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Optics, Mounts, Rails and Sights If it aims your firearm, post about it here.

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  #1  
Old 10-10-2008, 8:12 AM
1022rimfire 1022rimfire is offline
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Default Aimtpoint T-1 vs Aimpoint Comp M4, M3, M2, etc.

I was wondering if anyone has tried the T-1 vs the other Aimpoints with larger, 30mm lenses.

Is there any negative impact to the smaller diameter lens on the T-1? Slow you down? More sensitive to cheek wield?

After trying an Eotech, I'm wondering if the smaller "tunnel" to look through may be an issue...

Any input based on your experience would be appreciated. Thanks.
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  #2  
Old 10-10-2008, 12:20 PM
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I have used the T-1, ML3, and Eotechs. The EoTech to me is little faster but. I really like the fact that I can leave the Aimpoint turned on and will not have to worry about the betties dyeing on me tell 5years from now.

The T-1 does have little smaller tunnel but not by much. Because the T1 is smaller you do not have as much peripheral obstruction like the full-size Aimpoint. Also the T-1 is more compact so it has lest to get snagged on. In short I prefer the T-1.

Mike @ CSGW
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  #3  
Old 10-11-2008, 7:00 PM
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The T-1 is much faster for me because of the smaller diameter. The Eotech also feels faster for the same reason. Both the T-1 and Eotech have minimal bodies which block your sight wereas the regular M series have a thicker body.

There is also a tunnel vision effect with the regular Aimpoints that the T-1 and Eotech's does not suffer from.

It seems counter intuitive but you can see more and be faster with a smaller sight than with a larger one. The T-1 owns it in my mind, the speed of an Eotech with the bombproof quality of an Aimpoint.
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  #4  
Old 10-11-2008, 7:08 PM
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T-1 is 4 MOA while you can get 2MOA in the Comp4M and ML3.
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  #5  
Old 10-11-2008, 9:22 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Olav View Post
T-1 is 4 MOA while you can get 2MOA in the Comp4M and ML3.
The T-1 is actually closer to 3MOA.

I hear this comes up alot, especially when it comes to the Eotech vs. Aimpoint debate and I have to wonder if it actually matters.

I have owned half a dozen Aimpoints and as many Eotechs and I can say that it has never mattered to me what size the dot was. I actually prefer the 4 moa dot as it is easier to pick up on the lower setting.

I have also hear people blab on about how at 100 meters a 4MOA dot covers up too much, than I remind them it's a red dot designed to hit man size target not a high powered scope to shoot gophers. Than it usually degrades into "but oh at this and this distance it would cover up a man size target", at which point I roll my eyes and wonder how many rounds that person has actually put through the said optic. Basically, at any distance where the dot would cover up a man size target you shouldn't be shooting at and if you were the hold over would relegate this point moot. But the legion of MOA worshiper will call me crazy when I say that an Aimpoint with a 4MOA is MINUTE OF MAN good from 0-600 meters if you do your part. It is easily 0-300M from an offhand position if you do your part. Having a 1-2-4 MOA dot will not affect that one bit.

I am just tired of that random bit that a lot of people throw out. I really must ask anyone that have been using AP's for more than a few years if having a 2 moa dot somehow made them shoot more accurately?
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Last edited by bobfried; 10-11-2008 at 10:03 PM..
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  #6  
Old 10-22-2008, 8:23 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bobfried View Post
The T-1 is actually closer to 3MOA.

I hear this comes up alot, especially when it comes to the Eotech vs. Aimpoint debate and I have to wonder if it actually matters.

I have owned half a dozen Aimpoints and as many Eotechs and I can say that it has never mattered to me what size the dot was. I actually prefer the 4 moa dot as it is easier to pick up on the lower setting.

I have also hear people blab on about how at 100 meters a 4MOA dot covers up too much, than I remind them it's a red dot designed to hit man size target not a high powered scope to shoot gophers. Than it usually degrades into "but oh at this and this distance it would cover up a man size target", at which point I roll my eyes and wonder how many rounds that person has actually put through the said optic. Basically, at any distance where the dot would cover up a man size target you shouldn't be shooting at and if you were the hold over would relegate this point moot. But the legion of MOA worshiper will call me crazy when I say that an Aimpoint with a 4MOA is MINUTE OF MAN good from 0-600 meters if you do your part. It is easily 0-300M from an offhand position if you do your part. Having a 1-2-4 MOA dot will not affect that one bit.

I am just tired of that random bit that a lot of people throw out. I really must ask anyone that have been using AP's for more than a few years if having a 2 moa dot somehow made them shoot more accurately?
But what happens if the target is smaller than minute of man? For example, if the BG's are firing at your from the prone or from behind hard cover with little more than a head and gun exposed...

