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Centerfire Rifles - Semiautomatic or Gas Operated Centerfire rifles, carbines and other gas operated rifles.

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  #1  
Old 03-05-2014, 4:09 PM
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Default Keep your weapon systems running

We're all aware of the old motto "two is one, one is none" and we all act accordingly (or at least I would hope)... Rather it be spare parts, several guns, dozens of mags, a literal ton of ammo, or perhaps all of the above.

Rest assured, I'm not going to ask what spare parts I should stock up on, or what company makes the most reliable this or that. I'm not interested in playing fan boy.

My idea is simply this... Having what I need to maintain my primary (AR-15) and secondary firearm (your choice of Pistol) at ALL times, rather it be for a class, a trip to the range, a day out in the countryside/hills/BLM, maybe even while hiking/camping/hunting, otherwise traveling, or even a proverbial SHTF/Zombie apocalypse type situation.


#1. Let's assume for this exercise you don't have the option of simply driving home or grabbing another gun from your safe.
#2. Let's assume for this exercise all maintenance and repairs must be made in the field, with only what you have with you and nothing else.


So, I'm curious and looking for ideas... What would or what do you carry with you, for such a situation? How do you carry and organize it?


Things to consider:

  • Be realistic!
  • Work with what you have, and only what you have.
  • Weight & space will be of primary concern...
  • This exercise is about only about what you can carry and what's critical, not hauling your entire workbench or garage on your back. Again, be realistic.
  • Your primary (AR-15) and secondary (Pistol) firearm, and only those TWO firearms.
  • Spare parts (which spare parts would you consider field replaceable, with what you have on hand, and carry with you for this purpose?)
  • Tools (which tools?)
  • Cleaning supplies (what type of supplies?)
  • Ammo (how much ammo?)
  • Mags (how many mags?)
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  #2  
Old 03-05-2014, 4:18 PM
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Prob my LWRC w/ spare bolt and trigger springs. Not much tools needed to swap those parts out. And a Glock 19 for having least amount of parts and fairly easy to work on. Prob not much spare parts or tools needed for a Glock.
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Old 03-05-2014, 4:52 PM
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Thanks, this was fun to think about. I am no commando operator, so this is just what seems logical off the top of my head. Assuming other preparations are taken care of, and we’re dealing with only firearm related care:

Guns are an AR-15 and a Glock 17

AR-15 spare parts : spare lower parts kit, spare complete bolt carrier group, spare detent set, and spare batteries.
Glock 17 spare parts : Spare extractor, spare firing pin, spare trigger spring, spare recoil spring assembly, and a spare barrel.

For tools I would want a good multi-tool, a small but heavy mallet, a couple sized punches, a flashlight, and a second set of needle-nosed pliers.

For cleaning supplies I would want .22 and 9mm brass bore brushes and rods, a bore snake, small bottle of cleaner/degreaser, larger bottle of lubricant, a couple of toothbrushes, patches, and a can of compressed air, two or three lint free rags.

I am fuzzy on how much ammo would be practical to carry, so I’ll leave that as: As much as I can.
For mags, I think 4 for each gun, plus one in each well.

The tools, spare parts, and cleaning supplies can all fit in a rather small pack, or wouldn’t take up much room in a larger pack.
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Old 03-05-2014, 5:02 PM
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I have been thru the La riots and northridge earthquake.

You could use the time proven 7.62x39 and a G 9mm.

A boot lace with some oil is more than enough for pm's.

A NY Reload is my spare parts. That and some back up family members - I ain't no lone wolf.
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  #5  
Old 03-05-2014, 5:09 PM
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Good post! It feels good to think.

Side note: Yes, for this exercise primary & second firearms and what you can carry are the only focus. Other preps or concerns are more or less assumed, or just not considered.

I'm not LEO/MIL or some "SF operator", nor am I pretending to be such. That's not what this is about.

