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Centerfire Rifles - Semiautomatic or Gas Operated Centerfire rifles, carbines and other gas operated rifles.

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  #1  
Old 12-02-2012, 5:40 AM
NOTABIKER NOTABIKER is offline
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Default removing trigger housing M1A

so i read up on how to clean my new to me 1983 M1A. watched many videos.
i am no gun smith but i am pretty mechanical. i release the trigger guard no problem. no matter what i try the receiver housing does not come out. i tried safety on-off .i tried slight leverage no go. it does have some play in it with the trigger guard released but the assembly will not come out. hell of a way to get started cleaning. their must be a hang up i do not know about HELP thanks.
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Old 12-02-2012, 5:47 AM
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You don't "just release it". Once unlatched, you rotate fully open then pull straight out. You may have to wiggle it a bit as some of them are in tight. Use the TG itself to pull on to get added leverage.
Once the TG is fully open, there is nothing to hold the housing in...................unless someone put it back in place with some still wet/tacky stock finish and therefore gluing the housing to the stock.
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  #3  
Old 12-02-2012, 5:50 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NOTABIKER View Post
so i read up on how to clean my new to me 1983 M1A. watched many videos.
i am no gun smith but i am pretty mechanical. i release the trigger guard no problem. no matter what i try the receiver housing does not come out. i tried safety on-off .i tried slight leverage no go. it does have some play in it with the trigger guard released but the assembly will not come out. hell of a way to get started cleaning. their must be a hang up i do not know about HELP thanks.
What do you mean by "receiver housing"? Has your rifle been bed with epoxy? Is there a rear lug on the receiver? If the trigger assembly is sticking, sometimes a little muscle is required to pull it free.
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Old 12-02-2012, 6:01 AM
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Push the trigger guard fully forward and then wiggle it out.

Receiver will then come out of the stock.
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Old 12-02-2012, 6:15 AM
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i did all of the above, i am rotating the trigger guard all the way forward which does allow the trigger assy to become loose. BUT the rear part of the assy does not move much. the front part moves up and down maybe 1/4 inch. i am positive the trigger guard is releasing like it should. the housing is not sticking like dirty or dry. it moves up and down and the receiver wants to separate from the wood. something mechanical is not letting the receiver housing to come out. otherwise the rifle functions properly. thank you for trying to help. i will not force it. i know better. i went back to vids and watched it being done. i do not feel i am doing something wrong. i live in the diamond bar area so cal. if somebody local that has worked on these wants to look at it PM me thanks

Last edited by NOTABIKER; 12-02-2012 at 6:19 AM..
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  #6  
Old 12-02-2012, 6:29 AM
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Make sure the safety is on/the rifle is cocked. This way the hammer is back and vertical. Then just man up and use some strength. If it hasn't been removed for 29 years it may be stuck by some dried oil or even BLO.

And for the love of god, pics please!
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Old 12-02-2012, 12:05 PM
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something is wrong, i am doing everything the right way and it will not come out. bad omen.
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Old 12-02-2012, 12:10 PM
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should have got a garand
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Old 12-02-2012, 12:24 PM
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Has it been bedded? If so they could have glued it in by accident.
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  #10  
Old 12-02-2012, 2:17 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hoop View Post
Has it been bedded? If so they could have glued it in by accident.
Ding.
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eh why bring logic into this, that makes too much sense... besides when you have bested a fool, you have accomplished nothing and he is a fool.
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  #11  
Old 12-02-2012, 3:53 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hoop View Post
Has it been bedded? If so they could have glued it in by accident.
Nope. Not by accident. They don't just slather it in epoxy and then put a pricetag on it. The receiver and trigger group are packed full of clay when it's bedded--all that has to be removed, cleaned up and oiled. I assure you, it's all been disassembled at least once before.

Actions were glued in from time to time. Intentionally.