It'd be nice to to be able to shoot "minute-of-head"... More of an issue at 200 yd. and beyond where a 4 MOA dot will be 8 inches wide and might cover/obscure a head-size target....

You gotta figure at some point, the BG's are going to take cover and make themselves 'smaller'...

I have both 4 MOA AP's and a 1 MOA Eotech and the 1 MOA dots are a lot easier to hit a 8 in. bullseye at 200 yd. than 4 MOA.... I do like the 4 MOA for close-in.

Oh, I also have a new T1 that I haven't had a chance to use yet. It is lower than the Eotech and M AP's. I'm going to try it on my M1A Scout. I get a much better (lower) cheek weld with it than with the Eo or AP M (where I had to do more of a chin hold)... Also, really appreciate the lighter weight, smaller profile.

Last edited by E. Fudd; 10-22-2008 at 8:30 AM..
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  #7  
Old 10-22-2008, 11:01 AM
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From my experience, the 4MOA dot becomes a problem when trying to engage at 200m+. It just covers up the target too much for my tastes but as has already been mentioned it's faster to acquire even on the low setting. All the more reason to stick with this size up close, but this enough of a problem for me that I switched to the EOTech. Combining a 65MOA ring with a 1MOA dot was the best of both worlds for me and I stuck with it for several years. It's only recently that I think Aimpoint's gotten back in the game with different dot sizes while maintaining best in class ruggedness and battery life. The T-1 is now my favorite, but I think it's really best to consider it over the M4 when you want something lightweight and compact.
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  #8  
Old 10-24-2008, 8:59 AM
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After getting the T1, I've sold the M4.
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  #9  
Old 10-28-2008, 7:49 PM
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I had the same dilemma a while back and I went with the T-1. The dot is actually a 3 moa which is plenty small. Ive put the T-1 and the M4S next to each other to compare the dot size and you really have to squint to tell the difference.
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  #10  
Old 10-28-2008, 9:44 PM
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T1 is slightly harder to use from very unconventional positions. But I have replaced all but one of my other Aimpoints with T1s anyway.
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  #11  
Old 10-30-2008, 9:01 AM
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So the 1 moa dot won't make the difference at say 100 yards. If I am firing from approx. 100 -150 yards or so, will an eotech get me a tighter group or a 2moa aimpoint a larger grouping. I know its a hard question, but in general, will a 1moa eotech tighten up my grouping at that kind of distance?? I've been debating on this and its making me not want the strikefire vs. eotech.
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  #12  
Old 10-30-2008, 1:06 PM
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If you're asking for some subjective testing, I can offer just my personal observations.

Between the ML3 2MOA and EOTech 557, I saw negligible POI differences from 0-100 yards. However, I was sporting an AimPoint 3X and EOTech 3.75X FTS magnifier, respectively, so my magnification additions may not stack up directly with your setup and original question.

Out past 100 yards and in general, I just prefer the EOTech reticle as it's much crisper than the 2MOA Aimpoint and as an added bonus, the 557 sports a built-in BDC for those longer shots. One other thing you may notice is that EOTechs projects on clear glass whereas Aimpoint uses a reflective lens for their diode, hence giving off a slight tinge of distortion under magnification.

Hope this helps.
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Old 10-30-2008, 4:22 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bombadillo View Post
So the 1 moa dot won't make the difference at say 100 yards. If I am firing from approx. 100 -150 yards or so, will an eotech get me a tighter group or a 2moa aimpoint a larger grouping. I know its a hard question, but in general, will a 1moa eotech tighten up my grouping at that kind of distance?? I've been debating on this and its making me not want the strikefire vs. eotech.
Seriously, you are worried about your group sizes...these are combat optics meant for shooting bodies.

Go buy a hunting scope if you want to shoot little groups
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  #14  
Old 10-31-2008, 12:45 PM
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Not to mention, do you use ammo that's capable of sub-moa groups?

Plenty of good iron sight shooters shoot MOA. A front sight post is MUCH larger than 5MOA.

This is a non-issue. It's made up by people who don't really understand holdovers and sight picture.
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  #15  
Old 11-02-2008, 10:27 PM
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I love eotechs. I love the circle with the dot, good for both really fast target acquisition and farther distances.
That said, there just seems to be so many problems with the run of eotechs in recent years. All seems to be battery related, and because of the seriousness of it, I just can't rely on them anymore. Many military units have recalled the eotech 553 because of the power issue, and I refuse to pay so much money for something that can go tits up on me.

Don't mind an aimpoint, I own the t-1 and m3. Both great, Just wish the eotech was just as sturdy and had the same long *** battery life.
Oh yea, supposedly eotechs can't be used at funny angles with polarized sunglasses. I haven't personally tried this myself so my apologies if im spreading wrong crap.
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