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Competition, Action Shooting And Training. Competition, Three gun, IPSC, IDPA , and Training discussion here.

View Poll Results: FAVORITE FIREARMS TRAINING OUTFITS IN SOCAL
Academi/U.S. Training Center/Blackwater 8 4.88%
Alias Training & Security Services 18 10.98%
Costa Ludus (Chris Costa) 18 10.98%
FOG (Falcon Operations Group) 46 28.05%
5 Arrows Tactical Training (Darren Harlow) 11 6.71%
ITTS (International Tactical Training Seminars) 24 14.63%
PTS (Phoenix Tactical Solutions) 18 10.98%
TAC-1 (Tactical Advanced Combat) 16 9.76%
TASC (The Academy of Saint Crispian / Stan Lee) 49 29.88%
TFTT (Tactical Firearms Training Team) 13 7.93%
TriCon (Trident Concepts Jeff Gonzales) 3 1.83%
WOTG (Way of the Gun Frank Proctor) 13 7.93%
Multiple Choice Poll. Voters: 164. You may not vote on this poll

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  #41  
Old 03-07-2013, 10:12 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by supernachos View Post
In the current *panic* climate, the cost of taking the trainig courses are relatively cheap compared to the cost of ammo needed to take the class. So looking at SMG's videos I would really like to venture out and take WOTG once ammo prices stabilize.
Good choice, man. Not sure when Frank will be back in SoCal but if you can swing it, try to make that Dreamshot 1 class in Alabama with Frank, Kyle Defoor and JD Potynsky. Considering that you'll have 3 bad dudes and discounted onsite ammo, it helps to offset travel costs. You'll see it further down the list in July.

http://wayofthegun.us/index.php/schedule-pricing

I'm moving around my work schedule to make this as are several SoCal alumni already signed up.
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  #42  
Old 03-08-2013, 3:41 PM
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Originally Posted by SuperSet View Post

... try to make that Dreamshot 1 class in Alabama with Frank, Kyle Defoor and JD Potynsky. Considering that you'll have 3 bad dudes and discounted onsite ammo, it helps to offset travel costs. You'll see it further down the list in July.

http://wayofthegun.us/index.php/schedule-pricing
Having trained with Frank Proctor, Kyle Defoor and JD Potynsky who are top notch instructors with a wealth applicable experiences operationally and as instructors to all types of students, I think this is an outstanding opportunity to train with all three over two days for $550. Hope they can make ammo available locally at the Alabama range.

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Estimated Round Count: 450 carbine / 1000 pistol. We are working to get a limited amount ammo for sale at the event but this is not yet locked. Plan on bringing your own ammunition. If this changes, we will update you.
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  #43  
Old 03-12-2013, 11:19 PM
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I've taken several classes with Phoenix Tactical Solutions, and I had outstanding experiences every time. Very safety-focused, friendly, and patient. Their low-light/night shooting class was awesome!
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  #44  
Old 03-18-2013, 5:40 PM
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FALCON!
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  #45  
Old 03-18-2013, 8:24 PM
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Smile Fastest improvement thanks to Phoenix Tactical Sloutions

I would like to suggest to anyone planning to take Defensive Tactical courses ; try Phoenix Tactical Sloutions. I can truly say that within 4 Handgun Courses I was training next to some Experienced shooters attending their first PTS handgun course and I did held my ground during Firing Drills thanks to good fundamentals and result oriented instructions by PTS.Total attention to Students, small classes with great students, amazing instructions and with real world feel to all drills. My accuracy improved 100%, with tight groupings up to 25 yards. I know that I still have a lot to learn but already have the confidence to shoot accurately in real world scenario drills something that I had not achieved in 8 years of Range shooting or attending other Tactical shooting Schools.
Absolutely the best Shooting instructions and experience with Phoenix Tactical solutions.
Thank you

Last edited by buckwildpow; 03-19-2013 at 7:33 PM..
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  #46  
Old 03-21-2013, 2:25 PM
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I've done a couple classes with PTS, and they're awesome. Small instructor:student ratios, hands-on instruction, curriculum that continually adjusts itself to where the students are actually at (not just moving on to the next thing with half the class still struggling to learn the last three things). Maani's a great mix of kicking your @$$ when you need it but stopping to point out that gee, 9/10 in the heart at 35 yards--while still not good enough to stop training!!!--is still 9 out of 10 in the heart at 35 yards. :P

I also love that he videotapes half the classes. I learned a lot just going home and watching my own video....noticed things visually I would have never noticed otherwise.

