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  #641  
Old 11-23-2012, 3:34 PM
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The conversation took place a couple months ago.

Kemasa I will pm you the info.

If you can also get us in touch with your contact that would great.
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  #642  
Old 11-23-2012, 5:37 PM
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Yes, things change as the answer just came back, which means that instead of guessing, it is more certain (until things change).
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  #643  
Old 11-23-2012, 5:47 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Addax View Post
We have recently been informed by our local BATF supervisor "word of mouth" (no official memo), that if you take an existing firearm and convert / alter the "operation" of the firearm from the original factory configuration ( i.e. semi-auto to single shot) by having to install new parts then they are considering this re-manufacturing the gun, unless the original manufacturer of the gun makes / offers a single shot configuration.

We were advised to obtain a variance letter from BATF so we do not need to re-mark the semi-auto pistols we convert to SSE.

Just passing along this information.

We can't say we agree with it, but we do not make the regulations.
why would the ATF care about CALIF law on or roaster no less?
these handguns are legal to own, legal to buy, just not the avg guy can have it shipped to CALIF
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  #644  
Old 11-23-2012, 5:55 PM
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It is not about the CA law, it is about modifying a firearm, which can be a Federal issue. There are limits as to what transfers are considered acceptable. A FFL can not just sell it, but a PPT is ok.
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  #645  
Old 11-30-2012, 5:17 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Table Rock Arms View Post
Just dropping in to let you guys know that I am back from my vacation and will be doing single shot pistols again.

I figure by now there are so many FFL's in California that are doing them that there is much less need for me to do them. Which is great for me as I really started my business with some other things in mind and when I started doing the single shot pistols they just got out of control. At this point I am happy to help out where I can.


YES!

I'm going to spend so much money!
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Originally Posted by Steyr_223 View Post
dude, its a pump-action..You can put a live weasel or hollowed d**do on the barrel and it would be legal...
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  #646  
Old 11-30-2012, 6:10 PM
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Pm'd and emailed you to sse.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Table Rock Arms View Post
Just dropping in to let you guys know that I am back from my vacation and will be doing single shot pistols again.

I figure by now there are so many FFL's in California that are doing them that there is much less need for me to do them. Which is great for me as I really started my business with some other things in mind and when I started doing the single shot pistols they just got out of control. At this point I am happy to help out where I can.

Last edited by CAGLS; 11-30-2012 at 6:20 PM..
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  #647  
Old 12-01-2012, 1:33 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Table Rock Arms View Post
Just dropping in to let you guys know that I am back from my vacation and will be doing single shot pistols again.

I figure by now there are so many FFL's in California that are doing them that there is much less need for me to do them. Which is great for me as I really started my business with some other things in mind and when I started doing the single shot pistols they just got out of control. At this point I am happy to help out where I can.
glad to hear this welcome back.
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  #648  
Old 12-01-2012, 8:54 AM
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Originally Posted by Saym14 View Post
glad to hear this welcome back.
+2...great news!
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  #649  
Old 12-01-2012, 2:38 PM
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FYI Valkyrie in Santa Clara is closed for an audit and inventory at the moment.
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  #650  
Old 12-02-2012, 1:27 AM
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table rock arms - the website pages seem to be down. anyone bought a SSE ther erecently ?
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  #651  
Old 12-02-2012, 2:46 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Saym14 View Post
table rock arms - the website pages seem to be down. anyone bought a SSE ther erecently ?
Just email Ryan: tablerockarms@gmail.com. We've been corresponding for my SSE.
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  #652  
Old 12-02-2012, 6:27 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Saym14 View Post
table rock arms - the website pages seem to be down. anyone bought a SSE ther erecently ?
Sorry about that. I have been meaning to take them down which I just did. Best way to find out if I can do a certain pistol would be to email me with any questions.
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  #653  
Old 12-05-2012, 10:36 AM
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Talking Inland Empire?

Hi calgunners. I'm Nate and i'm trying to see what kind of demand there would be for a shop in the San Bernardino area to do SSE handguns. Also any other pertinet information that I could use to try and convince my LGS for the need for them to look into it. Trying to think on a scale of EBR works, DAS, and Addax tactical. Is there anything closer than those to San Bernardino that does them? Will you please help me by stating what area you'd be coming from. Thanks in advance.
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  #654  
Old 12-06-2012, 3:44 PM
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All pertinent information is in the sticky (I'm assuming you mean legal).
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  #655  
Old 12-06-2012, 8:53 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Natejpg View Post
Hi calgunners. I'm Nate and i'm trying to see what kind of demand there would be for a shop in the San Bernardino area to do SSE handguns. Also any other pertinet information that I could use to try and convince my LGS for the need for them to look into it. Trying to think on a scale of EBR works, DAS, and Addax tactical. Is there anything closer than those to San Bernardino that does them? Will you please help me by stating what area you'd be coming from. Thanks in advance.
if you had the right guns at fair prices I would go there. you would be the closest to me. I am going to EBR and they are 65 miles. thats a lot of round trip driving when you have to go to start DROS and then pick it up. I am in the east san gabriel valley.
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Last edited by Saym14; 12-06-2012 at 8:58 PM..
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  #656  
Old 12-13-2012, 7:38 AM
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Default Kenny Hamerman (45colt@bellsouth.net) Great SSE Service

