Calguns.net  

Home My iTrader Join the NRA Donate to CGSSA Sponsors CGN Google Search
CA Semiauto Ban(AW)ID Flowchart CA Handgun Ban ID Flowchart CA Shotgun Ban ID Flowchart
Go Back   Calguns.net > OUTDOORS, HUNTING AND SURVIVAL > Camping, Hiking and Outdoor Activities
Register FAQ Members List Calendar Mark Forums Read

Camping, Hiking and Outdoor Activities Camping, hiking, and other outdoor activities within.

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #1  
Old 11-26-2012, 4:31 PM
MasterrEugene's Avatar
MasterrEugene MasterrEugene is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: Bay Area
Posts: 812
iTrader: 0 / 0%
Default Question/s about water storage

Hello Calguns Family,

My family has a 55 gallon food grade barrel in the backyard with water in it. The barrel gets a good amount of shade because it is under a trilee with greenery growing all over the top, giving the barrel a good amount of shade (I meant that the trilee has the greenery, not the barrel). That being said, i've read sources online that direct you to bleach the water for storage.

My question is, is bleaching stored water a necessary step for water storage, or can one simply store unbleached water and just boil it before drinking as an alternative?

I understand that algae and other greenery can grow in the water, but shouldn't boiling before drinking fix that problem?

Please don't give irrelevant input. I tire of asking questions and people giving their irrelevant input, deviating from the topic, and my question never gets answered. I mean no offense, and sorry if this offends you, but please stick to the topic. Is stored water that has never been treated by bleach potable after boiling?

thank you
__________________
Acts 2:38

Last edited by MasterrEugene; 11-26-2012 at 4:33 PM..
Reply With Quote
  #2  
Old 11-26-2012, 4:53 PM
speedrrracer speedrrracer is online now
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2011
Posts: 2,408
iTrader: 1 / 100%
Default

No, boiling will not solve the problem.

Remember: boiling kills live stuff, but it doesn't alter the laws of chemistry. Toxins released by certain algae are still toxins. Those toxins are still in the water (assuming you had the really bad kind of algal growth) and can ruin your day.

Ounce of prevention really applies in these cases. Use a bit of bleach beforehand.

Some reading:
http://www.hc-sc.gc.ca/ewh-semt/pubs...bacter-eng.php
__________________
Reply With Quote
  #3  
Old 11-26-2012, 5:00 PM
gemoose23's Avatar
gemoose23 gemoose23 is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: Escaped CA to Iowa
Posts: 1,081
iTrader: 13 / 100%
Default

I think I remember that if your water is from a city source/treament plant you do not need to bleach.

If from untreated place, I get my water from a well on the land, bleaching wouldn't hurt.

Either way you end up boiling stored water to ensure safety.

here's a non-Canadian water link http://www.prepareandsurvive.info/do...andStorage.pdf
__________________
Hornady LnL, Dillon Precision, RCBS, Lee Precision and Lyman User
If You want Match or Leadless hunting Ammo check out Monolithic Munitions Yes I am a shill, friends with the owners.
Reply With Quote
  #4  
Old 11-26-2012, 5:00 PM
frigginchi's Avatar
frigginchi frigginchi is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Posts: 1,167
iTrader: 4 / 100%
Default

Speedrrracer is right.

It only takes an 1/8 of a cup of bleach to treat 55 gallons. When you boil the water the bleach will out gas. bleach is only .99 cents a gallon. cheap insurance against bubble gut.
Reply With Quote
  #5  
Old 11-26-2012, 5:20 PM
MasterrEugene's Avatar
MasterrEugene MasterrEugene is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: Bay Area
Posts: 812
iTrader: 0 / 0%
Default

Thanks guys my question has been answered. One more thing if you dont mind. I read that the bleach needs to be unscented. Is this the same thing as "regular scent"?

Thanks

Sent from my MB525 using Tapatalk 2
__________________
Acts 2:38
Reply With Quote
  #6  
Old 11-26-2012, 6:13 PM
TheChief's Avatar
TheChief TheChief is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2011
Posts: 1,373
iTrader: 0 / 0%
Default

It depends...each vendor has their own interpretation. Regular scent could mean it has the original regular scent they started adding to their bleach line 20 years ago or it could mean its gonna smell like regular bleach.

You should be able to just call them and ask if you can use their "regular scented" bleach to treat water and they will know.
__________________
All things being equal...
Reply With Quote
  #7  
Old 11-26-2012, 6:20 PM
speedrrracer speedrrracer is online now
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2011
Posts: 2,408
iTrader: 1 / 100%
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by MasterrEugene View Post
Thanks guys my question has been answered. One more thing if you dont mind. I read that the bleach needs to be unscented. Is this the same thing as "regular scent"?
I agree with Chief -- chemically speaking, what does "regular scent" mean?

