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  #1  
Old 02-01-2010, 7:54 AM
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Default 10mm vs 9mm???

I have seen quite a few 10mm pistols for sale recently. Is there a major difference between the 9mm and 10mm?? What would be the advantage of 10mm?
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  #2  
Old 02-01-2010, 7:58 AM
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mmm....are you being serious?? i own both and 10mm kicks butt!!! it might be too powerful for some people. do a google search on how powerful a 10mm is. don't take my word on this, but i read somewhere that a 10mm is about the same as .41 super.
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Old 02-01-2010, 8:02 AM
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BIG difference between 9 and 10mm.

The 9mm is certainly easier to find ammo for, and less expensive by far than most of what you will find in 10mm factory ammo.

The 10mm is a versatile cartridge, through handloading it can be mild like a
.40 S&W or nearly as hot as a .41 Magnum.

There are many more firearms available in 9mm vs. the 10mm.
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Old 02-01-2010, 8:04 AM
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Default Muzzle energy, ammo cost

The 9mm handgun typically has a muzzle energy of 350 to 400 foot pounds, while the 10mm has a muzzle energy of 550 to 600 foot pounds, depending on barrel length and load used.

9mm practice ammo costs $10 to $12 per 50, while 10mm practice ammo costs $20 to $25 per 50.
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  #5  
Old 02-01-2010, 8:13 AM
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10 mm is more like 700-800 foot pounds



Quote:
Originally Posted by Miltiades View Post
The 9mm handgun typically has a muzzle energy of 350 to 400 foot pounds, while the 10mm has a muzzle energy of 550 to 600 foot pounds, depending on barrel length and load used.

9mm practice ammo costs $10 to $12 per 50, while 10mm practice ammo costs $20 to $25 per 50.
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Old 02-01-2010, 8:18 AM
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10mm is one of two cartridges in a semi auto handgun that broke the mold for the ballistic gelatin during testing. The other was .357 sig. 9mm pales in comaparison. If you have a ton of extra cash to spend and don't mind having more recoil 10mm is a good way to go, but if you have more limited funding and wish to shoot a lot more for less 9mm is the way to go.
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  #7  
Old 02-01-2010, 8:21 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mikeinla View Post
Is there a major difference between the 9mm and 10mm??
About 1mm?? If you are new to shooting handguns, start with a 9mm that you can get a .22 conversion for. Learn the basics and shoot it a lot with the .22s. Become accostomed to the recoil of the 9mm. Get your skills developed on a less powerful and cheaper to shoot gun before moving up. Then go to a range that has a 10mm available to rent. Try it out to see if it is something that you would want to spend you money on.
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  #8  
Old 02-01-2010, 8:41 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mikeinla View Post
I have seen quite a few 10mm pistols for sale recently. Is there a major difference between the 9mm and 10mm?? What would be the advantage of 10mm?
The main difference: Money

The reason why you see 10mm pistols for sale: Money

For paper punching and SD, the 9mm is entirely suitable. The 10mmAuto can be significantly more powerful, but there are also 10mmLite loads comparable to .40S&W levels (.40S&W is nothing more than a shortened 10mmAuto with a small primer pocket). The 10mmAuto is an excellent cartridge but ammo is significantly more expensive than 9x19mm, .40S&W or .45ACP since it is not currently adopted/issued by a major LE department/agency. You REALLY need to reload, to be able to shoot the 10mm, even then the cases are more expensive. The 10mm can be loaded from .40S&W to mid-range .41Mag levels. You don't see many 10mm's in competitive shooting circles because it doesn't give a competitive advantage and the brass is expensive, when it's a lost brass match. Very versatile and a wonderful offensive carbine load.
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  #9  
Old 02-01-2010, 9:32 AM
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as an example of energy in other rounds.

