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California 2nd Amend. Political Discussion & Activism Discuss gun rights activism and 2A related political topics here. All advice given is NOT legal counsel.

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  #1  
Old 01-08-2014, 8:49 PM
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Default CA SB 199 de león 2014 - BB devices (BB guns)

SB 199

Another gut and amend. Removes the "less than 6 mm" restriction from BB guns as pertaining to imitation firearms.

Last edited by peterabbits; 01-08-2014 at 8:57 PM..
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  #2  
Old 01-09-2014, 12:40 AM
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So this bans airsoft? And paintball guns?
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Old 01-09-2014, 4:12 AM
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Not enough criminals he says, well make new ones.
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Old 01-09-2014, 5:39 AM
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LOL @ this bill. We just went full New Jersey.
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Old 01-09-2014, 5:46 AM
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More stupid laws from stupid people. Kalifornia's most abundant natural resourse is stupidity. If the libtard law makers are truly interested in public safety and protecting people they would work a reversing AB109.
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Old 01-09-2014, 6:39 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by peterabbits View Post
SB 199

Another gut and amend. Removes the "less than 6 mm" restriction from BB guns as pertaining to imitation firearms.


"BB devices" are currently considered "imitation firearms".

So, not sure what the removing "less than 6mm" wording does. Because as long as it looks like a gun, it's considered an "imitation firearm" no matter what caliber it is.



Penal Code 16250
As used in this part, "BB device" means any instrument that expels a projectile, such as a BB or a pellet, not exceeding 6mm caliber, through the force of air pressure, gas pressure, or spring action, or any spot marker gun.

Penal Code 16700
(a) As used in this part, "imitation firearm" means any BB device, toy gun, replica of a firearm, or other device that is so substantially similar in coloration and overall appearance to an existing firearm as to lead a reasonable person to perceive that the device is a firearm.
(b) As used in Section 20165, "imitation firearm" does not include any of the following:
(1) A nonfiring collector's replica that is historically significant, and is offered for sale in conjunction with a wall plaque or presentation case.
(2) A BB device.
(3) A device where the entire exterior surface of the device is white, bright red, bright orange, bright yellow, bright green, bright blue, bright pink, or bright purple, either singly or as the predominant color in combination with other colors in any pattern, as provided by federal regulations governing imitation firearms, or where the entire device is constructed of transparent or translucent materials which permits unmistakable observation of the device's complete contents, as provided by federal regulations governing imitation firearms.

Penal Code 20165
(a) Any person who, for commercial purposes, purchases, sells, manufactures, ships, transports, distributes, or receives, by mail order or in any other manner, an imitation firearm, except as authorized by this section, is liable for a civil fine in an action brought by the city attorney or the district attorney of not more than ten thousand dollars ($10,000) for each violation.
(b) The manufacture, purchase, sale, shipping, transport, distribution, or receipt, by mail or in any other manner, of an imitation firearm is authorized if the device is manufactured, purchased, sold, shipped, transported, distributed, or received for any of the following purposes:
(1) Solely for export in interstate or foreign commerce.
(2) Solely for lawful use in theatrical productions, including motion picture, television, and stage productions.
(3) For use in a certified or regulated sporting event or competition.
(4) For use in military or civil defense activities, or ceremonial activities.
(5) For public displays authorized by public or private schools.
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Last edited by Quiet; 01-09-2014 at 6:42 AM..
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  #7  
Old 01-09-2014, 7:13 AM
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Perhaps is indicated here:

Quote:
Originally Posted by jcwatchdog View Post
So this bans airsoft? And paintball guns?
So as to definitely include things such as paintball guns, that otherwise may not be considered a "BB device, toy gun, replica of a firearm, or other device" that is so substantially similar in coloration and overall appearance to an existing firearm.

A.W.D.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Quiet View Post


"BB devices" are currently considered "imitation firearms".

So, not sure what the removing "less than 6mm" wording does. Because as long as it looks like a gun, it's considered an "imitation firearm" no matter what caliber it is.



Penal Code 16250
As used in this part, "BB device" means any instrument that expels a projectile, such as a BB or a pellet, not exceeding 6mm caliber, through the force of air pressure, gas pressure, or spring action, or any spot marker gun.

