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  #1  
Old 09-14-2010, 10:32 PM
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Default Will CRPA rate a gubernatorial candidate?

Just noticing both candidates are not responding to the CRPA questionniare. Will CRPA be issuing their opinion? Or DAC (duck and cover) knowing they both are lacking interest to the firearm community?
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  #2  
Old 09-15-2010, 6:45 AM
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Sometimes it better to just punt.

I doubt that there's a consensus of the Board on this.
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Old 10-02-2010, 8:18 PM
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I think that it is disappointing that they ONLY attempt to rate Republicans and Democrats. There is an outstanding candidate running for Governor named Chelene Nightingale. She is 100% pro 2nd Amendment, she has also held several "shooting with Chelene fundrasers". She comes from a military family.

Now why CRPA doesn't want anyone to know about her is a mystery to me. Meg claims to be the same as Jerry anyway so it's not like there is any vote to split.

I'm facing the same problem in my own campaign. CRPA and the NRA never even bothered to send me a questionnaire. I'm sure they didn't even bother to send a questionnaire to Chelene either.
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Old 10-02-2010, 9:20 PM
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Kind of telling that Whitman won't answer the CRPA questionnaire, isn't it? Personally, I'm at a loss of which of them to vote for.
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Old 10-03-2010, 9:47 AM
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I'm lucky to be able to rely on my trusty secretary and have sent him out to do further research before I cast my vote.

Where's Oaklander with his great pie charts and Venn diagrams when we need him?
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  #6  
Old 10-03-2010, 11:22 PM
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Originally Posted by Robert Gosney View Post
I think that it is disappointing that they ONLY attempt to rate Republicans and Democrats. There is an outstanding candidate running for Governor named Chelene Nightingale. She is 100% pro 2nd Amendment, she has also held several "shooting with Chelene fundrasers". She comes from a military family.

Now why CRPA doesn't want anyone to know about her is a mystery to me. Meg claims to be the same as Jerry anyway so it's not like there is any vote to split.

I'm facing the same problem in my own campaign. CRPA and the NRA never even bothered to send me a questionnaire. I'm sure they didn't even bother to send a questionnaire to Chelene either.
Sir,

What office are you running for, if I may ask?

Thanks..........
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  #7  
Old 10-03-2010, 11:25 PM
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Outstanding to whom?

If only for economics, CRPA should continue rating those candidates with a greater than zero chance of winning.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Robert Gosney View Post
I think that it is disappointing that they ONLY attempt to rate Republicans and Democrats. There is an outstanding candidate running for Governor named Chelene Nightingale. She is 100% pro 2nd Amendment, she has also held several "shooting with Chelene fundrasers". She comes from a military family.
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  #8  
Old 10-04-2010, 8:35 AM
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Originally Posted by CRPAGunner View Post
What office are you running for, if I may ask?
American Independent running for California State Assembly District 59 (Victor Valley). I wondered the same thing, so I Googled his name.

http://voteforgosney.blogspot.com/

He specifically states that he is pro-2A.
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Old 10-04-2010, 2:50 PM
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Originally Posted by wildhawker View Post
Outstanding to whom?

If only for economics, CRPA should continue rating those candidates with a greater than zero chance of winning.
I don't agree when organizations abandon their principles so that they can help enforce the two party system. They are actually helping to encourage a LESS informed electorate.

It should be painfully obvious to everyone here that the California Republican party does not do much to protect gun rights.

Too many times I see people voting for less favorable candidates then begging them for scraps. Why not instead vote for people who actually WANT to give you what you say that you want?

Last edited by Robert Gosney; 10-04-2010 at 2:53 PM..
  #10  
Old 10-04-2010, 2:56 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Gryff View Post
American Independent running for California State Assembly District 59 (Victor Valley). I wondered the same thing, so I Googled his name.

http://voteforgosney.blogspot.com/

He specifically states that he is pro-2A.
Yes, that's me. I'm 100% pro gun.
  #11  
Old 10-04-2010, 5:39 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Robert Gosney View Post
I don't agree when organizations abandon their principles so that they can help enforce the two party system. They are actually helping to encourage a LESS informed electorate.

