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  #961  
Old 06-12-2018, 9:23 PM
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BrassCase BrassCase is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by F&F FIREARMS View Post
Brass Case.... Nbrun was accommodated with product. I just meant that he wasnt involved in the sales part of it. Thanks for the appreciation guys! You rock!
Good to hear, he deserves it! These things are a lot of work, just keeping up with PMs is a chore on its own!!!


It will be interesting to hear what Jordan believes may be wrong with the jig. Strange since it is reported that the first 2 out of it in Sac were OK.
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  #962  
Old 06-12-2018, 9:37 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BrassCase View Post
Good to hear, he deserves it! These things are a lot of work, just keeping up with PMs is a chore on its own!!!


It will be interesting to hear what Jordan believes may be wrong with the jig. Strange since it is reported that the first 2 out of it in Sac were OK.
Incorrect. The first is unconfirmed if it is bad or good still. Currently being sent to get checked. 2nd, 3rd, 4th, 5th have been confirmed bad, 6th unconfirmed and is also going out to get checked, 7th confirmed bad. Then you got the 2 in the bay that are bad as well. The numbers represent the order they were completed.
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  #963  
Old 06-12-2018, 9:39 PM
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Yes. Many thanks to Nick and Chris for setting this up. I feel that they have been extremely accommodating and more than fair. Thank you both.
Kevin

Last edited by Sicarius; 06-13-2018 at 12:27 AM..
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  #964  
Old 06-12-2018, 9:51 PM
get-a-gun get-a-gun is offline
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Anyone who's FCU ended up out of spec please report what exactly was wrong, what parts did not feet together. We need to rule out the human error factor.

I didn't hold a jig in my hands but from what I can see on the photos many holes can be double checked by aligning a jig with sig completion parts.
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  #965  
Old 06-12-2018, 9:58 PM
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Whoever hosts the jig in the SF Bay area, I have access to a table top drill press and can probably loan it for the duration of time the jig is up here.

For those with out of spec lowers, I wonder if JB weld can be used to salvage them. I've used it to repair 80% ar lowers, but it sounds like the tolerances on the sig fcu are tight.
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  #966  
Old 06-12-2018, 10:19 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wowsza View Post


top notch customer service; great job, guys.
F&F Firearms, do the right thing and send him a new insert without having to be unprofessional about it.

This is just bad form and I would hesitate to buy anything from you and would warn others about this situation.
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  #967  
Old 06-12-2018, 10:58 PM
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Originally Posted by vic18t View Post
F&F Firearms, do the right thing and send him a new insert without having to be unprofessional about it.

This is just bad form and I would hesitate to buy anything from you and would warn others about this situation.
I think it's already stated in that conversation that the fcu will be replaced. However, no return/refund for the build kit.
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  #968  
Old 06-13-2018, 4:35 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wowsza View Post
nubrun notified me that the jig was damaged or defective the night of 6/7, after two inserts had been drilled.



F&F Firearms admitted earlier in this thread that they knew about the problem on 6/4.



F&F Firearms knew the jig was damaged or defective for days before having nubrun contact me.



if the jig is damaged or defective, it's not their fault, but what angers me at this point is they knew there was a problem and didn't say a word until it was too late, and not once have they apologized for it or offered to make things right in any way.







i would normally agree, but i'm not going to let someone insult me in private because he thinks it won't get out.



i have never personally insulted either of these guys or called them any names, and have respectfully voiced my side of the issue while apologizing when i was out of line or jumped to conclusions.







to be clear, the 5 replacement inserts are for the 5 sacramento calgunners that ruined their inserts by using the jig.



nubrun reached out to JSD on their behalf, and JSD agreed to replace the the inserts and jig. i was not given the same courtesy, even though i had notified nubrun of my damaged inserts on 6/7.



i asked nubrun about having my inserts replaced, and he told me to contact JSD myself; i have not heard back from JSD as of monday night, granted he is on vacation.



and while we're speaking of him, big thanks to JSD for replacing the five inserts for the sac guys without even knowing if the jig was at fault. he has been by far the most professional out of the three, and i apologize again for criticizing his product, because it is clear he stands by what he makes and is willing to go out of his way to make things right.

1. It has been said repeatedly that we did not have confirmation of a problem on 6/4. All I have are texts asking about how to assemble something and there being difficulty. This does NOT mean a jig issue.