Penal Code 16700
(a) As used in this part, "imitation firearm" means any BB device, toy gun, replica of a firearm, or other device that is so substantially similar in coloration and overall appearance to an existing firearm as to lead a reasonable person to perceive that the device is a firearm.
(b) As used in Section 20165, "imitation firearm" does not include any of the following:
(1) A nonfiring collector's replica that is historically significant, and is offered for sale in conjunction with a wall plaque or presentation case.
(2) A BB device.
(3) A device where the entire exterior surface of the device is white, bright red, bright orange, bright yellow, bright green, bright blue, bright pink, or bright purple, either singly or as the predominant color in combination with other colors in any pattern, as provided by federal regulations governing imitation firearms, or where the entire device is constructed of transparent or translucent materials which permits unmistakable observation of the device's complete contents, as provided by federal regulations governing imitation firearms.

Penal Code 20165
(a) Any person who, for commercial purposes, purchases, sells, manufactures, ships, transports, distributes, or receives, by mail order or in any other manner, an imitation firearm, except as authorized by this section, is liable for a civil fine in an action brought by the city attorney or the district attorney of not more than ten thousand dollars ($10,000) for each violation.
(b) The manufacture, purchase, sale, shipping, transport, distribution, or receipt, by mail or in any other manner, of an imitation firearm is authorized if the device is manufactured, purchased, sold, shipped, transported, distributed, or received for any of the following purposes:
(1) Solely for export in interstate or foreign commerce.
(2) Solely for lawful use in theatrical productions, including motion picture, television, and stage productions.
(3) For use in a certified or regulated sporting event or competition.
(4) For use in military or civil defense activities, or ceremonial activities.
(5) For public displays authorized by public or private schools.
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  #8  
Old 01-09-2014, 7:54 AM
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Didn't bother to read the whole crap by the way, but all I can see is a plot by these retards to make anything that resembles firearm a taboo to the coming generation .That way it will be very easy for them to erase 2A in the future.
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Old 01-09-2014, 12:44 PM
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Forces all airsoft guns, except paintball guns to made out of bright solid colors?
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  #10  
Old 01-09-2014, 12:54 PM
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Someone from the Liberal Gun Club needs to visit this asshat and get him to stop the BS.
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  #11  
Old 01-09-2014, 1:43 PM
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Originally Posted by mshill View Post
Someone from the Liberal Gun Club needs to visit this asshat and get him to stop the BS.
Yes, Liberal Gun Club please save us from the idiots you vote in.
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  #12  
Old 01-09-2014, 4:33 PM
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You can cry and mock these Rulers, but the voters of California love them like Jesus Christ.

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Old 01-09-2014, 9:17 PM
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Can someone explain the impact of SB 199 on air rifles?

If I understand this correctly, the bill

(1) establishes that the term "BB gun" also applies to pellet rifles,
(2) classifies all BB guns as imitation firearms, except those that are painted like toys, and
(3) bars the purchase, sale and transport of BB guns.

Does this mean it's illegal to purchase a Benjamin Marauder in .25 caliber, or, if you already own one, to take it anywhere, such as on a wild turkey hunt?
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Old 01-09-2014, 10:49 PM
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Ok so these bills always read like a foreign language to me.

So...

Is this saying that pellet, bb, airsoft etc will be illegal unless you already possess them come 2015?

Since "purchasing, selling, manufacturing, shipping, transporting, distributing, or receiving" is included... I guess that covers just about everything BUT possession.

I would say this is getting ridiculous... but it's already ridiculous.
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  #15  
Old 01-09-2014, 10:58 PM
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Who's to say they won't use that law to make illegal ANY projectile over 6mm. Do the math.

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  #16  
Old 01-09-2014, 11:28 PM
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Airsoft guns come in 8MM also. Not common, but they're around.
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  #17  
Old 01-10-2014, 1:22 AM
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From my reading they are banning BB guns that look like real guns, possibly including ones you already own. BB guns will need to be made in one of a handful of colors that make it look like a toy (which will probably lead to more injuries because they will then be treated like toys by more people IMO).

My guess is they are trying to slow down the thugs that go buy a realistic looking BB / airsoft gun cause they can't figure out how to buy a real gun with their felonies on their record, who go and rob 7Elevens with them.

Paintball guns don't look similar to real firearms, so shouldn't be included in the definition of an imitation firearm IMO.