There's no way to know, obviously. I would guess the answer is "no, you don't want regular scent, whatever that means"...the absence of something (unscented) would seem to be very different than the presence of something ("regular scent") but I have no way to substantiate that for bleach.
__________________
Reply With Quote
  #8  
Old 11-26-2012, 7:06 PM
DavidR310's Avatar
DavidR310 DavidR310 is offline
CGSSA Coordinator
CGN Contributor
 
Join Date: Apr 2011
Location: Yucca Sucka
Posts: 3,180
iTrader: 4 / 100%
Default

For Clorox....regular scented means no scents added and the scent you smell is naturally occurring from the chemicals. I do not know about other brands.
Reply With Quote
  #9  
Old 11-26-2012, 7:11 PM
MasterrEugene's Avatar
MasterrEugene MasterrEugene is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: Bay Area
Posts: 812
iTrader: 0 / 0%
Default

thanks for everyones input
__________________
Acts 2:38
Reply With Quote
  #10  
Old 11-26-2012, 7:24 PM
DavidR310's Avatar
DavidR310 DavidR310 is offline
CGSSA Coordinator
CGN Contributor
 
Join Date: Apr 2011
Location: Yucca Sucka
Posts: 3,180
iTrader: 4 / 100%
Default

You could always email Clorox to hear it from the horse's mouth:
http://www.clorox.com/contact/
Reply With Quote
  #11  
Old 11-26-2012, 8:01 PM
wjc's Avatar
wjc wjc is offline
CGN/CGSSA Contributor
CGN Contributor
 
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: Sunnyvale, Ca
Posts: 10,628
iTrader: 0 / 0%
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by DavidR310 View Post
For Clorox....regular scented means no scents added and the scent you smell is naturally occurring from the chemicals. I do not know about other brands.
Just an addition...use the "Regular" Clorox bleach. Don't use Splashless or the scented bleaches. They contain other chemicals.

You basically want 6% Sodium Hypochlorate in pure form.
__________________
Some words can give you a feeling that makes your heart warm. Republic is one of those words.

-- John Wayne as Davy Crockett in The Alamo
Reply With Quote
  #12  
Old 11-26-2012, 8:11 PM
Skidmark's Avatar
Skidmark Skidmark is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: Semi-Banned
Posts: 1,717
iTrader: 0 / 0%
Default

You can add some bleach, to water stored like that. But be certain that your bleach is still good - it can go bad. I prefer using iodine to treat water for pathogens, it holds up much better over time than bleach. My own primary water storage unit is down in the basement, it's called a "water heater." I also have some backup storage units, they're called "toilet tanks." Beyond that, maybe 20 gallons in old bleach bottles and five-gallon jugs.
__________________
Making guns illegal is as stupid as making drugs or prostitution illegal.

Calguns Foundation contributor
Reply With Quote
  #13  
Old 11-26-2012, 8:22 PM
wjc's Avatar
wjc wjc is offline
CGN/CGSSA Contributor
CGN Contributor
 
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: Sunnyvale, Ca
Posts: 10,628
iTrader: 0 / 0%
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Skidmark View Post
You can add some bleach, to water stored like that. But be certain that your bleach is still good - it can go bad. I prefer using iodine to treat water for pathogens, it holds up much better over time than bleach. My own primary water storage unit is down in the basement, it's called a "water heater." I also have some backup storage units, they're called "toilet tanks." Beyond that, maybe 20 gallons in old bleach bottles and five-gallon jugs.
Just an fyi, Iodine can be bad for people with an iodine allergy.

http://www.iodine-resource.com/iodine-allergy.html
__________________
Some words can give you a feeling that makes your heart warm. Republic is one of those words.

-- John Wayne as Davy Crockett in The Alamo
Reply With Quote
  #14  
Old 11-26-2012, 9:00 PM
firemanjoe's Avatar
firemanjoe firemanjoe is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2012
Location: Unincorporated San bernardino county
Posts: 916
iTrader: 23 / 100%
Default

I have a bunch of boxes of the 6-1gal bottles from Costco, should I do anything to treat those 1 gal bottles?
__________________
"...... to disarm the people - that was the best and most effectual way to enslave them." - George Mason -
Reply With Quote
  #15  
Old 11-27-2012, 9:32 AM
DeanW66's Avatar
DeanW66 DeanW66 is offline
CGN/CGSSA Contributor
CGN Contributor
 
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: Thanks to Casual Shooter, this really is kinda fun (was Los Gatos Mountains) ;-)
Posts: 5,075
iTrader: 17 / 100%
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by MasterrEugene View Post
Is stored water that has never been treated by bleach potable after boiling?
As mentioned by others, no.

