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California 2nd Amend. Political Discussion & Activism Discuss gun rights activism and 2A related political topics here. All advice given is NOT legal counsel.

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  #201  
Old 08-12-2012, 3:58 AM
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Course it passed, this is Kalifornia. Want to see how it is living in the UK under unreasonable and draconian gun laws, just watch Kalifornia go down the slippery slope.
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  #202  
Old 08-12-2012, 8:57 AM
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I wonder if they will be able to get the DROS software updated by 2014 and how many new restrictions will be imposed, not by the change in the law, but by omissions in what the software allows (like the inability to perform a PPT when the seller has a non-CA drivers license).
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  #203  
Old 08-13-2012, 7:03 AM
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Would it be possible to transfer all your firearms into a trust prior to 1/1/14, name your children as beneficiaries, and, in so doing, circumvent the intra-familial transfer fee? Also, since a trust is deemed to be an entity, would you have to pay a private party transfer fee when you transfer your firearms into the trust?
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  #204  
Old 08-13-2012, 12:35 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by steel View Post
Would it be possible to transfer all your firearms into a trust prior to 1/1/14, name your children as beneficiaries, and, in so doing, circumvent the intra-familial transfer fee? Also, since a trust is deemed to be an entity, would you have to pay a private party transfer fee when you transfer your firearms into the trust?
Good Question.
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  #205  
Old 08-13-2012, 2:32 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by steel View Post
Would it be possible to transfer all your firearms into a trust prior to 1/1/14, name your children as beneficiaries, and, in so doing, circumvent the intra-familial transfer fee? Also, since a trust is deemed to be an entity, would you have to pay a private party transfer fee when you transfer your firearms into the trust?
I would bet a $ to a do-nut that if you do that, upon disbursal from the trust, each firearm and recipient would have to be DROS'ed.
IANAL, but before doing anything along those lines, you should seek competent legal counsel - someone up on trusts, and firearms law.
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  #206  
Old 08-21-2012, 1:05 AM
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I don't know if anyone has seen/read this article yet (If I missed it in a previous post -rookie mistake on my part.): Death of a Long Gun Registry.

Looks like neighbors from up north have already tried and failed with this type of policy.
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  #207  
Old 08-21-2012, 3:55 PM
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Sad to see my Senator letters on AB809 did no good.
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  #208  
Old 08-21-2012, 4:09 PM
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I hope it fouls up the system and creates a major backlog in the DROS process. Maybe even consume all of the DOJ bandwidth and crash a few servers due to the volume of requests. Kind of like a DDOS event, but in this case I guess it would be a DDROS attack.
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  #209  
Old 09-14-2012, 9:33 PM
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Buy all you can now.
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  #210  
Old 09-19-2012, 10:02 AM
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Or, unfortunately since California is one of the most beautiful and varied landscapes in the country...

Time to leave California and take your money (whatever the State hasn't already taxed you to death out of) with you. Yep, seriously. I hear Vermont, another typically very Liberal--and very pro-2A--State is lovely all times of the year.
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  #211  
Old 09-20-2012, 10:42 AM
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I hear Vermont, another typically very Liberal--and very pro-2A--State is lovely all times of the year.
Just wait until winter rolls around...
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  #212  
Old 10-08-2012, 9:52 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by steel View Post
Would it be possible to transfer all your firearms into a trust prior to 1/1/14, name your children as beneficiaries, and, in so doing, circumvent the intra-familial transfer fee? Also, since a trust is deemed to be an entity, would you have to pay a private party transfer fee when you transfer your firearms into the trust?
Sounds like something for Librarian to possibly give a thought on.
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  #213  
Old 10-08-2012, 8:58 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by steel View Post
Would it be possible to transfer all your firearms into a trust prior to 1/1/14, name your children as beneficiaries, and, in so doing, circumvent the intra-familial transfer fee? Also, since a trust is deemed to be an entity, would you have to pay a private party transfer fee when you transfer your firearms into the trust?
This is the question I have posed on my thread about Handguns showing up in AFS on routine traffic stops etc. http://www.calguns.net/calgunforum/s...80#post9479880

It seems that if someone established an NFA trust and put you in it, then went ahead and DROS'd a pistol (or in this case any gun after Jan. 2014) you wouldn't be in the California registry but still a legal owner of a registered pistol in California.
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  #214  
Old 11-09-2012, 7:14 PM
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Does anyone know if there have been any lawsuits against this BILL!?!?!??!?!?!
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  #215  
Old 11-09-2012, 8:24 PM
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It's law now, and no, no lawsuits.
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  #216  
Old 11-09-2012, 8:52 PM
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Originally Posted by Librarian View Post
It's law now, and no, no lawsuits.
What about the lawsuit against registration in general?
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  #217  
Old 11-14-2012, 5:14 AM
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Correct me if i'm wrong but don't we currently have to register our long guns as well as out Handguns currently? Seems to me like I fill out the same dros documents regardless of what type of firearm I buy thru a FFL.. (hand gun, long gun or Frame) I recently bought a stripped lower and had to fill out DROS paperwork for that too..

