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Ladies Forum A place for our female Calgunners to discuss, share and interact without the 'excess attention' sometimes found in online forums.

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  #1  
Old 10-11-2009, 8:04 PM
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Default good training course for my wife

Im looking for a 1 or 2 day pistol training course tailored for women that are new to shooting. My wife has only gone shooting once, really liked it, but I want her to get her fundamentals down, so that she feels more comfortable with weapons should a home defense situation arise, also i think it would be nice if she met other women that are into shooting. Any suggestions ?

some of you that went to lytle a couple weeks ago might have met her.


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  #2  
Old 10-11-2009, 8:10 PM
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On-Target has a variety of women-only training courses. I'd highly recommend them, my wife (a former anti) took their intro course and really enjoyed it.

Oh, they're also a sponsor here.

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  #3  
Old 10-11-2009, 8:15 PM
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I took the General Handgun class from the Firearms Training Associates in Corona. I'm taking the Advanced course in November. They do also offer a women's only course.

http://www.ftatv.com/home
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  #4  
Old 10-18-2009, 5:38 AM
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I took the 4 Day Defensive Handgun at Front Sight, they also offer a 2 Day course. Some of the gals in my class were pretty damn good shooters!
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Old 10-18-2009, 6:35 PM
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ITTS they are located at Angeles national Forest . Great instructor's
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Old 10-22-2009, 3:30 PM
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I have used Firearms Training Associates in Corona for several classes and they are great! I think the best. I know they have a CCW Self defense class for the ladies. Taught by a female retired cop... she know her stuff
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Old 10-22-2009, 3:36 PM
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I think there's an appleseed shoot coming up this weekend(?) near San Diego... anyway, soon. $5 for the day, they really encourage women to come and learn. haven't been to one yet but they sound like a nice break-in for beginners, especially women.
megan
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Old 10-22-2009, 3:41 PM
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www.appleseedinfo.org

http://www.eventbrite.com/org/28719640?s=442480
megan
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Old 10-22-2009, 6:51 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Slim View Post
I have used Firearms Training Associates in Corona for several classes and they are great! I think the best. I know they have a CCW Self defense class for the ladies. Taught by a female retired cop... she know her stuff
X3.

FTA offers a variety of great classes. If you take the General Handgun class you can participate in their End of the Month club - essentially a 1/2 day practice session/clinic with instructors on the last Saturday of the month for $25. Great deal and a great way to keep your skills polished.
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  #10  
Old 10-22-2009, 6:59 PM
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thanks everyone, i think the corona one is going to be a good choice, reasonably close to where we live and all.
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  #11  
Old 10-23-2009, 4:00 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ronin16 View Post
ITTS they are located at Angeles national Forest . Great instructor's
Can't go wrong
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  #12  
Old 10-29-2009, 3:26 PM
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Hope it is ok to post here being a man and all. I think I have something to contribute...

If you have any vacation time saved up you could take one of the many 2-Day or 4-Day classes at Front Sight just outside of Las Vegas, and then spend a couple nights actually in Las Vegas at a nicer hotel and see a show or something. Follow up the gun play time with romantic time being my point. No reason it has to be all gun play, right? Everybody enjoys romantic time. The last time I took the class about 1/3 of the students were women. Another 1/3 were law enforcement types. The women were all first time shooters and they did better than some of the cops (and better than myself). It doesn't have to be tailored towards women for them to get into it. They just need the instructor not to have his head up his rear and talk down to them because they're women (not that I see that happening very often anymore). The instructors at Front Sight treat everyone with respect and adjust their instruction to the students skill and comfort level nicely. You can get cheap flights to Vegas, and you can pickup first time student certificates for about $150 or less here on Calguns.net or on eBay. So don't let their advertised price give you sticker shock. You can do it on the cheap.

And for the record...I'm pretty sure I don't like you. Beautiful wife who can share your interests...yep, I'm pretty sure I hate you. Does she have a single sister? Seriously though, very cool your wife is taking an interest in your hobbies and enjoying them. Hopefully you can find a way to reciprocate (and actually mean it).

