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Competition, Action Shooting And Training. Competition, Three gun, IPSC, IDPA , and Training discussion here.

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  #1  
Old 05-27-2018, 12:41 PM
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Default 100 yards iron sights in .223



Advice wanted


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  #2  
Old 05-27-2018, 2:01 PM
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Shoot good ammunition!
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Old 05-27-2018, 2:07 PM
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mbuis and good barrel and good ammo. Aim small hit small.
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Old 05-27-2018, 2:11 PM
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Adjust down 3 clicks..
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  #5  
Old 05-27-2018, 2:31 PM
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Adjust down 3 clicks..


Her first day out since I got her for Xmas. Was able to zero her in at 25y. Noticed 50y was a few inches low. Thought Iíd leave it there and adjust my aim. Seemed like the 223 ammo shot higher than .556 but I donít know much about trajectory yet.


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  #6  
Old 05-27-2018, 2:42 PM
edgerly779 edgerly779 is offline
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>556 faster out of the barrel less barrel rise. Called barrel dwell. At close range this is significant.
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Old 05-27-2018, 2:47 PM
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Do 3 shot groups, mark center and adjust from there. You should have it tight quick. Just FYI on most milspec ammo 36 yard and 300 yard is the same trajectory.
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Old 05-27-2018, 2:51 PM
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Advice wanted


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Is that one group?
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  #9  
Old 05-27-2018, 2:56 PM
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Is that one group?


No. I was just glad to see Iím getting shots on target. Will try the shoot three and mark next time.


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Old 05-27-2018, 3:01 PM
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No. I was just glad to see Iím getting shots on target. Will try the shoot three and mark next time.


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Oh, so you were adjusting your sights, chasing impacts? Or...

More info on rifle? ammo you were using?
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  #11  
Old 05-27-2018, 3:24 PM
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Oh, so you were adjusting your sights, chasing impacts? Or...



More info on rifle? ammo you were using?

Once i had it zero at 25 I left it alone. The rifle was a Daniel Defense DDM4V3. Ammo was 55gr America Eagle 223


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Old 05-27-2018, 5:15 PM
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Practice fundamentals of sight picture, trigger squeeze, follow through, etc. set up with sandbags, build a good stable position...

Hard to diagnose, looks like you are using a shotgun. We all start out like that though donít feel bad.
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Old 05-27-2018, 5:16 PM
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Is there a reason for no scope? Also Iím guessing your pretty new to shooting?


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  #14  
Old 05-27-2018, 5:23 PM
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Once i had it zero at 25 I left it alone. The rifle was a Daniel Defense DDM4V3. Ammo was 55gr America Eagle 223


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How old are you? What helped me the most was finding a few old guys to take me under their wing(s). I baked for them. They helped me learn. Itís nearly impossible to read and learn as much on the internet as you can from a salty old Marine.

Five minutes of instruction from somebody who spent a lifetime doing this is worth about five hours of reading on the internet.
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  #15  
Old 05-27-2018, 5:42 PM
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You said it shot 5.56 at different poi than .223 at 25 yards it ain't much but you are better off to just shoot one brand& weigh until you get it dialed in . Sighted in at 25 should be high at 50 not lower Before sighting in you need to decide how far you plan on shooting said gun and at what as that will determine range to sight in .The 30 / 300 sight in is good if you don't mind being 7 to 9 inches high in the 100 yards range but if you want to be closer at 100 yards you need to be around 1 1/2 inch low at 25 yards . Also how far your sight is above center of bore matters a lot .

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Old 05-28-2018, 11:52 AM
OpenSightsOnly OpenSightsOnly is offline
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Advice wanted
Instead of using that target, buy a stash of MR 31C target, and use that for your 100 yard practice.

The X ring is about 0.75 MOA while the 10 ring is 2 MOA.

Also, show up at a service rifle/highpower match to get advice and training.
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  #17  
Old 05-29-2018, 7:51 AM
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Instead of using that target, buy a stash of MR 31C target, and use that for your 100 yard practice.
The targets you were using aren't very helpful for iron sights. For 100yds you need targets that are approximately 6" diameter such as those mentioned above. Small paper plates sprayed black are good too. Dirty Bird or Shoot N See are good reactive targets.