I have seen people in the sales section talk about "cash and carry" I would assume this is where you just buy a long gun off someone without DROSing it...

I too have long guns that were passed down from my father in law that were passed to him from his father... I read the bill and shouldn't have to register these but whats to stop people from handing them down and just saying "Oh I got them before 2013? "

thanks guys
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  #218  
Old 11-14-2012, 6:57 AM
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Originally Posted by Eddie916 View Post
Correct me if i'm wrong but don't we currently have to register our long guns as well as out Handguns currently? Seems to me like I fill out the same dros documents regardless of what type of firearm I buy thru a FFL.. (hand gun, long gun or Frame) I recently bought a stripped lower and had to fill out DROS paperwork for that too..

I have seen people in the sales section talk about "cash and carry" I would assume this is where you just buy a long gun off someone without DROSing it...

I too have long guns that were passed down from my father in law that were passed to him from his father... I read the bill and shouldn't have to register these but whats to stop people from handing them down and just saying "Oh I got them before 2013? "

thanks guys
When you dros a long gun the serial number is not recorded. So not registered. Cash n carry is referring to guns over 50yrs old or on a curio n relic list by the batfe. My two cents.
Go ahead an look at your latest dros form I had to as well when I learned this.
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  #219  
Old 11-14-2012, 8:03 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hk91666 View Post
When you dros a long gun the serial number is not recorded. So not registered. Cash n carry is referring to guns over 50yrs old or on a curio n relic list by the batfe. My two cents.
Go ahead an look at your latest dros form I had to as well when I learned this.
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Hey, thanks for the feedback, I just assumed that the DROS paperwork had the serial number on it for long guns... guess I never really looked that close at the paperwork... do you guys know if this is the same for "Frames" ie: a stripped lower?
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  #220  
Old 11-14-2012, 8:18 AM
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Hey, thanks for the feedback, I just assumed that the DROS paperwork had the serial number on it for long guns... guess I never really looked that close at the paperwork... do you guys know if this is the same for "Frames" ie: a stripped lower?
I would think so mine did not have it, as long as listed as long gun not handgun. I do not know about checked "other". I argued and lost with a guy who told me same info a year ago plus. Until I looked on one. A lot of dealers will start dros early due to no s/n.

January 2014 will suck!
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  #221  
Old 11-14-2012, 11:32 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Eddie916 View Post
do you guys know if this is the same for "Frames" ie: a stripped lower?
It is today; probably those will get registered in 2014, because DROS has only two categories, handgun and long gun. Feds have those plus 'other'.
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  #222  
Old 12-03-2012, 1:15 PM
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I'm moving out of California.
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  #223  
Old 12-05-2012, 6:34 PM
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I bought a colt ar15 the 6920 LE
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  #224  
Old 12-27-2012, 2:32 PM
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Is there basis for a lawsuit to overturn this law? If so, who would have standing? Im racking my brain to understand what may be done to stop this from happening before it starts. Too bad none of my emails and letters to my assemblyman helped. We were in the minority.
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  #225  
Old 12-27-2012, 6:16 PM
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I was given a nice Chinese sks as a gift when I was 16 by my moms ex boyfriend. He passed away about 4 yrs ago. I know he got the sks in michigan over 15yrs ago by some family member..sounds like I need to register it now, will I have a hard time in this case? What is the process?
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  #226  
Old 12-27-2012, 6:40 PM
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Default Make your voice heard!

Make your voice heard concerning the possibility of a new assault weapons ban and voice your opinion directly to the White House.

:arrow: http://www.whitehouse.gov/share-your...g-gun-violence

:arrow: http://www.nraila.org/get-involved-l...your-reps.aspx


People, some serious Federal gun legislation is coming our way, and I'm afraid we are not going to stop it. We had better get on the ball before its to late!

Here's a simple form letter you can use.


Dear Sir.

The tragedy and heartbreak of the event that took place at Sandy Hook Elementary goes without saying, along with the immeasurable losses suffered by the families and loved ones of these victims. You will be asked to consider legislative proposals that might curtail or minimized future tragedies like the one that just took place at Newtown, Conn.

Of all the proposals, firearms and their control will be in the forefront and as you know a very hot and divided topic that concerns our Second Amendment, as well as all law abiding gun owners, so here is what I am asking, that you use common sense when considering proposed gun legislation and to take a look on what has NOT worked in the past.

Assault Weapons Ban: Assault Weapons Ban in '94. It was on the books for 10 years. Columbine occurred right in the middle of it. It didn't make any difference.