Last edited by tacticalcity; 10-29-2009 at 3:42 PM..
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  #13  
Old 10-29-2009, 7:26 PM
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I just got back from the Frontsight 4-day defensive handgun class, and I can honestly say that it was worth the time and effort. I'll echo the previous poster that there were a lot of women - including 2 deputies - and many law enforcement. The training was hard work and exhausting, but I feel so much more comfortable and confident with my gun. The instructors were patient and helpful, and extremely qualified. Lots of emphasis on safety and safe handling of firearms. If you can't spare 4 days, the 2-day is worth it, too.

Gotta say, I was very apprehensive about going there. 4 days of shooting? Yeah right. But I made it through, and ended up really enjoying it, although I really need a massage for my aching shoulders!

My husband and I took the class together - his second time. We coached each other, and I really appreciated his help. It didn't hurt that he gave me some things to work on before the class to prepare me. It worked for us, but sometimes it's best not to team up with your significant other.

The cost is high, but you can buy certificates on ebay for around $300. That's good for one 4-day or two 2-days. They do really push the membership stuff (reminded me of a time share presentation), but if you can ignore that, the rest of the info and training is great. After I've worked on my skills for a time, I'd like to go back and do it again.

Oh yeah, we did go to Vegas ahead of time for a few days. Next time, we'll do it after (shorter drive on the last day, and they have lots of spas in Vegas!!!!!).

Last edited by katokat; 10-29-2009 at 7:28 PM..
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  #14  
Old 11-02-2009, 7:04 AM
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I too have taken the 4-day handgun course at Front Sight. I did learn a lot but I was not impressed with the 1 instructor to 15 student ratio for our range, which was typical. Front Sight is about volume training, and I think the courses are set up so you have to repeat them. Individual attention was sparse- maybe 4 or 5 minutes in 4 days. Most of the range masters' time was spent keeping 44 people with guns safe on the range (a really high priority, I would agree).

I did become a member of Front Sight in anticipation of repeating the class with a revolver and taking the rifle and shotgun courses too. However, I learned that to actually "graduate" from the course will require most untrained shooters like me to take it over. A lot of emphasis is on speed of shooting, and speed in clearing malfunctions, which are precisely defined steps that have to be done in 1.5 seconds. These are very frustrating, especially the jam with a round in the chamber and another attempting to feed. It requires that you lock the slide back, remove the magazine, rack the slide three times, insert a magazine, then rack the slide- all in 1.5 seconds! It was hard to even remember the steps let alone do them quickly. A lot of practice is required, more than one would get in the two days it is taught and practiced, hence the need to repeat the course.

It was very common to see a woman crying outside the range area with an instructor talking to her. I noticed individuals from the ranges on either side us at one point or another the first two days. One of the four women our class was brought to tears the first day by an arrogant, condescending instructor who berated her every attempt. Some fellow students finally told the guy to back off, and she was taken under wing by an excellent competitive shooter in the class, and progressed very well. The other women in the course were easily on a par with the men in their shooting skills and the other skills taught, and did in fact seem to follow the instruction more precisely than people like me.

The days are long starting at 0730 and lasting until 1730 or later, with one late night until 2130 or so with a night shoot. It was hard work just being on your feet that long, when you are used to sitting at a desk all day

I'd like my wife to attend a course but when I described the Front Sight experience she could see no logic in attending. I would suggest looking at Gunsite near Prescott, AZ, or Thunder Ranch in Oregon. Both seem to emphasize smaller classes and more individual instruction. Besides both of these have to be more picturesque than Pahrump, Nevada!
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Old 11-02-2009, 8:24 AM
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powaybob - thanks for the honest write up, as my wife is a total novice, i def wont send her to frontsight, since i think that it would totally turn her off of shooting, she likes shooting based on the two times she has gone, but would need alot of help for various things..

thanks.
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  #16  
Old 11-02-2009, 11:53 AM
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I am truly sorry to hear you had that kind of experience there. Mine was nothing like that, and I mean NOTHING like that.