It should be painfully obvious to everyone here that the California Republican party does not do much to protect gun rights.

Too many times I see people voting for less favorable candidates then begging them for scraps. Why not instead vote for people who actually WANT to give you what you say that you want?
i've heard Nightingale speak. your rant regarding the need to buck the 2-party system aside, i wouldn't call that woman an "outstanding" candidate for governor by any stretch of the word.
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  #12  
Old 10-05-2010, 7:45 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Robert Gosney View Post
I don't agree when organizations abandon their principles so that they can help enforce the two party system. They are actually helping to encourage a LESS informed electorate.
Who said anything about party? I said, "[i]f only for economics, CRPA should continue rating those candidates with a greater than zero chance of winning".

Quote:
It should be painfully obvious to everyone here that the California Republican party does not do much to protect gun rights.
It definitely does not do what most think it does.

Quote:
Too many times I see people voting for less favorable candidates then begging them for scraps. Why not instead vote for people who actually WANT to give you what you say that you want?
Because, when they are *not elected*, they will only be in a position to give you nothing.
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  #13  
Old 10-06-2010, 8:16 AM
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Originally Posted by goober View Post
i've heard Nightingale speak. your rant regarding the need to buck the 2-party system aside, i wouldn't call that woman an "outstanding" candidate for governor by any stretch of the word.
My rant? As opposed to your words of wisdom goober? Why is Nightingale not outstanding? You don't agree with her?
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Old 10-06-2010, 8:25 AM
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Originally Posted by wildhawker View Post
Who said anything about party? I said, "[i]f only for economics, CRPA should continue rating those candidates with a greater than zero chance of winning".
If I can't trust the CRPA to rate candidates on gun rights why would I look at them for economic ratings? Why would you?

Quote:
Originally Posted by wildhawker View Post
It definitely does not do what most think it does.
Neither does the NRA or CRPA

Quote:
Originally Posted by wildhawker View Post
Because, when they are *not elected*, they will only be in a position to give you nothing.
We're already getting nothing! And I'll tell you something else. If you are willing to settle for crumbs then that's all you'll ever have.
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Old 10-06-2010, 8:54 AM
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Originally Posted by Robert Gosney View Post
My rant? As opposed to your words of wisdom goober? Why is Nightingale not outstanding? You don't agree with her?
if you noticed, my statement was (paraphrased) "your point A aside, your point B is wrong". i didn't comment on the wisdom (or lack thereof) in your rant. "rant" and "wisdom" are not, by definition, mutually exclusive.


regarding Nightingale != "outstanding", i was happy to refrain from specifics, out of pity. but since you asked:

Truther?
Chemtrails?

i could go on regarding qualifications, experience, demeanor, etc.
but it really matters little because not only is Nightingale a completely inappropriate choice, she is a totally non-viable one as well.
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Old 10-06-2010, 8:58 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by goober View Post
if you noticed, my statement was (paraphrased) "your point A aside, your point B is wrong". i didn't comment on the wisdom (or lack thereof) in your rant. "rant" and "wisdom" are not, by definition, mutually exclusive.


regarding Nightingale != "outstanding", i was happy to refrain from specifics, out of pity. but since you asked:

Truther?
Chemtrails?

i could go on regarding qualifications, experience, demeanor, etc.
but it really matters little because not only is Nightingale a completely inappropriate choice, she is a totally non-viable one as well.
I agree that "rant" was a little harsh, but I also agree with you on Nightingale.
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Old 10-06-2010, 9:25 AM
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Originally Posted by Gryff View Post
I agree that "rant" was a little harsh, but I also agree with you on Nightingale.
Merriam-Webster seems to uphold my use of the word:

Quote:
rant
verb \ˈrant\
Definition of RANT
intransitive verb
1
: to talk in a noisy, excited, or declamatory manner
2
: to scold vehemently
transitive verb
: to utter in a bombastic declamatory fashion
— rant·er noun
— rant·ing·ly\ˈran-tiŋ-lē\ adverb
Examples of RANT

1. “You can rant and rave all you want,” she said, “but it's not going to change things.”
2. He ranted that they were out to get him.