OP:
1: The hammer must be to the rear. Do that first.
2. Check to make sure the mag latch pin hasn't shifted. That will prevent the trigger guard from fully opening. If it's moved; good luck. You're in for some cursing.
3. If all that is good, get a flat faced punch, pull the oprod to the rear and tap the trigger group out by placing the punch on the mag latch. On a bedded rifle, you'll probaby have to do the same to the receiver--put a dowel under the receiver roll mark (not under the thin rear sight base platform or safety bridge).
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Old 12-02-2012, 4:44 PM
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You also may want to put a stripper clip in the stripper clip guide to keep the bolt from flying forward and playing with your fingers when you whack out the trigger group. You can remove the receiver from the stock by turning the rifle up-side down, sit down, then drop the butt end of the stock on your upper leg. Usually that's enough force to allow the receiver to fall free from the stock. It will pivot out from the front band.

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  #13  
Old 12-02-2012, 5:13 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 30Cal View Post
Nope. Not by accident. They don't just slather it in epoxy and then put a pricetag on it. The receiver and trigger group are packed full of clay when it's bedded--all that has to be removed, cleaned up and oiled. I assure you, it's all been disassembled at least once before.

Actions were glued in from time to time. Intentionally.


OP:
1: The hammer must be to the rear. Do that first.
2. Check to make sure the mag latch pin hasn't shifted. That will prevent the trigger guard from fully opening. If it's moved; good luck. You're in for some cursing.
3. If all that is good, get a flat faced punch, pull the oprod to the rear and tap the trigger group out by placing the punch on the mag latch. On a bedded rifle, you'll probaby have to do the same to the receiver--put a dowel under the receiver roll mark (not under the thin rear sight base platform or safety bridge).
very good suggestions but they did not pan out. calling springfield monday. i have not tried the punch until the guy that sold me the rifle tells me to do it. for the price i am paying i do not want to beat on it now. he might just want the rifle back. he is a good guy and does not know their is a problem. thanks for the info
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  #14  
Old 12-02-2012, 5:35 PM
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Where are you located? I have been building these for NMC competition for a few years, or so. If you are in the SF bay area I can look at it for you.
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  #15  
Old 12-02-2012, 6:12 PM
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The trigger pin may have walked out (but the stock inletting is supposed to keep that in place). I don't think there's a way to fix it besides just pulling hard. If the pin is moved, the trigger pull would probably be sort of crappy by M1/M1A standards.

Springfield is going to tell you to put it in a box and ship it back.

Last edited by 30Cal; 12-04-2012 at 5:51 PM..
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Old 12-02-2012, 6:22 PM
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Is the bolt in the closed position, cocked and safety on?
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  #17  
Old 12-03-2012, 8:34 AM
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the problem is whatever splines are involved mating the receiver to the trigger assy is locked up from long term storage. if it was taken apart and cleaned properly before storage this would not happen. i might just not buy the rifle. i called SA today and they said if the pin has not gotten out of alignment on the mag release [ it has not ] the rifle needs to be shipped back to them. very possible you can break the stock,receiver,trigger assy forcing it apart. looking at the rifle it looks fantastic, no visible rust, wood very nice.
let this be a lesson to those of you that run a patch down the bore once in a while and think you are done. i am sure long term gun powder residue staying on metal parts caused this.
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Old 12-03-2012, 8:37 AM
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Man, I'd buy this if I was closer... Don't give up on a great gun.
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  #19  
Old 12-03-2012, 8:38 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NOTABIKER View Post
i am sure long term gun powder residue staying on metal parts caused this.

Not likely at all. No matter whether the bolt is open or not, and no matter if the safety lock is engaged or not. The hammer WILL be cocked if the trigger guard is opened. You may have a tolerance stackup at the receiver/trigger guard cam pin interface that is a little tight. OR as I have seen in the past, the trigger pin works out of the housing and binds the hammer and will not allow the trigger guard to fully open.

Where are you located? If you are anywhere near Fresno take it to Tom Luhmann, if you are in SF Bay area I can help you.
Springfield Inc will just jerk you around.