It's about being realistic and keeping your weapon systems running for when you might need them most. Rather that be a "your life depends on it" scenario or just a multiple day hunting trip in the mountains. Both situations are realistic and in both situations it's not only important to keep your firearms clean & functional, but considering an unforeseen expedite field repair/maintenance is not fantasy.

I'm not trying to imply something in the middle of fire fight, but rather when you return to your hunting camp or base camp, or wherever you're safe and have time to conduct your repairs or whatever actions are needed. But again, the option of grabbing another gun or carrying your workbench with you, is not realistic for this exercise. Neither is simply waiting until you get home or bringing your firearm to your gunsmith or armorer.

EDIT: Let me elaborate a little more... This a thought exercise, but thought grounded in reality, not Hollywood or the internet. I'd also like to add this is not about a catastrophic failure of parts like your barrel or receiver(s). It's not realistic to carry and install a spare barrel or receiver(s) in the field.
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  #6  
Old 03-05-2014, 5:35 PM
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Routine preventative maintenance on replaceable parts will greatly reduce your gun going down when you don't want it to. I routinely replace parts before they start failing but when they hit an approximate round count. But even with that a gun can have problem.

Any part with a spring will eventually fail (recoil springs, mag springs, etc.) as will those metal parts being slammed into other metal (firing pins, bolts). I keep a small tool kit with extra springs, o-rings, firing pins, pins, etc. for the guns I shoot most. A punch and a multitool is all I need to take most my guns completely down, barring a receiver tube or barrel replacement.

A decent lube and a bore snake will keep a weapon clean for months.

Last edited by till44; 03-05-2014 at 5:37 PM..
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Old 03-05-2014, 7:33 PM
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This is what I might think I would be using...
An AR and an AR pistol... The rifle has compartments on the butt stock for oil, solvent, and patches. Both of my weapons have single point slings and made out of para-cord, so that would be my bore snake. I would also have batteries in the pistol grip for my flashlight and red dot... I have room to carry 6 mags, on a belt and a mag in each weapon. 8 mags total. Small parts kits stashed/stuffed in one of the mag pouches for necessary parts needed for broken or lost parts and in extended periods of time I can use either weapon to fix and repair as needed for 1 weapon I wouldn't need tools to disassemble for cleaning and maintaining and if weight becomes an issue to where I have to move rapidly... I would convert both weapons into one S.B.R. if need be.

I'm not sure if this would apply to your exercise.
You did say AR and pistol... AR pistol would be my choice.
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  #8  
Old 03-05-2014, 9:40 PM
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AR and XDm..
Poop hit fan I "magically" have three 18 rnd mags for the pistol and 6 standard capacity minus 2 rnds mags for the AR. Military issue cleaning kits with some CLP. The rod that came with my pistol is on my go bag also. Maybe a spare bolt and some springs. Batteries for optic and light and maybe an extra sling.
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  #9  
Old 03-05-2014, 9:47 PM
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Interesting Comments. I'll offer this. LPS #2 is some amazing stuff when your trying to get a dirty gun running.
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  #10  
Old 03-05-2014, 10:15 PM
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I have a Saiga (unconverted/featureless) and a GP-100 (w/ speed loaders.) They have-been/are-always/will-be 'running', with virtually zero upkeep/maintenance.
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  #11  
Old 03-05-2014, 10:18 PM
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I can make most parts for my ak if in real shtf situation. Cant say same for ar. Just sayingcause tolerance is so diffrenr
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  #12  
Old 03-06-2014, 10:29 AM
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I'm sort of a minimalist. For the ar, a spare firing pin, a firing pin retaining pin, and a bolt cam. The cleaning kit would be similar to the gi kit. For the pistol , a good .357 revolver. I'd pulse up the ammo to 25% over what I think I need

Last edited by kenl; 03-06-2014 at 11:06 AM..
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  #13  
Old 03-06-2014, 11:01 AM
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I personally spent hundreds, if not thousands of hours shooting the M16 platform. Multiply that with 20 - 50 other guys doing the same thing is a LOT of operating time.