We had 1 instructor for every 2 students, and they were all very patient and all very cool. They made it clear if we felt we were being pushed too hard to tell them and they would back off, they just wanted us to succeed. But I never saw any instructor actually need to be told to back off, they were all so very patient.

Like I said before, the women performed much better than most of the men on my line.

I am headed back this January and will report back either way...so we can see if your experience has become the norm, or was an oddity. I certainly hope it is not the norm. That would seriously suck.

As for speed shooting, and timed drills...yes...that was the point. To leave there with the ability to handle anything that came up and survive a firefight. And yes, the steps were very hard to remember. But the instructors were very cool about the fact that it was hard to remember and patiently worked with each of us until we got it and could do it consistently. That said, they started us of extremely slowly and made us do things so many times that it became second nature before moving on.

The one instructor per line sounds like the issue to me. We had more instructors than we really needed, which relieved any stress students felt and kept instructors from getting overwhelmed. There was always someone there to help you out individually. If you didn't have that, I think it would be chaotic and very frustrating for everyone. So I truly hope that things will be the way I remember them the last time I went and not the way you describe. I will feel very cheated if they are as you describe.

Last edited by tacticalcity; 11-02-2009 at 12:05 PM..
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  #17  
Old 11-02-2009, 12:13 PM
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For a good, basic intro course, check out firearmstraining.com

Greg Block offers an all around great, intro class. It isn't specifically female oriented, but plenty of women sign up for the class and he always has a female instructor there.

The class takes place at Burro Canyon Range.
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  #18  
Old 11-02-2009, 3:04 PM
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I think I represented the Front Sight experience I had as accurately as I am able. I plan to return in the spring some time and have another go, so we will see what that experience is like. I think I said there were 468 students there that session in October.

I thoroughly understand the time pressure objective, and I made great improvement in the shooting aspect, and even did pretty well in the house exercise. Clearing the type 2 and 3 jams was just more than I could learn in two days to do quickly, but I do appreciate the importance of knowing what to do and being able to do it rapidly. I'll get it done eventually.

The good news is it is a four hour drive from San Diego, so it is not a great hassle to go there. And lodging in Pahrump is not too expensive, but I would not consider it a culinary destination. Actually, as long as the days were, it worked out well that I bought frozen dinners and salad stuff at the grocery store and just ate in the room. That saved both time and money. My big night out on the fourth night was to go to Panda Express.
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Old 11-02-2009, 3:50 PM
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poway and tactical city, did both of you pay full rates? or use the certificates that sell massivly discounted? is this one of those things where they run two seperate styles based on what the person paid? can anyone say if htey called with a certificate they were guided to a different date ?
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  #20  
Old 11-03-2009, 6:52 AM
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I bought one of the heavily promoted, popular packages that includes 5 days of training (the last day is concealed carry permits from Utah, Nevada, and Florida that allow CCW in about 30 states). The package is $1199 and includes your choice of calibers in a Springfield XD, a belt and holster, a flashlight, and other goodies- all first quality stuff. It really is a good package. I subsequently bought a membership for $912 that allows me to attend the 2 and 4 day courses as many times as I choose.

There is no difference that I could see. There were members who paid no tuition alongside us who had paid for the course. I do not think they have a tiered course system at Front Sight based on price paid for the certificate.

Maybe I just happened to select a weekend when everyone else decided to attend, since others have said they experienced a smaller class size. But they certainly expect a volume of people with over a dozen ranges with at least 20 stations each.

I know that I chose that weekend because I thought the temperatures would be pleasant for the desert. For two days it was in the 90s and little breeze, and then a front went through and the temperature the next few days was in the 80s, then 70s with a lot of wind.

I think the training is good if you are a bit thick skinned and can learn from what others are doing. They do set up a shooter/coach pairing among the relays so you teach each other (and yourself) what you are supposed to do. That is good.