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Originally Posted by SiegeX View Post
So after Buds told me to kick rocks when trying to have them transfer an off-roster Dan Wesson Valor to Valkyrie for the SSE mod, I found a CA-friendly dealer in Florida named Kenneth Hamerman (45colt@bellsouth.net). Not only was Kenny a stand-up, honest seller with great communication and fast shipping, but his price on the Valor was $150 cheaper than Buds! Kenny has done many transfers to Valkyrie and before purchasing with him I called Valkyrie up and they confirmed smooth transactions with him.

Speaking of which, I also want to mention that the folks over at Valkyrie Arms are top notch. They are down to earth people who never once gave me that 'greater than thou' attitude and were more than happy to explain the SSE process to me.

Both Kenny Hamerman and Valkyrie have earned my business for some time to come. I'll also be donating to CGN as if it weren't for this forum I'm sure my Valor wouldn't have been possible.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Strykeback View Post
I have to give a recommendation for Kenny Hamerman as well. He found me an HK p30 and was really quick on returning emails as well as shipping my gun off to Ryan at Tablerock the morning I had transferred him the money. He specializes in Colt and Dan Wesson 1911s but can find many other guns you might be looking for.

And since we need all the california friendly dealers we can Id recommend putting him on the list for off roster firearms

Kenny hamerman
45colt@bellsouth.net
I wanted to give a shout out and thanks to both "SiegeX" and also "Strykeback" without both of their recommendations on this board I would have never found out about Kenny Hamerman (45colt@bellsouth.net). This is the first time I have posted on Calguns so sorry in advance for any formatting issues. Anyways I can attest that everything the above two posters have said about Kenny Hamerman is dead on. His prices were great (much better than Bud's) and you are sure you are getting a new product (unlike some of the things I read about Bud's online). He took a lot of time e-mailing me all the details of the transaction and at the same time recommended where to go to have the SSE performed on the Dan Wesson Valor I purchased from him earlier this year. He conducts business the old fashion way and is very customer service friendly. He is also great at finding many of the harder to find and procure firearms. I definitely plan on him being my go to guy in the future as from my experience he is the friendliest and most helpful dealer I have ever done business with.

One last thing I should mention, this is the first time I have ever written a review for a product/service/individual online. I usually don't feel the need to do this but given the outstanding service I received from Kenny I felt compelled to do so. Thanks again Kenny.
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  #657  
Old 12-16-2012, 9:24 PM
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Anyone know if I can just register a sse of a hk mp5 clone pistol barreled receiver? Or does the gun have to be complete gun with trigger pack and bolt?
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  #658  
Old 12-17-2012, 11:11 AM
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A handgun has to be either on the certified list or exempt. A receiver is neither. You also have to do the firearm safety demo, which you can not do unless it is complete or you are exempt.
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  #659  
Old 12-17-2012, 11:11 AM
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A handgun has to be either on the certified list or exempt. A receiver is neither. You also have to do the firearm safety demo, which you can not do unless it is complete or you are exempt.
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  #660  
Old 12-17-2012, 12:28 PM
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Complete it is thanks
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  #661  
Old 12-28-2012, 10:22 PM
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I've been in a gun shop (who shall remain unnamed) in the Temecula area recently with a friend of mine who wants a SA XDM. I explained to him that the only way to get one in CA is to either buy one from a private party or to go to a shop that does SSE conversions.

One of the sales associates overheard our conversation and he gave me the information below:

1. We should be careful about SSE pistols because a lot of gun shops are doing them incorrectly and that the DOJ have been cracking down on dealers on these. The converted pistol needed to be re-marked and re-serialized for them to be legal. I've told him that I have a pistol that is a SSE and that it was never re-serialized. He said I should be OK but that...

2. I should be careful on using a SSE pistol as my primary home defense firearm. He said that since the DROS indicated that it is a single-shot, I may get into other legal issues should I ever use it against an intruder. A prosecutor may use that fact against me - converting a SSE into its original configuration from the manufacturer.

I've told him (respectfully) that I follow these threads on Calguns and I've never heard of any issues from #1 or #2. Can anyone confirm the information I was given? Or was the gun shop employee misinformed or full of it?