Origin of RANT
obsolete Dutch ranten, randen
First Known Use: 1601
Related to RANT
Synonyms: bluster, fulminate, huff, rave, spout
anyway, it was not meant in a derogatory manner. i set that point aside, as i was not arguing against it.
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Old 10-06-2010, 1:08 PM
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Originally Posted by goober View Post
if you noticed, my statement was (paraphrased) "your point A aside, your point B is wrong". i didn't comment on the wisdom (or lack thereof) in your rant. "rant" and "wisdom" are not, by definition, mutually exclusive.


regarding Nightingale != "outstanding", i was happy to refrain from specifics, out of pity. but since you asked:

Truther?
Chemtrails?

i could go on regarding qualifications, experience, demeanor, etc.
but it really matters little because not only is Nightingale a completely inappropriate choice, she is a totally non-viable one as well.
LOL! So as long as they smile and are polite while they screw you it's ok? What a joke! You should vote for Jerry then. He's the most qualified. He's also got the most experience and a pleasant demeanor, etc.

Yea, I WANT an inappropriate candidate to win! The appropriate candidates want to grant amnesty to the illegal aliens and kill our economy. Not to mention confiscate our guns. Oh, and I think that believing that CO2 is a pollutant is more dangerous than believing in chemtrails, don't you? As far as being a truther, how does that effect the price of bullets in California?
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Old 10-06-2010, 4:43 PM
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LOL! So as long as they smile and are polite while they screw you it's ok? What a joke! You should vote for Jerry then. He's the most qualified. He's also got the most experience and a pleasant demeanor, etc.
where did i say anything remotely like that?
oh wait, i get it. you focused in on one word in my response, "demeanor", and crafted a reply based on that. might want to work on that...

Quote:
Yea, I WANT an inappropriate candidate to win! The appropriate candidates want to grant amnesty to the illegal aliens and kill our economy. Not to mention confiscate our guns. Oh, and I think that believing that CO2 is a pollutant is more dangerous than believing in chemtrails, don't you? As far as being a truther, how does that effect the price of bullets in California?
i was pretty sure i was done trying to discuss this with you before, but now I'm definitely there. best of luck with your pet candidate and your personal campaign. let us know how that endorsement works out for ya.
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Old 10-06-2010, 6:23 PM
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Originally Posted by goober View Post
where did i say anything remotely like that?
oh wait, i get it. you focused in on one word in my response, "demeanor", and crafted a reply based on that. might want to work on that...



i was pretty sure i was done trying to discuss this with you before, but now I'm definitely there. best of luck with your pet candidate and your personal campaign. let us know how that endorsement works out for ya.
Oh, you've been trying to discuss something with me? Funny because I've been trying to discuss something with you too but you won't answer my questions. I can tell that you're not really used to using your noodle much, but why don't you go back and answer the questions that I laid out. Or better yet, get off your *** and make the case for the "appropriate" candidate.

I just had a thought.... LOL you vote for the "appropriate" candidate and let me know how the appropriate ****ing over goes.
  #21  
Old 10-06-2010, 8:17 PM
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Originally Posted by Robert Gosney View Post
Oh, you've been trying to discuss something with me? Funny because I've been trying to discuss something with you too but you won't answer my questions. I can tell that you're not really used to using your noodle much, but why don't you go back and answer the questions that I laid out. Or better yet, get off your *** and make the case for the "appropriate" candidate.