It may be that some of the women were reluctant to come in the first place and all the new information and stress of handling a pistol and reacting to the firing upsets them. I am no psychologist, and since I have been married 29 years it is safe to say I don't know much about women!http://www.calguns.net/calgunforum/i...es/biggrin.gif
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Old 11-03-2009, 3:03 PM
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Sounds like we might have been at the same class. Starting October 23, 2009. My wife and I had never touched a handgun before February 2009, so all we had was the local rangemaster giving us a very good safety orientation and some good tips, and a lot of reading and self-range practice before Front Sight.

We took the 4-day defensive handgun followed by the one-day CCW class. My wife had used a .22 rifle over 35 years ago, but never used a handgun. After the class I've heard her tell people that she was a little intimidated by handguns before the Front Sight classes, but felt very comfortable now. She's also said that she was impressed with the treatment the women received. She kind of expected the instructors to concentrate on the men but was pleasantly surprised. Three instructors might have seemed a little slim for 44 people, but we found that they were always ready to assist anyone.

My wife got a lot of one-on-one and a lot of understanding. I had read comments on forums and blogs that they were supportive of women, but my wife's feelings clearly support those claims. There was a lot of information - one of our instructors called it like "drinking from a fire hose". That's close, but despite the volume, I feel like everything was touched enough so we can practice and refine now that we are home.

Lectures were very good. They covered the material very well and didn't seem practiced.

We got started by signing up for emails from Front Sight and watched different deals come and go. The main instructor, Wes, explained that they try to tailor classes for different types and balance the price and features. We got a Self-Reliance package that covers a lot of handgun classes and some open-hand defense and the CCW day. We slid in on a 2-for-1 deal for about $1,500 for lifetime attendance on all the classes in the package. But it wouldn't have been bad to get the $1,200 deal that they are doing a lot also - it usually comes with an XD pistol worth $600. I've seen where people have posted complaints about availability of these guns, but there were several there who used the guns from the deal. Afterwards the guns would have to be sent to an FFL near the student - but they had them.

One other thing - the grading for the higher certificates depends on speed. My wife used her Ruger SR9 and the safety slowed her down. I had my Glock (no safety) and I think next time she will either rent a Glock or will own one. The instructors really seem to like Glocks because of reliability and simplicity.

I had picked up some Blackhawk Serpa holsters on eBay for around $30 each. They worked out quite well. The release requires you to hold your trigger finger straight to release the gun so it is in the right (safe) place after drawing the weapon.

We will be back. From here out all the classes are free unless we go for rifle or other exotic stuff.
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  #22  
Old 11-03-2009, 6:29 PM
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JaMail as a female that just started learning to shoot in April of this year I would suggest either the NRA shooting program On Target (haven't taken but plan on it) and Front Sight if you can manage to get a trip in. They have certificates that can be used for those whom have never been there. Well worth the money you spend on the trip. I learned so very much in my four day class.
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Old 11-05-2009, 6:59 AM
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+1 for firearmstraining.com and Greg Block
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Old 11-07-2009, 11:10 AM
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DHJ1974 -
I was there the same weekend, at range 1E. We started with just under 40, and several more left at the end of the 2-day session. Some of the instructors switched around, and the most helpful to me was a long-time law enforcement officer (retired) who shot a 1911. Since my gun is more similar to his than to the Glock/XD guys, he spent quite a bit of time with me to get the motions with the safety smoother. I also had some trouble manipulating the slidelock and mag ejector since my hands are smaller, but he taught me a trick or two that wouldn't slow me down. Very patient, very nice.

I didn't mind the fast pace, since I am not brand new to shooting. Although it did get exhausting if you weren't physically and mentally prepared for the long sessions. My motivation in taking the class was to speed up and feel more comfortable handling my pistol. My movements are crisper, although I didn't speed up that much, but I feel much more in control now. Yes, the classes are geared to make you want to return, and it does feel like a time share pitch - but I can ignore that.

Guess it really depends which instructors you get. And maybe not best for a first time shooter, but good for skills development.
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Old 11-24-2009, 10:18 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by powaybob View Post
I too have taken the 4-day handgun course at Front Sight. I did learn a lot but I was not impressed with the 1 instructor to 15 student ratio for our range, which was typical. Front Sight is about volume training, and I think the courses are set up so you have to repeat them. Individual attention was sparse- maybe 4 or 5 minutes in 4 days. Most of the range masters' time was spent keeping 44 people with guns safe on the range (a really high priority, I would agree).

