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  #161  
Old 04-11-2014, 9:46 AM
Tym2getbizeee Tym2getbizeee is offline
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Ok. Thanks Tripper.
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  #162  
Old 04-12-2014, 2:18 PM
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I posted this in the 2nd A Litigation forum, but figured it should be posted here for your benefit too.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Paladin View Post


From Monterey Co. Sheriff Scott Miller:
http://www.co.monterey.ca.us/sheriff...nformation.htm
(emphasis added)

Historically many people have applied for a CCW with little idea as to whether or not their request would be successful. Often the unknown element centers on the State of California’s requirement to show “good cause” in order to obtain a CCW. The standard of “good cause” varies widely from county to county. In my opinion, “personal protection” should suffice to establish the good cause standard.

However, with this standard comes a requirement that the background process be more thorough and rigorous than has been the case in the past. At some point during your application process, a background investigator will contact a sampling of your neighbors, family and co-workers to determine your suitability to carry a concealed weapon. We will advise the people we contact of the reason for the contact, and ask them if they would recommend you be issued a CCW permit.


While this may seem intrusive to some, I believe that with an expanded definition of “good cause” (that applies to virtually every lawful resident of the County) comes a higher level of due diligence on our part to ensure we are not issuing CCW permits to individuals who shouldn’t have one. Those individuals who have lived an upstanding life in every respect and enjoy a well-earned reputation among their neighbors, co-workers and friends should have little problem successfully getting through our process.


So now, in this sheriff's opinion, our RKBA protected by the 2nd A to the BoR should depend upon whether our "neighbors, family and co-workers" (or, in the 3rd para., "neighbors, co-workers and friends"), think people should get CCWs?

Just a "heads up" to CGF re. possible legal targets for winning $$$.
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  #163  
Old 04-12-2014, 3:29 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Paladin View Post
I posted this in the 2nd A Litigation forum, but figured it should be posted here for your benefit too.
Yup, that's been his policy since he began accepting applications a few months after taking office.
I was in the first wave of applicants but didn't even make it to the intrusive neighbors/friends/coworkers interview part... Guess I wasn't "upstanding" enough based on my interview (even though my LiveScan was fine, I have 03 FFL & COE, I was a freakin CRPA Director at the time, etc.).
My denial letter just stated I "did not meet the qualifications" for them to issue me a permit. When I asked for specifics, the answer was the same.
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  #164  
Old 04-12-2014, 6:37 PM
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I think there's no chance Bernal would be any better.

At this point "good cause" for reasons of self defense is, after Peruta, a given. Bernal's concession that self defense suffices for good cause is a gimmie. _All_ sheriffs have to accept self defense as good cause. So his web site basically just repeated the law as it stands, and said he'd adopt the policies of past sheriffs, without saying whether he's talking about the sheriffs who think only cronies showed good character.

The only question is how onerous the next sheriff will make the "good character" portion. The evasiveness by Bernal isn't a good sign. Miller's policy, as irritating as it is, is at least known.

It looks like there are two other candidates: Mike Richards, whose web site says nothing about CCW, and Fred Garcia, whose web site is also silent on the issue. Does anyone know anything about them?
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  #165  
Old 04-13-2014, 8:59 PM
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During the last election, Garcia initially said he would make Monterey County "shall issue". He later stated that he believed "shall issue" meant that anyone who demonstrated a reasonable need, and clarified to include "business people who carry a lot of cash" as an example of what would be included in that list.

Left my gut telling me he'd be no better about issuing than Kanalakis was, and I voted for Miller.

I'm suspicious that Miller's policy may have become a little less harsh than it started. I've heard quite a few of the stories from those who applied early on. I applied last Summer, and was approved at about the 90 day mark after my initial interview. The initial interview was painless as well, and the investigator seemed genuinely pleased to see my good cause was simply for protection of myself and my family.

They did send an investigator (Hans Koch) to my house, who did talk to my neighbors. From what I gathered, he never actually told them I had applied for a CCW permit, just that they were conducting a background investigation. Basic questions about my character, whether they had ever had any problems with me, etc. He was courteous and professional. I will add that I was honest with him during our interview and mentioned that while I had read the policy, I would appreciate him not mentioning the CCW to one of my neighbors in particular.

