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California 2nd Amend. Political Discussion & Activism Discuss gun rights activism and 2A related political topics here. All advice given is NOT legal counsel.

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  #281  
Old 08-12-2017, 12:46 AM
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Originally Posted by Discogodfather View Post
Why do you always personalize everything? Put on the man's pants and discuss the issues on their merit. When I trash your ideas you claim it's a personal insult, it's just silly. It's just another redirect because you are out of ideas.
And C.F. didn't personalize with his post?

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It’s always seemed to me absurd that you make 100% of the people to do something, in order to make sure that 1 or 2% of the people don’t behave badly.
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  #282  
Old 08-12-2017, 12:51 AM
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And with that being said since I own more than one I also have the new maglocks installed on 7 of my rifles.

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So seven of your rifles aren't going to be used for self defense or home defense?
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Not checkers, not chess, its Jenga.
"The California matrix of gun control laws is among the harshest in the nation and are filled with criminal law traps for people of common intelligence who desire to obey the law." - U.S. District Judge Roger T. Benitez

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  #283  
Old 08-12-2017, 12:53 AM
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So seven of your rifles aren't going to be used for self defense or home defense?
That is correct.

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It’s always seemed to me absurd that you make 100% of the people to do something, in order to make sure that 1 or 2% of the people don’t behave badly.
-Milton Friedman
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  #284  
Old 08-12-2017, 12:55 AM
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That is correct.

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However I have the luxury of changing their configurations at a later date if I choose to do so.

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It’s always seemed to me absurd that you make 100% of the people to do something, in order to make sure that 1 or 2% of the people don’t behave badly.
-Milton Friedman
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  #285  
Old 08-12-2017, 6:18 AM
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So seven of your rifles aren't going to be used for self defense or home defense?
Why would a rifle with a fixed mag be less effective for home defense vs a rifle with a BB?




.
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It makes it bigger and longer.
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  #286  
Old 08-12-2017, 6:37 AM
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Why would a rifle with a fixed mag be less effective for home defense vs a rifle with a BB?




.
If it's an AR it has something called an ND double feed liability. Essentially the bolt carrier is in the buffer tube, the rifle can't be opened, the mag can't be dropped, so how do you clear it. Bad enough it's a brick until you remove the buffer tube, which takes tons of time and requires special tools. The real threat is that a double feed, in the right position, can act like a firing pin and hit the primer in front of it, now you have a potential negligent discharge and it's out of battery to boot.

So, a complete nightmare. Are you going to defend yourself with that? All you need is a SIG 320 and you can officially have a two ring circus.
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Not checkers, not chess, its Jenga.
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  #287  
Old 08-12-2017, 9:23 AM
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If you gonna neuter your ar15 with featureless stuff, might as well sell it and buy a mini14
Usually I'd agree, but if you don't already have a Mini-14, it too will be registered through the involuntary registration they now have or you won't get one. Voluntary registration is agreeing with the involuntary registration.
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  #288  
Old 08-12-2017, 9:29 AM
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17 years ago I can understand the purpose for registration. Today we live in a different world and our state leaders are basically lunatics. Registering a BB rifle isn't even close to a standard magazine release to consider preserving imo. Featureless at least allows us to install a regular magazine release. For me between a standard magazine release at the cost of a pistol grip, flash hider and collapsible stock, is worth it.

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I've always understood the government's purpose for registration, for that reason I don't understand why anyone would want to though.
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  #289  
Old 08-12-2017, 9:36 AM
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I've always understood the government's purpose for registration, for that reason I don't understand why anyone would want to though.
I'd challenge you to think beyond what we all heard at the gun show in the 70's and the 80's during the paper age when such ideas about registration actually meant something, i.e. keeping off the radar.

In the information age is seems crazy to suggest they do not possibly know almost everything about us, and that assuming that they do not is dangerous.

Also, why would you be worried about what the State knows then post on a public forum about what you think they do not know you have?