Last edited by kendog4570; 12-03-2012 at 8:46 AM..
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Old 12-03-2012, 1:23 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kendog4570 View Post
Not likely at all. No matter whether the bolt is open or not, and no matter if the safety lock is engaged or not. The hammer WILL be cocked if the trigger guard is opened. You may have a tolerance stackup at the receiver/trigger guard cam pin interface that is a little tight. OR as I have seen in the past, the trigger pin works out of the housing and binds the hammer and will not allow the trigger guard to fully open.

Where are you located? If you are anywhere near Fresno take it to Tom Luhmann, if you are in SF Bay area I can help you.
Springfield Inc will just jerk you around.
i am in pomona ca
i think you are onto something with the trigger pin. that seems to be the area it hangs up. cant see in their. the front of the trigger assy seems to have more movement than the rear. hard to tell if the trigger guard is releasing all the way or not. the housing does move up and down in the stock some . maybe 3/8 inch then stops SOLID

Last edited by NOTABIKER; 12-03-2012 at 1:56 PM..
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  #21  
Old 12-03-2012, 3:21 PM
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I've done these a time or two.
Lock the trigger guard back in place and see if the hammer functions properly (cocks, fires, safety locks). SAI made/makes their own housing (not USGI) and can lead to some troubles. Although to be fair to them, the ones I have seen this happen on were scrapped/out of spec GI housings. The one part that they made aftermarket that didnt seem to give too much trouble was their trigger housings.

Last edited by kendog4570; 12-03-2012 at 3:26 PM..
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  #22  
Old 12-03-2012, 4:10 PM
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Trigger guard fully open. The spline is the worn feature facing you. So if the front part (where the spline is) is moving, and rear isn't, then the spline doesn't make sense. You can see the trigger pin there. Note how far the trigger guard swings open. The backside is pretty much devoid of features. All the pins come out this side.

Mine (bedded supermatch) takes a fair amount of coaxing (a little shy of yanking) to work it out.



ETA: A 1983 rifle probably USGI parts. All of 'em.

Last edited by 30Cal; 12-03-2012 at 4:28 PM..
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Old 12-03-2012, 4:17 PM
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Here's where you'd be if the mag latch pin (roll pin on the bottom right) started walking out. This is waaay short of fully open.


Last edited by 30Cal; 12-03-2012 at 4:20 PM..
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  #24  
Old 12-03-2012, 6:41 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 30Cal View Post
... A 1983 rifle probably USGI parts. All of 'em.
Don't bet on that.
Springfield Armory Inc. has been making junk parts for a long time. Back then, bolts and op rods were unobtainable. The ones they made were pretty bad. In fact, they had 2 or 3 revisions of the bolt, and they were all recalled.
Parts were made, mixed, and matched all the time. Your trigger and sear are M1 Garand parts.

Last edited by kendog4570; 12-03-2012 at 7:09 PM..
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Old 12-04-2012, 7:37 AM
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thank you all for the help, what happened was the trigger pivot pin [ very small] broke in half. half stayed in and still worked. the other half fell out and got stuck. tapping on the barrel upside down on a towel the pin moved and it came apart. SA is shipping me one for free on a rifle made 10-1983.
some of you went to a lot of trouble to help me thanks.
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Old 12-04-2012, 8:00 AM
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Glad to hear it went OK.
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Old 12-04-2012, 5:04 PM
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Nice that you got it figured out without having to send the whole thing back!
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Old 12-04-2012, 5:23 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NOTABIKER View Post
thank you all for the help, what happened was the trigger pivot pin [ very small] broke in half. half stayed in and still worked. the other half fell out and got stuck. tapping on the barrel upside down on a towel the pin moved and it came apart. SA is shipping me one for free on a rifle made 10-1983.
some of you went to a lot of trouble to help me thanks.
We're all here to help each other when we can. I'm glad there were some M1A pros here. I learned some stuff too.
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