I'm told that early on there was voice stress analysis conducted during the interviews, that was not the case with mine. I did go to psych services for my psych eval, which was no big deal at all other than having to drive and pay for it.

Right around the 90 day mark I got a phone call saying my permit had been approved, and made an appointment to go pick up my permit. Honestly everyone I worked with at the Sheriff's Department was friendly, courteous, and professional. The only complaint I have about the entire process stems from my belief that the process shouldn't include interviewing neighbors or the psych eval.
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  #166  
Old 04-16-2014, 7:54 AM
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I received a response from Mike Richards regarding his stance on the issuance of CCW permits.

"Thank you for your question Mr. *****. I have received quite a bit of questions regarding the CCW policy. If elected Sheriff, my CCW policy would differ only slightly from that of Scott Miller's. I agree with his level of necessity required for applying for a CCW and I agree with the need for a thorough background check. The major difference I have, is I disagree with the psychological exam. They are too subjective. Only 3 of California's 58 counties currently require this. That speaks volumes about its viability in the process. That being said, I would apply even more due diligence to the background investigation to ensure that the recipient of a CCW is thoroughly vetted for the privilege of having a permit."
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  #167  
Old 04-16-2014, 9:55 AM
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Default Monterey -- Good Cause Statements available UPDATE 4/4/12

Did you email back that it's not a priv according to the 9th
( yes I know that's being debated but is currently the order, as it has not yet been overturned )


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Last edited by Tripper; 04-16-2014 at 10:56 AM..
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  #168  
Old 12-07-2014, 9:11 AM
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Have any CGNers in Monterey county heard/inquired re. CCWs & the new sheriff? Any specifics re. changes in GC, visiting/interviewing neighbors, psych exam, etc?

Only 1 month until there's a new sheriff in town: Steve Bernal.
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  #169  
Old 12-07-2014, 9:14 AM
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i'll inquire next chance I get
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  #170  
Old 12-26-2014, 10:22 PM
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Default 391 current valid CCW's in Monterey County...

Much better then the 50 - 60 that had CCW's in the 90's, and most of the 2000's.

If you want one, apply. The apparently will also be dropping the Psyche Exam.

Good luck!

M
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  #171  
Old 12-26-2014, 10:46 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Laphroaig View Post
. The apparently will also be dropping the Psyche Exam.



Good luck!



M

Who says
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  #172  
Old 01-05-2015, 6:03 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tripper View Post
i'll inquire next chance I get
Were you able to find out?

IIRC, the sheriff was sworn in today.
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  #173  
Old 01-05-2015, 6:05 PM
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Haven't had the opportunity
Yes, he was sworn in today
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  #174  
Old 02-14-2015, 4:15 PM
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still hoping to talk to someone soon, was waiting for them to decide who's in charge
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  #175  
Old 05-07-2015, 9:50 AM
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Any news about the new CCW policy? I'm starting paperwork soon...
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  #176  
Old 05-10-2015, 9:03 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by thomasesmith3 View Post
Any news about the new CCW policy? I'm starting paperwork soon...
Sheriff Miller's old CCW policy per the SO's website is quoted at:
http://www.calguns.net/calgunforum/s...php?p=13858276

Here is the CCW policy currently posted on Sheriff Bernal's website (https://www.montereysheriff.org/CCW/) (emphasis added):
Quote:
A MESSAGE FROM MONTEREY COUNTY REGARDING CONCEALED WEAPONS PERMITS

The purpose of this message is to give individuals interested in obtaining a Carry Concealed Weapon Permit (CCW) an idea of the standards and process for successfully obtaining one from the Monterey County Sheriff’s Office.

Historically many people have applied for a CCW with little idea as to whether or not their request would be successful. Often the unknown element centers on the State of California’s requirement to show “good cause” in order to obtain a CCW. The standard of “good cause” varies widely from county to county. In my opinion, “personal protection” should suffice to establish the good cause standard.