Times have changed, and we need to evolve with new technology. My solution is to assume they know, and analyze what they do not want us to do. Judging from their insane illegal regulations and failure to open the reg period until 7 months after the supposed start date and then making it as hard as possible to register, you tell me what they want us to do.
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Someone must put an end to this endless bickering by posting the unadulterated indisputable facts and truth.
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Not checkers, not chess, its Jenga.
"The California matrix of gun control laws is among the harshest in the nation and are filled with criminal law traps for people of common intelligence who desire to obey the law." - U.S. District Judge Roger T. Benitez

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  #290  
Old 08-12-2017, 9:38 AM
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Originally Posted by Discogodfather View Post
If it's an AR it has something called an ND double feed liability. Essentially the bolt carrier is in the buffer tube, the rifle can't be opened, the mag can't be dropped, so how do you clear it. Bad enough it's a brick until you remove the buffer tube, which takes tons of time and requires special tools. The real threat is that a double feed, in the right position, can act like a firing pin and hit the primer in front of it, now you have a potential negligent discharge and it's out of battery to boot.
I agree with this, I don't like fixed mag on AR for same reason.
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  #291  
Old 08-12-2017, 9:40 AM
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Originally Posted by meno377 View Post
17 years ago I can understand the purpose for registration. Today we live in a different world and our state leaders are basically lunatics. Registering a BB rifle isn't even close to a standard magazine release to consider preserving imo. Featureless at least allows us to install a regular magazine release. For me between a standard magazine release at the cost of a pistol grip, flash hider and collapsible stock, is worth it.

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I'd think about that idea you just stated for a few more seconds. So you think 17 years ago it was a no-brainer? Let me tell you something about 2000 my friend, it was extremely difficult to even tell what was going on. People like you, who were throwing shade on registration any way they could, dominated the discussion. To them the confiscation was coming a year later, and it was all a giant trap.

So forgive me if I raise my hand to my forehead when I see you saying you would have seen the advantage to registration 17 years ago. The fact is nothing is obvious when we don't know what's coming next.
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Someone must put an end to this endless bickering by posting the unadulterated indisputable facts and truth.
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Not checkers, not chess, its Jenga.
"The California matrix of gun control laws is among the harshest in the nation and are filled with criminal law traps for people of common intelligence who desire to obey the law." - U.S. District Judge Roger T. Benitez

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  #292  
Old 08-12-2017, 9:45 AM
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Originally Posted by Discogodfather View Post
I'd think about that idea you just stated for a few more seconds. So you think 17 years ago it was a no-brainer? Let me tell you something about 2000 my friend, it was extremely difficult to even tell what was going on. People like you, who were throwing shade on registration any way they could, dominated the discussion. To them the confiscation was coming a year later, and it was all a giant trap.

So forgive me if I raise my hand to my forehead when I see you saying you would have seen the advantage to registration 17 years ago. The fact is nothing is obvious when we don't know what's coming next.
Nope. I said 17 years ago I can understand. That is not saying it was a 'no brainer'. Trying to change my wording or meaning are we??
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I've been married so long that I don't even look both ways when I cross the street.
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-Milton Friedman


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It’s always seemed to me absurd that you make 100% of the people to do something, in order to make sure that 1 or 2% of the people don’t behave badly.
-Milton Friedman

Last edited by meno377; 08-12-2017 at 9:59 AM..
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  #293  
Old 08-12-2017, 9:53 AM
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Originally Posted by Discogodfather View Post
I'd challenge you to think beyond what we all heard at the gun show in the 70's and the 80's during the paper age when such ideas about registration actually meant something, i.e. keeping off the radar.

In the information age is seems crazy to suggest they do not possibly know almost everything about us, and that assuming that they do not is dangerous.

Also, why would you be worried about what the State knows then post on a public forum about what you think they do not know you have?

Times have changed, and we need to evolve with new technology. My solution is to assume they know, and analyze what they do not want us to do. Judging from their insane illegal regulations and failure to open the reg period until 7 months after the supposed start date and then making it as hard as possible to register, you tell me what they want us to do.
If they know I have it(and I'm sure they do) then I shouldn't need to register it. To voluntary register is agreeing to the rules they are setting and has nothing to do with evolving with new technology.
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  #294  
Old 08-12-2017, 11:59 AM
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Here's an advantage to registration because we have people like this in office.


Think hard about what she said and what kind of ideological maniacs we have in California government. It will be tried here first and soon.
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  #295  
Old 08-12-2017, 12:02 PM
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Here's an advantage to registration because we have people like this in office.


Think hard about what she said and what kind of ideological maniacs we have in California government. It will be tried here first and soon.
Fixed.
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I've been married so long that I don't even look both ways when I cross the street.
Quote:
A society that aims for equality before liberty, will end with neither equality nor liberty.
-Milton Friedman


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It’s always seemed to me absurd that you make 100% of the people to do something, in order to make sure that 1 or 2% of the people don’t behave badly.
-Milton Friedman
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  #296  
Old 08-12-2017, 12:04 PM
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Originally Posted by Discogodfather View Post
I'd think about that idea you just stated for a few more seconds. So you think 17 years ago it was a no-brainer? Let me tell you something about 2000 my friend, it was extremely difficult to even tell what was going on. People like you, who were throwing shade on registration any way they could, dominated the discussion. To them the confiscation was coming a year later, and it was all a giant trap.