Proper sight alignment is important. 6 O'clock hold or "pumpkin on a fencepost"
concentrating on the front sight focus is important.

http://www.odcmp.org/0907/usamu_sightpicture.asp

http://blog.cheaperthandirt.com/impr...anship-skills/

Last edited by smoothy8500; 05-29-2018 at 7:53 AM..
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  #18  
Old 05-29-2018, 8:56 AM
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Originally Posted by 17+1 View Post
Practice fundamentals of sight picture, trigger squeeze, follow through, etc. set up with sandbags, build a good stable position...



Hard to diagnose, looks like you are using a shotgun. We all start out like that though donít feel bad.

I think the hardest thing for me to do at that distance is keeping my support hand steady long enough to stay center.


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  #19  
Old 05-29-2018, 8:58 AM
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The shoot and see were 12x12 , couldnít imagine hitting something half that.


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Old 05-29-2018, 9:11 AM
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I think the hardest thing for me to do at that distance is keeping my support hand steady long enough to stay center.


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If your shooting without a front support like a bag or bi-pod you need to take your muscles out of it. Use your bone structure and or a sling to support the weight of the gun. If your using muscles to hold the gun on target, your going to get very tired quickly.

Also right or wrong and easier way to shoot off hand or without a front rest is to start high on the target and slowly fall into your point of aim. Line your sights up high, let your breath out slowly, squeeze the trigger, and relax letting the gun slowly fall into the spot where you want to fire. Once you hit that spot, the trigger should go off. It sounds like a lot going on, but itís easier controlled movements vs hard concentrating on one spot.
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Old 05-29-2018, 9:14 AM
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Quote:
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The shoot and see were 12x12 , couldnít imagine hitting something half that.


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Aim small miss small aim big miss big .you can hit a golf ball as far as you can see it ( if gun is accurate enough) if it is setting center on top of front sight .As previously stated you don't cover the target you balance it on top of front sight .

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  #22  
Old 05-29-2018, 9:21 AM
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If your shooting without a front support like a bag or bi-pod you need to take your muscles out of it. Use your bone structure and or a sling to support the weight of the gun. If your using muscles to hold the gun on target, your going to get very tired quickly.

Also right or wrong and easier way to shoot off hand or without a front rest is to start high on the target and slowly fall into your point of aim. Line your sights up high, let your breath out slowly, squeeze the trigger, and relax letting the gun slowly fall into the spot where you want to fire. Once you hit that spot, the trigger should go off. It sounds like a lot going on, but itís easier controlled movements vs hard concentrating on one spot.
I shoot mostly off hand or with shooting sticks and even though I prefer a single stage for bench/ deer stand a good two stage like Ruger elite is great for shooting as described . with practice the gun will almost fire itself when sights align . I would add don't try to hold on target , practice trigger release as soon as line up not hold on target until you get around to squeezing trigger .

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  #23  
Old 05-29-2018, 9:28 AM
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Thanks for the tips, is there a sticky for all this info? I guess I should use the search function too.

Really appreciate the advice. Will get a sling before my next trip out. Are there any brands to stay away from?


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Old 05-29-2018, 10:39 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by smoothy8500 View Post
The targets you were using aren't very helpful for iron sights. For 100yds you need targets that are approximately 6" diameter such as those mentioned above. Small paper plates sprayed black are good too. Dirty Bird or Shoot N See are good reactive targets.
MR 31C is the 600 yard slow prone target reduced for 100 yard "walk 'n paste" highpower matches.

SR 1C is a good alternative since the x ring is about 2 MOA as a starter.

Since the scoring rings are graduated for 100 yards, that's a good starter or a gauge for progress.
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Old 05-30-2018, 9:42 PM
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The cartridge you are shooting is pretty awesome. Inexpensive, accurate and little recoil. Even a cheap knock off reddot that is mounted securely should shrink those groups in half. As you add magnification to the sight enhancement youíre groups can shrink even more.
Shooting that rifle open sights is wasting all those attributes I mentioned above. I understand for the purists and their opinion to not be dependent on anything battery or other.