However, with this standard comes a requirement that the background process be more thorough and rigorous than has been the case in the past. At some point during your application process, a background investigator will contact a sampling of your neighbors, family and co-workers to determine your suitability to carry a concealed weapon. We will advise the people we contact of the reason for the contact, and ask them if they would recommend you be issued a CCW permit.

While this may seem intrusive to some, I believe that with an expanded definition of “good cause” (that applies to virtually every lawful resident of the County) comes a higher level of due diligence on our part to ensure we are not issuing CCW permits to individuals who shouldn’t have one. Those individuals who have lived an upstanding life in every respect and enjoy a well-earned reputation among their neighbors, co-workers and friends should have little problem successfully getting through our process.

Please read through the additional requirements to obtain a CCW permit carefully before submitting your application. If you choose to continue the process I hope this message provides some clarity regarding your chances for successfully obtaining a CCW permit.
Looks like the critical parts are the same. (I did the bolding and/or underlining.) So, they say SD = GC, but then push GMC through the roof and, it appears, make your RKBA subject to your neighbors', co-workers' and friends' ratification....

If Bernal does NOT follow this same procedure with ALL CCW applicants (think political donors, "friends of the sheriff"/"posse" members, politicians, celebrities), he's open for a Guillory-type 14th A Equal Protection federal lawsuit, but for GMC rather than GC.

Hypothetically, let's say there's a world-famous film star (and director) who lives in (and was once the mayor of) Carmel-By-The-Sea, a city which, acc to CGF's 2013 survey, does not issue CCWs. We'll call him "Mr. E." Let's suppose Mr. E has a Monterey SO CCW. When it is/was time to renew, if the sheriff has the same policy for renewals that means his "background investigator" would have to go to Mr. E's neighbors (who, unlike his friends, may be hard-core antis), and "ask them if they would recommend [Mr. E] be issued a CCW permit." Not only would the same procedure have to be followed, but the same standard as to judging whether to issue or not be followed. IOW, let's say 1 of your neighbors says "Nyet!" when asked if you should get a CCW and because of that you are denied. If 1 of Mr. E's neighbors also said "No!" and yet was issued, that too is a 14th A Equal Protection violation.

ETA: Since its been 5 months since the Bernal has been sworn into office and the same policy statement is on the SO website, I'll update the OP. Since they say SD = GC (have gone "vSI"), I'm going to make it a "TIME TO APPLY!!!" with Alert symbol but with a caveat since they're pushing GMC to sainthood levels....
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Last edited by Paladin; 05-23-2015 at 1:42 PM..
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  #177  
Old 05-10-2015, 10:51 AM
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Renewals are a quick interview, don't go through all that stuff again
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  #178  
Old 05-10-2015, 10:51 AM
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SD is sufficient
Next appointments are out to July I think
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  #179  
Old 05-23-2015, 9:39 AM
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Default Monterey *** TIME TO APPLY!!! (w/caveat) ***

Just seen this


Earliest appointment is July I think
But I'd say overwhelm them with appointments and maybe help get some of the other stuff reconsidered

Last edited by Tripper; 05-23-2015 at 9:43 AM..
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  #180  
Old 05-23-2015, 1:41 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tripper View Post
Just seen this


Earliest appointment is July I think
But I'd say overwhelm them with appointments and maybe help get some of the other stuff reconsidered
I won't ask what made them decide to change their policy, I'm just glad they did.
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  #181  
Old 05-23-2015, 3:28 PM
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I think folks should bring the app when they ask for appointment, hand it in and say the 90 starts now, then they will be pressed to do it within the livescan limit, which they can't with all the stuff they do
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  #182  
Old 06-30-2015, 11:26 AM
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Default Renewals in Monterey seem to be delayed

My first LTC expires this week after two years.

I got the notice for my renewal, that had been mailed to the wrong address. I filled in the paperwork, got an appointment, and took it in early this month. I took the (re-)training, and got the paperwork in. It looks like they are backlogged, and don't know how long it might be until my information gets reviewed. FYI: Nothing has changed since last time. Once it gets reviewed, then it has to "go up the chain" for approval or dis-approval.