9mm = .38 spl +P
10mm = .41 Magnum
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  #10  
Old 02-01-2010, 9:44 AM
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9mmepiphany:

.38 special +p only runs about 20,000cup
9mm runs at almost 40,000psi in standard form and over 40k in +p and +p+

Needless to say 9mm runs at much higher pressures than any .38 special cartridge. The .38 special even in +p+ comes nowhere near 9mm in any catergory including muzzle velocity, energy, and/or pressure.
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  #11  
Old 02-01-2010, 10:04 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mikeinla View Post
I have seen quite a few 10mm pistols for sale recently. Is there a major difference between the 9mm and 10mm?? What would be the advantage of 10mm?
The advantage of the 10mm would be increased penetration potential against barriers, and potentially game animals. If you want that kind of performance and want an autoloader that can serve multiple purposes, then 10mm may be a decent choice. It still isn't quite up to .41 magnum levels. .41 magnum can be loaded with much heavier bullets, and it also is usually loaded pretty mild from the factory, so comparing the hottest 10mm loads to mild .41 magnum loads is not accurate. It is probably a step up from .357 magnum though.

If you're talking about it's usefulness from purley a home defense perspective, then the 10mm is actually closer in terminal performance to the .40S&W. Most manufactures have not designed their modern hollowpoints for use in full house 10mm loads, thus their currently isn't a defense load that takes full advantage of its performance. And yes I know DT makes some hot loads for 10mm with HPs, however those bullets were designed for the .40s&w. Keep in mind those HPs are designed to expand to a point and then stop. They have an expansion limit, and when they reach a velocity higher than intended the petals just fold back without more expansion. Tests conducted by Dr. Gary Roberts show that while the DT loads in .40s&w did offer more pentration than identical weight factory loaded gold dot loads, they did not offer more expansion.

Modern 9mm HPs perform well, and if all you're looking for is a general HD/range caliber it will serve you well. If you're looking at something for potential run ins with larger animals then the 10mm has a significant advantage. Or if you already have guns chambered in other calibers then 10mm is a fun cartridge to shoot, so there's always the fun factor.
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  #12  
Old 02-01-2010, 10:07 AM
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Definitely money is the issue. If I seriously had like infinite money to spend on ammo, plus watermelons and other various fruits to shoot at.. I'd shoot 10mm all day just to be able to really appreciate 10mm.

9mm is considered the more practical ammo. Easy to control, good price, and in another state - you get much more ammo per mag.
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  #13  
Old 02-01-2010, 10:10 AM
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Some people want to pick on the 9mm always claiming "weak knock down power". But in reality, they have never seen anyone shot or knocked down, I have.

Trust me, 9mm will kill you dead, even the FMJ.
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  #14  
Old 02-01-2010, 10:23 AM
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Quote:
Needless to say 9mm runs at much higher pressures than any .38 special cartridge. The .38 special even in +p+ comes nowhere near 9mm in any catergory including muzzle velocity, energy, and/or pressure.
i believe you...that wasn't the point

the point was to give a relative comparsion between the .38Spl and the .41 Mag...was i incorrect?
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  #15  
Old 02-01-2010, 10:36 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by southsac916 View Post
Some people want to pick on the 9mm always claiming "weak knock down power". But in reality, they have never seen anyone shot or knocked down, I have.

Trust me, 9mm will kill you dead, even the FMJ.
As will .22 short
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  #16  
Old 02-01-2010, 10:45 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by southsac916 View Post
Some people want to pick on the 9mm always claiming "weak knock down power". But in reality, they have never seen anyone shot or knocked down, I have.

Trust me, 9mm will kill you dead, even the FMJ.
Agreed. I hate the mindset of other people thinking anything smaller than a .45 = peashooter.
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  #17  
Old 02-01-2010, 10:58 AM
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Default Energy question

Quote:
Originally Posted by TZL View Post
10 mm is more like 700-800 foot pounds
I checked several ammunition websites and found the following muzzle energy figures for 10mm:

Federal AE 180 gr FMJ - 424 ft-lbs
Federal Hydrashok 180 gr HP - 424 ft-lbs
CCI Blazer 200 gr FMJ - 431 ft-lbs
Corbon 165 gr JHP - 573 ft-lbs
Winchester Silvertip 175 gr HP - 649 ft-lbs

I would contend that most commercial 10mm ammo is well below your range of 700 to 800 ft-lbs.
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  #18  
Old 02-01-2010, 11:03 AM
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It all comes down to intended use. 10mm is the round I take to the woods. 9mm is the round I use for home defense.
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Old 02-01-2010, 11:11 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Miltiades View Post
I checked several ammunition websites and found the following muzzle energy figures for 10mm:

Federal AE 180 gr FMJ - 424 ft-lbs
Federal Hydrashok 180 gr HP - 424 ft-lbs
CCI Blazer 200 gr FMJ - 431 ft-lbs
Corbon 165 gr JHP - 573 ft-lbs
Winchester Silvertip 175 gr HP - 649 ft-lbs

I would contend that most commercial 10mm ammo is well below your range of 700 to 800 ft-lbs.
Most of the 10mm ammo loaded by the major manufacturer's is loaded to the original anemic FBI spec of 180gr@950fps, that's .40SW territory. The Win Silvertip is the last, close to original power loading for the 10mm, from a major manufacturer. The only ammo companies that are loading the 10mm to/near its original (Norma AB) specification are: Corbon, DoubleTap and BuffaloBore. They load ammo in the 200gr@1200fps, 180gr@1300fps range, 155gr@1500fps range.
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  #20  
Old 02-01-2010, 11:11 AM
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Focus on shot placement.
Focus on shot placement.
Focus on shot placement.
Focus on shot placement.
Focus on shot placement.
Focus on shot placement.
Focus on shot placement.
Focus on shot placement.
Focus on shot placement.


Did I make my point?
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  #21  
Old 02-01-2010, 1:18 PM
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Unless a bear's charging you.
Unless a bear's charging you.
Unless a bear's charging you.
Unless a bear's charging you.
Unless a bear's charging you.
Unless a bear's charging you.
Unless a bear's charging you.
Unless a bear's charging you.
Unless a bear's charging you.


Well, you do have to focus on shot placement, but you don't want a minor caliber for a woods gun.

Quote:
Originally Posted by shooterdude View Post
Focus on shot placement.
Focus on shot placement.
Focus on shot placement.
Focus on shot placement.
Focus on shot placement.
Focus on shot placement.
Focus on shot placement.
Focus on shot placement.
Focus on shot placement.


Did I make my point?
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Last edited by cineski; 02-01-2010 at 1:46 PM..
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  #22  
Old 02-01-2010, 1:44 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cineski View Post
Unless a bear's charing you.
Unless a bear's charing you.
Unless a bear's charing you.
Unless a bear's charing you.
Unless a bear's charing you.
Unless a bear's charing you.
Unless a bear's charing you.
Unless a bear's charing you.
Unless a bear's charing you.


Well, you do have to focus on shot placement, but you don't want a minor caliber for a woods gun.
Bears use fire to char people now?
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Old 02-01-2010, 1:46 PM
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Woops! I'll fix that ;-)
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Old 02-01-2010, 1:47 PM
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I think OP only posted this up because 9mm is only 1mm away from 10mm...bullet size-wize, but demension of entire cartridge is a big difference.
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Old 02-01-2010, 3:26 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cineski View Post
Unless a bear's charging you.
Unless a bear's charging you.
Unless a bear's charging you.
Unless a bear's charging you.
Unless a bear's charging you.
Unless a bear's charging you.
Unless a bear's charging you.
Unless a bear's charging you.
Unless a bear's charging you.


Well, you do have to focus on shot placement, but you don't want a minor caliber for a woods gun.
Make sure you file the front site off that 10mm pistol so after you shoot the bear with it and he shoves it up your *** it won't hurt as much
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Old 02-01-2010, 3:51 PM
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This is always a favorite too

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Old 02-01-2010, 3:57 PM
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10mm round has more kinetic energy @ 100 yds. than the 9 does @ the muzzle

180 grn in 10mm travels the same speed as 115 grn in 9mm
the recoil of the different rounds is also significant
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Old 02-01-2010, 4:04 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by liftman View Post


This is always a favorite too

LoL!

1mm. That's the difference.
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Old 02-01-2010, 4:06 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by buffybuster View Post
Most of the 10mm ammo loaded by the major manufacturer's is loaded to the original anemic FBI spec of 180gr@950fps, that's .40SW territory. The Win Silvertip is the last, close to original power loading for the 10mm, from a major manufacturer. The only ammo companies that are loading the 10mm to/near its original (Norma AB) specification are: Corbon, DoubleTap and BuffaloBore. They load ammo in the 200gr@1200fps, 180gr@1300fps range, 155gr@1500fps range.
I understand Elite Ammo is also doing some fairly hot 10mm ammo but I'm not sure how readily available it is.
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Old 02-01-2010, 4:11 PM
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liftman: that stick figure drawing is an instant end-all to this debate. I was set on my .40 or .357mag, but think it'd be stupid for me NOT to convert over to 10mm now.
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Old 02-01-2010, 4:44 PM
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Lol. Glad I could help you out.
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Old 02-01-2010, 5:58 PM
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I'm a 10MM proponent. I have nothing against the 9MM. It is a good round. But, the 10MM does everything the 9MM does but a lot better. It does take more practice and it is more expensive to shoot. I'm a reloader so I load my 10to suit my mood, practice time and fun time at the range. The recoil is completely managable and let's face it - more is more. The 10MM is alive and well with a great future.

