance, before coming to speak.

They each spoke separately.
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  #216  
Old 06-05-2017, 8:33 PM
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Originally Posted by LeftHand-Fu View Post
Just to catch you up: the City Council dropped the entire "firearms safety ordinance", and then directed their staff to draft something targeting only gun retailers.

Ezell vs. the City of Chicago, which concerned gun ranges, no longer applies. It's debatable whether it ever did, as Cupertino has had an ordinance since about 1962 requiring permits for recreational shooting, that ordinance has never been used to restrict ranges, and the proposed new ordinance did not change that language. But as I said, they dropped the entire proposal.

All that's left is a possible new ordinance imposing new security requirements on gun retailers.
OK - and what about the recent controlling 9CA precedent from Alameda County????
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  #217  
Old 06-05-2017, 9:30 PM
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OK - and what about the recent controlling 9CA precedent from Alameda County????
We'll need to see the draft ordinance to know if that applies, but as far as we know they're not trying to restrict store locations here. They are considering requiring additional security to make gun store burglaries more difficult. No details are available.
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  #218  
Old 06-05-2017, 10:07 PM
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A husband and wife, from San Francisco, were pro ordinance,,,, but they had not read the ordinance, before coming to speak.

They each spoke separately.
Perfect candidates to run for the CA legislature next year!
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  #219  
Old 06-06-2017, 8:30 AM
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Who spoke in favor of it? That would have to be the Bloomberg operative. There should have been at least one there, if they are keeping track of their local efforts.
There were about 40 of us at the first Public Safety Commission meeting. All spoke against the draft ordinance. Over 50 turned out for the second PSC meeting, and all but three who spoke were against it.

The husband and wife mentioned above were from Cupertino. "San Francisco" stands out in listeners' minds because the husband mentioned he works at UCSF, as if that gives him extra expertise on this topic. They had learned about the meeting on nextdoor.com but apparently had no idea what was in the draft ordinance. (Someone else here who has a Nextdoor account said the OP supported the ordinance, but most of the replies were against it.) The husband complained about limits on research funding, and generally spouted Bloombergesque talking points in reaction to other speakers without addressing what was in the actual draft. The wife said something about being afraid of "guns exploding in childrens' backpacks"...where do these paranoid delusions come from? Both were very emotional, completely unprepared, and at times I actually felt sorry for them. One other guy spoke in favor of reproducing state gun laws at the local level to "remind" people, unaware of the state constitutional issues that would create. None of those arguments seemed to get any traction with the commissioners. Arguments against the draft ordinance ranged from broad 2A rights to very specific state constitutional preemption issues.

The PSC was short one member, and deadlocked with two in favor of modifying the draft to edit out preemption issues, and two wanting to drop the thing like a hot potato.

The next event was a City Council goal-setting offsite, to which the public was invited. It began at an ungodly early Sunday morning hour, and only a few of us showed up, all against, none in favor. Two of us spoke, and also had productive side conversations with key Council members. (Most of the other attendees were there to argue about Vallco Mall. It was a long morning.)

At the next City Council meeting, they dropped the whole thing due to preemption issues, but decided to have city staff draft a new ordinance requiring more security at gun stores. And that's where we are today, waiting to see if they release a draft to an upcoming PSC meeting.
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  #220  
Old 06-09-2017, 3:14 PM
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Originally Posted by LeftHand-Fu View Post
We should probably make a new thread just on Kerley's. And you should call them, pronto. By mid-May I saw very little inventory left, and the display cases were for sale. Last time I drove by, a week or two ago, it looked like they'd shuttered the whole retail front and were only working out of the back. I have not been near there since, but as I understand it the lease runs out this month.
Waited a few days and didn't see any movement so I started a new thread on Kerley's closing.
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  #221  
Old 03-25-2018, 8:19 AM
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This issue is back on the council agenda.

May 1, 2018
Public Hearings
16-1751 Subject: Gun Control ordinance
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  #222  
Old 03-25-2018, 8:23 AM
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Here is a pdf showing the up coming calendar items.
Attached Files
File Type: pdf City of Cupertino Gun Control Ordinance.pdf (351.2 KB, 34 views)
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  #223  
Old 03-25-2018, 11:28 AM
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Thanks. I've added that to my calendar for recording at minimum, attendance if possible. This is ominous, as I haven't seen anything run by the Public Safety Commission yet. I wonder if they've referred a draft ordinance for review at the April 12th commission meeting, or if they'll do so after the May 1st council meeting ...or if they're just going to try and surprise us with a fast one this time.
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  #224  
Old 03-25-2018, 3:20 PM
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Probably resurfaced after the student walkout from De Anza college that ended at city hall. Hopefully the residents that were at the first meeting that opposed this will again show up at make their voices heard.
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  #225  
Old 03-25-2018, 10:09 PM
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What happened at Twin Sisters?

they gendered into twin brothers




Would some kind soul
put the regulation into print and PM it to me or post it please,

My access to the www is via amateur radio and for some reason im unable to
view or make the link work , Thank You Kindly

i realized this is old news so to speak, but rusty minds want to know

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Old 03-25-2018, 10:20 PM
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Originally Posted by inyocountymark View Post
Would some kind soul
put the regulation into print and PM it to me or post it please,