I just had a thought.... LOL you vote for the "appropriate" candidate and let me know how the appropriate ****ing over goes.
Since you are new to the forum I would suggest that you go read the rules that you agreed to when you signed up. The personal attacks will only expedite your departure from this community.
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Old 10-06-2010, 9:54 PM
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Originally Posted by obeygiant View Post
Since you are new to the forum I would suggest that you go read the rules that you agreed to when you signed up. The personal attacks will only expedite your departure from this community.
Let me endorse that sentiment.

Any more commentary from CRPA on promoting any candidates, or recommendations from the membership to CRPA? If not, the thread will close down tomorrow.
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Old 10-06-2010, 10:26 PM
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Originally Posted by Robert Gosney View Post
If I can't trust the CRPA to rate candidates on gun rights why would I look at them for economic ratings? Why would you?
You misunderstood my simple point about economics, which had nothing to do with economic ratings. Rest assured that I never have, and never will, suggest *any* gun rights organization involve themselves in the politics of the economy.

To say my original point differently: if for no other reason than to preserve funds and avoid low ROI efforts, CRPA should continue to only rate those candidates who have a greater than zero chance of winning (and, preferably, only those likely to be the top voter-getters based on polling and registration records).

Quote:
Neither does the NRA or CRPA
Since you didn't offer any specific examples, I can only say that your assertion is without merit on its face. If you'd like to discuss this in greater detail, PM me and I'd be glad to have a conversation over the phone.

Quote:
We're already getting nothing! And I'll tell you something else. If you are willing to settle for crumbs then that's all you'll ever have.
Obviously you haven't familiarized yourself with contemporary legislative action, or how CRPA and NRA are working hard to advance our cause in spite of an unfriendly majority. In any case, frankly, I'm more fearful of the byproducts of legislatures that *do* act than that of those that don't.

Would you mind sharing what it is that you've been involved in to actively advance our cause? Someone who pontificates as you have here would surely have an extensive CV of pro-gun efforts. You would, I am sure, concur with the old axiom "actions speak louder than words".

You are a member of the CRPA and NRA, aren't you? It would be quite embarrassing for a candidate practically begging for an endorsement from these organizations to be found not capable of contributing even the minimal dues that go to support their hard work and operations.
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Last edited by wildhawker; 10-07-2010 at 2:00 AM..
  #24  
Old 10-07-2010, 8:47 AM
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Originally Posted by wildhawker View Post
You misunderstood my simple point about economics, which had nothing to do with economic ratings. Rest assured that I never have, and never will, suggest *any* gun rights organization involve themselves in the politics of the economy.
You said that CRPA should rate candidates if for no other reason economics if I remember correctly. How was I supposed to take that?

Quote:
Originally Posted by wildhawker View Post
To say my original point differently: if for no other reason than to preserve funds and avoid low ROI efforts, CRPA should continue to only rate those candidates who have a greater than zero chance of winning (and, preferably, only those likely to be the top voter-getters based on polling and registration records).
How much does it cost to rate a candidate? They mail out a questionnaire and gauge the candidates responses. Let the voters be informed and make their own decisions. What you are talking about maybe is campaigning for and contributing to a particular candidate. Sure, I'm fine with the CRPA making their own decisions as to whom they will campaign for and give money to. What I have a problem with is the *rating* of only Democrats and Republicans, because of the pretense of objectivity. That's the way I see it anyway. In my opinion the ratings are incomplete at best. Which leads me to say that an objective rating and informed electorate is not part of the agenda at CRPA or the NRA.
Tell me: why not rate all of the ballot qualified candidates and let the voters decide for themselves? The CRPA could still help campaign for whomever they want to but then they would have to explain why they are supporting candidates that are not as pro gun as other ballot qualified candidates.


Quote:
Originally Posted by wildhawker View Post

Since you didn't offer any specific examples, I can only say that your assertion is without merit on its face. If you'd like to discuss this in greater detail, PM me and I'd be glad to have a conversation over the phone.