Quote:
Originally Posted by speedrrracer View Post
Toxins released by certain algae are still toxins. Those toxins are still in the water (assuming you had the really bad kind of algal growth) and can ruin your day.
A proper filter + boiling would be good.

Quote:
Originally Posted by gemoose23 View Post
I think I remember that if your water is from a city source/treament plant you do not need to bleach.
False.

Municipally treated water, for the most part in the USA, is chloraminated. To try and put it simply, this is a blend of chlorine (A.K.A. bleach) and ammonia. The reason is that chlorine alone will degrade in the distribution system losing its "killing power." Adding ammonia extends the killing lifetime (but also introduces other potential issues, side tracks from this discussion).

Back to bleaching your storage containers: the bleach will degrade over time, thus exposing your supply to the original growth worries you started with. How long of time is sort of open to debate but is weeks/months not years.

Bonafides: I'm a state certified drinking water treatment plant operator.
__________________
CalGuns Network (CGN) is different from CalGuns Foundation (CGF). Both need our support. I have gold name because I support CGN; plus, I send $10 every two weeks to CGF automatically via online BillPay as described here.

Support CGF by shopping at Amazon!
Reply With Quote
  #16  
Old 11-27-2012, 9:43 AM
Laythor's Avatar
Laythor Laythor is offline
The other white meat.
CGN Contributor
 
Join Date: Oct 2012
Location: San Jose
Posts: 992
iTrader: 5 / 100%
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by firemanjoe View Post
I have a bunch of boxes of the 6-1gal bottles from Costco, should I do anything to treat those 1 gal bottles?
nope.
Reply With Quote
  #17  
Old 11-27-2012, 12:15 PM
xrMike's Avatar
xrMike xrMike is offline
Calguns Addict
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: waaaaay South Bay
Posts: 7,256
iTrader: 11 / 100%
Default

Consider those full-sized chlorine tablets used to chlorinate pools instead. They last indefinitely, and you can use them to make your own liquid chlorine (the method for converting pellets to liquid chlorine is posted all over the net).

Liquid chlorine like chlorox is just chlorine gas dissolved in water. It goes bad over time (weak, actually) as the gas escapes.

A few pounds of those pellets would last you a lifetime.
Reply With Quote
  #18  
Old 11-27-2012, 12:31 PM
CAHighSierra's Avatar
CAHighSierra CAHighSierra is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2011
Location: Tracy
Posts: 789
iTrader: 8 / 100%
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by firemanjoe View Post
I have a bunch of boxes of the 6-1gal bottles from Costco, should I do anything to treat those 1 gal bottles?
Change them to different containers for long term storage. Certain plastic bottles will leech crap into the water from the plastic overtime.
__________________
You shoot me in a dream, you better wake up and apologize.
Reply With Quote
  #19  
Old 11-27-2012, 4:36 PM
Skidmark's Avatar
Skidmark Skidmark is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: Semi-Banned
Posts: 1,717
iTrader: 0 / 0%
Default

People should be rotating their stored water, just as they rotate other stores like gasoline, diesel, food, etc.

Replenish old with fresh, and consume what was just taken out of storage.
__________________
Making guns illegal is as stupid as making drugs or prostitution illegal.

Calguns Foundation contributor
Reply With Quote
  #20  
Old 11-27-2012, 6:39 PM
stitch_paradox's Avatar
stitch_paradox stitch_paradox is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2010
Posts: 1,627
iTrader: 48 / 100%
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Skidmark View Post
People should be rotating their stored water, just as they rotate other stores like gasoline, diesel, food, etc.

Replenish old with fresh, and consume what was just taken out of storage.

^^^^ This


I rotate mine every 4 to 6 months. Is that too long?
Reply With Quote
  #21  
Old 11-28-2012, 12:06 PM
calif 15-22's Avatar
calif 15-22 calif 15-22 is offline
Paid Government Shill
CGN Contributor
 
Join Date: Jan 2012
Location: Nor Cal
Posts: 4,458
iTrader: 22 / 100%
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Skidmark View Post
People should be rotating their stored water, just as they rotate other stores like gasoline, diesel, food, etc.