So forgive me if I raise my hand to my forehead when I see you saying you would have seen the advantage to registration 17 years ago. The fact is nothing is obvious when we don't know what's coming next.
that was 17 years ago. Today this state is a completely different animal all together.

I'm not gonna say it's gonna happen in a year. But these people in office today are there to make a name for themselves and it's not to benefit the people of this state such as better water storage or proposing De-sal plants along the coast or lower taxes.

These people want national attention and banning the ownership of our legally purchased firearms is the one to put them on the radar.

Never ever forget gun control is the national platform for the DemoKratic party.
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Public Safety Chairman Reggie Jones Sawyer, D-Los Angeles said, “This is California; we don’t pay too much attention to the Constitution,”
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z6Dj8tdSC1A
contact the governor
https://govnews.ca.gov/gov39mail/mail.php
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  #297  
Old 08-12-2017, 12:27 PM
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Geez, this troll thread is still going, eh?
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  #298  
Old 08-12-2017, 1:22 PM
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Time to close. How about disadvantages of registration
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  #299  
Old 08-12-2017, 1:28 PM
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BTW anyone want to explain the message being sent to the DOJ about registering a BB rifle? If some are claiming that registration is the challenge, you are also telling the DOJ that you are satisfied registering a crippled rifle with a bullet button. That is not a message I want to send.

I know that the alternatives are no better to others here, but a regular magazine release overrides a bullet button for me personally. The new maglocks aren't the best options either, but you don't have to register those.
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I've been married so long that I don't even look both ways when I cross the street.
Quote:
A society that aims for equality before liberty, will end with neither equality nor liberty.
-Milton Friedman


Quote:
It’s always seemed to me absurd that you make 100% of the people to do something, in order to make sure that 1 or 2% of the people don’t behave badly.
-Milton Friedman

Last edited by meno377; 08-12-2017 at 1:33 PM..
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  #300  
Old 08-12-2017, 2:03 PM
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Geez, this troll thread is still going, eh?
How did it even get a two star rating? That's about two stars more than it deserves.
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  #301  
Old 08-12-2017, 4:27 PM
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BTW anyone want to explain the message being sent to the DOJ about registering a BB rifle? If some are claiming that registration is the challenge, you are also telling the DOJ that you are satisfied registering a crippled rifle with a bullet button. That is not a message I want to send.

I know that the alternatives are no better to others here, but a regular magazine release overrides a bullet button for me personally. The new maglocks aren't the best options either, but you don't have to register those.
As far as I can gather, the message being sent is that you are down with evolving technology.
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Old 08-13-2017, 9:34 AM
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The advantage of registration is that you will show your loyalty to the crown.


...On another note, I was at the gun store the other day and I mentioned Calguns and that the site had helped me over the years and that I was finally going to make an account. The guy said that it was full of "cucks."

I told him that it was our duty to over comply in anyway possible, and that if we tried extra hard, that the crown would smile upon us and that they may give us more privileges, and that we needed to show just how responsible we can be as subjects of California.

He then said I was a cuck too.

What's a cuck and why would he assume you are all cucks?

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  #303  
Old 08-13-2017, 9:45 AM
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One thing to point out since at least one user here is misleading regarding options. There are two main options: Registering or not registering. But there are several options within the category of not registering. Featureless, fixed magazine, disassembly, storage out of state, manual operation. It's been debated that you limit your options if you don't register. Well it's true that you limit your option to register if you don't. Now is that an option worth losing? That is a personal choice. And you still have five other options if you choose not to register so you can keep your rifle (s) in compliance with the law.

I am not aware of any options within the category of registering. If you register, are their other options with a registered AW other than de-registration that allows you to keep your rifle? Are you guaranteed to have your name removed from the database if you decide to de-register?