All in all, great guy, great instructors, great class, and I can't wait till I can load some more ammo and hit up another one.
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  #47  
Old 04-14-2013, 2:54 AM
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Another vote for Stan (TASC), i've taken several classes from him. Incredibly nice guy, very skilled, very patient and i always learn so much from him.
we are very fortunate to have him. Worth the drive from San Diego
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  #48  
Old 04-14-2013, 1:43 PM
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I'd like to give a shout out to the following:

TJ Johnston at Allsafe Defense in Orange, CA. Great instructor and NRA advocate. He is who made me an NRA certified instructor.

Maani at Phoenix Tactical. Very nice guy and fellow Angeles Shooting Range instructor. There are plenty of schools/trainers at Angeles but he is the only other one I would recommend.

Dan and Chad at Tac-1; after sneaking in to my class I discovered their true identities as crime fighters. Good dudes and great shooters yet with the humility to say, "if you stop learning from others you are no good..."

Lastly, I'm happy just to be on the list after less than two years teaching in the civilian community.
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Last edited by Stan08; 12-25-2013 at 7:55 AM.. Reason: Change hubris to humility. Wrong choice of word.
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  #49  
Old 04-15-2013, 10:04 AM
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Thank you for your kind words Stan. It's always a pleasure seeing you at the range. Your students think highly of you...that speaks volumes about your character and skills as an instructor. I hereby recommend Stan as well!

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Originally Posted by Stan08 View Post
I'd like to give a shout out to the following:

TJ Johnston at Allsafe Defense in Orange, CA. Great instructor and NRA advocate. He is who made me an NRA certified instructor.

Maani at Phoenix Tactical. Very nice guy and fellow Angeles Shooting Range instructor. There are plenty of schools/trainers at Angeles but he is the only other one I would recommend.

Dan and Chad at Tac-1; after sneaking in to my class I discovered their true identities as crime fighters. Good dudes and great shooters yet with the hubris to say, "if you stop learning from others you are no good..."

Lastly, I'm happy just to be on the list after less than two years teaching in the civilian community.
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  #50  
Old 05-17-2013, 9:25 AM
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I recently found out that Ares Armor provides training as well.These guys are all MARSOC guys and I thought I would put a link to their training here since I didn't know until I visited their store in Oceanside. I plan to take their courses in the fall when I have time.


Training -Ares Armor
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  #51  
Old 05-20-2013, 5:02 PM
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Another outfit I've heard good things about since late last year is Aegis Academy.

They're in Pala which is north San Diego County. Hope to check them out in the Fall.
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  #52  
Old 07-28-2013, 11:12 PM
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since it might be easier to ask here from those that have taken classes from all of these training outfits,

for all their pistol 101 level classes, do they allow .22lr pistols? as i do have way more .22lr ammo than 9mm ammo at this moment and for foreseeable future. and i know most training classes require at minimum 200 rounds and more.
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Because -ohmigosh- they can add their opinions, too?
Proof we can all comment on whatever we want no matter the topic at hand!
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  #53  
Old 07-28-2013, 11:53 PM
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Originally Posted by Scratch705 View Post
since it might be easier to ask here from those that have taken classes from all of these training outfits,

for all their pistol 101 level classes, do they allow .22lr pistols? as i do have way more .22lr ammo than 9mm ammo at this moment and for foreseeable future. and i know most training classes require at minimum 200 rounds and more.
Seriously, right now, things are so fluid you'd best ask each outfit individually...
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  #54  
Old 07-29-2013, 7:54 AM
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Originally Posted by Scratch705 View Post
since it might be easier to ask here from those that have taken classes from all of these training outfits,

for all their pistol 101 level classes, do they allow .22lr pistols? as i do have way more .22lr ammo than 9mm ammo at this moment and for foreseeable future. and i know most training classes require at minimum 200 rounds and more.
I know for sure Civilian Arms Training allow's 22lr for both their pistol and rifle class. I have shot their level 1 and 2 pistol class with a 22 and when I was talking to them about the level 1 rifle class they even told me they have students come with 10/22's. Yeah reloading is a bit different with a 10/22 vs. AR but the fundamentals are still the same.
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  #55  
Old 07-29-2013, 8:52 AM
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It really boils down to what your training goals are.

If you want to learn Safety, Gun handling and basic marksmanship, most any of the "reputable" outfits in SoCal will do.