Obviously you haven't familiarized yourself with contemporary legislative action, or how CRPA and NRA are working hard to advance our cause in spite of an unfriendly majority. In any case, frankly, I'm more fearful of the byproducts of legislatures that *do* act than that of those that don't.
Then you should be voting for lawmakers that will *un-do*. Hint: not Meg.
Quote:
Originally Posted by wildhawker View Post
Would you mind sharing what it is that you've been involved in to actively advance our cause? Someone who pontificates as you have here would surely have an extensive CV of pro-gun efforts. You would, I am sure, concur with the old axiom "actions speak louder than words".

You are a member of the CRPA and NRA, aren't you? It would be quite embarrassing for a candidate practically begging for an endorsement from these organizations to be found not capable of contributing even the minimal dues that go to support their hard work and operations.
I'm not looking for an endorsement. Just a rating. I think that's only fair don't you? Then let the voters decide. I wasn't given the courtesy of a rating because it does not fit within the agenda of the CRPA or the NRA. So what is their agenda then? Protecting Republicans. It's just like icaucus. They are the same way. They say that their goals are lower taxes, smaller government, etc. but that really isn't the case. Since they will only rate Republicans and Democrats their main objective would be preserving the two party system. Or preserving the status quo.

I've never been a member of CRPA. I have been a member of the NRA for around 10 years although I will have a hard time continuing with that.

What have I been doing to advance the cause of liberty and gun rights? A hell of a lot more than my Republican opponent. I've been involved in the Patriot movement since around 1991 and very active in Patriot groups. I've been an active member of the NRA. Now, I'm trying to take the fight to the Assembly. Do you actually think there is something in this for me?

Actions speak louder than words all right. That's exactly what I'm saying. So what does that say about the CRPA and the NRA only rating Republicans and Democrats? Again, don't get confused. I'm not saying endorse, I'm only saying rate, they can still endorse anyone that they want.
Is it that only Democrats and Republicans have qualified candidates? Is it because they don't want to offer an explanation if they chose to endorse a less pro gun candidate? Are they afraid of splitting the conservative vote? All of these are lousy answers in my opinion and involve compromising our principles in one way or another. I'm done compromising my principles. Conservatives compromising themselves is what has taken us to the point we are at. I'm tired of the fear arguments too about splitting the conservative vote. I'll tell you this too. The fear argument falls flat in the governor's race. It's not going to make any practical difference if it's Meg or Jerry in the governor's office.

Keep in mind, I'm not the one that started this thread. It's a glaring omission that the CRPA won't allow anyone to have a positive rating in the governor's race. Actions speak louder than words.
  #25  
Old 10-07-2010, 9:06 AM
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Originally Posted by Robert Gosney View Post
I think that it is disappointing that they ONLY attempt to rate Republicans and Democrats. There is an outstanding candidate running for Governor named Chelene Nightingale. She is 100% pro 2nd Amendment, she has also held several "shooting with Chelene fundrasers". She comes from a military family.

Now why CRPA doesn't want anyone to know about her is a mystery to me. Meg claims to be the same as Jerry anyway so it's not like there is any vote to split.

I'm facing the same problem in my own campaign. CRPA and the NRA never even bothered to send me a questionnaire. I'm sure they didn't even bother to send a questionnaire to Chelene either.
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Now thats a person i can suppport.
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  #26  
Old 10-07-2010, 1:06 PM
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wildhawker wildhawker is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Robert Gosney View Post
You said that CRPA should rate candidates if for no other reason economics if I remember correctly. How was I supposed to take that?
I suppose you could have interpreted my comments as I meant them.

Quote:
How much does it cost to rate a candidate? They mail out a questionnaire and gauge the candidates responses. Let the voters be informed and make their own decisions. What you are talking about maybe is campaigning for and contributing to a particular candidate. Sure, I'm fine with the CRPA making their own decisions as to whom they will campaign for and give money to. What I have a problem with is the *rating* of only Democrats and Republicans, because of the pretense of objectivity. That's the way I see it anyway. In my opinion the ratings are incomplete at best. Which leads me to say that an objective rating and informed electorate is not part of the agenda at CRPA or the NRA.
You are not even a member of the CRPA yet want us, as members, to support some idea that we should be spending our money on rating no-chance candidates from the Green Party et al? How amusing.