Replenish old with fresh, and consume what was just taken out of storage.
^^^^^^^^^^^ THIS^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
I have (2) 55 galloon HDPE Blue food grade containers in the garage. Fill them up, add a little clorox bleach and empty every 6 months. I don't rotate water as it is cheap to pump it out on the driveway and refill. If SHTF during the 1 hour it takes to fill both then I'm out of luck. But so far this has worked well for me. Don't forget to get a hand pump for the containers as syphoning is a pain.

Good luck
__________________

I will no longer respond to posts where I am quoted. It's a matter of insanity!

Quote:
Originally Posted by Citadelgrad87 View Post
It's one thing to question everything . . . It's entirely another thing to reject simple, rational explanations in favor of ever more fantastic and far reaching explanations because you've decided the government cannot be trusted.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hoooper View Post
Anyone who says the American dream requires a specific pay range doesn't understand the meaning of the American dream

Last edited by calif 15-22; 11-28-2012 at 3:30 PM.. Reason: spelling
Reply With Quote
  #22  
Old 11-28-2012, 12:14 PM
paul0660's Avatar
paul0660 paul0660 is offline
In Memoriam
 
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: Ukiah
Posts: 15,706
iTrader: 34 / 100%
Default

Quote:
I tire of asking questions and people giving their irrelevant input, deviating from the topic, and my question never gets answered. I mean no offense, and sorry if this offends you, but please stick to the topic.
Geez. You get a headache from reading?

We store water in gallon jugs with three drops of bleach. If we had to use it shtf, we would boil it before, IF POSSIBLE. 55 gallons won't stay sweet for long.
__________________
*REMOVE THIS PART BEFORE POSTING*
Reply With Quote
  #23  
Old 11-28-2012, 12:19 PM
Cnynrat's Avatar
Cnynrat Cnynrat is offline
Senior Member
CGN Contributor
 
Join Date: Dec 2008
Posts: 2,052
iTrader: 5 / 100%
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by MasterrEugene View Post
thanks for everyones input
I think the proper procedure when storing in 55 gal drums is to "sterilize" the drum first with a higher concentrate of bleach. I think they recommend about 1C of bleach per 55 gal drum. Let that sit for an hour or so, dump that out and rinse. Then fill with water treated at the lower level.
__________________
Dave

Lifetime Member, Second Amendment Foundation
Reply With Quote
  #24  
Old 11-29-2012, 8:38 AM
NorCalSurvival NorCalSurvival is offline
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2012
Posts: 12
iTrader: 0 / 0%
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Cnynrat View Post
I think the proper procedure when storing in 55 gal drums is to "sterilize" the drum first with a higher concentrate of bleach. I think they recommend about 1C of bleach per 55 gal drum. Let that sit for an hour or so, dump that out and rinse. Then fill with water treated at the lower level.
Probably the only answer i agree with so far... Boiling is adequate for purifying water. If you take initial steps to properly sanitize the container, It should store well treated or untreated. JMO
Reply With Quote
  #25  
Old 11-29-2012, 8:42 AM
Katch's Avatar
Katch Katch is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2012
Location: Sacramento
Posts: 152
iTrader: 1 / 100%
Default

Use Calcium Hypochlorite to Disinfect Water

A 1-pound pag of calcium hypochlorite in granular form will treat up to 10,000 gallons of drinking water

Calcium hypochlorite is one of the best chemical disinfectants for water, better than household bleach by far. It destroys a variety of disease causing organisms including bacteria, yeast, fungus, spores, and viruses.

Calcium Hypochlorite is widely available for use as swimming pool chlorine tablets or white powder that is much more stable than chlorine. This is often known as “pool shock”.

How to Disinfect Water Using Calcium Hypochlorite

Using granular calcium hypochlorite to disinfect water is a two step process.

To make a stock of chlorine solution (do not drink this!) dissolve 1 heaping teaspoon (about one-quarter of an ounce) of high-test (78%) granular calcium hypochlorite for each two gallons (eight liters) of water. To disinfect water add one part of the chlorine solution to 100 parts water to be treated. Let the mixture sit for at least one-half hour before drinking. Be sure to obtain the dry granular calcium hypochlorite since once it is made into a liquid solution it will begin to degrade and eventually become useless as a disinfecting agent. This also means you should make your treated drinking water in small batches, for example enough for a few weeks at a time at most.

Another plus for using calcium hypochlorite to disinfect water for emergency use is that a little goes a very long way. A 1-pound pag of calcium hypochlorite in granular form typically costs only a few US dollars and can be obtained in any swimming pool supply section of your hardware store or online. This amount will treat up to 10,000 gallons of drinking water, which is enough for a family of four for some six or seven years at a gallon per day per person!