The other unfortunate condition that was mentioned on the Michel and Associate's webinar is joint registration. Apparently the joint participant is required to live in the same residence. That certainly defeats the point of passing them down to your children.
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I've been married so long that I don't even look both ways when I cross the street.
Quote:
A society that aims for equality before liberty, will end with neither equality nor liberty.
-Milton Friedman


Quote:
It’s always seemed to me absurd that you make 100% of the people to do something, in order to make sure that 1 or 2% of the people don’t behave badly.
-Milton Friedman

Last edited by meno377; 08-13-2017 at 10:21 AM..
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  #304  
Old 08-13-2017, 10:14 AM
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Originally Posted by meno377 View Post
If you register, are their other options with a registered AW other than de-registration that allows you to keep your rifle? Are you guaranteed to have your name removed from the database if you decide to de-register?
There is no guarantee they'll remove your name from the database when you formally de-register, and I would assume they won't because we all know they lie about everything else. So I won't ever be formally de-registering anything, personally.

What I will do, if I don't want my rifle to be a RAW anymore, is convert it to non-AW configuration (featureless, fixed-mag, etc), and then swap out the receiver for a non-RAW receiver. That effectively makes that firearm de-registered. And as an added bonus, I can build the old RAW receiver back into an AW if I want, or I can sell it out of state if I need the money. With this method, you don't lose any of the available options.

Last edited by cockedandglocked; 08-13-2017 at 10:17 AM..
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  #305  
Old 08-13-2017, 10:22 AM
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You don't have to de-register if you sell your RAW through a RAW FFL to someone out of state.

Registration theoretically gives you all options, so it's the most versatile.

People still talking about lists and whether they will take this and that off this and that list forget they are on a list being here posting, especially when they talk about their guns and post pictures of them.

So who cares about lists? Dumbest ideas possible spawned from empty gun show rhetoric back when people used paper to remember things. Go watch the movie "Snowden" and bring a box of tissues, because you are going to cry a river.
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  #306  
Old 08-13-2017, 10:26 AM
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You don't have to de-register if you sell your RAW through a RAW FFL to someone out of state.

Registration theoretically gives you all options, so it's the most versatile.

People still talking about lists and whether they will take this and that off this and that list forget they are on a list being here posting, especially when they talk about their guns and post pictures of them.

So who cares about lists? Dumbest ideas possible spawned from empty gun show rhetoric back when people used paper to remember things. Go watch the movie "Snowden" and bring a box of tissues, because you are going to cry a river.
If it's no big deal then why does the registration process exist in the first place? If there is literally no difference between records of a DROS and the registration database, then there is no point in having anyone register. The registration window isn't for OUR benefit. If it is, what do we benefit from?
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Old 08-13-2017, 10:28 AM
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That is correct.

Sent from my SM-G930U using Tapatalk
Under what circumstances would you use your rifle? Why do you have it to begin with?

No need to answer, its a rhetorical question, one we should all consider.
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Old 08-13-2017, 10:34 AM
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If it's no big deal then why does the registration process exist in the first place? If there is literally no difference between records of a DROS and the registration database, then there is no point in having anyone register. What is the benefit for us? The legislation didn't open the registration window for OUR benefit. If they did, what do we benefit from?
Except if you think about it for a few seconds, you realize they don't want people to register (given all their actions) and that opening the reg period is a shelter for them to avoid legal issues. They don't want to do it but they have to.

So no, information is not the goal. The reason so much information is required is to get people like you to not want to register because they think that information is going to be used against them.

The old reg periods have nearly no information, so the AWCA can't be used to mine anything other than the info in the new registry. What possible use is all the information they are taking? According to you and other anti-reggers, all they need is a name and address. Who cares if your hair is pink?

They engineered these regulations and the new process specifically to deter anyone from registering, because it's the last thing they want.
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Old 08-13-2017, 10:35 AM
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If it's no big deal then why does the registration process exist in the first place? If there is literally no difference between records of a DROS and the registration database, then there is no point in having anyone register. The registration window isn't for OUR benefit. If it is, what do we benefit from?
I think registration exists because it is the only way to grandfather existing guns while banning new ones. Without registration, everyone would just say "oh ya of course I've had this since before the ban", like they do with magazines. (Which, on a related note, the lack of ability to prove when mags were acquired is the whole reason the state decided "fine, now nobody can have them anymore")

Last edited by cockedandglocked; 08-13-2017 at 10:38 AM..
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Old 08-13-2017, 10:37 AM
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Edit: I used google and looked up what cuck meant. That wasn't very nice! I will buy my sporting goods elsewhere.

The reason we own guns is to partake in the occasional fox hunt... I like to drink my tea on an early morning fox hunt. I would hate for the crown to take away my privleges.
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Old 08-13-2017, 10:40 AM
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Except if you think about it for a few seconds, you realize they don't want people to register (given all their actions) and that opening the reg period is a shelter for them to avoid legal issues. They don't want to do it but they have to.