Watch a basic video on how to shoot off a bench using common household items if you donít want to spend money on bags or formal rests. A 50 cal military ammo box with 2 sandbags inside that you use in support of the rifle once at the range makes for an excellent supported rest. You just store them in the can and thatís what you grab when you go to the range.
As others have pointed out searching out some rudimentary technique pays very well outside formal instruction.

Sling. There are tons out there along with opinions on the best.

Typically I never use a sling when shooting from a bench.
The slings value as a 5th means of rifle support comes into play when you need support using only your body to shoot and stabalize the rifle.
Hands down I love the VTAC sling. An excellent product offered by an impressive individual. Kyle Lamb.
This brand of sling replaced every other. I started with 2 point basic, 3 point transitional, 1 point non transitional, 1 point transitional to now 2 point transitional. Knowing what I know I would never go back to any of the others.
But, as with any sling itís imperative you watch a video dedicated to whichever one you purchase to understand the merits of each. Not all slings are created equal.
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Old 05-30-2018, 9:44 PM
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Buy a scope or move the target to 25 yards
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Old 05-31-2018, 11:27 AM
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What scope magnification should I consider?


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Old 06-01-2018, 6:40 AM
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Giving up on the irons, eh?
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Old 06-01-2018, 6:55 AM
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What scope magnification should I consider?


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Boy you just opened a can of worms Lol . Check out Cabela's 3x circle dot . best ever for what most people need .

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Old 06-01-2018, 8:50 AM
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2-point sling, use it just like for NRA High Power competition shooting, so google some videos of sling usage that.

A better trigger could be a huge difference, what trigger are you using (stock?) and what brand/model rifle? A milspec trigger can be anywhere up to 6.5lbs, long slow gritty and nasty. A 2-stage 4.5lbs competition trigger (lightest allowed for High Power) is a lot different feeling.


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Old 06-01-2018, 9:06 AM
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2-point sling, use it just like for NRA High Power competition shooting, so google some videos of sling usage that.

A better trigger could be a huge difference, what trigger are you using (stock?) and what brand/model rifle? A milspec trigger can be anywhere up to 6.5lbs, long slow gritty and nasty. A 2-stage 4.5lbs competition trigger (lightest allowed for High Power) is a lot different feeling.


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Iím using a Daniel Defense M4. Iíve heard their triggers are hot or miss, I think I lucked out and got a really clean trigger. I even bought a Geissele trigger before shooting her but the stock canít be more than 5# pull with a clean break and a short reset. Good enough imo

I really thought I could get away without any optics but you guys sold me so Iím searching for a local optic I can find with mounts and see if this will close some groups.


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Old 06-04-2018, 9:10 AM
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Just a final update. I picked up a 1-4x optic and went as far as 500meters but couldnít knock down the steel at SAc Valley. I was mostly effectively at 300 yards. Got all my shots on target using 18Ē shoot n see.




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Old 06-04-2018, 9:21 AM
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Just a final update. I picked up a 1-4x optic and went as far as 500meters but couldn’t knock down the steel at SAc Valley. I was mostly effectively at 300 yards. Got all my shots on target using 18” shoot n see.




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Go back to Sac Valley this coming Sat or Sun for the xtc course match and 3x600.A lot of good people there to get you squared away.
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Old 06-04-2018, 9:23 AM
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Try one of the Appleseed events also. They teach you the basic 3 shooting positions using a sling at 25 yards. They teach you basic marksmanship such as trigger control, breathing, natural point of aim, etc. Its a 2 day course but you will learn a lot!
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Old 06-04-2018, 9:25 AM
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Try one of the Appleseed events also. They teach you the basic 3 shooting positions using a sling at 25 yards. They teach you basic marksmanship such as trigger control, breathing, natural point of aim, etc. Its a 2 day course but you will learn a lot!


Heading to Front Sight soon.


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