Thanks in advance.
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  #662  
Old 12-29-2012, 1:39 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by samz4mc View Post
I've been in a gun shop (who shall remain unnamed) in the Temecula area recently with a friend of mine who wants a SA XDM. I explained to him that the only way to get one in CA is to either buy one from a private party or to go to a shop that does SSE conversions.

One of the sales associates overheard our conversation and he gave me the information below:

1. We should be careful about SSE pistols because a lot of gun shops are doing them incorrectly and that the DOJ have been cracking down on dealers on these. The converted pistol needed to be re-marked and re-serialized for them to be legal. I've told him that I have a pistol that is a SSE and that it was never re-serialized. He said I should be OK but that...

2. I should be careful on using a SSE pistol as my primary home defense firearm. He said that since the DROS indicated that it is a single-shot, I may get into other legal issues should I ever use it against an intruder. A prosecutor may use that fact against me - converting a SSE into its original configuration from the manufacturer.

I've told him (respectfully) that I follow these threads on Calguns and I've never heard of any issues from #1 or #2. Can anyone confirm the information I was given? Or was the gun shop employee misinformed or full of it?

Thanks in advance.
# 1 seems to be in direct contradiction to this post from back in February 2012 on another thread. Unfortunately, the above lacks sufficient detail. E.G., what does "cracking down" mean? Warnings with specific cites to the Penal Code? Fines? Permit loss? Under what Penal Code section or other legal authority? Was the unnamed Temecula FFL subject to these directly, or was it relayed from another party? It's important to identify the source of the information. Any chance you can return and do some more recon?

Also, what "stamp" would be applied? Neither the ATF nor the DROS has a separate firearm type for "single shot pistol" or "roster exempt pistol" that I know of. Here's the list I have:

ATF (from form 4473):
  • Handgun
  • Long Gun
  • Other Firearm
DROS (from electronic form):
  • Combination Gun
  • Derringer
  • Frame
  • Pistol
  • Receiver
  • Revolver
  • Rifle
  • Shotgun
  • Destructive Device
  • Flare Gun
  • Machine Gun
  • Silencer
  • Tear Gas Launcher
  • Any Other Weapon
  • Unknown
  • (Other)
Regarding # 2, is there a Penal Code section that supports this idea? I don't know of any, but that doesn't mean it doesn't exist. SSE doesn't seem to implicate the NFA. So under what (California) authority is the CA DOJ or any law enforcement agency "cracking down"? Yes, I know that cops are ill-informed of the law, and they often make allegations unsupported by law (which ultimately results in great expense to those defending against those allegations), but what crime would be alleged in that hypothetical?

Can an experienced FFL weigh in on this to shed some light?
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  #663  
Old 12-29-2012, 2:42 PM
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Since we were at that shop for only a brief moment, I did not press for any more info. He did not cite any specific reports or rulings or penal codes on #1. I will make it a point to get more info from that particular employee the next time I am there. This FFL does not do SSE (and I don't think the other two FFLs in the area do either), but I should point out that it was another employee there that pointed me to a FFL in the San Diego that does SSE and that is where I eventually ended up purchasing a SSE pistol some months back.

On #2, again that particular employee did not cite any rulings or penal codes. I really don't know where his information came from.

I don't know for sure, but my take on that entire conversation was that he probably did not want us to take (our) potential business elsewhere. But just the fact that he mentioned those two items made me concerned enough to pose my questions here.
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  #664  
Old 12-29-2012, 2:46 PM
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I suspect that until we see actual case law, one will never really know the full extent that a "Crack down" will be... or whether or not SSE is an issue...

I will say however, I have questioned (myself and my FFL) what challenges I might face if I us SSE in self defense... I have one (with another on the way) that are designed as self defense weapons... I hope I'm not put in a position to be the guinea pig.
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  #665  
Old 12-29-2012, 5:42 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by samz4mc View Post
1. We should be careful about SSE pistols because a lot of gun shops are doing them incorrectly and that the DOJ have been cracking down on dealers on these. The converted pistol needed to be re-marked and re-serialized for them to be legal. I've told him that I have a pistol that is a SSE and that it was never re-serialized. He said I should be OK but that...
There was some question as to whether converting a firearm to single shot was considered manufacturing, which would require the name be marked on the firearm (the barrel would be ok) and the serial number (which a variance could be received from the BATF) marked for the new manufacturer.

This has since changed. If you have a complete functional firearm and just exchange parts with no milling or machining, then it is not considered to be manufacturing and that means that no marking is required. Now, not all BATF regions might feel that way.

In any case, it is FUD since the serial number is a Federal issue and the CA DOJ would not be involved, other than trying to get the BATF to do something.

