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Ammo and Reloading Factory Ammunition, Reloading, Components, Load Data and more.

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  #1  
Old 01-02-2018, 5:40 AM
spur0701 spur0701 is offline
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Default Duplicating Buffalo Bore Barnes Lead Free Heavy 357 Mag

I thought this would be a good place to ask this given the lead free rules in some parts of CA. I've done some searches but my google-fu isn't coming up with very much. Normally I don't think I would ever mess with these particular Barnes 140 gr 38/357 solid copper bullets, looking at Midway they are about .80 each, but American Reloading had them on sale last month for about .12 each and I picked some up.

Buffalo Bore puts out a load where they advertise the following velocities from stock guns:

1947 fpsMarlin mod 1894, 18-inch barrel
1518 fpsS&W mod 27, 5-inch barrel
1519 fpsS&W MT Gun, 4-inch barrel
1436 fpsS&W mod 66, 3-inch barrel
1385 fpsS&W mod 66, 2.5-inch barrel

I would like to duplicate that if I could. I know they are less dense than lead and longer taking up more case volume. The Barnes site doesn't give very much load data. Anyone done any load development using these?
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  #2  
Old 01-02-2018, 7:38 AM
Divernhunter Divernhunter is offline
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You need to use the Barnes data for Barnes bullets. Just load max for best accuracy and terminal performance.
You may not be able to get exact results because Buff Bore may use powders us handloaders cannot get.
Also what they say for speeds may or may not be what you get when you shoot the factory ammo. This is quite common.
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  #3  
Old 01-02-2018, 7:46 AM
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I would concentrate on finding the best charge for my gun.
I would not try to duplicate someone else's load data.
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  #4  
Old 01-02-2018, 3:50 PM
spur0701 spur0701 is offline
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The data from Baranes is kind of limited as far as powders go, for this particular bullet they list these:

Powder, Starting, velocity, Max, velocity

Blue Dot (Alliant) 8.7 1374 10.2 1518
A-No.9 (Accurate) 11.7 1397 13.2 1527
Enforcer (Ramshot) 13.5 1521 15.0 1669
Steel (Alliant) 8.1 1333 9.6 1515
2400 (Alliant) 11.3 1371 12.8 1530
VIT N110 (Vihtavouri) 11.9 1403 13.4 1596
Lil'Gun (Hodgdon) 13.5 1513 15.0 1669
H110 (Hodgdon) 14.5 1477 16.0 1610
Win 296 (Winchester) 14.9 1513 16.4 1633
IMR 4227 (IMR) 14.3 1457 15.8 1587

...of all these I've only got Blue Dot and only maybe a pound and have never used it. I thought someone might have worked up another load using Unique or HP-38 or Titegroup or AA#7.

I understand that Buffalo Bore loads are pretty well thought of and just recently loaded some "FBI" load heavy 38 based on an effort some others (on Smith and Wesson forums I believe) made to duplicate the current Buffalo Bore loading using HS-6.

If I can I would like to end with something cross platform for use in a GP100, S&W Model 19, and Marlin 94.
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  #5  
Old 01-03-2018, 8:21 AM
Whiterabbit Whiterabbit is offline
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Why would you not try the bluedot since you have it?10 grains of powder is frugal and 1500 fps is a killer for a 9mm bullet. It would be a fine load, if your guns like it.
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Old 01-03-2018, 12:16 PM
spur0701 spur0701 is offline
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Because the bluedot that I have....I have no idea how old it is or how it has been stored, it's a little left in an 8 lb container that I picked up at an estate sale back in the day (about 10 years ago) and it was old then I think (could have been all the cat hair that was all over it and everything else when I got it). ....add to that when I started searching around looking for info on loads for this Barnes 140 grainer I ran across warnings about using bluedot in some loads (125 gr jacketed) and my take away from the discussions was that bluedot had a rep for being finicky. So I'm somewhat hesitant to try the bluedot unless I have no choice.
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Old 01-03-2018, 12:23 PM
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Magilla26 Magilla26 is offline
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I use 2400 with the 140 grain XPB. I get 1450 fps out of my GP100 and 1837 fps out of my Marlin 1894C. The Barnes Manual has only four powders listed and did not list 2400. Many other sources were used to develop this load.
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Old 01-03-2018, 12:51 PM
Whiterabbit Whiterabbit is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by spur0701 View Post
Because the bluedot that I have....I have no idea how old it is or how it has been stored, it's a little left in an 8 lb container that I picked up at an estate sale back in the day (about 10 years ago) and it was old then I think (could have been all the cat hair that was all over it and everything else when I got it). ....add to that when I started searching around looking for info on loads for this Barnes 140 grainer I ran across warnings about using bluedot in some loads (125 gr jacketed) and my take away from the discussions was that bluedot had a rep for being finicky. So I'm somewhat hesitant to try the bluedot unless I have no choice.
That's your choice then. If you are looking for full snot loads and you don;t trust your powder, why are you not buying H110, verifying your non-ruger guns are strong enough to handle the power, and going for it?

Should be pretty straight forward.
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  #9  
Old 01-03-2018, 1:30 PM
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Dirk Tungsten Dirk Tungsten is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by spur0701 View Post
Because the bluedot that I have....I have no idea how old it is or how it has been stored, it's a little left in an 8 lb container that I picked up at an estate sale back in the day (about 10 years ago) and it was old then I think (could have been all the cat hair that was all over it and everything else when I got it). ....add to that when I started searching around looking for info on loads for this Barnes 140 grainer I ran across warnings about using bluedot in some loads (125 gr jacketed) and my take away from the discussions was that bluedot had a rep for being finicky. So I'm somewhat hesitant to try the bluedot unless I have no choice.
Frankly, I would toss this stuff. are you even 100% sure the powder in the container is what it's supposed to be?
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  #10  
Old 01-03-2018, 1:46 PM
brianinca brianinca is offline
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I used H110 for my 140 gr XPB loads. Works well. Lots of fun with 158 gr JHP, too. Works for several other of my calibers, so I always have a few pounds on hand. I use Power Pistol for lighter weight bullets.
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  #11  
Old 01-03-2018, 2:35 PM
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This isn't Buffalo Bore, but straight from a box of Barnes VOR-TX .357 Magnum 140 gr XPB HP: MV is 1265 fps. Again, MV is 1265 fps. I repeated as not to be a typo. Factory ammo.
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  #12  
Old 01-03-2018, 4:29 PM
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The powders you're trying to fit (Unique, HP-38, etc.) aren't magnum pistol powders. For max performance you're going to need slow powders. Blue Dot is starting in that range. H110, 2400, MP300, AA#9 is where you need to be powderwise. They'll also make better use of the carbine length barrel.
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  #13  
Old 01-03-2018, 8:20 PM
bruce381 bruce381 is offline
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h110 or 296 get a lb and try it
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  #14  
Old 01-04-2018, 2:49 AM
spur0701 spur0701 is offline
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So a couple of last things before I venture off to try....which would be the better choice since I have to lay in a new powder, H110 or 2400? Do either require a magnum primer or will standard SPP do? Does one have anything over the other? I'm seeming to rememeber that 2400 is almost like Unique in that it can be used in a lot of different loading....and alothough I don't reload 300 BLK yet I plan to at some point and from a couple of articles I skimmed I rememeber H110 being used often. Thanks for all the help!
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