I did become a member of Front Sight in anticipation of repeating the class with a revolver and taking the rifle and shotgun courses too. However, I learned that to actually "graduate" from the course will require most untrained shooters like me to take it over. A lot of emphasis is on speed of shooting, and speed in clearing malfunctions, which are precisely defined steps that have to be done in 1.5 seconds. These are very frustrating, especially the jam with a round in the chamber and another attempting to feed. It requires that you lock the slide back, remove the magazine, rack the slide three times, insert a magazine, then rack the slide- all in 1.5 seconds! It was hard to even remember the steps let alone do them quickly. A lot of practice is required, more than one would get in the two days it is taught and practiced, hence the need to repeat the course.

It was very common to see a woman crying outside the range area with an instructor talking to her. I noticed individuals from the ranges on either side us at one point or another the first two days. One of the four women our class was brought to tears the first day by an arrogant, condescending instructor who berated her every attempt. Some fellow students finally told the guy to back off, and she was taken under wing by an excellent competitive shooter in the class, and progressed very well. The other women in the course were easily on a par with the men in their shooting skills and the other skills taught, and did in fact seem to follow the instruction more precisely than people like me.

The days are long starting at 0730 and lasting until 1730 or later, with one late night until 2130 or so with a night shoot. It was hard work just being on your feet that long, when you are used to sitting at a desk all day

I'd like my wife to attend a course but when I described the Front Sight experience she could see no logic in attending. I would suggest looking at Gunsite near Prescott, AZ, or Thunder Ranch in Oregon. Both seem to emphasize smaller classes and more individual instruction. Besides both of these have to be more picturesque than Pahrump, Nevada!
Odd I had a totally different expedience at Front Sight. I am a disabled female. I had a wonderful experience on the four day handgun course. I even got one on one help. And I needed help and a lot of patience in the instruction and got it with no issues what so ever. As a matter of fact every single staff member I came across was nothing but polite and helpful. Yes the days are long but you learn a lot in those four days. I just started shooting in April of this year. So I am relatively new at shooting. We were done with out night shoot by 8pm in September. I didn't see anyone crying at all in the four days I was there and there were a couple of hundred taking classes that cycle.Well except me when I had major malfunction issues with my gun but that is a whole different story. And quite a few of the ones on my range had never even handled a gun at all before taking the course. There were 38 people on our range BUT they did it in relays so not nearly as bad for the numbers. We had at least three instructors and sometimes four on our range the entire time. And your not on your feet the entire time there is down time when you are not up on the line. But yes if you are not used to being on your feet all day it can seem a bit much. Yes there are many other training schools out there and what may work for one may not work for another. But I have heard bad experiences on the other schools too. So I don't think there is anything as a perfect one size fits all gun school.

Last edited by KylaGWolf; 11-24-2009 at 10:24 PM..
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  #26  
Old 11-24-2009, 10:34 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JaMail View Post
powaybob - thanks for the honest write up, as my wife is a total novice, i def wont send her to frontsight, since i think that it would totally turn her off of shooting, she likes shooting based on the two times she has gone, but would need alot of help for various things..

thanks.
Don't just take Powaybob's word on Front Sight. I can say as a female that had very little shooting experience to have found their course to be extremely helpful and full of useful information. I needed a lot of help and got it and got lots of help including one on one help from an instructor. I never once was made to feel stupid. As a matter of fact they encouraged me to keep trying and not give up. An example of this was the last day. They have a shooting contest. They put everyone's name in a hat that is on that range. They draw two names and you go head to head shooting at three targets. I actually won the first round of my competition. Although I did lose on the second round (due to malfunctions with my handgun). The instructors explained things as many times as I needed to understand what to do and were patient when I had to take longer to do something and didn't make me feel like I was too slow or not good enough. And on the final day they give you the option if you want to test with concealment garment and moving targets or without and static or with concealment garment and static. Here is something else you still graduate even if you don't get the fancy sticker. So there is no "fail" per se.
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Old 11-24-2009, 10:38 PM
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I think I represented the Front Sight experience I had as accurately as I am able. I plan to return in the spring some time and have another go, so we will see what that experience is like. I think I said there were 468 students there that session in October.