If you want to learn Hi Speed ninja special Ops wannabe gijoe stuff then go to the places that are staffed by ex Spec Ops guys.

If you want to learn something you can actually use like competition shooting 3 Gun, USPSA etc. Look for someone who have lots of experience and holds a GM ranking or national titles etc..Frank Proctor, Bob Vogel, Rob Leatham the list goes on...

If you want to learn how to do dangerous things:
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  #56  
Old 08-18-2013, 7:40 PM
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Darren Harlow's Home Defense training at 5ArrowsTactical.com in San Dimas - Post Training Review: It was everything I was hoping for. My wife and I opted for a private session since I've only been shooting for 6 months and she had never touched a firearm in her life and has been anti-guns her whole life. I can honestly say that she is a believer now and had so much fun and felt very safe and at ease while in the training. She may want to get her own pistol now. Hahaha

Our private sessions consisted first of a 3 hour class session to learn about firearms safety and the Do's and Don'ts, proper grip, proper stance, cleaning and disassembly of our firearms, personal Home Defense plans for our family, and much more. Then a 3 hour hands on session at the range to apply everything we learned and to perform drills for Home Defense shooting with my Shotgun and Pistol. Darren had a set plan but would adjust as we wanted more or less focus on any specific area. He was patient with my wife was able to introduce her to our firearms at a perfect pace.

I highly recommend his group sessions or private sessions for anyone who's interested in Home Defense training.
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  #57  
Old 11-02-2013, 5:57 PM
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Default Phoenix Tactical Solutions

I've recently started taking classes with Phoenix Tactical Solutions and I would highly recommend them. Within the last few months I have seen my skills dramatically improve. I have also noticed this with other students who I have taken multiple courses with. That's pretty much exactly what you're looking for when you take training and it's a testament that the way they conduct their training works. I think the main reasons that these courses helped me improve so much are the following:

1) Maani and Sean are both very skilled and knowledgeable instructors. They have an incredible attention to detail and relentless drive to make their students better.
2) The instructor/student ratio that they maintain allows them to closely monitor everything that students are doing and will point out anything that is incorrect before it becomes engrained as a "training scar".
3) The training is very flexible and tailored to the students in the class. This allows the students to progress at a much faster pace than in classes that are rigidly structured. It also keeps students more engaged in the class.
4) They teach the latest and most relevant tactics and they explain why things are done certain ways which helps the material sink in better.

Aside from making you a better shooter the classes are fun, reasonable priced, and convenient. Definitely worth considering them if you're looking for firearms training.
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  #58  
Old 11-03-2013, 5:43 AM
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I voted for Phoenix Tactical Solutions because the student to teacher ratio is very low. They stress the fundamentals and insist on safety protocols. They are a great bunch of instructors that are friendly and take the time to teach you individually and as a group. The class prices are extremely reasonable as well.
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  #59  
Old 02-18-2014, 11:31 AM
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I have just taken a beginning pistol class with one of the more popular schools listed in a poll in this forum. I took that beginning class even though I could have easily "tested/qualified" for one of the schools more advanced offerings out the gate because I wanted to see/evaluate the instructors teaching style and approach to the basics and safety. The basics ARE the basics and there is very little variation on that theme. Additionally, safety protocols are PARAMOUNT in a beginning class when the instructor/school should be evaluating each student first and foremost on safety concepts adhered to. I have to admit I was suprised that the evening beginning pistol class, with several students who had never fired a weapon before, was held in darkness under the head lights of two vehicles. I feel that it was an difficult environment for the instructor to observe student weapons manipulation and mantain control and safety during live fire on the shooting line. I would not take a class like this in the darkness again. \

I admit I do not know if the intructor had a lighted range reserved and was changed at the last minute by the range staff or not.

Last edited by Ronin2; 02-21-2014 at 9:53 AM..
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  #60  
Old 02-18-2014, 2:11 PM
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Originally Posted by Ronin2 View Post
I have to admit, sadly, that I was VERY disappointed both in the safety protocols, teaching style and dissemination of information. I was the only person there, instructor included, wearing body armor which for a number of reasons both class specific and in principle, should always be worn IMHO.
Safety is extremely important. I've seen a few people shoot themselves in classes and matches. Very unpleasant and a reminder about how quickly things can go bad.
Outside of that, what were you hoping to pick up from the class?
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  #61  
Old 02-18-2014, 5:25 PM
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Originally Posted by Ronin2 View Post
I have to admit, sadly, that I was VERY disappointed both in the safety protocols, teaching style and dissemination of information.
It's clear to me who you're talking about but setting that aside please explain in more detail the three areas of deficiencies: safety protocols, teaching style and dissemination of information in terms of your expectations and glaring shortcomings.