2 to be clear I’m not sure where Chris got the 6/4 date from since he wasn’t on the group text with the Sacramento guys. Feel free to reach out to them and confirm

3. Yes the 5 inserts are for the Sacramento guys since they reached out to jsd. He sent them to me to help expedite since he was leaving on vacation.

4. If your insert was damaged as it has been said multiple times, reach out to jsd and he will likely replace it like he did the others. No need to keep acting like you’re getting hung out to dry

5. I did not reach out to jsd on behalf of the Sacramento guys. They did their own leg work like I advised you to do as well. No additional “courtesy” was given to them.

I propose we stop bickering in the main thread. You have my cell number, you’re welcome to give me a call any time. Also if it helps to resolve this, i have 2 spare inserts that I can ship up to you if you ship me your bad inserts down (like the sac guys are) so we can help provide feedback to jsd. How is that offer? And then I will deal with jsd when he gets back from vacation.
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  #969  
Old 06-13-2018, 4:44 AM
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Guys, I am on vacation in the mountains of West Virginia. I hardly get internet in the house we are staying at, let alone cell phone service.

I know probably none of you on here know me other than Chris and Nick. I will not let a problem go without trying to fix it.

I have not received the jig back yet, but I can come up with 2 different scenarios.

1) The jig is out of spec for the slide catch pin hole (this is most likely the case, anything is possible in machining)

2) The top plate was not used to secure the FCU in the jig (this will add to what was experienced, please squeeze the top plate into the jig as tightly as possible with a vise when you are drilling, I have a video on how I do that on my JSD Supply facebook)



I sent out a jig that I personally tested twice, and nick is going to test again when he receives it. I also sent out 5 FCU replacements because that was all we knew for 100% certainty were having issues. I will send out the other 2 as well. So far I have only been contacted by wowsza. I will need to get shipping info sent to my email from him and the other person.


Typically, when dealing with warranty replacements, the defective product is sent back, inspected, and either fixed or replaced. I haven't even seen pictures of all of the FCUs in question so I'm going off the good word of the members here that there are issues. I know California is in an uproar over the July 1 deadline, so I wanted to get these out sooner than later.


Something else we didn't necessarily discuss is human error. Please follow the instructions.



If there is an issue with a JSD Supply product, I will handle it. Either through our dealers, or directly.
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  #970  
Old 06-13-2018, 5:59 AM
F&F FIREARMS F&F FIREARMS is offline
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Vic18t, we are replacing his insert... I have been very professional or I probably wouldnt be in business or have such great reviews... this was a different situation... I apologize that everyone has to see this in the thread...
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  #971  
Old 06-13-2018, 6:09 AM
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i ruined my first fcg because at the time the instructions were not posted and just a video.

With that being said it worked however the takedowm hole nd slide stop holes were out of place which caused the slide stop to not function.

I did not drill the holes with the top piece in as i did not want to damage it.
I strongly suggest anyone who is building on at this point read the instructions a few times.
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  #972  
Old 06-13-2018, 6:11 AM
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If tjer3 is anyone in the oceanside/carlsbad area WITH a DRILL PRESS AND VICE that would like to use my jig please pm me.
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  #973  
Old 06-13-2018, 8:17 AM
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Jordan, thanks for taking time from your vacation to update the group.

What disturbs people is the drilling into the top plate, drill holes are shown in pictures posted above. Jordan has indicated that this is OK, he created the jig and procedure so...I think what has happened is that people using a group jig and others like James above, saw this and didn't want to damage the top plate since it was going to be used again and again and the fear was that the plate would end up like Swiss cheese and fail. Would Using match marks between the jig and top plate help to minimize that? So they tried to come up with alternatives to use in order to preserve the top plate for the next guy. At least that was my thinking. Jordan may not have anticipated that each jig would get the heavy repeated usage (damaging the top plate) which is probably novel to CA only due to a jig shortage with respect to July 1st.

At this point I would be happy to my own top plate and maybe each of the group jig users should each buy their own or at least have one to share with just a couple of others and consider the top plate as a sacrificial piece that needs should to be replaced after every 3rd(?) use? As it is late in the game I don't know how practical that is and how fast JSD could crank out top plates so that is probably not the solution for the CA deadline.

The bottom line is that we need to get this moving along again. We've have a lot of wasted days with the jig sitting around doing nothing. Let's all stop the bickering, look forward and get moving along.
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  #974  
Old 06-13-2018, 9:11 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BrassCase View Post
Jordan, thanks for taking time from your vacation to update the group.

