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Concealed Carry Discussion General discussion regarding CCW/LTC in California

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  #41  
Old 02-19-2018, 9:20 PM
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BTW, I'm not advising or suggesting that anyone carry at the zoo. I am merely trying to analyze the actual laws and not just the policies or what people think the law is. My argument is purely academic here.
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  #42  
Old 02-20-2018, 8:48 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jessdigs View Post
My wife is planning a trip to SF Zoo soon. I'm thinking about taking off work and going.

Lock your gun in a locking container in your vehicle and go to the dang zoo. Contrary to what some of these guys will tell you, its still within the realm of reasonable behavior to be armed less than 24 hrs/day.



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  #43  
Old 02-20-2018, 9:09 AM
Robotron2k84 Robotron2k84 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CSACANNONEER View Post
For criminal trespass, one has to be asked to leave and refuse to do so within a reasonable time but, yea, if someone refuses to leave, they could easily be charged with and convicted of trespass.

As far as 171(b) goes, As long as a city, county or state employee regularly enters that building as part of his/her employment, you seem to agree that it would be covered under 171(b). I agree that if no government employee regularly enters a specific building as part of their employment, it would not be covered under 171(b). However, that is not exactly what you originally claimed. You originally said "staffed by" and I contend that it only takes a government employee to routinely enter the building as part of their employment to qualify it as a building covered by 171(b). There is no requirement for a government employee to be stationed at said building.
Re: PC 602 - being asked to leave: this is not necessarily the case; some of the violations are statutory and based on actions of the violator with respect to posted signage. 602(k) and 602(l)(4) are both statutory and at trial would have to be proven by the prosecution.

As for the reading of SFPC 617 - the first definition of City Property says: "San Francisco Zoo," inclusive. They further go on to list items that are not City Property, but it can be read as "Areas that are not explicitly mentioned follow these rules."

As for PC 171(b) it is not just enough that public employees are present, such as eating lunch at a cafe, but that their material function be present at the building in question. That to me means they spend more than a few minutes each day at that location and it is their primary work assignment.

The latter two would probably have to be decided by a trial.

Maybe case law would be instructive at this point.
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Old 02-20-2018, 1:17 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Robotron2k84 View Post
Re: PC 602 - being asked to leave: this is not necessarily the case; some of the violations are statutory and based on actions of the violator with respect to posted signage. 602(k) and 602(l)(4) are both statutory and at trial would have to be proven by the prosecution.

As for the reading of SFPC 617 - the first definition of City Property says: "San Francisco Zoo," inclusive. They further go on to list items that are not City Property, but it can be read as "Areas that are not explicitly mentioned follow these rules."

As for PC 171(b) it is not just enough that public employees are present, such as eating lunch at a cafe, but that their material function be present at the building in question. That to me means they spend more than a few minutes each day at that location and it is their primary work assignment.

The latter two would probably have to be decided by a trial.

Maybe case law would be instructive at this point.
As a CCW holder I'd be less concerned with being prosecuted if caught than I would having my IA discover that I was caught and decide to revoke my license or deny me at renewal because I couldn't use common sense/good judgement and not carry at the zoo.
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