I maintain my stuff. But the last thing I'm worried about is my quality AR platform rifle "breaking" on me. I would carry a bore snake, some lube and a toothbrush.

I am much more concerned with having the right load out of water, food, ammo, medical supplies, etc.
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  #14  
Old 03-06-2014, 11:12 AM
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I keep a spare BCG in my range bag and a small 3mL bottle of lube in the grip of my rifle. My pistol is typically a Glock. I honestly don't have spare parts for any of them (I have five) beyond magazines. It's not that I don't think a Glock is incapable of failure but I don't shoot my pistols nearly as much as I shoot my ARs so I'm much more likely to break a part for my rifle just due to use. If you go by round count, I'd say my pistols see 1/10th to 1/20th the use that my long guns do.
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  #15  
Old 03-06-2014, 12:38 PM
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This is a tough one for me because I could go with either an AK47 AK74 AR-15 or Scar 17 I have spare parts and a good stash of ammo for everything but the Scar 17 but I do have plenty of magazines for each. Though the only weapon mags I have loaded at all times are for an AR15 and G17. Pistol would be a G17 I have 2 exactly the same but one of them I shoot for practice and training exclusively.

I have a cleaning supply kit that is a rollup pouch I bought from SKD that has just about everything I'd need in the field. I keep a spare AR15 bolt a few BCM upgrade kits which come with gas rings extractors o-rings ect. It has an AR-15 and AK sight tool leatherman bit accessory kit, a screwdriver small enough to work on a raddlock, a leatherman extension, a few common sized punches, an otis wire and a breakdown GI rod cleaning kit with patches chamber/bore brushes lube a cut in half brush ect. I also keep 2 Aimpoint batteries and 2 CR123 and AA batteries in it. Then I carry a leatherman MUT that has a pouch woven into my battlebelt and a pouch on my range bag. This set up has saved me and a few people while on a range trip in the desert its about 150% the size of a chipotle burrito and doubles as a cleaning mat.

My go bag is nothing bigger than a standard school bag which has enough room to accommodate my cleaning kit which is the only thing that gets moved from bag to bag. It carries just enough to GTFO of town or help the neighbors
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  #16  
Old 03-06-2014, 2:39 PM
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Thanks to those who actually followed the exercise and think outside the box.

The rest of you should post more in off-topic. I'm not interested in starting another caliber debate, a pissing contest or expounding on personal philosophies. Those are beyond the scope of this exercise. But then again, it's the internet and I should know better than to assume the ability for critical thinking.
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Old 03-06-2014, 4:11 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Drivedabizness View Post
I maintain my stuff. But the last thing I'm worried about is my quality AR platform rifle "breaking" on me. I would carry a bore snake, some lube and a toothbrush.
This is what I have. Small bottle of CLP, bore snake and couple brushes. Figure if SHTF, I won't have time to break down my rifle or handgun to keep it well cleaned with rods and brushes and different cleaners and lube.
Run bore snake and CLP, slap back together and keep trucking.
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Old 03-06-2014, 4:53 PM
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The amount of stuff you take is dependent on the length of time you will be without access to spare parts.

If you go camping, bring a complete high quality spare bolt, a buffer, action spring, trigger springs, buffer detent/detent spring, magazine catch/spring/button, firing pin, cam pin, firing pin retaining pin, charging handle, bottle of Slip 2000 EWL, a bore snake and chamber brush, and a couple tools is all you need. Oh, and a Glock 17. Pick the ammo and mag amounts.

If this is a bug-out situation parts/tools become critical. Assuming that there will be small amounts of down time to make repairs at night or in a concealed location here is a list:

A complete BCG, another complete bolt, all bolt parts (ejector, ejector spring and pin, extractor, extractor spring and rubber bumper), gas rings, firing pin, cam pin, firing pin retaining pin, lower receiver parts kit (minus grip), a gas tube w/pin, receiver extension/ castle nut, action spring (high quality), spare buffer, and a charging handle.