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There is always something to pick up.. either something "to do" or "not to do" that is new.
Did you pick up anything useful in terms of things to do or not?
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Last edited by ramzar; 02-18-2014 at 5:28 PM..
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  #62  
Old 02-18-2014, 5:50 PM
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If you feel this outfit is that unsafe, perhaps naming them might prevent others from a potentially bad day.
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  #63  
Old 02-18-2014, 7:20 PM
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Originally Posted by Ronin2 View Post
I have just taken a beginning pistol class with one of the more popular schools listed in a poll in this forum..
Greetings Steve,

I wish you had brought this to my attention first but I'm sorry you did not enjoy the class and thought that it was unsafe.

This is the very first public mud sling I have had in over three years of business which is a little surprising anyways.

As far as safety protocols I did and always mention the following in all live fire classes:

4 Weapons Safety Rules:
1. Treat every weapon as if it were loaded
2. Do not point your weapon at anything you do not intend to shoot
3. Keep your finger straight and off the trigger until you are ready to fire
4. Keep weapon on safe until you intend to fire
*Know your target and backstop
**1 meter safety circle
***Unholstering etiquette: face either downrange or towards the berm
****Self Time Out: No shame
*****Work bench 90 deg from downrange
******Everyone is a safety officer: shared responsibility
*******First Aid & Casualty evacuation plan (GSW demonstration of pressure bandage, quik clot, CAT tourniquet and MEDEVAC plan. Designated ambulance with car keys in ignition with yahoo map of Olive View UCLA on dashboard.

Additional safety prac app of yelling at each other for safety concerns.

I remember vividly that night of constant line checks, segregation of experienced vs inexperienced students and more.

I have had ZERO casualties from accidental/negligent GSWs as Saint Crispian LLC or during my time in uniform which not everyone in the SoCal (and even Angeles Shooting Range affiliated) training schools can claim. Not one single errant shot to the leg, hand or demo vehicle. None.

I'm wondering why you stayed until the very end if you felt unsafe, I would not have if so. Anyways, I will offer you a refund (minus paypal fees) since you were not satisfied, just let me know.

Sincerely,

Stan
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Last edited by Stan08; 02-18-2014 at 7:55 PM..
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  #64  
Old 02-18-2014, 10:30 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ronin2 View Post
...safety protocols are PARAMOUNT in a beginning class when the instructor/school should be evaluating each student first and foremost on safety concepts adhered to. I have to admit, sadly, that I was VERY disappointed both in the safety protocols, teaching style and dissemination of information. I was the only person there, instructor included, wearing body armor which for a number of reasons both class specific and in principle, should always be worn IMHO.

This instructor promotes his military background (one of the reasons I choose this school) extensively and it is now clear to me that just because someone has, in the words of Col. Jeff Cooper, "seen the elephant" (been deployed to the sandbox/maybe seen combat) and survived, in no way means he can effectively "teach" that skill set to others.
...
You aren't very specific what isn't safe or exactly what happened.


If you are talking about TASC, its probably the safest classes I have taken and recommended many others including my girlfriend.

If you did run into something unsafe, everyone is a range officer, and the instructor had you guys practice calling it out, not sure why you didn't call it out if it was so unsafe? or stayed? The instructor also recommended time out if you wish to step out for any reasons.

Also the numerous positive reviews on yelp and calguns reflects the level of safety, professionalism, and excellent course material.
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  #65  
Old 02-18-2014, 11:24 PM
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I have taken multiple courses from each of the following:

Alias Training- They offer the best training by far. I have trained with Kyle Defoor, Pat McNamara, and John McPhee.

ITTS-I have taken multiple pistol,shotgun, and carbine classes from Uncle Scotty. He offers the best training based out of SoCal. ITTS has excellent facilities with unique capabilities and also has an extremely experienced training cadre.

FOG- I have taken multiple courses with Voodoo and Hollywood. They are good dudes and excellent teachers.

Mossie Tactics-Buck Mossie is an excellent instructor. I have trained pistol and shotgun with him.

TFTT-I have only taken pistol classes from Max Joseph. He offers a very organized and structured training program and I hope to take more courses from him.