Non gun: May 18, 1927: In the deadliest mass school murder in United States history, former school board member Andrew Kehoe set off three bombs in Bath Township, Michigan killing 45 people and wounding 58. Kehoe killed himself and the superintendent by blowing up his own vehicle.

It has been said, that you cannot legislate morality. People bent on evil, will find any means at their disposal to implement atrocities, like the case in point. (Dec 14, 2012 – Chinese state media say a man stabbed 22 children. An adult and eight children were killed with a knife at a school.) People bent on evil, have no regard for the law period and will acquire whatever firearms they desire for their purpose, banned or not.

We have some 20,000 gun laws (state and federal) on the books now, do you honestly believe adding anymore will stop violence or mass murder? Further banning is not the answer. More education and acknowledging the responsibility of each and every gun owner to ensure that his/her firearms are secure and inaccessible, and that consequences for irresponsibility be met with a punishment proportionate to the crime committed as a result of that irresponsibility.
We have to face facts that we live in a violent society. At any time your house could be subject to a home invasion resulting in unspeakable atrocities. So is it justifiable to deprive law abiding citizens of their right to be equally armed, defending themselves against an intruder with a semiautomatic or even automatic, whether he has an Assault rifle or pistol, or say for the sake of argument several intruders? Many Governors in the U.S. have armed bodyguards who carry assault weapons in case of multiple hostiles and the convenience of not having to reload. Faced with a likewise scenario would you deprive a law abiding citizens of their right to be as equally armed?
Further gun bans are not the answer. Punishment for those who use firearms in the commission of a crime should result in steeper penalties and they should be enforced to the max.

Please note that since the Assault Weapons Ban expired, violent crime has dropped according to F.B.I. statistics.

In 2011, an estimated 1,203,564 violent crimes occurred nationwide, a decrease of 3.8 percent from the 2010 estimate.

When considering 5- and 10-year trends, the 2011 estimated violent crime total was 15.4 percent below the 2007 level and 15.5 percent below the 2002 level.

Laws have very little effect on stopping crime, because criminals don't care. The biggest crime against society would be to impair the law abiding citizen to defend his family with equal force.

I can only ask that you use common sense when considering the possibility of further gun legislation.

Respectfully submitted,
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  #227  
Old 12-27-2012, 6:47 PM
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Originally Posted by jeffxbr View Post
I was given a nice Chinese sks as a gift when I was 16 by my moms ex boyfriend. He passed away about 4 yrs ago. I know he got the sks in michigan over 15yrs ago by some family member..sounds like I need to register it now, will I have a hard time in this case? What is the process?
No. Registration happens on transfers only. If you have it and keep it, you need do nothing.
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  #228  
Old 01-01-2013, 10:31 PM
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Where can I find out what fights are mounting against this law if any? All that I see is crap showing that it passed but what gives?
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  #229  
Old 01-02-2013, 8:42 AM
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How does the affect members of the military if they PCS into the state? If they buy a gun here I can understand that, but would they be required to register any long guns they bring in the state?

Simple answer seems to be yes; however, if they're only here for 3 years and are sent here on orders by a higher echelon of the government it seems like they [federal government] would trump the state government and wouldn't be applicable.

Granted I think the time is coming where everyone, regardless of what state you live in, will be required to register their guns.
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  #230  
Old 01-02-2013, 9:11 AM
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How does the affect members of the military if they PCS into the state? If they buy a gun here I can understand that, but would they be required to register any long guns they bring in the state?

Simple answer seems to be yes; however, if they're only here for 3 years and are sent here on orders by a higher echelon of the government it seems like they [federal government] would trump the state government and wouldn't be applicable.

Granted I think the time is coming where everyone, regardless of what state you live in, will be required to register their guns.
The ONLY reason to register a firearm is a future confiscation... How can it serve ANY other purpose?
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  #231  
Old 01-02-2013, 9:21 AM
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The ONLY reason to register a firearm is a future confiscation... How can it serve ANY other purpose?
That is the purpose. They're playing the "long game". Once people have accepted this level of registration, they will enact legislation that covers all existing property as well.
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  #232  
Old 01-02-2013, 10:46 AM
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Originally Posted by USMCbassman View Post
How does the affect members of the military if they PCS into the state? If they buy a gun here I can understand that, but would they be required to register any long guns they bring in the state?

Simple answer seems to be yes; however, if they're only here for 3 years and are sent here on orders by a higher echelon of the government it seems like they [federal government] would trump the state government and wouldn't be applicable.

Granted I think the time is coming where everyone, regardless of what state you live in, will be required to register their guns.
At the moment, military moving here on orders are exempt from registering anything. I don't recall that being changed in the bill. If you separate here, then you need to register as a new resident.
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  #233  
Old 01-02-2013, 11:44 AM
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Thanks Librarian!

