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California 2nd Amend. Political Discussion & Activism Discuss gun rights activism and 2A related political topics here. All advice given is NOT legal counsel.

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  #1  
Old 01-23-2013, 6:18 PM
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Default 2013 Fed S 150 Feinstein - AW ban TEXT NOW AVAILABLE

http://thomas.loc.gov/cgi-bin/bdquery/z?d113:s150:

Be aware that the actual language of the bill will not be available via official sources (Government Printing Office) for a day or so.

Legislative bodies do not consider "press releases". They do not assign press releases to committees, amend them, debate them, vote on them, nor do they send press releases on the next legislative house. Calguns will follow the lead of the legislative bodies and encourage serious discussion of actual bills.
A reminder: comments that have a content that means only 'oh, this is terrible!' add nothing to the discussion. One may safely presume that would be the default position of more than 90% of Calguns members.
Comments that are merely an insult to the Senator and any co-sponsors should be sent directly to her contact page, https://www.feinstein.senate.gov/pub....cfm/e-mail-me - or, better, withheld entirely.
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Not a lawyer, just Some Guy On The Interwebs.

Heller was 2008. McDonald was 2010. Things started getting bad with GCA-1968.
It takes time to unwind 40 years of bad law.

Last edited by Librarian; 02-04-2013 at 6:03 PM..
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Old 01-23-2013, 6:19 PM
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Now, please stop making new DiFi AW Ban threads.
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Heller was 2008. McDonald was 2010. Things started getting bad with GCA-1968.
It takes time to unwind 40 years of bad law.
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Old 01-24-2013, 9:58 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by defcon View Post
xxxxxxxxxxx and xxxxxxxxxx are safe
Please do not be lulled into a false sense of security.

NOTHING IS SAFE WHILE CONGRESS IS IN SESSION.

Dianne or any other Senator can amend the bill at any time before it becomes law.

WE NEED TO FIGHT FOR ALL OF OUR RIGHTS, EVEN IF YOUR GUN IS NOT ON THIS LIST.
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Old 01-24-2013, 10:09 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by D.M.C. View Post
It'll never pass. Just all hot air and bluster for the dog and pony show.
I remember people saying the same thing in 1994.
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Old 01-24-2013, 10:31 AM
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Originally Posted by halo66 View Post
Agreed...is this a joke???????
Watch the video, and ask yourself if this Senator is joking or not.
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Old 01-24-2013, 11:01 AM
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NRA response:

http://www.nraila.org/news-issues/ne...aspx?s=&st=&ps
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Old 01-24-2013, 11:11 AM
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Originally Posted by CHIEFone View Post
heard from where?
http://freebeacon.com/feinstein-the-...ons-over-time/
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Old 01-24-2013, 12:12 PM
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I count at least 6 senate democrats who are up for re-election in 2014 in very pro-gun states. Possibly 10 if I stretch it a bit.

The democrats have a choice to make. Pass the ban, or retain their senate majority. Even with the new filibuster rules, they need 60 votes to invoke cloture. Write your senators and representatives anyway. Tell them to straighten up and fly right.
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Old 01-24-2013, 12:57 PM
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I very rarely post, especially in the political side of the forum, but feel compelled to now.

One reason I rarely post here is that I would be just preaching to the choir. Unfortunately, the choir has seen more and more people just humming their own little tune.

We need to get back onto the same sheet of music: We are against any and all such legislation.

Don't be afraid to preach to the choir; that's how you get them to sing!

And don't be surprised by the inclusion of 22lr; they are setting precedent for future grabs.

I also see too many taking the same approach that LEO's are forced to---- doing their best to clean up after the crime was committed and file their reports on the dead bodies.

We know that they would like to -stop- the crime from occurring in first place. That's what we need to do now.

We cannot wait to see what we will do to exercise our rights under a new bill, or try to figure out how to fight it in court after its passage. We need to stop it from happening in the first place, and THEN BE READY to transition to a post passage fight.

Planning only a counter-attack means you're planning to be the first to lose. We need to be involved in -all- aspects of this battle; defensive fortifications, attack -and- counterattack. Only then can we hope for success.

We -are- on the defensive right now, meaning that we are on the wrong foot. But quietly hoping for the best will allow the worst. Remember, it's the loud, misguided, and oppressive few that are gaining ground.

Don't agree with past and upcoming rallies? That fine; contribute to the NRA-ILA. Disagree with the NRA? That's fine; join the GOA. There are options. The best being to take multiple approaches.