I thoroughly understand the time pressure objective, and I made great improvement in the shooting aspect, and even did pretty well in the house exercise. Clearing the type 2 and 3 jams was just more than I could learn in two days to do quickly, but I do appreciate the importance of knowing what to do and being able to do it rapidly. I'll get it done eventually.

The good news is it is a four hour drive from San Diego, so it is not a great hassle to go there. And lodging in Pahrump is not too expensive, but I would not consider it a culinary destination. Actually, as long as the days were, it worked out well that I bought frozen dinners and salad stuff at the grocery store and just ate in the room. That saved both time and money. My big night out on the fourth night was to go to Panda Express.
OK sounds like you got the weekend they set a record for number of students attending at one time. When you go again stay at the Saddle West if you can. They have a deal for those going to classes at Front Sight. LOL most nights we ate cheap at the hotel and on the long night ate at Sonic. As for the jams unfortunately I have had too much experience in clearing those. What would mess me up is the after action drills of the step and look and step again.
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Old 11-24-2009, 10:41 PM
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poway and tactical city, did both of you pay full rates? or use the certificates that sell massivly discounted? is this one of those things where they run two seperate styles based on what the person paid? can anyone say if htey called with a certificate they were guided to a different date ?
Jamail if you have never taken a class at Front Sight you can use one of the gray certificates for the class and that is all you need. If you take the four day class the certificate is only good for one person if you are taking the two day it is good for two people. I didn't get guided to a different date when I used my certificate in September. No its not two separate styles based on what they paid for the certificates. But the certificate is good for either the two or four day courses.
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Old 11-24-2009, 10:45 PM
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I bought one of the heavily promoted, popular packages that includes 5 days of training (the last day is concealed carry permits from Utah, Nevada, and Florida that allow CCW in about 30 states). The package is $1199 and includes your choice of calibers in a Springfield XD, a belt and holster, a flashlight, and other goodies- all first quality stuff. It really is a good package. I subsequently bought a membership for $912 that allows me to attend the 2 and 4 day courses as many times as I choose.

There is no difference that I could see. There were members who paid no tuition alongside us who had paid for the course. I do not think they have a tiered course system at Front Sight based on price paid for the certificate.

Maybe I just happened to select a weekend when everyone else decided to attend, since others have said they experienced a smaller class size. But they certainly expect a volume of people with over a dozen ranges with at least 20 stations each.

I know that I chose that weekend because I thought the temperatures would be pleasant for the desert. For two days it was in the 90s and little breeze, and then a front went through and the temperature the next few days was in the 80s, then 70s with a lot of wind.

I think the training is good if you are a bit thick skinned and can learn from what others are doing. They do set up a shooter/coach pairing among the relays so you teach each other (and yourself) what you are supposed to do. That is good.

It may be that some of the women were reluctant to come in the first place and all the new information and stress of handling a pistol and reacting to the firing upsets them. I am no psychologist, and since I have been married 29 years it is safe to say I don't know much about women!http://www.calguns.net/calgunforum/i...es/biggrin.gif
That is one thing I will say is the weather is hot there. In September it was 100 degree plus the entire four days of my class. I was fine till the last day then got a bit too warm. So I suggest to anyone that is going to go to Front Sight is a week before UP your water and salt intake.

As to the reaction you saw there I have a feeling some of those women may not have been all that keen on being there in the first place. I know there are some that go there thinking they are going to hate it in the first place (although I don't quite understand that concept).
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Old 11-24-2009, 10:50 PM
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OK for those that went to Front Sight do you remember who your instructors were. I had Patty Walker and she was great and one of the assistants named Bill and he was great too I don't remember the name of the third guy on our range but he was OK. I also got some one on one help with Rangemaster Bishop and he rocked. I will also say got some great information from Wes.
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