Calcium hypochlorite will store for a long period of time and remain effective as a chemical drinking water treatment. So get rid of the household bleach and buy a can of Calcium hypochlorite for your disaster emergency water disinfection needs. It lasts far longer and treats far more water than the traditional chlorine bleach water disinfection treatment.

http://www.survivalistboards.com/sho...d.php?t=115642

Last edited by Katch; 12-01-2012 at 12:46 PM.. Reason: added link
Reply With Quote
  #26  
Old 11-29-2012, 8:44 AM
Skidmark's Avatar
Skidmark Skidmark is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: Semi-Banned
Posts: 1,717
iTrader: 0 / 0%
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Katch View Post
This article was originally posted on Survival Topics.
What article? Were you quoting from another source? Please provide a link when doing so.
__________________
Making guns illegal is as stupid as making drugs or prostitution illegal.

Calguns Foundation contributor
Reply With Quote
  #27  
Old 11-29-2012, 9:31 AM
xrMike's Avatar
xrMike xrMike is offline
Calguns Addict
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: waaaaay South Bay
Posts: 7,256
iTrader: 11 / 100%
Default

Katch, nice post summarizing the superiority of granular hypochlorite over liquid bleach. I was hoping somebody would post up the method, since I was being lazy (above).

Fresh liquid bleach is fine if kept tightly capped and used within a year or so.

But for long term you really want the pool shock or the tablets (tablets are cheaper).
Reply With Quote
  #28  
Old 11-29-2012, 10:14 AM
Cnynrat's Avatar
Cnynrat Cnynrat is offline
Senior Member
CGN Contributor
 
Join Date: Dec 2008
Posts: 2,052
iTrader: 5 / 100%
Default

Another alternative is to use Purogene, which is chlorine dioxide.
__________________
Dave

Lifetime Member, Second Amendment Foundation
Reply With Quote
  #29  
Old 11-29-2012, 3:32 PM
Quinc's Avatar
Quinc Quinc is offline
Veteran Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: Butte County
Posts: 2,978
iTrader: 27 / 100%
Default

What if you stored distilled water? Yes it is missing the minerals but couldn't you add those back in or take a multivitamin?
__________________
Shop Amazon and contribute to CGF!
click this link before going to amazon.com
http://www.shop42a.com


www.appleseedinfo.org

"Everyone has a plan, till they get punched in the face." -Mike Tyson
Reply With Quote
  #30  
Old 11-29-2012, 3:36 PM
Cnynrat's Avatar
Cnynrat Cnynrat is offline
Senior Member
CGN Contributor
 
Join Date: Dec 2008
Posts: 2,052
iTrader: 5 / 100%
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Quinc View Post
What if you stored distilled water? Yes it is missing the minerals but couldn't you add those back in or take a multivitamin?
I think distilled water still needs to be treated to avoid bacterial contamination.
__________________
Dave

Lifetime Member, Second Amendment Foundation
Reply With Quote
  #31  
Old 11-29-2012, 6:55 PM
wjc's Avatar
wjc wjc is offline
CGN/CGSSA Contributor
CGN Contributor
 
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: Sunnyvale, Ca
Posts: 10,628
iTrader: 0 / 0%
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Quinc View Post
What if you stored distilled water? Yes it is missing the minerals but couldn't you add those back in or take a multivitamin?
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cnynrat View Post
I think distilled water still needs to be treated to avoid bacterial contamination.
...and algae
__________________
Some words can give you a feeling that makes your heart warm. Republic is one of those words.

-- John Wayne as Davy Crockett in The Alamo
Reply With Quote
  #32  
Old 11-30-2012, 12:32 PM
MasterrEugene's Avatar
MasterrEugene MasterrEugene is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: Bay Area
Posts: 812
iTrader: 0 / 0%
Default

what about putting the stored algae water through a filter such as a berkey sports bottle? will it then be potable?
__________________
Acts 2:38
Reply With Quote
  #33  
Old 12-08-2012, 11:04 PM
jeffrice6's Avatar
jeffrice6 jeffrice6 is offline
Veteran Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Nor Cal
Posts: 3,885
iTrader: 32 / 100%
Default

Just added 150 gallons to the supply ~ 3 Tablespoons of bleach per 55g.
__________________
WTB: S&W 617 4" 10 shot Pre-Lock
Reply With Quote
  #34  
Old 12-09-2012, 4:23 AM
the86d's Avatar
the86d the86d is offline
Calguns Addict
 
Join Date: Jul 2011
Location: Pinko-occupied ObamaDerkaderkastan
Posts: 5,628
iTrader: 2 / 100%
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by DeanW66 View Post
Municipally treated water, for the most part in the USA, is chlorinated. To try and put it simply, this is a blend of chlorine (A.K.A. bleach) and ammonia. The reason is that chlorine alone will degrade in the distribution system losing its "killing power." Adding ammonia extends the killing lifetime (but also introduces other potential issues, side tracks from this discussion).