Just as long as you do saddle-up.

p.s. This not an attack on those of you who are obviously joking in this thread; just trying to do my part to get you all to sing.
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  #10  
Old 01-24-2013, 1:16 PM
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Some of you are falling for the "shell game" being played by Feinstein here. You are making the mistake of thinking that because some (Kel-Tec SU16CA, Ruger Mini-14 Ranch Rifle, etc.) are not mentioned by name, that they are not banned elsewhere by feature or by the simple fact that they are semi-automatic.

There is no cause for celebration here, nor any collective sigh of relief.
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  #11  
Old 01-24-2013, 1:20 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by glock_this View Post
Scary scary stuff. I have an extra few pryers to say tonight before bedtime.

But all you tin foil hat guys need to chill out with the angry garbage posts about not posting models here that are not listed. If you think that matters, your just being overly dramatic. You can't possibly think they don't have methods for figuring that out that go way beyond the simple review of an internet forum? Please, get your heads out of the sand.
Well I object to your objection about my complaints!

Even if (big if) it doesn't hurt us, tell me, what purpose could it possibly serve to list make and models not included in any of these bills? Only to pat ourselves on the back and say "at least mine are safe, this time". Moderators and activists have asked not to do it, most posters agree. The risk is greater than the reward. Not that hard of a concept to figure out bud. But you go be the rebel that you are.
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  #12  
Old 01-24-2013, 2:30 PM
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Originally Posted by baffomet View Post
The only problem is that our senators are Feinstein herself and Boxer, who will definitely vote for it.
I know its wasted effort (it made me feel a bit better), but I sent an email to DiFi to show my distaste.

Dear Senator Feinstein,

Today I watched as you unveiled your attempt to once again restrict the rights of me and my fellow Americans.

As a hunter and sportsman I am offended by the comment that no one is trying to take my guns; the fact of the matter is that is EXACTLY what you are trying to accomplish. Even if you don’t take away my guns, you will have effectively taken them from future generations.

As a father I am saddened that by outlawing the transfer of your listed firearms, my daughter will never be able to receive her rightful inheritance and those firearms that should be rightfully hers will be seized and melted down by the government.

As a citizen of this country, I am concerned that the government that is supposed to represent me feels the need to either disarm me or treat me as a criminal.

As a veteran of a foreign war (Operation Desert Shield/Storm), I find it incredible that the elected representative from my state can attack the founding document of this nation with impunity and with no regard for what the veterans of this nation have fought to protect.

In short, Senator Feinstein, I am disgusted that you would stand on the graves of innocent children in an attempt to push through your personal agenda. This is not about preventing homicides as the firearms you have chosen to ban account for less than three percent of the weapons used in homicides (per 2011 FBI statistics). Rather this is about taking the first step towards total disarmament of the citizens of this nation.

As Ben Franklin so aptly said, “They who can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety, deserve neither liberty nor safety.”

-Xxxx Xxxxx
A veteran and voter in the State of California


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  #13  
Old 01-24-2013, 2:48 PM
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It is definately a far flung attempt at gun grabbing. We still must fight it even if there isnt a chance it will pass. Someone mentioned that it is more about shifting the baseline on what is acceptable. The more crap they throw in there, the better the chance they can pass something less reaching down the road. They will be seen as 'reaching across the aisle' as a compromsie.
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  #14  
Old 01-24-2013, 2:58 PM
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This is a response letter I recieved from Assemblywoman Beth Gaines:

Dear Sir,

Thank you for contacting my office regarding your concerns about overbearing gun control legislation as a result of the recent shootings in the U.S.

I agree with you and I will continue to support our constitutional right to own firearms.

Thank you again, for contacting my office and fighting for the 2nd Amendment.

Best regards,



BETH GAINES

Assemblywoman, 6th District
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  #15  
Old 01-24-2013, 2:59 PM
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Start contacing your reps now. Here is a link to find them:

http://whoismyrepresentative.com/
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Old 01-24-2013, 4:06 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Waffleobill View Post
DiFei knows the bill wont pass as is, it's her starting point for negotiations with the conservative law makers.
The GOP doesn't negotiate, it capitulates. That's why they agreed to raise taxes without reducing spending. They think that giving up something that's less than what the other side wants, without getting anything in return, is a "negotiation".
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Old 01-24-2013, 5:17 PM
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People need to stop reading through the lists, it does not matter what is included and what is not. I do not care which of my firearms are affected or if I could modify them to meet the new criteria. I dont care if were able to knock off half of the list of even the one characteristic test, I will not stand for any part of this bill passing in any form. WE need to strike this one down and then start working on removing the bad laws already in place.
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Old 01-24-2013, 5:45 PM
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Originally Posted by Ironmany2k View Post
Spot on. This is just the starting point. Now the so called "compromise" will begin. If anything passes we lose!