FTA-I have taken pistol, shotgun, and carbine courses from FTA. All of the classes were billed as "Advanced" courses but in reality they were intermediate at best. Bill Murphy is a cool guy and has some good facilities so I think his courses are worth checking out.

I noticed that ADE was missing from the poll and for good reasons. I do believe that one of the schools in the poll has instructors that got into the business while working for ADE...something to think about.
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  #66  
Old 02-18-2014, 11:27 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ronin2 View Post
...
I was the only person there, instructor included, wearing body armor which for a number of reasons both class specific and in principle, should always be worn IMHO..
Seriously Ronin2, other than TFTT, how many other firearm training outfits have you attended that mandated body armor to be worn by all students?

Look at all the course equipment requirements by all the other firearm training institutions in the list. If you went totally by your safety protocol standard , then most of the training outfits on the list is a Safety Protocol Failure ( spells SPF ... figure that )!

Are you then in the opinion that they are all unsafe and should be avoided, is that then, a true statement?!

In regards to proper safety protocol for firearms training and the use body armor, I couldn't find a legit reference on Google. If you can point me to the right direction that would be great...
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  #67  
Old 02-19-2014, 5:26 AM
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5 Arrows all the way!
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  #68  
Old 02-19-2014, 8:49 AM
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Originally Posted by Ronin2 View Post
A class of new/first time shooters IN THE DARK?

How many of you think that it was safe or prudent to stage a level 1/beginners handgun class in the dark? With a 9 to 1 new shooter to instructor ratio? IN THE DARK?

It was MY suggestion as we were all walking into postion at the line, when Stan didn't request it, that the students who had never handled a gun before (three or four I believe) should be grouped together at one end of the line for obvious reasons. Without myself or another student in my absence, volunteering to add a second vehicles headlights to the available light, the range would have been illuminated only by the headlights of Stan's car. Then to my amazement, when the class was off the line loading magazines and adjusting gear etc, Stan shut off his car and its headlights. I left my car idling the entire class to provide some light. Without my car's headlights, 8 beginning shooters would have been fumbling around in the dark with condition 1 weapons their holsters (two other students besides myself had a personal flashlight). Stan had no extra lights for anyone.

I admit I knew the class was going to be operating after dark, the stated class hours were 1700 to 2100 hrs. I had never been to a class with Stan and I mistakenly assumed the range, which I had never been to after dark, would be lit up for the class.
A level 1 class for rookie shooters in the dark? That doesn't make sense nor sound safe!
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  #69  
Old 02-19-2014, 11:17 AM
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5 Arrows gets my money
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Old 02-19-2014, 11:37 AM
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This is really a general response but...

I've taken a lot of classes and the one thing I know that I am not is an expert on training. There is a lot going on under the hood that I have come to find out while talking shop on the side with some of the instructors. Some things some instructors can do while others try to get away with it. But again being exposed to how little I know about how to train people I would say that is an opinion of mine but I hope a insightful one.

One thing however that seems to stick and never go wrong though is this.

Certain instructors draw certain types of people and you can get a pretty good ballpark of the quality and type of training offered by the nature of their students. Cobra Kai is Cobra Kai... Amway is Amway... If I were brand spanking new and wondering how to judge a training outfit, I would look at the fruit as you shall know the tree by them.
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Old 02-19-2014, 2:25 PM
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If I felt unsafe, for any reason, I would bring it to the trainer's attention. If that didn't satisfy me, I would leave. You didn't say that you left, which makes me think you stayed for the entirety of the class, which begs the question, in my mind, did you really feel unsafe or are you just taking some cheap shots? Also, if you honestly felt the class was unsafe, why would you need the instructor to give you a form to fill out in order to say just that? Did you not have the instructor's phone number and email, if you were somehow unable or unwilling to voice your concerns in person? I think I would be more pro-active than that.
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Old 02-19-2014, 3:56 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GM_77 View Post
...
Certain instructors draw certain types of people and you can get a pretty good ballpark of the quality and type of training offered by the nature of their students. Cobra Kai is Cobra Kai... Amway is Amway... If I were brand spanking new and wondering how to judge a training outfit, I would look at the fruit as you shall know the tree by them.

"Cobra Kai" , that is a some cool, 1980's generational shyet (which kid's nowadays be probably scratching their heads at its meaning). Cobra Kai, so profound and the inference was not lost on me in this case... well done!!!

"If I were brand spanking new and wondering how to judge a training outfit, I would look at the fruit as you shall know the tree by them."