Back to bleaching your storage containers: the bleach will degrade over time, thus exposing your supply to the original growth worries you started with. How long of time is sort of open to debate but is weeks/months not years.

Bonafides: I'm a state certified drinking water treatment plant operator.
Hmmm. If I put a few drops of bleach in a FDA approved container such as empty 2 liter soda bottles after rinsing out thoroughly, fill with chlorinated Municipally treated water, then seal the lid, I would assume that the bleach added should kill any microorganisms in the container, and be safe for storage for a long time, as if I don't break the seal even the degrading bleach along with the air/water tight sealed top should keep everything inside dead, as the bottle can not be added to (new living organisms) because it is sealed.

Correct me if I am wrong, and tell me why if I am.
__________________
"That's what governments are for - get in a man's way." - Captain Malcolm 'Mal' Reynolds
Reply With Quote
  #35  
Old 12-09-2012, 5:58 AM
JoeJinKY JoeJinKY is offline
Banned
 
Join Date: Oct 2011
Posts: 851
iTrader: 1 / 100%
Default

I am pondering this same question, about water storage.

The "solution" I am currently considering is the purchase of a 10,000 gallon underground water storage tank buried on my property, and plumbed into my water inlet to the house. The idea would be that once the tank was filled, every toilet flush, every shower, every load of laundry would replace a small portion of the stored water as fresh water from the city water source would enter the tank and the stored water would exit the tank to the intended use. I figure that would prevent the water from becoming stale. Am I wrong?

If the water supply was cut off or became non-potable, I'd have a pump to get the rest of the water out, and it would ALL go through large multistage filter that would remove anything of concern before it came into the house.

http://www.tank-depot.com/productdet...x?part=N-41338

Reply With Quote
  #36  
Old 12-09-2012, 6:15 AM
Dutch3's Avatar
Dutch3 Dutch3 is offline
Dirt Farmer
CGN Contributor
 
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: Butte County
Posts: 11,296
iTrader: 3 / 100%
Default

I have 150 gal. stored in blue plastic drums. I used to keep them outside (in the shade) but algae still formed over the course of my 1-year rotation schedule.

This year, I moved them into a shed and we will see how it looks in the spring.

I have been using liquid bleach. I once made the mistake of using splashless. (It states "Regular" on the label, with "Splashless" in a smaller size underneath). Splashless has some sort of soapy additive to thicken it.

I poured some in the drum and began filling it. I went to empty another drum and when I came back, the drum with the splashless bleach had puked out about 100sf of suds, LOL.

When I rotate the water in the spring, I plan to use the granular form instead of liquid bleach.
__________________
Assembly Public Safety Chair Reginald Jones-Sawyer:
..."and with that I'd like to turn it over to my colleague Loni Hancock, Senate Public Safety Chair, and as I like to say, my partner in crime."

Senate Public Safety Chair Loni Hancock:
"Yeah, we do that quite a lot, actually..."

- Joint Legislative Informational Hearing on Firearms - Newsom Initiative #1756 - May 3rd 2016
Reply With Quote
  #37  
Old 12-09-2012, 6:49 AM
JoeJinKY JoeJinKY is offline
Banned
 
Join Date: Oct 2011
Posts: 851
iTrader: 1 / 100%
Default

DeanW66, since you are the apparent expert here, what is your suggestion regarding my previous post? I can afford to put a 10-20,000 gallon water tank on my property. I am wondering about above ground vs. below ground issues. The tanks are advertised to be FOR storage of potable water, and they are either white translucent, green or black.

I thought a white tank would be best, because it would be easiest to see algae growth along the walls using a waterproof PTZ camera built into the top of the tank, especially if the tank was enclosed in a structure that offered an external light source such as florescent bulbs that could be turned on for a quick inspection of the tank's interior surfaces.

I figure that a below ground tank would be better, but an above ground tank is also an option in that there is a place on my property where the bottom of the tank would be low enough to not obscure the view. However, this is KENTUCKY, where people do a lot of shooting! I wouldn't want a stray bullet to find its way through the side of my tank. This is why I am looking at underground options.