My access to the www is via amateur radio and for some reason im unable to
view or make the link work , Thank You Kindly

i realized this is old news so to speak, but rusty minds want to know
They haven't published anything yet. I'm sure one of us will post or PM it for you when they do. Most of this thread has been about proposed regulations that the City Council gave up on. After that they were going to focus on a something else: forcing the local gun store get bollards and other security. But that store has long since moved on, and for all we know they've got a different gleam in their eye now. (Very cool that you're accessing this via packet radio or Pactor or whatever!)
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Old 03-26-2018, 1:40 AM
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Originally Posted by LeftHand-Fu View Post
They haven't published anything yet. I'm sure one of us will post or PM it for you when they do. Most of this thread has been about proposed regulations that the City Council gave up on. After that they were going to focus on a something else: forcing the local gun store get bollards and other security. But that store has long since moved on, and for all we know they've got a different gleam in their eye now. (Very cool that you're accessing this via packet radio or Pactor or whatever!)
Thank You, yes packet radio on a vintage c64, i have a tablet and some new friends have let me use their system but im breaking them in slowly to the firearm in every corner theory, (and i like using the packet system) they are my age and im glad they chose to live out their retirement years in my AO, and again i thank you very much for that information
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Old 04-20-2018, 4:43 PM
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The gun control ordinance item has been removed from the May 1st council meeting in Cupertino. The agenda should be posted next week. I will be out of country next week and unable to see the agenda when it is posted. Maybe someone else can verify this so people do not waist their time showing up for nothing. Or making sure they do not add it at the last minute. Because that never happens.
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  #229  
Old 04-20-2018, 5:00 PM
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The gun control ordinance item has been removed from the May 1st council meeting in Cupertino. The agenda should be posted next week. I will be out of country next week and unable to see the agenda when it is posted. Maybe someone else can verify this so people do not waste their time showing up for nothing. Or making sure they do not add it at the last minute. Because that never happens.
Thanks, I'll check on it next week.
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  #230  
Old 04-20-2018, 11:42 PM
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This is just BS. Some ****ty little city government members that want to make the news. Look we banned firearms too!
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  #231  
Old 04-21-2018, 1:59 PM
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This is just BS. Some ****ty little city government members that want to make the news. Look we banned firearms too!
They will get a gold star, pat on the back and their name on some obscure Bloomberg list.
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Old 04-26-2018, 8:57 AM
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The agenda has been released, and I do not see firearms mentioned: PDF

I suppose the topic could come up at the end of the meeting during the "Report on Committee assignments and general comments". A member of the public could also bring the topic up during the Oral Communications segment and the Council could then discuss it, but state law would prohibit them from making a decision without putting it on the official agenda for another meeting. What we're really watching for is any indication a new ordinance is in the works through any committee or staff assignments.

At previous meetings the Council has directed their staff to draft new local firearms regulations, as described earlier in this thread. Any such ordinance would be assigned to the Public Safety Commission for review before going to back to the Council. The next meeting of that commission is May 10th, and that agenda should be posted next week.
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Old 04-26-2018, 9:38 AM
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It's bad enough with 50 different state interpretations of the Bill Of rights. When individual cities begin to qualify those rights it's all but over here in the USA.
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Old 04-26-2018, 2:17 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jimi Jah View Post
It's bad enough with 50 different state interpretations of the Bill Of rights. When individual cities begin to qualify those rights it's all but over here in the USA.
Cities and counties are limited in what they can do under CA state constitutional limits on "preemption", and that derailed most of what Cupertino was trying to do. All we had to do was show up at some meetings to explain existing state law to them. But they'd still like to do something.

I think if the Council wants to make a statement they should give up on a specific ordinance and just declare a resolution that makes it clear as if we didn't already know that they don't like guns, don't know anything about guns, and don't have any idea what they're talking about.
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Old 05-07-2018, 11:26 AM
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I see nothing to concern us in this week's PSC meeting agenda either [PDF].

The minutes for last week's City Council meeting are not yet posted, but the video [link] is there.

In skipping around in the video, all I found was a brief mention by Vice Mayor Sinks at 5: 43: 45 of a proposal by Sheriff Smith for a possible county gun buyback program. This was just something Sinks heard at an event he was required to attend.

I may not be able to monitor these things every month, but so far so good.
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Old 05-07-2018, 4:43 PM
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Looks like this is on the back burner again. It is still listed under the "Date to be determined" section of the Up Coming Agenda Items I receive. I will keep watching and alerting everyone if anything changes. We know it is just a matter of time.
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Old 05-07-2018, 10:44 PM
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Thanks @BCA142.
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Old 05-31-2018, 6:48 AM
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Saratoga is considering a firearms ordinance too: https://www.mercurynews.com/2018/05/...n-regulations/
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Old 06-23-2018, 9:26 PM
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The council has published the minutes and some comments from residents. Looks like there'll be a public hearing, and the ordinance will likely be passed -- most of the comments from residents are supportive of it.

My take: just another unenforceable ordinance, good for publicity when council members want to seek higher office.

http://www.saratoga.ca.us/AgendaCent.../_06202018-276

https://legistarweb-production.s3.am..._Ordinance.pdf

RECOMMENDED ACTION:
Conduct a public hearing concerning the attached ordinance that would establish regulations for
storage of firearms in Saratoga residences and requirements for reporting lost or stolen firearms in
the City of Saratoga; and, introduce and waive the first reading of the ordinance and direct staff to
place the ordinance on the consent calendar for adoption at the next regularly scheduled meeting
of the City Council.

Draft Ordinance:
https://legistarweb-production.s3.am...n_Firearms.pdf

Resident Comments; CRPA letter at the end:
https://legistarweb-production.s3.am...unications.pdf

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Saratoga is considering a firearms ordinance too: https://www.mercurynews.com/2018/05/...n-regulations/
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Old 06-24-2018, 8:40 AM
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Looks like Saratoga's willing to fight any preemption challenge. There is already a state law requiring firearms to be stored locked if children are around, and another requiring stolen firearms reported within what, five days? This could get interesting.
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