I may hear a lot of disagreement on this, but, I believe the 10 is closer in ballistics to the .357 mag than the 41 mag. Please don't quote me inflated fps numbers. Just look at the reloading manuals, Corbon or Double Tap data. Now that being said, I've fine with true .357 ballistic statistics for my semi-auto. AND, no the .357 SIG is not strong enough to be in this comparison. It (10MM) is a proven manstopper, barrier penetration maker and very accurate round. Done...........
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Old 02-01-2010, 6:07 PM
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9mm is fine if you need to shoot civilized Europeans, everyone else gets the TEN. Just kidding really.
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Old 02-01-2010, 6:09 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by southsac916 View Post
Some people want to pick on the 9mm always claiming "weak knock down power". But in reality, they have never seen anyone shot or knocked down, I have.

Trust me, 9mm will kill you dead, even the FMJ.
If I want to use "knock down power", I'll hit the bad guy with my truck. I like "fall down dead power", that's why I like my 10mm!
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Old 02-01-2010, 6:38 PM
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The caliber debate will never end. There will always be another newer, better, faster, heavier, more deadly round, and a bunch of people recommending it. When you ask most of them what they'd keep if they could only have 1 caliber for everything, plinking, competition, HD, SD, etc, they either say 9mm or .45 90% of the time.

When it comes down to it, you will be able to afford to shoot the 9mm much, much more, and both will kill somebody just as dead. So go with the 9mm if you're worried about humans. Who cares if you can drop somebody at 100yards, somebody 100yards is not a threat in the eyes of the law, so if you don find yourself shooting at somebody that far away, you'll soon find yourself in prison. All pistol rounds suck compared to rifle rounds, so if you're worried about hunting an animal at that kind of range, get a rifle. In an average home where an average gun-owner mite live, you'd be hard pressed to find a straight shot over 50 feet, at that range, both the 9mm and 10mm will require skill to hit the target, and both will likely drop the target in a single well placed shot, yet neither is likely to drop the target wih a poorly placed shot.

Just wait for the 11mm round, it's 1 more, and it will be the new "in" round.

Quote:
Originally Posted by southsac916 View Post
Some people want to pick on the 9mm always claiming "weak knock down power". But in reality, they have never seen anyone shot or knocked down, I have.

Trust me, 9mm will kill you dead, even the FMJ.
Had that discussion the other day with a friend. He was giving me crap for keeping a 9mm loaded and ready as my HD gun, apparently anything smaller than .40cal is not lethal

What does he shoot you may ask? A 6-shot .38 special with a 2" barrel of course, much better than having 10 rounds of 9mm and a 4" barrel to shoot it out of.
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Old 02-01-2010, 6:54 PM
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11mm = 44, I wonder when they will start making that one. I love Calguns, I really do.
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Old 02-01-2010, 7:30 PM
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I think I will get both and get a g26 and a g29. Practice with the g26 and use as a back up gun to the g29, which will be my backpacking pistol.
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Old 10-19-2010, 12:23 PM
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get a g29 with a drop in barrell and shoot both and add .40 and 357 sig
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  #39  
Old 10-19-2010, 12:41 PM
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Helpful_Cub Helpful_Cub is offline
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I want a Kimber GT10, put since its a special edition, it won't be added to the California approved list.

http://www.durysguns.com/inventory/category/GT10
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  #40  
Old 10-19-2010, 12:51 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Helpful_Cub View Post
I want a Kimber GT10, put since its a special edition, it won't be added to the California approved list.

http://www.durysguns.com/inventory/category/GT10
Thats what I came in here to say.


Ps I heart guntalk.
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