Additionally, can you point me to a good filtration device or system that can handle LARGE volumes of water? I don't want the wimpy faucet mounted units for $19.95. I would like something that could filter 40 or 50,000 gallons of water before it needed service, and something that would virtually guarantee GOOD water. I saw a five-stage filter unit that uses UV light, osmosis and a carbon filter, as well as two other stages, to filter microbes and contaminants out of water. It is interesting, but I am not sure it can handle the water usage of an entire home, via a storage tank source as I propose.

On a related note ... about capturing rain water ... is this SAFE? Can it be made potable? I can't imagine that catching water off of your roof, where birds poop on your shingles and dead bugs rot away, is water that one should drink or use for cooking! Still, I see a lot of stuff on the Net about catching rain water and storing it in tanks. I assume this water is mainly for irrigation purposes. Is there a way to SAFELY capture rain water for potable use?

I am doing some things to my home to TRY to get into a better position, should the economy turn south and things get ugly. I have already added a 1,000 gallon propane tank and will be adding a second 1,000 gallon tank soon. I just received my Cummins-Onan 20kW standby generator. I have a 16-camera DVR and exterior motion sensors. Sadly, I was forced to sell all of my boats at the last gun show to pay for all of this. Dang! I probably should have bought a gun while I was there.

I will soon begin a construction project. I am tearing down my 100-year-old tobacco barn and replacing it with a new three-story building, 32'x60' with a poured concrete basement, a workshop on the ground floor and guest bedrooms above, with a large attic above that. The building will have a separate secure storeroom for food, medical supplies, spare tires and such, and I am even considering installing a lift so I can move heavy items from floor to floor without lugging them up or down a flight of stairs.

http://www.beachhouselifts.com/Key-Safety-Features.html





I will patiently wait for your response and advice.
Reply With Quote
  #38  
Old 12-09-2012, 7:10 AM
DeanW66's Avatar
DeanW66 DeanW66 is offline
CGN/CGSSA Contributor
CGN Contributor
 
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: Thanks to Casual Shooter, this really is kinda fun (was Los Gatos Mountains) ;-)
Posts: 5,075
iTrader: 17 / 100%
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by the86d View Post
Hmmm. If I put a few drops of bleach in a FDA approved container such as empty 2 liter soda bottles after rinsing out thoroughly, fill with chlorinated Municipally treated water, then seal the lid, I would assume that the bleach added should kill any microorganisms in the container, and be safe for storage for a long time, as if I don't break the seal even the degrading bleach along with the air/water tight sealed top should keep everything inside dead, as the bottle can not be added to (new living organisms) because it is sealed.

Correct me if I am wrong, and tell me why if I am.
Adding the bleach changes the ratio of the municipal water (assuming your municipality, as most do, produces chloraminated water) chlorine and ammonia. Possibly affecting its ability to inactive the nasties. Note I said possibly. Might be ok, might not.

Have you ever cracked open a 2L bottle of soda, put the lid back on as tight as you can and left it to sit for a day or two? Does it lose carbonation in those couple of days? If so, that means you don't have an airtight seal. I'm not convinced your idea is 100% safe.

Quote:
Originally Posted by JoeJinKY View Post
DeanW66, since you are the apparent expert here, what is your suggestion regarding my previous post? I can afford to put a 10-20,000 gallon water tank on my property. I am wondering about above ground vs. below ground issues. The tanks are advertised to be FOR storage of potable water, and they are either white translucent, green or black.

I would not call myself and expert; simply knowledgeable. The tanks are for potable water. I happen to live on a well system, no municpal water and have a black one fed from my well.

I thought a white tank would be best, because it would be easiest to see algae growth along the walls using a waterproof PTZ camera built into the top of the tank, especially if the tank was enclosed in a structure that offered an external light source such as florescent bulbs that could be turned on for a quick inspection of the tank's interior surfaces.

I believe white will break down in sunlight faster. Most of the storage tanks I see in use near me are black or dark green for this reason.

I figure that a below ground tank would be better, but an above ground tank is also an option in that there is a place on my property where the bottom of the tank would be low enough to not obscure the view. However, this is KENTUCKY, where people do a lot of shooting! I wouldn't want a stray bullet to find its way through the side of my tank. This is why I am looking at underground options.

Additionally, can you point me to a good filtration device or system that can handle LARGE volumes of water? I don't want the wimpy faucet mounted units for $19.95. I would like something that could filter 40 or 50,000 gallons of water before it needed service, and something that would virtually guarantee GOOD water. I saw a five-stage filter unit that uses UV light, osmosis and a carbon filter, as well as two other stages, to filter microbes and contaminants out of water. It is interesting, but I am not sure it can handle the water usage of an entire home, via a storage tank source as I propose.