I assume next time I need to start the renewaql 90 days before expiration, so that there's more time.

Not much more I can do for now.
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  #183  
Old 07-08-2015, 8:57 AM
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Wish i would have waited for Bernal. out 150 plus a trip to the VA(long as wait times)
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  #184  
Old 07-29-2015, 9:05 AM
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Default Monterey *** TIME TO APPLY!!! (w/caveat) ***

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tripper View Post
Renewals are a quick interview, don't go through all that stuff again

Well, now renewals require a fresh application, same as new, just no new livescan and they don't go visit neighbors again or anything. And Yes Psych is absolutely gone

Also, my understanding is that if one is denied you appeal via the undersheriff and every person I know of that has appealed has received their CCW (denial was overturned)
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  #185  
Old 07-29-2015, 4:59 PM
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This boob's cute little move may be legal, but WTF! While recognizing that good cause equals self protection and avowing to do the Constitutional think, in the next breath the good sheriff says he is going to set higher GMC standards. Recognizing the proper standard for good cause shouldn't affect GMC. Then the good sheriff announces that if you apply we are going to tell everyone, including co-workers that may be very anti gun, that you are applying AND YOU MIGHT LOSE YOUR JOB. The mafia was more honorable than this county Chief LEO.
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  #186  
Old 07-31-2015, 3:55 PM
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California has a definition of GMC and it does not involve calling neighbors.
I can't get a CCW in Alameda County, but having to ask your neighbors if you can exercise a basic right is just wrong.

What part of concealed have they forgotten.
You may as well wear it on your belt if everyone knows you have it..........
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  #187  
Old 07-31-2015, 4:27 PM
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A friend of mine pulled out of the process once they said they will speak to the neighbors. Neighbors happen to be gangsters.. Friend told investigators you can talk to my other neighbors but not them. They told her no we will talk to everyone. Why would you want to tell a bunch of gangsters one of their neighbors will carry a gun all the time. It just lets them know that person has guns in their house for sure and makes it a burglary target now
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  #188  
Old 07-31-2015, 6:10 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Chewy65 View Post
This boob's cute little move may be legal, but WTF! While recognizing that good cause equals self protection and avowing to do the Constitutional think, in the next breath the good sheriff says he is going to set higher GMC standards. Recognizing the proper standard for good cause shouldn't affect GMC. Then the good sheriff announces that if you apply we are going to tell everyone, including co-workers that may be very anti gun, that you are applying AND YOU MIGHT LOSE YOUR JOB. The mafia was more honorable than this county Chief LEO.
Insulting a sheriff that is slowly going in the direction we want him to is not wise.

He accepts SD = GC.
He's gotten rid of the psych eval.
He doesn't ask your references/employer/neighbors when you renew. See the above and also: http://www.calccw.com/Forums/announc...y-no-pain.html

These are all "good things" that Sheriff Bernal's done w/o being forced to by the courts.

Hopefully, in time, he'll get more comfortable w/issuing CCWs and skip your employer and neighbors and just ask for 3 non-family, in county references.

Patience, Weedhopper.

Quote:
Originally Posted by e90bmw View Post
California has a definition of GMC and it does not involve calling neighbors.
Really? What is it? Link?

I know about the CA AG's opinion letter from back in the 1970s, but that was in re. GC, not GMC.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Brian1833 View Post
A friend of mine pulled out of the process once they said they will speak to the neighbors. Neighbors happen to be gangsters.. Friend told investigators you can talk to my other neighbors but not them. They told her no we will talk to everyone. Why would you want to tell a bunch of gangsters one of their neighbors will carry a gun all the time. It just lets them know that person has guns in their house for sure and makes it a burglary target now
Probably better would be to tell the SO that they are gangmembers and ask the SO if when they talk to them to: (1) take all the names of whom they talk with and run them by their database, and (2) as them not to tell those neighbors why they're asking about your "friend": not tell them (and, ideally, not tell your other neighbors who may talk w/them) your "friend" is applying for a CCW.