I like that as well, well done... (you're not Mr. Miyagi are you ?! )

Last edited by supernachos; 02-19-2014 at 6:33 PM..
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Old 02-19-2014, 4:25 PM
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Default TASC class Feb 8

Hi, I was also at the TASC class Feb 8. While it's true that the reduced lighting made things a bit more challenging, I saw no evidence of any safety breaches, and I was watching for them. Stan spent a lot of time going over the basics of safe gun handling. He also took a considerable amount of time to demonstrate the use of pressure bandages, tourniquets and hemastatic clotting agents. I came away impressed with 2 things. 1) Stan's a very good and patient instructor. 2) I have a LOT of bad habits to break. I've been practicing what he showed us and have already noticed a substantial improvement in my techniques. I intend to take additional classes at TASC.
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Old 02-19-2014, 7:56 PM
AMIEVIL05 AMIEVIL05 is offline
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I was also at the TASC class Feb 8. Like it was said in prior posts, lighting did make it more challenging but I knew this prior to going to the class ie; time and range. Stan was very thorough on safe handling of the firearm,if there was an medical emergency, evacuation plans, stopping bleeding etc.The recent post of 8 new shooters is incorrect. I believe there was 3 who have never operated a firearm.I think Ronin2 was under the assumption that since it was a 101 class that everyone was new. It is also a refresher class. Stan was very patient with all of us and I never felt my safety was in jeopardy.I felt during the class, Ronin2 would over speak the instructor which I thought was rude. Stan runs a good, safe class and I walked away with more knowledge than I came with. I will be attending more TASC classes in the future.
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Old 02-19-2014, 8:17 PM
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Just for the record, in the last few minutes, Stan refunded my class tuition despite my rejection of his earlier offer to do so. While I appreciate the thought, I was there for the class, I assume Stan had to pay the range something for my presence and I feel that a refund was not needed or justified.

As I have said, I liked Stan and have no doubt he is a stand up guy. Thank you Stan but it was not nessisary.

Cheers.
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Old 02-19-2014, 8:17 PM
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Default Tuition refunded

Paypal refund 40527279HW2982XXX for the St. Crispian Pistol 101 class (8 February) issued to Stephen F. on 19 February at 2100 for $100USD.

Principle is more important to me than profit and I will not keep the money of a dissatisfied customer.
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Old 02-19-2014, 10:46 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ronin2 View Post
Additionally, I was wearing level III BALCS armor and very aware of what to look for having successfully taken several low light / night handgun classes.
Even though your post had many valid points, I found your repeated statements about wearing body armor a little chest-thumping. How many beginners do you know who would buy a Level III+ armor for their first intro to firearms class? (especially considering that many don't return for any instruction after their first class). Sounds like you went into this class with wrong expectations.
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Old 02-20-2014, 6:51 AM
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5 Arrows is by far the best company I have trained with Darren is a down to earth no bull leave your ego at the car kind of guy
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Old 02-20-2014, 8:00 AM
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Thumbs up

5 Arrows is by far the best company I have trained with Darren is a down to earth no bull leave your ego at the car kind of guy
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Old 02-20-2014, 8:35 AM
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I've taken the carbine 101/202 from Stan. First rate instruction - always thought he was safe. My wife took the carbine 101 class at night and didn't feel it was unsafe either. She had taken the Pistol 101/202 from Stan as well and has nothing but good things to say about him. I plan on taking Stan's low light course next time it is offered.

I recently took a 2 day IDPA course from Bob Vogel, and 2 guys were out of their element. Bob immediately refunded their money and apologized that the skill level required wasn't communicated properly. If you are into IDPA/IPSC, I cannot recommend Bob Vogel highly enough. He doesn't do regular classes, but if you get the opportunity don't pass it up to take one of his classes if you shoot IDPA/IPSC.

I took a pistol II class from Tac-1 and I think their curriculum could use some tweaking (and I mentioned this to them in their critique session after the class). Some of the drills they did (for instance - the drawing from right holster with left hand), should have been done a few times dry fire first. There's nothing like getting muzzle swept by the guy next to you because of the awkwardness of the drill with a loaded 1911. I may re-visit them at some time. It's good to mix up the instruction, but sometimes I feel they are "overpromoted". They have good polish in their marketing, but it just feels like a lot of hype sometimes. The quality of instruction is good though, but there was a lot of downtime (anecdotes, stories). I prefer more time on the line.

Last edited by Kodemonkey; 02-20-2014 at 8:43 AM..
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