I don't have answers/comments for the above sections.

On a related note ... about capturing rain water ... is this SAFE? Can it be made potable? I can't imagine that catching water off of your roof, where birds poop on your shingles and dead bugs rot away, is water that one should drink or use for cooking! Still, I see a lot of stuff on the Net about catching rain water and storing it in tanks. I assume this water is mainly for irrigation purposes. Is there a way to SAFELY capture rain water for potable use?

I don't think it's safe for drinking w/o some filtering and chemical treatment. For example, municipalities are required to regularly (weekly) test the water in various parts of their distribution system. When collecting samples during rain, the field personnel collecting the samples have to be super extra careful to avoid getting rain in the sample bottle, because we are taught that a single rain drop can cause a false positive for contamination.

I am doing some things to my home to TRY to get into a better position, should the economy turn south and things get ugly. I have already added a 1,000 gallon propane tank and will be adding a second 1,000 gallon tank soon. I just received my Cummins-Onan 20kW standby generator. I have a 16-camera DVR and exterior motion sensors. Sadly, I was forced to sell all of my boats at the last gun show to pay for all of this. Dang! I probably should have bought a gun while I was there.

I will soon begin a construction project. I am tearing down my 100-year-old tobacco barn and replacing it with a new three-story building, 32'x60' with a poured concrete basement, a workshop on the ground floor and guest bedrooms above, with a large attic above that. The building will have a separate secure storeroom for food, medical supplies, spare tires and such, and I am even considering installing a lift so I can move heavy items from floor to floor without lugging them up or down a flight of stairs.

http://www.beachhouselifts.com/Key-Safety-Features.html



sounds like quite a serious set of projects.

I will patiently wait for your response and advice.
__________________
CalGuns Network (CGN) is different from CalGuns Foundation (CGF). Both need our support. I have gold name because I support CGN; plus, I send $10 every two weeks to CGF automatically via online BillPay as described here.

Support CGF by shopping at Amazon!

Last edited by DeanW66; 12-09-2012 at 7:13 AM..
Reply With Quote
  #39  
Old 12-09-2012, 7:16 AM
badreligion badreligion is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: May 2007
Location: Simi Valley
Posts: 541
iTrader: 4 / 100%
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by JoeJinKY View Post
I am pondering this same question, about water storage.

The "solution" I am currently considering is the purchase of a 10,000 gallon underground water storage tank buried on my property, and plumbed into my water inlet to the house. The idea would be that once the tank was filled, every toilet flush, every shower, every load of laundry would replace a small portion of the stored water as fresh water from the city water source would enter the tank and the stored water would exit the tank to the intended use. I figure that would prevent the water from becoming stale. Am I wrong?

If the water supply was cut off or became non-potable, I'd have a pump to get the rest of the water out, and it would ALL go through large multistage filter that would remove anything of concern before it came into the house.

http://www.tank-depot.com/productdet...x?part=N-41338


Joe the main issue is water pressure. You will require a pressure/accumulater tank to accomplish your goals. Most municipal water is supplied to customers between 60-120 psi with the ideal around 80psi. This kind of pressure will destroy most of your standard plastic barrels as they are non pressurized containers. So to accomplish your ideas your looking at a steel or stainless steel pressure tank and your costs go through the roof just for the tank of that size.

You could use an underground storage tank that could be made to work in the way your wanting but it will take more work. The basic idea is like an air compressor. Your main storage tank is feed from muni water via a valve, either manual or float, this tank is like the free air around your compressor. You then pump water from your storage tank to a pressure tank (300 gallons?), just like an air compressor. The pressure tank is what feeds your house.

Its not impossible to do what your wanting but it does take quite a bit of work and a certain level of maintence to keep it all running properly.
__________________
Quote:
Some people will do skanky things for $25, and not all those people are crack whores.

Bill Wiese
San Jose, CA

Reply With Quote
  #40  
Old 12-09-2012, 7:38 AM
JoeJinKY JoeJinKY is offline
Banned
 
Join Date: Oct 2011
Posts: 851
iTrader: 1 / 100%
Default

What about something like this?

http://www.truckpaper.com/listingsde...x?OHID=3802305

Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump



All times are GMT -8. The time now is 8:24 PM.




Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.9
Copyright ©2000 - 2016, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Proudly hosted by GeoVario the Premier 2A host.
Calguns.net, the 'Calguns' name and all associated variants and logos are ® Trademark and © Copyright 2002-2016, Calguns.net an Incorporated Company All Rights Reserved.