Tools: Minimum number of punches (use your knife butt as a hammer, or buy brass hammer and cut the handle down), bolt disassembly tool (Brownnellshttp://www.brownells.com/gunsmith-to...prod18759.aspx), driver handle and bits, (you can also remove the castle nut with a punch and a hammer, I've done it.

Cleaning: 2 - Bore snakes, a couple chamber brushes, a tooth brush, a couple brushes for gas key and carrier cleaning, bolt cleaning tool, Fire Clean, small bottle of powder/grease/cleaner remover.

Ammo: As much as you can carry of M855. and 9mm +p.

Pistol, don't bother with Glock parts, just bring a second Glock. So maybe a 17 and 19 with just Glock 17 mags.

Magazine: As many as you can take. Minimum of 8 standard capacity magazines. Or as many 10s as you can fit in. Preload you mags of course.

For a few days there may only be enough time to oil your bolt, so keep oil and the spare bolt on the rifle (grip and or stock).

If it is a high quality AR it will keep running as long as you keep the bolt and carrier lubed and don't break anything.

Good luck.

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Old 03-06-2014, 6:04 PM
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AR15 with spare BCG, bore snake, small bottle of MPro7 cleaner and a small bottle of oil, extra batteries for eotech, series3 Multitasker tool, 5 loaded mags

G17 3 loaded mags

Camelback backpack with water bladder, some fire starter, and a couple MRE's, flashlight and spare batteries.
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Old 03-06-2014, 6:10 PM
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my M6A3 with spare BCG, plenty o' mags and a revolver, those things NEVER jam.
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Old 03-06-2014, 6:39 PM
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Handgun would be one my glock 17's. I have three of them and a bunch of mags.

If I could only take one rifle it would probably be my SGL-21. I have a bunch of pre-ban mags and thousands of rounds of ammo.
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Old 03-06-2014, 7:21 PM
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Handgun would be beretta, put I'm transitioning to a glock 19, my ar, six mags each, bottle of lube, punches, small gun smithing hammer, spare parts kit, a complete bcg, ammo for both platforms (100 rounds each) flashlight, edc knife, batteries, bore snakes, patches. That's just for the weapon systems, I'll have other survival type items that are already in the bob.
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Old 03-06-2014, 8:36 PM
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Wow, some of you put your rifles through the paces. After being deployed twice, and using an ar/m16 since the 70s, I worry more about lost parts than broken ones (I tend to be a fumbled finger klutz).

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Old 03-07-2014, 4:57 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kenl View Post
Wow, some of you put your rifles through the paces. After being deployed twice, and using an ar/m16 since the 70s, I worry more about lost parts than broken ones (I tend to be a fumbled finger klutz).

Warning: Post may contain general statements. These statements are not directed towards anyone specific, unless noted otherwise. That includes you!

(^- that should be my new sig line)


That's not really what this was about. It was more about being prepared and just getting people to think. As opposed to standing by the useless stupid crap I see posted over and over again... Posts along the lines of "I've never had anything break/fail/malfunction" or "get an AK, they never break".

Spare me. It's useless and doesn't help anyone.

In all honesty, I don't care about how many years you spent down range or how many guns you've shot over how ever many decades of your life... You have my respect and I learn from your experience, but at the end of the day it has no bearing on the level of my preparedness or how I think.

I care deeply about being prepared. I absolutely hate when I need something (anything) and I don't have it. I care less about having it and not needing it.