What disturbs people is the drilling into the top plate, drill holes are shown in pictures posted above. Jordan has indicated that this is OK, he created the jig and procedure so...I think what has happened is that people using a group jig and others like James above, saw this and didn't want to damage the top plate since it was going to be used again and again and the fear was that the plate would end up like Swiss cheese and fail. Would Using match marks between the jig and top plate help to minimize that? So they tried to come up with alternatives to use in order to preserve the top plate for the next guy. At least that was my thinking. Jordan may not have anticipated that each jig would get the heavy repeated usage (damaging the top plate) which is probably novel to CA only due to a jig shortage with respect to July 1st.

At this point I would be happy to my own top plate and maybe each of the group jig users should each buy their own or at least have one to share with just a couple of others and consider the top plate as a sacrificial piece that needs should to be replaced after every 3rd(?) use? As it is late in the game I don't know how practical that is and how fast JSD could crank out top plates so that is probably not the solution for the CA deadline.

The bottom line is that we need to get this moving along again. We've have a lot of wasted days with the jig sitting around doing nothing. Let's all stop the bickering, look forward and get moving along.
Drilling the top plate of the jig won't have any detrimental effects. Its the top part that bends the rails and holds the insert down when clamped in a vice, so drill away.

You can't buy the top plate separately, so that's not an option anyways.

And the jig hasn't been sitting around, JSD shipped me the replacement prior to the hold up in shipping the questionable jig back to him, which was great. We currently have 24 people expected to complete there inserts by saturday night... Its going to be a loooong Saturday...
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  #975  
Old 06-13-2018, 11:35 AM
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I'm, in the Bay area and like some of the other members I'm getting concerned about the deadline and the jig.

JSD states that current orders for jigs should ship when they get back on 6/18 - should someone over here just purchase a jig and wait for it to ship as a timely alternative to the community jig?

Honestly I'd be willing to pick one up to speed up the process but if it's not going to speed anything up there's no point.
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  #976  
Old 06-13-2018, 12:00 PM
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Originally Posted by Marxman View Post
I'm, in the Bay area and like some of the other members I'm getting concerned about the deadline and the jig.

JSD states that current orders for jigs should ship when they get back on 6/18 - should someone over here just purchase a jig and wait for it to ship as a timely alternative to the community jig?

Honestly I'd be willing to pick one up to speed up the process but if it's not going to speed anything up there's no point.
So the thought is that the jig will return back to the bay area after this weekend. I have a personal one that's part of the 6/4 shipping cycle that I hope ships when Jordan gets back next week.

Does anyone have a drill press and is willing to host people int he bay area?
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  #977  
Old 06-13-2018, 12:45 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Marxman View Post
I'm, in the Bay area and like some of the other members I'm getting concerned about the deadline and the jig.

JSD states that current orders for jigs should ship when they get back on 6/18 - should someone over here just purchase a jig and wait for it to ship as a timely alternative to the community jig?

Honestly I'd be willing to pick one up to speed up the process but if it's not going to speed anything up there's no point.
I paid for a personal jig during the original group buy period. I talked with Chris last night and he said it could be 2 weeks. I am hoping that JSD's shipping schedule is still accurate and it gets shipped earlier (6/18).
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  #978  
Old 06-13-2018, 1:49 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nubrun View Post
So the thought is that the jig will return back to the bay area after this weekend. I have a personal one that's part of the 6/4 shipping cycle that I hope ships when Jordan gets back next week.

Does anyone have a drill press and is willing to host people int he bay area?
I have a drill press and the bits from McMaster Carr that you recommended. I just don't have the space to host. I can bring the drill press where ever we can find a space in the Bay Area. Let me check with my cousin if I can use her office warehouse. If necessary, we can do it in my office, Saturday and Sunday. I can clear one of my rooms to do the work. Maybe during the week if I don't have patients coming in.

I need a time line when the jig can come to the bay area to coordinate the space.
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  #979  
Old 06-13-2018, 2:28 PM
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So the rest of the jigs aren't shipping in 5 days like stated? Maybe Jordan should consider shipping the Cali orders if he's behind on his production.
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  #980  
Old 06-13-2018, 3:40 PM
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Again if anyone in North San Diego county is willing to host and has a drill press I am willing to bring my JIG which has already made a few working FCG's.
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  #981  
Old 06-14-2018, 8:30 AM
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So to get things back on track here is the jig rotation information. We should get through all of the IE people this weekend and then one jig will head to the bay area, and one will head back to sacramento to let them re-do their inserts. From there the second jig will go to the bay area as well.

