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Calguns LEOs LEOs; chat, kibitz and relax. Non-LEOs; have a questions for a cop? Ask it here, in a CIVIL manner.

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  #1  
Old 05-13-2012, 1:47 AM
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Default Pepper Spray Question

What is protocal to CYA if you have to use pepper spray on a person for actual self defense while you are waiting for the cops? I got into a fight with a guy in our neighborhood who came and attacked me (he's in jail now) and I was just thinking if I had pepper spray things would have been much easier for me. Thanks in advance.
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Old 05-14-2012, 8:31 AM
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You got witness(es) that this perp came near you to physically assault you? Did he have a weapon?
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Old 05-24-2012, 7:29 PM
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Originally Posted by JTROKS View Post
You got witness(es) that this perp came near you to physically assault you? Did he have a weapon?
He did NOT have a weapon, but the encounter did turn into a fist fight.
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Old 05-24-2012, 8:05 PM
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Pepper spray... ugh

If the guy is angry enough, it may just piss him off even further. It sometimes has no effect on *some* people. You can fight through pepper spray.

If you did pepper spray him, hand him water or a hose so he can rinse his eyes once he's no longer a threat. Time and distance are your friend. It's OKAY to retreat.
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Old 05-24-2012, 9:04 PM
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If an attack is imminent, you don't have to wait until he physically attacks you. While waiting for the police, gather or identify witnesses. Give first aid, IF SAFE TO DO SO, and keep an eye on the supect.

I have had very good success in subduing combative individuals with pepper spray. Make sure that you have quality spray, such as Blue Sabre or Def-Tec First Defense. Don't rely on the crap they sell at 7-11 or the car wash. Get it from a LE supplier.
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Old 05-24-2012, 11:35 PM
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Originally Posted by bearstatearmory.com View Post
I was just thinking if I had pepper spray things would have been much easier for me. Thanks in advance.
Maybe...maybe not. i've seen less lethal options work amazingly well and I have also seen them completely fail.
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Old 05-25-2012, 12:06 AM
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Restrain the individual if possible, offer copius amounts of water and fresh air after the individual is either restrained or you know longer deem him a threat. If at all possible do not put the individual on his stomach after they have been sprayed as it can cause positional asphyxiation. I have seen some guys get sprayed with it and carry on fighting like you poured water on them but of the many times I have either used pepper spray to defend myself or others, or witnessed it, it was effective. It generally takes a few seconds to take effect, but it is an excellent tool. look for something 2 million SHU or better.
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Old 05-25-2012, 7:51 AM
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I have seen OC work well in a prison setting, it will give you a slight tactical advantage. If your names in the hat it won't matter what you throw.. OC,CS Gas,rubber bullets,batons. Most inmates will lay down once staff arrives,they need to look good in front of homies'. The prison setting is violent, I saw an inmate fight with a shank in his eye, basically survival instincts take over.




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Old 05-25-2012, 11:07 AM
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The circumstances will determine if you should detain someone whom you have sprayed. Back in my sergeant days I worked an area where there seemed to be alot of folks making "citizen's arrests" (technically, "private person" arrests). My thoughts on this should not be construed as legal advice:

1. For the most part, people carry defense sprays for protection, not as a tool to effect an arrest (unless you are in some sort of less-lethal only security position).
2. Generally, the goal is to escape your attacker.
3. If you are assaulted and use any level of force to defend yourself, I recommend calling the police to file a report. Get witnesses to assist if possible. This way you have the opportunity to document the incident from your point of view.
4. If your assailant is immobilized due to your actions (unarmed self defense, use of spray) move to a safe location and call it in. Tell the dispatcher the suspect is on the scene and was sprayed, punched, etc. so that EMS might be called.
5. If your assailant flees, stay at the scene and call it in. Depending on the agency, they may send a unit for a report, they may take a phone in report, they may say if you are OK and the assailant has disappeared you may go.
6. Attempting to detain an assailant potentially exposes you to additional physical, civil and even criminal jeopardy which must be balanced against any "benefit" from essentially making a private person's arrest on him/her. To me, barring extenuating circumstances it would not seem to be worth prolonging / escalating contact with this person if it was a random assailant. If it was something that you think would recur or had potential for future contact, then MAYBE but be sure you know the laws relating to private person's arrests and think about how you would restrain him/her without escalating your own legal exposure.

For me, if some random mugger or someone attempted to assault me and I was able to repel the attack with OC spray and the mugger fled ... I'd let him go and simply report it. If I was being attacked by a stranger and I was able to disable him/her by spraying, I'd break and run and call it in.

No hard and fast rules ... it's a dynamic situation and dependent upon specifics.

Last edited by eltee; 05-25-2012 at 11:23 AM..
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Old 06-07-2012, 6:51 PM
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I used to live in bear country and still have a can of bear spray in my home. It's 9 OZ. Would there be an issue if I used it on an intruder in the home? Someone trying to get in?
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Old 06-07-2012, 10:53 PM
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Originally Posted by oldsmoboat View Post
I used to live in bear country and still have a can of bear spray in my home. It's 9 OZ. Would there be an issue if I used it on an intruder in the home? Someone trying to get in?
TIA
Hard to say. A lot of variables come into play. If it was me, and the hose down was necessary, I wouldn't sweat it. Technically, I think you might be in violation of the letter of the law, but not the spirit of the law.
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  #12  
Old 06-22-2012, 12:27 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SheepDogShepherd View Post
Restrain the individual if possible, offer copius amounts of water and fresh air after the individual is either restrained or you know longer deem him a threat. If at all possible do not put the individual on his stomach after they have been sprayed as it can cause positional asphyxiation. I have seen some guys get sprayed with it and carry on fighting like you poured water on them but of the many times I have either used pepper spray to defend myself or others, or witnessed it, it was effective. It generally takes a few seconds to take effect, but it is an excellent tool. look for something 2 million SHU or better.
I can attest to that. My academy class had chemical exposure about a month ago. While I was not on my stomach, when I was looking down washing my eyes out, it felt like I could not breath. It is a very un-nerving feeling when you cannot see and you are having difficulty breathing.
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Old 07-09-2012, 12:19 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by eltee View Post
6. Attempting to detain an assailant potentially exposes you to additional physical, civil and even criminal jeopardy which must be balanced against any "benefit" from essentially making a private person's arrest on him/her. To me, barring extenuating circumstances it would not seem to be worth prolonging / escalating contact with this person if it was a random assailant. If it was something that you think would recur or had potential for future contact, then MAYBE but be sure you know the laws relating to private person's arrests and think about how you would restrain him/her without escalating your own legal exposure.
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Defend and retreat are you best options. Defend yourself from attack and retreat to safe location and call police.
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