I guess my brain and thought process just work differently. But that's fine.
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Old 03-07-2014, 4:13 PM
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Weapon?????????? By definition and words do have meanings the only weapon I own is my CCW piece. The rest of my guns are range or hunting toys. I have spares for my favorites.
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Old 03-08-2014, 11:28 AM
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Could we maybe make a reccommended spare parts list for AKs and ARs.. for newbies like me..
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Old 03-08-2014, 3:30 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sunday View Post
Weapon?????????? By definition and words do have meanings the only weapon I own is my CCW piece. The rest of my guns are range or hunting toys. I have spares for my favorites.
Semantics... CCW/carry/HD firearm(s) is for defense against people (with intent to kill or injure), hunting is for killing animals (sport and/or food), and "range toys" are for killing paper/assorted inanimate objects.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Nrai2020 View Post
Could we maybe make a reccommended spare parts list for AKs and ARs.. for newbies like me..
Well, you start by following the few posts in this thread with useful information, but I'll make up a list... Basically my goal in regards to firearm preps is to have at least 1 spare of every part (or more for small items like springs, pins, etc.), for each of my primary & secondary firearms. In my case, that's an AR-15 & Glock 19... With a few exceptions, as I don't plan to keep a barrel or receiver(s) on hand, unless finances or upgrades/changes allow me to do so.
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Old 03-08-2014, 4:13 PM
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If you were to ever fire more than 300 rounds in a SHTF scenario, you will be:

A. Dead
B. Alive with a really cool new gun collection taken from the bad guys.

... just keeping it real.
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Old 03-08-2014, 4:18 PM
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Primary will be my SKS paratrooper, no mags to worry about, will only take spare complete bolt, 2 firepins, 2 extractor and one recoil spring. Cleaning kit well it comes with one already but a good old bore snake won't hurt.
Secondary my new ruger MKIII, spare extractor a few springs and 2 extra mags

Tools that I'll need none, my Swiss army knife will do.
7.62x39 ammo count 200.
22lr 2 bricks.
Cleaning kit, what comes with my sks for the ruger brush cleaner and 22 pistol bore snake, mosin duel oil and bore cleaner bottle.
No mags for sks and only 4 total for the Ruger

I'm sure if all fails I can find one of them assault weapon rock to use.
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Old 03-08-2014, 4:30 PM
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With out these threads calguns would fester and die off...
Why ar 15 ? I would take my bolt hunting rifle first and for most.

What parts do you need?
I know of ARs and m16s that have functioned flawlessly for many thousands of rounds.

Some clp and 550 cord will lube your barrel . Burn the tip and it will be hard enough to get most dirt and carbon.
A leatherman or Gerber should be fine for most of your tasks.

It is my humble opinion that for shtf or zombies or cops raiding or whatever the most essential thing you need is stealth, silence.
If you don't have a plan to make a suppressor, a way to acquire one, or a home made one, then your dead wrong.
all it takes is one shot and your position is given away and the odds of your survival are now very minimal.
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Old 03-08-2014, 4:37 PM
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Originally Posted by glock7 View Post
Handgun would be beretta, put I'm transitioning to a glock 19, my ar, six mags each, bottle of lube, punches, small gun smithing hammer, spare parts kit, a complete bcg, ammo for both platforms (100 rounds each) flashlight, edc knife, batteries, bore snakes, patches. That's just for the weapon systems, I'll have other survival type items that are already in the bob.
I take it you have never gone backpacking,
or maybe the worlds biggest strongest man lives in Cali, who knows?

Also, six mags apiece? And 100 rounds each?
Did you know that most AR15 magazines holds 30rounds?
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Old 03-08-2014, 5:01 PM
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Originally Posted by michaelthetrojan View Post
I take it you have never gone backpacking,
or maybe the worlds biggest strongest man lives in Cali, who knows?

Also, six mags apiece? And 100 rounds each?
Did you know that most AR15 magazines holds 30rounds?
Maybe he's like the Postman and is going to have Bill help pack it
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Old 03-08-2014, 5:03 PM
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Lol you said bill I immediately thought Billie Mays,

Haha I wonder what he would do or what load out he would choose
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Old 03-08-2014, 5:34 PM
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A small 1oz bottle of ATF and a quick deploy cleaning rod for stuck cases in your rifle. Im sure you'll run out of ammo before anything breaks.
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Old 03-08-2014, 9:56 PM
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I Quit...

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