No Compromise.
QFT!

Instruct your Senators and Reps to refuse to compromise. Kill this thing in its current form!

Tim
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Old 01-24-2013, 6:47 PM
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I'm waiting for the final text, but I've already spotted a fatal flaw.
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Old 01-24-2013, 6:52 PM
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Put your long pants on gentlemen, this one is going to get ugly. For those of you who think this thing is dead in the water, dream on. There is no compromise on either side of this so we must defeat this. Losing this battle means too much.
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  #21  
Old 01-24-2013, 8:55 PM
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People keep saying it's not going to pass because we understand math and politics. Anyone who thought it couldn't pass in 1994 did not understand math or politics. When the 1994 AWB was passed there were 258 Democrats and 176 Republicans in the US House. Of the Democrats, 188 voted for the AWB, and and 64 voted against. On the Republican side 46 voted For the ban, and 131 voted against.

That's about 25% defection from each party's stand. It is logical to assume that similar percentages would not vote with the party this time- Yes, The climate in the country towards gun rights is very ugly right now, but it was very ugly in 1994 as well. There had been a number of mass murders by way of shooting in the prior couple years, including what up to that point was the deadliest shooting spree in US history in a fast food establishment in Kileen, TX, as well as The infamous Long Island Railroad murder spree. There was also a school shooting in 1989 in Stockton, CA which killed 6, and was the impetus for the CA AWB which was what the Federal AWB was based on and inspired by. Emotions were running high then too.

There are a lot of similarities between then and now, and a few very important differences.

242 Republicans and 190 Democrats currently serve in the US House. It is likely that NRA membership is roughly double what it was in 1994- the only statistics I can find on this is that Membership has tripled since 1978, which was 16 years before the 1994 AWB. It has been 19 years since 1994, so it is likely that more than half of that growth has been since 1994. Regardless of the specific stats, it is obvious that the NRA is a much more powerful political force than it was in '94. The NRA grades members of congress, and the grades have skyrocketed since the 90's because politicians know how powerful the NRA is, so they have fallen in line. See: http://votesmart.org/interest-group/...2#.UQIMZo5MY20 (then) and http://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2...itics/nra.html (now).

Obviously it is important for us to not retreat now. I have written my representatives, and certainly encourage everyone to do the same. I just feel the frenzy of panic engulfing this site and our culture is not justified, and does not really do any good for us as gun owners, or the industry as a whole. Yes, the manufacturers are reaping massive profits right now. Gun shops did quite well for a while, but the consumers are paying for it, and the distributers and retailers across the country are going to have a very hard time continuing to do business if they have no product to sell, which seems to be the current situation.

If we could all just try to be rational and put our efforts into political action instead of overpaying for guns and ammo that will likely be much easier to come by and cheaper in a few months, I believe it would serve us all well.
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Old 01-24-2013, 9:21 PM
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The way I see it ...If we gun owners don't get organized and fight this with every thing we have ....we will be sorry....
So please someone get a plan coming and lets do it....
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Old 01-24-2013, 9:29 PM
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We need to stop letting psychotic 80 year women make the rules.
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  #24  
Old 01-24-2013, 10:21 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pgg View Post
QFT

If only people understood that a $200 donation would do FAR more to preserve their gun rights than panic-buying $2000 worth of magazines/ammo/guns at a 300%+ markup.
This.

Also, try going to town-hall meetings, write letters, call people.. Be the change you want to see.

Want people to think gun owners are "normal" Be "normal".. Gun rights aren't partisan; constantly attacking democrats, while ignoring the fact that there's a lot of republicans that are also useless when it comes to the 2nd, isn't useful.

The message needs to be that the 2nd is about civil rights. It's NOT about partisan politics.

But, talk to people. Invite them to the range. Educate them. That's how you win.
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Old 01-24-2013, 11:07 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Librarian View Post
Here's a new thread with the correct title form.

As is very well known, the actual bill has been announced to be submitted Thursday, Jan 24, 2013.

I'll update 'nnn' to the actual bill number and the first post will have a link to the bill status at Thomas or someplace official.