It also looks like they will be including things like this in the definition of a BB gun and also an imitation firearm:

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  #18  
Old 01-10-2014, 10:57 AM
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This is where we might finally see thugs paint real firearms with toy colors.
If I were LE, I would treat the realistic looking toy guns in toy colors as possibly real already.
Aside from clear ones. Unless Wonder Woman had clear stealth guns like her plane...
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Old 01-10-2014, 11:36 AM
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Okay under current law a "BB device" is any gun that shoots a less than 6mm projectile "through the force of air pressure, gas pressure, or spring action, or any spot marker gun"

And "BB devices" are exempt from the imitation firearms bull****

This bill removes the "less than 6mm" language. If that is all it did, that would render all BB's gun, airguns, etc even those larger than 6mm exempt from the "imitation firearms" bull****

But then it removes BB device from the exempt list. And includes only spot guns.

Hence who cares about the 6mm thing? It is only removed because it has become irrelevant.

Note, I refuse to call these things laws. Laws are defined as "ordinances of reason, made by one in lawful authority, for the common good of a complete community and promulgated" On every one of the 5 notes of a law, these things fail. Not rational, exceeds authority of legislature, not for the common good, not promulgated insofar as the law is made unknowable by the average person"
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Old 01-10-2014, 11:41 AM
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So now my Crossman .17 pellet rifle will be illegal, because it's not orange or transparent. Brilliant.


If we could run appliances on stupid this state would be completely energy independant.....
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Old 01-13-2014, 11:43 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mjmagee67 View Post
More stupid laws from stupid people. Kalifornia's most abundant natural resourse is stupidity. If the libtard law makers are truly interested in public safety and protecting people they would work a reversing AB109.
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Old 01-13-2014, 11:47 AM
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100% Agree!
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Old 01-13-2014, 2:37 PM
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As a standalone, the 6 mm thing is ok.

But this would ban me from taking my pellet rifle to the range to practice with it. Or from taking it hunting. Or from taking it over to a friend's house. Or from sending it to the manufacturer for repair.

Yeah, no good is right. De Leon really has his head up his ***, he is so inept at writing these bills, it's a wonder he ever manages to accomplish anything at all.
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Old 01-13-2014, 3:51 PM
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What the **** is this moron even trying to accomplish?

Paintball guns are luckily exempt as long as their projectiles are over 10mm (no problem since the standard .68 caliber is 17mm), but banning airsoft, pellet guns, BB guns, etc. unless the entire body is bright orange, transparent, etc.??

Is this because of cops shooting at children with toy guns and murdering them? Shouldn't we, oh I don't know, train cops to not be so trigger happy and give little kids some benefit of the doubt? Train them to adapt the new tactic of shouting things like "stop" "freeze" or "put the gun down" BEFORE they open fire?
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Old 01-13-2014, 4:09 PM
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Turkey hunting in CA is legal with an airgun.

Imagine how close you can get to a Turkey with a Hot Pink and orange air gun.

§311. Methods Authorized for Taking Resident Small Game.
"f) Air rifles powered by compressed air or gas and used with any caliber of pellet, except that wild turkey may only be taken with a pellet that is at least 0.177 caliber."
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Old 01-13-2014, 4:12 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cdtx2001 View Post
Not enough criminals he says, well make new ones.
it is the point of almost if not all gun legislation make criminals instead of jailing the real ones.

Quote:
Originally Posted by mjmagee67 View Post
More stupid laws from stupid people. Kalifornia's most abundant natural resource is stupidity. If the libtard law makers are truly interested in public safety and protecting people they would work a reversing AB109.
the voters are no help either. they are just as dumb if not just as idiotic as the legislator they put there.
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Old 01-13-2014, 4:12 PM
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And now panic BB/pellet gun buying, and a run on that ammo!
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  #28  
Old 01-13-2014, 4:34 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MichaelKent View Post
What the **** is this moron even trying to accomplish?
...
Is this because of cops shooting at children with toy guns and murdering them? Shouldn't we, oh I don't know, train cops to not be so trigger happy and give little kids some benefit of the doubt? Train them to adapt the new tactic of shouting things like "stop" "freeze" or "put the gun down" BEFORE they open fire?
Yes, that's exactly right. It's co-sponsored by Noreen Evans who is the rep for Sonoma as a response to the Andy Lopez shooting in Sonoma County in October 2013. Be more effective as a piece of legislation if it called for the SCSO to be issued with orange airsoft guns instead of Glocks, mind you.
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Old 01-13-2014, 4:43 PM
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I can just see a 6month backorder on C02 and pellets starting this week....$1500 pellet guns that once cost $150....
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Old 01-13-2014, 4:47 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Best sale View Post
Didn't bother to read the whole crap by the way, but all I can see is a plot by these retards to make anything that resembles firearm a taboo to the coming generation .That way it will be very easy for them to erase 2A in the future.
Yep, that is the heart of this strategy. Get our kids to grow up denouncing firearms in any form, and enthusiastically relinquishing the 2A.
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Old 01-13-2014, 7:55 PM
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I have a pre-ban Crossman for sale. The highly sought after, ultra dangerous multi-pump model. With 1tin of pre-ban steel BBs. $3000. No low ballers.
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Old 01-13-2014, 9:09 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by njineermike View Post
I have a pre-ban Crossman for sale. The highly sought after, ultra dangerous multi-pump model. With 1tin of pre-ban steel BBs. $3000. No low ballers.
Nobody needs more than 10 pumps...
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Old 01-14-2014, 6:01 AM
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Originally Posted by mshill View Post
Someone from the Liberal Gun Club needs to visit this asshat and get him to stop the BS.
Go get em you boys, girls, and whatever's!
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Old 01-14-2014, 6:06 AM
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I know it's a little off subject.... but....