A couple of things, please, please, please, read through all of the instructions at the link below completely before attempting to complete you're insert. There are a couple of important notes in there that can save you significant headache or broken drill bits/jigs. You don't want to be that guy that ruins the jig for everyone!

Step-by-step Instruction with Pictures:
http://80percenter.com/jsd-supply-p3...ert-completion

Reminder of the rules:

1) Sender pays shipping to the next user. This is about $7-8 using USPS Priority flat rate.
2) Jig starts at the host and he will help facilitate the movement of the jig through the area
3) If users want to get together, they should coordinate via PM since the legalities of build parties are ambiguous. I highly recommend regions try and look into this. It will help to drastically expedite the completion schedule.
4) Jig ships between users within the region first based on order on the list. As we get the second and third jig it will start at the bottom of the list in a different region.
5) Last user in region sends to first user of next region
6) Each user notifies me when they receive and when they ship the jig, so I can track
7) Anyone who completes their insert must inform me so I cross you off the list. This covers situations where a jig is shared by multiple parties and prevents jig from being sent to someone not needing it
8) Please, please, please, try and complete your insert as quickly as possible. If you are on vacation or unable to complete it quickly for any reason, let me know and I will modify the order in the list and we can keep it moving quickly.

I want to address a new issue that is coming up... Now that the jigs are moving around people are asking to be added to the list as the jigs get to that region. Here is how I am proposing this is handled to be fair to the guys that have been on the list forever...

People wanting to be added to the jig use list:
If someone in the region hosts (such as jig hosts) the jig at their location for a day (read between the lines), I don't have a problem with new requestor's using it that day. If they want to be added to the list where the jig is shipped to them, or transferred to them in person, I propose that these new requestor's wait until the jigs have shipped through all regions and everyone that has been on the list has completed theirs.

Inland Empire: June 14-15
Jig Host:nubrun
lambduh
obpwankel
Sitruc
Jcarp03
Deedzman
razmataz
abcdef760
rmnc3r
superjover
Ocbc
Odegard
Dkindrumr
Brian7581
Hamster07
Tribalpinoy
fahqtoo

Bay Area:
Jig Host: TBD Confirm with Wowsza and Brass Case how this is being handled
get-a-gun
golfhack
Inplainsight
223556
Jingerale
BayMaverick
CMC
Revognah
Brasscase
Marxman
willidru
1hotrod
GunnEnvy
westcoaster

Orange County:
Petree777

SFV:
northridgegun
striker199

Los Angeles:
munkeeboi
pensiveape
qvo
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  #982  
Old 06-14-2018, 8:33 AM
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Also, if you aren't planning on using the community jig anymore, please let me know so that I can get your name off the list. I know a couple of people who have jumped out and I have tried to remove their names so the list stays accurate.
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  #983  
Old 06-14-2018, 9:54 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mountain Max View Post
So the rest of the jigs aren't shipping in 5 days like stated? Maybe Jordan should consider shipping the Cali orders if he's behind on his production.
I guess we find out on the 18th... I am still holding out hope that JSD gets ours out on time....
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  #984  
Old 06-14-2018, 11:41 AM
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Originally Posted by Mountain Max View Post
So the rest of the jigs aren't shipping in 5 days like stated? Maybe Jordan should consider shipping the Cali orders if he's behind on his production.
Where was the 5 day thing stated? I know he is slightly behind on shipping (my personal jig is in the June 4th shipping date, and I haven't received notice yet) but I would think he has at least two weeks of per-orders still. I just don't want people to have the wrong expectations.
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  #985  
Old 06-14-2018, 12:22 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nubrun View Post
Where was the 5 day thing stated? I know he is slightly behind on shipping (my personal jig is in the June 4th shipping date, and I haven't received notice yet) but I would think he has at least two weeks of per-orders still. I just don't want people to have the wrong expectations.
Yeah I didn't know he missed the shipping schedule again. It looks like the schedule was changed again on the website, but if he hasn't shipped to you yet then it looks like we can't count on our personal jigs.