Quote:
Tell me: why not rate all of the ballot qualified candidates and let the voters decide for themselves? The CRPA could still help campaign for whomever they want to but then they would have to explain why they are supporting candidates that are not as pro gun as other ballot qualified candidates.
The CRPA is about gun rights, and their ratings are designs to produce the highest political return for that purpose. Politics is something you obviously don't understand, and I don't care to teach you here.

Quote:
Then you should be voting for lawmakers that will *un-do*. Hint: not Meg.
There's little "un-do"-ing that will come from the legislature. If you understood the roles in California government, you'd also understand that the governor really only has the power to veto, not "un-do".

Quote:
I'm not looking for an endorsement. Just a rating. I think that's only fair don't you? Then let the voters decide. I wasn't given the courtesy of a rating because it does not fit within the agenda of the CRPA or the NRA. So what is their agenda then? Protecting Republicans. It's just like icaucus. They are the same way. They say that their goals are lower taxes, smaller government, etc. but that really isn't the case. Since they will only rate Republicans and Democrats their main objective would be preserving the two party system. Or preserving the status quo.
You obviously haven't even spent the time to look at the ratings, then. Their lack of protecting Reeps in a critical year made national news. Then again, it's a bit irrational of me to expect you to be informed here when you've proved your unwillingness to inform yourself in any other topic we've touched on so far.

Quote:
I've never been a member of CRPA. I have been a member of the NRA for around 10 years although I will have a hard time continuing with that.
So you are just looking for a handout. Thanks for clearing that up.

Quote:
What have I been doing to advance the cause of liberty and gun rights? A hell of a lot more than my Republican opponent. I've been involved in the Patriot movement since around 1991 and very active in Patriot groups. I've been an active member of the NRA. Now, I'm trying to take the fight to the Assembly. Do you actually think there is something in this for me?
What does "very active in Patriot groups" mean? Give me specifics. Show me what you've done to earn the support of gun rights advocates and owners.

Quote:
Actions speak louder than words all right. That's exactly what I'm saying. So what does that say about the CRPA and the NRA only rating Republicans and Democrats? Again, don't get confused. I'm not saying endorse, I'm only saying rate, they can still endorse anyone that they want.
Is it that only Democrats and Republicans have qualified candidates? Is it because they don't want to offer an explanation if they chose to endorse a less pro gun candidate? Are they afraid of splitting the conservative vote? All of these are lousy answers in my opinion and involve compromising our principles in one way or another. I'm done compromising my principles. Conservatives compromising themselves is what has taken us to the point we are at. I'm tired of the fear arguments too about splitting the conservative vote. I'll tell you this too. The fear argument falls flat in the governor's race. It's not going to make any practical difference if it's Meg or Jerry in the governor's office.
Again, it's a ROI consideration. However, you're entirely wrong about Brown and Whitman. You should consider researching the topic a bit.

Quote:
Keep in mind, I'm not the one that started this thread. It's a glaring omission that the CRPA won't allow anyone to have a positive rating in the governor's race. Actions speak louder than words.
Political strategy takes some ability to read between the lines. I'm sorry you can't.
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  #27  
Old 10-07-2010, 6:19 PM
Robert Gosney Robert Gosney is offline
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How did you know that Robert Gosney was my favorite subject? I thought we were talking about the CRPA's lack of principle in regards to the governors race. My race is inconsequential compared to the governors race my unprincipled friend. You can keep your political strategies. Your political strategies have already helped to (insert your own word) this state over. Your political strategies are a FAILURE! You just don't have the courage to face that yet.
  #28  
Old 10-07-2010, 7:59 PM
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Nope, going noplace after an additional day. Closed.
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