My daughter turned 8 today. She's getting her first rifle as a birthday gift.

Suck it anti-gun political retards!
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Old 01-14-2014, 6:07 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by chris View Post
it is the point of almost if not all gun legislation make criminals instead of jailing the real ones.
Criminals = Quality six figure government jobs with pensions! Who needs the industrial military complex when you have the equally lucrative CA industrial law enforcement complex?

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Old 01-14-2014, 6:10 AM
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Nobody needs more than 10 pumps...
7 pumps in NYC even though the rats are larger.
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Old 01-14-2014, 7:06 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MichaelKent View Post
What the **** is this moron even trying to accomplish?

Paintball guns are luckily exempt as long as their projectiles are over 10mm (no problem since the standard .68 caliber is 17mm), but banning airsoft, pellet guns, BB guns, etc. unless the entire body is bright orange, transparent, etc.??

Is this because of cops shooting at children with toy guns and murdering them? Shouldn't we, oh I don't know, train cops to not be so trigger happy and give little kids some benefit of the doubt? Train them to adapt the new tactic of shouting things like "stop" "freeze" or "put the gun down" BEFORE they open fire?
Yes this gives LEO a license to kill anyone with a toy gun. This merely codifies the existing mentality in California that any gun is evil, and anyone with a gun...anyone including a kid is a threat that needs to be taken down.
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Old 01-14-2014, 7:10 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Warrior King View Post
Yes this gives LEO a license to kill anyone with a toy gun. This merely codifies the existing mentality in California that any gun is evil, and anyone with a gun...anyone including a kid is a threat that needs to be taken down.
Don't forget "anything that even has the vague appearance of resembling a gun is bad and should be controlled by the all knowing benevolent big brother".
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Old 01-14-2014, 9:18 AM
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This is on the reddit page for airsoft.


Here's a list of senators along with phone numbers to call:
Loni Hancock * District: (510) 286-1333 * Capitol: 916 651 4009
Joel Anderson: * Phone: (916) 651-4036
El Cajon District Office * Phone: (619) 596-3136
Temecula District Office * Phone: 951-676-1020
Kevin de leon * Capitol Office: (916) 651-4022 * District Office: (213) 483-9300
Steve Knight * Capitol Office: (916) 651-4021
Carol Liu * Capitol Office: (916) 651-4025
Glendale District Office * Phone: (818) 409-0400
Satellite Office * Phone: (909) 599-7351
Holly Mitchell * Capitol Office: (916) 651-4026
Los Angeles Office * Phone: (213) 745-6656
Darrell Steinberg * Capitol Office: (916) 651-4006 * District Office: (916) 651-1529
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Where is this ammo "Black market" he speaks of? Do they have .223 in stock?
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Kevin de Leon, on minority women and profiling.
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  #40  
Old 01-14-2014, 10:01 AM
tamalpias tamalpias is offline
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Originally Posted by njineermike View Post
I have a pre-ban Crossman for sale. The highly sought after, ultra dangerous multi-pump model. With 1tin of pre-ban steel BBs. $3000. No low ballers.
Quote:
Originally Posted by malfunction View Post
Nobody needs more than 10 pumps...
that is comedy gold right there!
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