So no, information is not the goal. The reason so much information is required is to get people like you to not want to register because they think that information is going to be used against them.

The old reg periods have nearly no information, so the AWCA can't be used to mine anything other than the info in the new registry. What possible use is all the information they are taking? According to you and other anti-reggers, all they need is a name and address. Who cares if your hair is pink?

They engineered these regulations and the new process specifically to deter anyone from registering, because it's the last thing they want.
Well I just mentioned a big downfall to registration besides the separate database that puts your name into it. The limitations of passing them down to your children. If they were forced to open a window this time then it will happen again. The argument that they don't want us to register is a red herring IMO.
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Old 08-13-2017, 10:43 AM
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Well I just mentioned a big downfall to registration besides the separate database that puts your name into it. The limitations of passing them down to your children. If they were forced to open a window this time then it will happen again. The argument that they don't want us to register is a red herring IMO.
My post above (#304) offers a pretty good solution for passing them down to your kids
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Old 08-13-2017, 10:44 AM
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I think registration exists because it is the only way to grandfather existing guns while banning new ones. Without registration, everyone would just say "oh ya of course I've had this since before the ban", like they do with magazines. (Which, on a related note, the lack of ability to prove when mags were acquired is the whole reason the state decided "fine, now nobody can have them anymore")
Are you saying in other words because they didn't require us to register magazines, that is the reason for the new ban on them?
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-Milton Friedman
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Old 08-13-2017, 10:46 AM
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My post above (#304) offers a pretty good solution for passing them down to your kids
Well, for most guns anyways. I realize for some types of guns, it's not as easy to just swap out a receiver - for this guns, I might think twice about registering. But for ARs and such, I think the receiver-swap strategy would be an effective way of bypassing all the AW restrictions.
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Old 08-13-2017, 10:48 AM
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Are you saying in other words because they didn't require us to register magazines, that is the reason for the new ban on them?
I suspect it's at least part of the reason, though it's impossible to say for sure what they were thinking. I'm not saying I wish they had magazine registration, I'm just saying I doubt a possession ban would have been a high priority if there was.
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Old 08-13-2017, 10:49 AM
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But for ARs and such, I think the receiver-swap strategy would be an effective way of bypassing all the AW restrictions.
This is exactly why registering a few spare AR receivers is a no brainer. Don't want an AW? Use a different, non-regged spare receiver.

For non-ARs, naturally, this can be a bit more tricky, especially for unique or one of a kind rifles.
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Old 08-13-2017, 10:49 AM
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My post above (#304) offers a pretty good solution for passing them down to your kids
If an all out ban comes our way, all of this is pointless which includes the registration process. We have discussed this over many times that more bans are coming, yet it seems that some here believe that registering their rifle (s) makes them immune to the future. Of course this is just a hypothesis, but many here are convinced another ban is coming our way.
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-Milton Friedman


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It’s always seemed to me absurd that you make 100% of the people to do something, in order to make sure that 1 or 2% of the people don’t behave badly.
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Old 08-13-2017, 10:53 AM
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This is exactly why registering a few spare AR receivers is a no brainer. Don't want an AW? Use a different, non-regged spare receiver.

For non-ARs, naturally, this can be a bit more tricky, especially for unique or one of a kind rifles.
My reasons are more pointed to me as an individual than my rifles. And to add; yes there are some that can't be replaced with another lower. SCARS are very popular for starters.

A few more to add to the list:
Beretta ARX 100
IWI Tavor
CZ Bren 805
FN FS2000
Remington ACR
Robinson XCR
Sig MCX
Turnbull Tar 40
LWRC REPR
PTR 91
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In honor of Fjold:
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I've been married so long that I don't even look both ways when I cross the street.
Quote:
A society that aims for equality before liberty, will end with neither equality nor liberty.
-Milton Friedman


Quote:
It’s always seemed to me absurd that you make 100% of the people to do something, in order to make sure that 1 or 2% of the people don’t behave badly.
-Milton Friedman

Last edited by meno377; 08-13-2017 at 11:22 AM..
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Old 08-13-2017, 11:26 AM
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"What would John Wayne do?" That's a good first question. Somehow I don't think he would be taking pictures of his guns to send to the capitol.
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Old 08-13-2017, 11:31 AM
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You know what all of you are doing by registering? You're validating their illegal laws. You are welcoming more tyranny. Imagine if no one registered.
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