Hypothetical scenario here and I'll use me just to make sure I understand this correctly:

Since I'm a resident of Kansas, but reside in CA (on military orders) I can continue to return to my HOR state, purchase firearms, and bring them in state without any consequence or requirement to register them as long as they are not Title II firearms (or if they are and I have proper approval from the ATF)?

Could you point me in the direction of state law that says that? Reason I ask for that is my wife works for the local PD and is telling me that I will be required to register my guns. I opposed her in that statement, but she swears up and down that I do.

Thank you again...I will also do some searching on my own; however, from what I've read on here you seem to be the man can find any law in black and white!
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  #234  
Old 01-02-2013, 11:52 AM
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PC 17000. (a) As used in this part, until January 1, 2014, any reference to the term “personal firearm importer” shall be deemed to mean “personal handgun importer” and, on and after January 1, 2014, any reference to the term “personal handgun importer” shall be deemed to mean “personal firearm importer.” A “personal handgun importer,” until January 1, 2014, and commencing January 1, 2014, a “personal firearm importer” means an individual who meets all of the following criteria:

(6) The individual moved into this state on or after January 1, 1998, in the case of a handgun, or in the case of a firearm that is not a handgun, on or after January 1, 2014, as a resident of this state.

(b) For purposes of paragraph (6) of subdivision (a):

(1) Except as provided in paragraph (2), residency shall be determined in the same manner as is the case for establishing residency pursuant to Section 12505 of the Vehicle Code.

(2) In the case of a member of the Armed Forces of the United States, residency shall be deemed to be established when the individual was discharged from active service in this state.
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  #235  
Old 01-02-2013, 11:57 AM
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Very well...that answers that! Thank you Mr. DD!

I was just reading another post on here where someone referenced a base order for CPEN stating that we were required to register with DOJ; however, and funny enough that order doesn't come up anywhere.

I'm aware of the base reg to register on base if we reside there, but that is neither here nor there.

Thank you!
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  #236  
Old 01-02-2013, 12:07 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by USMCbassman View Post
Thanks Librarian!

Hypothetical scenario here and I'll use me just to make sure I understand this correctly:

Since I'm a resident of Kansas, but reside in CA (on military orders) I can continue to return to my HOR state, purchase firearms, and bring them in state without any consequence or requirement to register them as long as they are not Title II firearms (or if they are and I have proper approval from the ATF)?

Could you point me in the direction of state law that says that? Reason I ask for that is my wife works for the local PD and is telling me that I will be required to register my guns. I opposed her in that statement, but she swears up and down that I do.

Thank you again...I will also do some searching on my own; however, from what I've read on here you seem to be the man can find any law in black and white!
mrdd got the one - it's nice that other people caught that bug! - and I'll do the other.

To the bolded question, best info is "No".

To reiterate for frequent commenters on that, I don't like it, but I have no documentation to refute it.

See the wiki -- http://wiki.calgunsfoundation.org/Fe...ments#Military
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Heller was 2008. McDonald was 2010. Things started getting bad with GCA-1968.
It takes time to unwind 40 years of bad law.
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  #237  
Old 01-02-2013, 12:33 PM
ATS76 ATS76 is offline
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Default How about home built firearms?

Do we need to register new home built firearms finished after 12/31/2013?
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  #238  
Old 01-02-2013, 9:30 PM
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Librarian Librarian is offline
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Originally Posted by ATS76 View Post
Do we need to register new home built firearms finished after 12/31/2013?
Register on transfer; if you keep it, no.
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Ask CA law questions in the How CA Laws Apply to/Affect Me Forum - most questions that start 'Is it legal ...' go there.

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Heller was 2008. McDonald was 2010. Things started getting bad with GCA-1968.
It takes time to unwind 40 years of bad law.
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  #239  
Old 01-04-2013, 3:57 PM
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glocksmith glocksmith is offline
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What is being done to fight this? Is anyone planning on taking this to court to overturn it?
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  #240  
Old 01-07-2013, 8:08 PM
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Default Need advice !!!

Quote:
Originally Posted by hardstatic View Post
That is the purpose. They're playing the "long game". Once people have accepted this level of registration, they will enact legislation that covers all existing property as well.
Brilliant observation and absolutely CORRECT !!

Its also called "the foot in the door technique" , "bait and switch" etc. etc.

My question:

Other than donating to this organization and the NRA, which I do, does anybody know of a website/organization that has "press one button - multiple send function" to automatically email gov't reps?

I REALLY feel adverse to emailing them through their government websites because they require full name, address etc.

I do not trust these creeps and want to avoid being targeted if ever they get stealthy.

Mr. Yee of California already has designs to force gun owners to register annually.
This is a ploy, information gathering with ulterior motives and a money squeeze vehicle for squelching our rights !!!

Not to mention Feinstein's designs.....
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