Quote:
2. I should be careful on using a SSE pistol as my primary home defense firearm. He said that since the DROS indicated that it is a single-shot, I may get into other legal issues should I ever use it against an intruder. A prosecutor may use that fact against me - converting a SSE into its original configuration from the manufacturer.
A prosecutor could try to do anything, but it is doubtful since the firearm would be in the same configuration as it was sent from the factory. It does not matter that during the transfer it was a single shot.
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  #666  
Old 01-03-2013, 6:19 PM
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Is it possible to somehow convert a Rhino revolver into a SSE?
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  #667  
Old 01-03-2013, 7:09 PM
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It might be difficult to convert it into a Single Shot, but if the size is large enough, you could convert it into a single action, which is exempt, again based on size. Based on the one link I found, I am not sure that it would be large enough.
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  #668  
Old 01-03-2013, 8:30 PM
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I saw a 2" Rhino for sale on Armslist. The person selling it said that they had it converted to DAO by a Chiapa certified GS.

If they can go DAO they might be able to go SAO.
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  #669  
Old 01-03-2013, 8:32 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by morrcarr67 View Post
I saw a 2" Rhino for sale on Armslist. The person selling it said that they had it converted to DAO by a Chiapa certified GS.

If they can go DAO they might be able to go SAO.
SAO is not equal to SSE
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  #670  
Old 01-03-2013, 8:36 PM
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For revolvers you don't do SSE.

You do SAO. A SAO revolver with a min 3" barrel, 5 shot and OAL greater than 7 1/2" is roster exempt.
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  #671  
Old 01-03-2013, 8:41 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Saym14 View Post
SAO is not equal to SSE
just as there is an exemption E for dimensionally-compliant Single-shot pistols, there is also an exemption for dimensionally-compliant single-action revolvers.

convert an SA/DA revolver to SAO and if the dimensions meet the regs, it would be roster exempt. perhaps it could be considered SAE (single-action exempt).
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  #672  
Old 01-03-2013, 9:21 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ke6guj View Post
just as there is an exemption E for dimensionally-compliant Single-shot pistols, there is also an exemption for dimensionally-compliant single-action revolvers.

convert an SA/DA revolver to SAO and if the dimensions meet the regs, it would be roster exempt. perhaps it could be considered SAE (single-action exempt).
oh yeah got it. does the rhino hhave a replaceable barrel ?
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  #673  
Old 01-03-2013, 10:38 PM
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Originally Posted by morrcarr67 View Post
For revolvers you don't do SSE.

You do SAO. A SAO revolver with a min 3" barrel, 5 shot and OAL greater than 7 1/2" is roster exempt.
need more info? how to do these.
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Old 01-03-2013, 10:46 PM
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P2000- Check out the thread that says how to bring in off roster S&W's. It is a sticky in this section. While its focus is on Smiths you can apply the knowledge to any revolver.


EDIT:

Just to help you and others out here is the link

http://www.calguns.net/calgunforum/s...d.php?t=453716

Last edited by morrcarr67; 01-04-2013 at 1:05 PM..
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Old 01-08-2013, 11:53 AM
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So, how up to date is the list of SSE providers at the head of this thread? Well, we know that Valkyrie is teats-up. Just wondering if anyone else in the Silicon Valley area or thereabouts might be able to handle a S&W M&P 45c?

(if they are available at all)
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Old 01-08-2013, 12:36 PM
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So, how up to date is the list of SSE providers at the head of this thread? Well, we know that Valkyrie is teats-up. Just wondering if anyone else in the Silicon Valley area or thereabouts might be able to handle a S&W M&P 45c?

(if they are available at all)
From reading that thread that was started about Valkyrie it seems like a lot of the SSE guns were being shipped to Tracy Rifle and Pistol in Tracy and PRK in Fresno. I would check with those two first.
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Old 01-08-2013, 1:11 PM
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From reading that thread that was started about Valkyrie it seems like a lot of the SSE guns were being shipped to Tracy Rifle and Pistol in Tracy and PRK in Fresno. I would check with those two first.
Fresno is about a 3hr drive, Tracy is just over an hour. The latter isn't too awful and I have spoken to them. Just wondering if there was anyone a bit closer to home.
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Old 01-09-2013, 12:07 AM
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Anyone near Lompoc done a SSE? Would love some tips, I want a PPS!
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Old 01-09-2013, 12:18 AM
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Fresno is about a 3hr drive, Tracy is just over an hour. The latter isn't too awful and I have spoken to them. Just wondering if there was anyone a bit closer to home.
Email Peter at Mount Pleasant Arms. He's in San Jose and might be able to get one for you.
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Old 01-18-2013, 5:40 AM
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Does anyone see any problems with applying the SSE to Magnum Research Desert Eagle 50 cal pistol and the Micro Eagle 380?
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