I'll add the correct link to the bill to this post; please feel free to reply to this thread with that link.

Be aware that the actual language of the bill will not be available via official sources (Government Printing Office) for a day or so.

Legislative bodies do not consider "press releases". They do not assign press releases to committees, amend them, debate them, vote on them, nor do they send press releases on the next legislative house. Calguns will follow the lead of the legislative bodies and encourage serious discussion of actual bills.
A reminder: comments that have a content that means only 'oh, this is terrible!' add nothing to the discussion. One may safely presume that would be the default position of more than 90% of Calguns members.
Comments that are merely an insult to the Senator and any co-sponsors should be sent directly to her contact page, https://www.feinstein.senate.gov/pub....cfm/e-mail-me - or, better, withheld entirely.
My concern as every one in California, is if this poisonous bill passes the way it is wrote would have a complete impact on curently A-R 15 CA compliant rifles. If you decide to follow communist law and register they will at that time not approve (based on California law conflictinf with Federal Law) and confiscate your rifle!!! Now you know why Senator Yee is holding back as he knows this is their game plan for California if it passes!!! Please correct me if I am wrong as I would much rather be wrong.
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Old 01-25-2013, 3:24 AM
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So, will Obama, Feinstein, and the rest of these people be held responsible after the next mass shooting that they will directly failed to prevent?

I'd say anyone who removes rights, fails to place armed guards in schools, fails to abolish gun-free zones, and otherwise fails to act accordingly from a position of power is guilty of contributing to the next shooting deaths we have in a major mass shooting.
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Old 01-25-2013, 7:17 AM
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Easy way to oppose this: https://www.popvox.com/bills/us/113/s150/report#nation
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Old 01-25-2013, 7:45 AM
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Don't get complacent folks, read "American gun owners a bunch of fools?"

http://www.gunsamerica.com/blog/are-...unch-of-fools/
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Old 01-25-2013, 8:29 AM
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just keep fighting the fight.

donate, write your reps, spread the word.

It's gonna be a LONG year.
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Old 01-25-2013, 8:43 AM
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Originally Posted by pointedstick View Post
I have no idea who will look at this, but I love the fact that ALL comments so far are opposed to the Bill, and they are from all over the country.

Keep it up...

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Old 01-25-2013, 8:48 AM
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My request is simple and brief. The Second Amendment of the Constitution was crafted with great foresight to protect the ability of the citizen to bear arms, to protect onself from their government should it become tyranical. Today, as in days past, that is a necessary right. Unfortunately many politicians are forgetting this, and trampling on their oaths to defend and protect the Constition. Please do not do this. Please take the time to look at crime statistics, and FBI data. Taking legally owned weapons from the hands of law abiding citizens will only increase crime by criminals who by definition do not follow laws and will prey on those they know to be unarmed. Also, please stop being a hypocrit, as you have a concealed carry pistol and armed guards.

(my email to Feinstein)
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Old 01-25-2013, 9:24 AM
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Quote:
DiFei knows the bill wont pass as is, it's her starting point for negotiations with the conservative law makers.
Quote:
I don't understand why so many of you think this bill won't pass. The political climate is ripe, plus a similar bill obviously passed in 1994. Don't be complacent.
People, don't underestimate the power of propaganda! The Obamacare meatgrinder was very instructive as we watched them fold one after the other after the other. We all thought Obamacare would be overturned, then the chief justice folded. We all thought he'd be defeated in '12, but WE folded (not to mention +- 4% voter fraud). The current machine is a propaganda master, don't underestimate the fever pitch of emotion and the strong arm tactics that will stop at nothing. No presumptions, no laying down, no compromise!
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Old 01-25-2013, 9:48 AM
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Dear Mr. and Mrs. XXXXXXXXX:
Thank you for contacting me to express your support for common-sense gun laws. I appreciate hearing from you, and I share your desire for sensible federal gun safety legislation.
The massacre at Sandy Hook Elementary School tragically stole the lives of 26 people, including 20 small children, and broke all of our hearts. We have failed our children, and we must take common-sense steps now to protect them. Since 1999 - the year of the massacre at Columbine High School - 258 students, teachers, and others have been killed in school shootings. Another 212 have been wounded due to gun violence at our schools.
The slaughter of innocents must stop. We cannot prevent every attack by those who wish us harm, but we can and must take some common-sense steps. First, we must take weapons of war and high-capacity clips off our streets; second, we must ensure that local law enforcement is involved in reviewing conceal and carry permits; third, we must close the gun show loophole so background checks are conducted; fourth, we must keep all guns out of the hands of the mentally ill and get them the help they need; and fifth, we must keep our schools safe by utilizing all of the law enforcement tools at our disposal.
In the days ahead, I will work for a comprehensive strategy, which includes sensible gun laws, a focus on mental health, and school safety. When there are an estimated 300 million firearms in the United States, nearly one gun per person, now is the right time. When more than 31,000 people die each year from gun violence in our nation - 87 people every day - now is the right time.
Again, thank you for writing to me. Please feel free to contact me again about this or other issues of concern to you.