Again: hopefully, after a couple of years experience (assuming we don't win SD = GC and "can own" = "can carry"/GMC via the federal courts), Sheriff Bernal will voluntarily drop some of these unwise policies.
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Last edited by Paladin; 07-31-2015 at 6:20 PM..
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  #189  
Old 02-07-2016, 7:44 AM
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Three weeks ago I called for an appointment and got one in August, a six month wait. A conflict developed and I called to see if I could change it. I was told that they were now into November, a nine month wait!
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  #190  
Old 02-07-2016, 8:49 AM
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Default Monterey *** TIME TO APPLY!!! (w/caveat) ***

Monterey did remove the psych evaluation it was not really by choice, paladin if you have questions about that feel free to pm me
They are getting further out on appointments, I've been telling everyone to apply, and word is getting out, convincing not to do the neighbor thing is tough, trying to drop the 3 gun limit is tough, work in progress
There is only 3 investigators I think, DOJ is responding slower than before.
On the plus side, renewal is easy, my suggestion on that is copy your original, keep it handy to turn in again, changing only what is necessary to be accurate. It is the same app. But be aware, they are processing renewals as well as taking new apps, they are getting behind on that and there is a tendency to notify a person of their renewal too late, making your ccw actually expire before your renewal is approved, call them maybe 6 months out to see when you can make an appointment for renewal, have you qualification ready, quals are good for a year.
Oh, if you did some SSE that changed your caliber in DROS, get it back to the caliber it is suppose to be, or the gun will be denied, they are fine with off roster as long as the caliber is correct, ie qualified with the serial, model and caliber, then DROS shows as 9" barrel at .52 caliber.. the DROS caliber needs to match what is on the gun and what you qualified with
PM any questions you might have

Last edited by Tripper; 02-07-2016 at 8:58 AM..
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  #191  
Old 03-15-2016, 5:43 PM
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Talked with one of the investigators for Monterey County Sheriff today and was told it now takes a least 3 months for the DOJ to respond back once fingerprints are taken.
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  #192  
Old 03-31-2016, 6:07 AM
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Appears that Monterey County has added one more investigator for doing background checks on CCW applicants.
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  #193  
Old 04-21-2016, 12:24 PM
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My appointment just got moved up three months sooner.
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  #194  
Old 06-11-2016, 8:16 AM
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It took almost 4 months from the 1st interview to the issuance of the CCW. Process was fairly simple.
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  #195  
Old 07-04-2016, 8:19 PM
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To those of you that successfully got your ccw. Without getting too personal, was your reason given, work related? Do you live in an area where your friendly with the niehbors?

I like the idea of ccw, although I don't have a dangerous job where a gun could possibly be needed, I do think that most of us, are potentially faced with the possibility of being in a situation where a firearm could save a life.

My biggest deterrent in this county , if it even got that far, is the talking with my niehbors. It seems rediculas to actually have that as a determining factor in the process. I live in a neighborhood where I do not choose to talk with or associate with certain niehbors. One being a ghetto loser, drug dealer, living at his senior mom's house, who's teenage kid is taking after him. Another niehbor being multiple families, living in a small house, almost guarantee they are not legal citizens.

Sure, there are a couple niehbors that I am friendly with. Even then, who.knows if they are against guns in general. No matter how much they like me or anyone else they might not like the thought of someone carrying. This is why I'm curious about the situation and process for some of you the carry in monterey county.
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Old 07-05-2016, 5:58 PM
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Default Monterey *** TIME TO APPLY!!! (w/caveat) ***

Personal protection is sufficient for Monterey


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Old 07-06-2016, 9:29 AM
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Personal protection is sufficient for Monterey


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^^^^
This....



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Old 07-06-2016, 8:49 PM
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^^^^
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Good to know, now how about the niehbor issue. I imagine there are others with crappy niehbors. What was your experience.
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Old 07-08-2016, 11:39 PM
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Good to know, now how about the niehbor issue. I imagine there are others with crappy niehbors. What was your experience.


Advise your Investigator of your concerns, no promise it will change anything though


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Old 07-10-2016, 2:01 PM
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Good to know, now how about the niehbor issue. I imagine there are others with crappy niehbors. What was your experience.


I believe they stopped that too...


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