He should just skip the line and ship all the California orders since it doesn't really matter to anyone else but us on the timeframe for this.
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  #986  
Old 06-14-2018, 12:34 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mountain Max View Post
Yeah I didn't know he missed the shipping schedule again. It looks like the schedule was changed again on the website, but if he hasn't shipped to you yet then it looks like we can't count on our personal jigs.

He should just skip the line and ship all the California orders since it doesn't really matter to anyone else but us on the timeframe for this.
I don't want to speak for JSD on any timeline, but if you are worried about the volreg deadline, you may want to consider getting in on the group builds.
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  #987  
Old 06-14-2018, 1:16 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nubrun View Post
I don't want to speak for JSD on any timeline, but if you are worried about the volreg deadline, you may want to consider getting in on the group builds.
I'm doing mine as an AOW with a Form 1 using the Inlander Arms kit so I don't have to worry about the deadline. I'm not on this group buy either so I guess I'm just the peanut gallery.
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  #988  
Old 06-14-2018, 1:40 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nubrun View Post
I don't want to speak for JSD on any timeline, but if you are worried about the volreg deadline, you may want to consider getting in on the group builds.
Do you know when the LA area is going to get the community jig?
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  #989  
Old 06-14-2018, 3:43 PM
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Do you know when the LA area is going to get the community jig?
Right now it's looking like after the bay area. After the bay area i think there are only 4 people left from the original list, 2 in LA and 2 in SFV. I know one LA person is driving out to the IE on saturday.
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  #990  
Old 06-14-2018, 4:39 PM
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Hey Nubrun, need your address for this Saturday. Could you PM it to me please?
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  #991  
Old 06-14-2018, 4:41 PM
Odegard Odegard is offline
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NVM saw the group pm, disregard.
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  #992  
Old 06-14-2018, 6:14 PM
qvo qvo is offline
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Originally Posted by Odegard View Post
Hey Nubrun, need your address for this Saturday. Could you PM it to me please?
Nubrun, what time are you hosting at your place on Saturday, how late can it be? Think about drive to join with you guys but have to work until 7pm.
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  #993  
Old 06-15-2018, 4:51 AM
westcoaster westcoaster is offline
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Anyone else not get their FCU yet? Bay area buyer here.
Getting a bit worried here...
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  #994  
Old 06-15-2018, 6:52 AM
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nubrun nubrun is offline
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Originally Posted by westcoaster View Post
Anyone else not get their FCU yet? Bay area buyer here.
Getting a bit worried here...
As far as I know you are the only one... Are you an X5 or Xcarry order? I would suggest talking with Chris.
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  #995  
Old 06-15-2018, 8:33 AM
jingerale jingerale is offline
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Originally Posted by westcoaster View Post
Anyone else not get their FCU yet? Bay area buyer here.
Getting a bit worried here...
fcu? I thought everyone already got those. I'm still waiting on my X5 kit.
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  #996  
Old 06-15-2018, 8:40 AM
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lamduh lamduh is offline
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Originally Posted by jingerale View Post
fcu? I thought everyone already got those. I'm still waiting on my X5 kit.
I talked to chris yesterday about the x5 he said he's about a couple weeks out on the restock on the x5 kits. I was going to buy another one but seems like some of you guys haven't even got the first one so I'll wait.

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  #997  
Old 06-15-2018, 8:59 AM
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nubrun nubrun is offline
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Originally Posted by lamduh View Post
I talked to chris yesterday about the x5 he said he's about a couple weeks out on the restock on the x5 kits. I was going to buy another one but seems like some of you guys haven't even got the first one so I'll wait.

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I think he has plenty coming, although not sure the pricing will be the same. I’ve been trying to feel him out on another one as well. The price he offered them at was a steal- lol.
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  #998  
Old 06-15-2018, 9:04 AM
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lamduh lamduh is offline
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Lol yea I know, I alrdy got the x5 i just wanted the xcarry to swap out.

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  #999  
Old 06-15-2018, 10:24 AM
myv myv is offline
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Originally Posted by nubrun View Post
Right now it's looking like after the bay area. After the bay area i think there are only 4 people left from the original list, 2 in LA and 2 in SFV. I know one LA person is driving out to the IE on saturday.
Hey Nubrun, since I am not sure if I will get my own jig in time, can I get added to the LA list? I know its small so hopefully we can fit me in.
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  #1000  
Old 06-15-2018, 10:31 AM
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Marxman Marxman is offline
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Anyone in the Bay Area capable or considering hosting a get together to discuss jig etiquette and proper usage of a drill press for educational purposes?
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