Sincerely,

Barbara Boxer
United States Senator

I guess she didn't READ my letter.
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  #34  
Old 01-25-2013, 10:32 AM
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i dont get why people are so concerned about which gun is on a certain list? who cares? no compromise!

im not even a fan of the ar15 or any gun in CA that needed a bullet button but i still fought for it when all that YEE crap was going on

this is nothing different, we just need to keep fighting for our rights no matter what!!!!

NO MORE, NOT ONE INCH!!!!

oh yea and stop panic buying and supporting the price gougers SMH
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  #35  
Old 01-25-2013, 10:38 AM
8669chrish 8669chrish is offline
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Gun rights in California are already to strict just imagine a federal law that bans everything. This is just a way to control the people, just in case there is another revolution. That way no one has a way to fight back. The **** is going to hit the fan soon and they don't want us armed. We will have to resort to the middle east tactics of sling shots and rock throwing. LoL.... we need to push back hard to stop them from taking are guns. Here is a link to send the political parties a letter to fight for gun owners. http://www.ruger.com/micros/advocacy/#
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  #36  
Old 01-25-2013, 11:00 AM
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Originally Posted by captainsavaho View Post
ARE EXISTING FIREARMS ACQUIRED LEGALLY BEFORE THIS PROPOSED AWB WILL BE GRANDFATHERED ?? YES OR NO .. CONFUSED
doesn't matter, this bill must not pass in any form
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  #37  
Old 01-25-2013, 12:22 PM
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desertjosh desertjosh is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JDay View Post
I remember people saying the same thing in 1994.
Quote:
Originally Posted by abishai View Post
Question about registration:
Anyone who owns a handgun in CA is already on a list, no?
For the most part yes. If you went thru an ffl then yes.
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  #38  
Old 01-25-2013, 12:34 PM
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Milsurp Collector Milsurp Collector is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rollsdeep View Post
I feel that most people on these boards are unnecessarily overly concerned with a law that has very little likelyhood of passing. Again, the 103rd congress (1993-1995) was pretty much the opposite of the current one. The numbers of D's and R's is reversed from then, and while I am not psychic, I have a very hard time understanding why anyone would think a bunch of R's are going to become martyrs to pass a law that they do not believe in, and their backers would be extremely upset about. It just doesn't add up. Obamacare did. The 94 AWB did. This does not.
All it would take is one more mass shooting like Newtown or Aurora and it will pass. Are you so confident there will not be another mass shooting this year?
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  #39  
Old 01-25-2013, 12:48 PM
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Originally Posted by Scuba Steve33 View Post
If you haven't joined the NRA or any 2A related organization you damn well better do it now. On top of that, sign up your friends and family even if they don't want to join.
Agree 100%, we have no reason to not join. You can get a Life Membership for $1,000 (yes, I know it's expensive). However, you can sign up for their Easy Pay Life (EPL) program and pay $25 a month ($0.83 a day), or even only $25 a quarter ($0.28 a day) until it's fully paid off. There is absolutely no reason to idly stand by and wait for someone else to fight for our rights.

Not one inch!

https://membership.nrahq.org/forms/s...aignID=nranews
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Old 01-25-2013, 1:43 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Waffleobill View Post
Agree 100%, we have no reason to not join. You can get a Life Membership for $1,000 (yes, I know it's expensive). However, you can sign up for their Easy Pay Life (EPL) program and pay $25 a month ($0.83 a day), or even only $25 a quarter ($0.28 a day) until it's fully paid off. There is absolutely no reason to idly stand by and wait for someone else to fight for our rights.

Not one inch!

https://membership.nrahq.org/forms/s...aignID=nranews
Existing Life Members can sign up others for Life Membership at $300 (or one-year for $20). You can also upgrade your Life Membership to Benefactor for $250 if you want.

https://www.nra-2013.org/
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If I were you, I would not pass this up. I would not let this go by...this is rare.
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