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2nd Amend. Litigation Updates & Legal Discussion Discuss California 2A related litigation and legal topics here. All advice given is NOT legal counsel.

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  #81  
Old 02-16-2014, 1:47 PM
SJ-Chris SJ-Chris is offline
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We keep assuming that all the anti-issue sheriffs are going to fight this for years and years. That could very well be the case. But can anyone provide examples of other Ca counties that have in the past switched from essentially no-issue to shall issue? What was the catalyst to make that happen? A new 2A sheriff elected? Reaction to some ruling in Ca or nationally?

Is there any chance that some of the essentially no-issue county sheriffs will simply start following the newly defined good cause (self defense only) requirement (once the en banc process/ appeals process plays out)? If the ruling stands, what impact (hopefully large) will the threat of citizens suing the sheriff/city have on their willingness to comply?

My pessimism thinks the answer will be that they will drag out for as long as possible. But before a few days ago I (and I assume many others) would have never expected this good news to come out of the 9th Circuit.
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  #82  
Old 02-16-2014, 3:17 PM
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sholling sholling is offline
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Originally Posted by SJ-Chris View Post
We keep assuming that all the anti-issue sheriffs are going to fight this for years and years.
I think we can count on a handful of sheriffs fighting civil rights until they are out of ideas to continue the fight without getting sent to jail for contempt of court. Hardcore anti civil rights sheriffs like those in SD, LA, OC, and many of the Bay Area counties will fight shall-issue for as long as humanly possible without risking jail. Others with stealth anti civil rights sheriffs like Riverside County's Shiff will fight a sneakier fight and fold sooner, but by no means will they give up overnight.
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  #83  
Old 02-16-2014, 3:18 PM
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Originally Posted by sholling View Post
It doesn't matter. For the sole purpose of protecting unpopular incumbent sheriffs from serious challenges California law effectively bars anyone but a midlevel or higher law enforcement officer from running for sheriff. Since it's career suicide to challenge a sitting sheriff - especially if he/she is your boss, very few legally qualified LEO are willing to risk the run.

Besides not only would the challenger face a sitting sheriff with a huge war chest funded by selling CCWs to well placed cronies, but also funded by a business community in fear of a backlash for not donating, and funding from a Republican Party that in the name of law and order would back Chairman Mao if he carried a badge. Add to that money pouring in from Bloomberg and the Bradys to keep a pro-civil rights candidate out of office. You can look to OC and the reelection of Sandra Hutchens for an example of just how close to impossible it is to successfully challenge a sitting sheriff.

The 24004.3 (aka the incumbent sheriff protection act) was created by the CA legislature to protect an unpopular Orange County Sheriff from being defeated at the polls by a popular judge. And yes the law has been blessed by the courts.



What I expect hardcore antis like Gore to do once the shall-issue order is issued by the district court is to use a combination of one or two or more year long delays and the good moral character clause of the law to keep permits almost impossible to get. And I expect that he will tack on conditions like daylight hours only, full sized guns under .25cal only, not within 5,280 feet from a school, park, government office, or daycare center. He won't pile on all of the restrictions at once, but rather force us to take him to court 4-5 more times over 4-5 more years before issuing his first unrestricted permits to non-conies on a shall-issue basis.


^^^^
I agree and expect that this will be the case in many counties, specifically Los Angeles where I live, within the actual city limits. They will fight this tooth and nail and dig deep into the taxpayers' pockets to forestall this as long as possible.
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  #84  
Old 02-16-2014, 5:15 PM
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This is why I do not ask for permission slips to exorcize my rights. Now when this goes to SCOTUS and finally settled I will apply (unless I have moved by then) so if I ever am stopped it should be hassle free.

Is this the theme song you use when exorcizing your right?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8LEWkwvaNcs
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  #85  
Old 02-18-2014, 10:33 AM
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The only way Gore will go is a health issue. Re-election is automatic in California, land of the lemming.

If the morons only knew what incumbancy does to their freedom, most would not re-elect. Unfortunately, the Government propaganda centers (public school systems) are doing a bang-up job creating even more morons.
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  #86  
Old 02-18-2014, 10:47 AM
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Originally Posted by 1813-2013 View Post
If thousands of license fees aren't a financial plus once Sheriffs loose the power and prestige of passing out LTCs as party favors, they will push for a state agency to handle licensing.
Was thinking the other day that the CA-DOJ basically already has the infrastructure in place. They already do the firearm purchase background checks and even issue the PFEC letters. So just have the PFEC process become the CCW process and instead of sending you an embossed letter good for 30 days....they send you a CCW card good for 24 mo.
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  #87  
Old 02-18-2014, 11:08 AM
dustoff31 dustoff31 is offline
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Originally Posted by Untamed1972 View Post
Was thinking the other day that the CA-DOJ basically already has the infrastructure in place. They already do the firearm purchase background checks and even issue the PFEC letters. So just have the PFEC process become the CCW process and instead of sending you an embossed letter good for 30 days....they send you a CCW card good for 24 mo.
This would be the best option IMO. One office with one set of standardized requirements throughout the state rather than 58 (at least) different ideas of what training, good cause, or moral character is or is not acceptable, etc.

Make it simple. Not a prohibited person? No, great, do these things. Get permit.

CA DOJ would also be able to make reciprocity agreements with other states regarding CCW. Whether they would or not of course is another matter.
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  #88  
Old 02-18-2014, 12:53 PM
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Is this the theme song you use when exorcizing your right?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8LEWkwvaNcs
No, I use this as my theme song..



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  #89  
Old 02-18-2014, 1:05 PM
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^ He was making fun of your spelling.....
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  #90  
Old 02-18-2014, 3:11 PM
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Originally Posted by mmayer707 View Post
^ He was making fun of your spelling.....
I don't know if he knows the difference between Exercising & Exorcizing.....
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"It's not always being fast or even accurate that counts, it's being willing. I found out early that most men, regardless of cause or need, aren't willing. They blink an eye or draw a breath before they pull the trigger--and I won't."

John Wayne as John Bernard (J. B.) Books in The Shootist
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