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California 2nd Amend. Political Discussion & Activism Discuss gun rights activism and 2A related political topics here. All advice given is NOT legal counsel.

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  #1  
Old 01-24-2013, 10:10 PM
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Default 2013 CA AB 174 - Bonta - As of 3/19, no longer a 2A bill.

3/19/2013 - has been amended to public school health centers - no longer a 2A bill



An attempt to delete all grandfather clauses on guns already owned.

ETA - link to bill: http://leginfo.legislature.ca.gov/fa...201320140AB174
// Librarian

Quote:
AB 174, as introduced, Bonta. Weapons: grandfather clauses.
Existing law prohibits the possession of various weapons. Under existing law, certain of these bans exempted from their scope weapons that were possessed prior to the ban, if prescribed conditions met, are authorized.
This bill would declare the intent of the Legislature to subsequently amend this bill to include provisions that would end all of those exemptions.
Digest KeyVote: MAJORITY Appropriation: NO Fiscal Committee: NO Local Program: NO

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Bill Text

The people of the State of California do enact as follows:


SECTION 1. Under current law, certain banned weapons are permitted under various “grandfathering in” clauses. It is the intent of the Legislature to subsequently amend this measure to include provisions that would end all of those exemptions.

Last edited by Markinsac; 03-19-2013 at 10:19 PM.. Reason: Bill has been amended out of 2A area.
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  #2  
Old 01-24-2013, 10:48 PM
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But, but, but... all my Democrat friends insist that the Government doesn't want to take away any of my guns!!!

Seriously, I hope that there is some shred of intellect left in the CA legislature, so that this can be killed in committee. If not, I suppose Jerry may have the legal wisdom to not sign this thing and save the state some serious trouble.

Not holding my breath, though...
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  #3  
Old 01-24-2013, 10:54 PM
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There is no shred of intellect in this pinhead. Still has his first election diapers on and he's already proposing crap legislation. Democratic supermajority, whoopee!!!
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Old 01-25-2013, 7:47 AM
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Originally Posted by IPSICK View Post
There is no shred of intellect in this pinhead. Still has his first election diapers on and he's already proposing crap legislation. Democratic supermajority, whoopee!!!
Don't worry, as he gets more experience, he'll get even better at proposing even worse legislation.
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Old 01-24-2013, 10:58 PM
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i can't think of a gun that is "grand fathered in" here in CA. If they passed a law against it, it had to be registered, and the law banned transfers.
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Old 01-24-2013, 11:03 PM
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Originally Posted by mag360 View Post
i can't think of a gun that is "grand fathered in" here in CA. If they passed a law against it, it had to be registered, and the law banned transfers.
This bill simply makes yesterday's registration tomorrow's confiscation. If you complied and registered an AW this bill means that they will be stopping by to pick it up. It's clearly a taking so they will have to at least compensate for the confiscated items.

OK, there is no text to the bill, just a statement of intent. Time will tell.

Last edited by cleonard; 01-24-2013 at 11:10 PM..
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  #7  
Old 02-11-2013, 8:20 AM
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Originally Posted by mag360 View Post
i can't think of a gun that is "grand fathered in" here in CA. If they passed a law against it, it had to be registered, and the law banned transfers.
RAW's are the current "grand fathered in" firearms.
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  #8  
Old 01-24-2013, 11:44 PM
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You cant *not* have a grandfather clause, and removing the existing one creates a slew of felons. Wtf.
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  #9  
Old 01-24-2013, 11:49 PM
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Originally Posted by Sakiri View Post
You cant *not* have a grandfather clause, and removing the existing one creates a slew of felons. Wtf.
Sure they can, as the gentleman before you points out, they have your name and address and 2 armed public servants will be over at 5pm to collect them from you so you do not put yourself in a situation where you are committing a felony
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  #10  
Old 02-09-2013, 7:11 AM
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Default 2013 CA AB 174 - Bonta - Weapons: grandfather clauses

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Originally Posted by sintax View Post
Sure they can, as the gentleman before you points out, they have your name and address and 2 armed public servants will be over at 5pm to collect them from you so you do not put yourself in a situation where you are committing a felony
Felony or not, someone will be resisting and get hurts.
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  #11  
Old 01-25-2013, 12:14 AM
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Y'all relax.

The Right People are all over this kind of proposed legislation.

Spoiled apple
Poison pill

Politics is warfare. Feints. Counter attacks. Flanking manouvers. Deception. And cavalry charges.

Not all our friends are Republicans.
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  #12  
Old 01-25-2013, 5:53 PM
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Originally Posted by jdberger View Post
Y'all relax.

The Right People are all over this kind of proposed legislation.

Spoiled apple
Poison pill

Politics is warfare. Feints. Counter attacks. Flanking manouvers. Deception. And cavalry charges.

Not all our friends are Republicans.
Yep. I hate the idea that something as fundamental as the Bill of Rights is protected via a high-stakes chess game but then it was in 1776 and human nature hasn't changed.
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Not wasting any more time and energy tilting, Don Quixote-like, on a regulatory problem that, constitutionally, should not even exist in a free state.
I cannot change the world unlike my hero Samuel Adams—but I can change my place in it.
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  #13  
Old 03-20-2013, 10:46 AM
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Originally Posted by jdberger View Post
Y'all relax.

The Right People are all over this kind of proposed legislation.

Spoiled apple
Poison pill

Politics is warfare. Feints. Counter attacks. Flanking manouvers. Deception. And cavalry charges.

Not all our friends are Republicans.
All warfare is based on deception. Hence, when we are able to attack, we must seem unable; when using our forces, we must appear inactive; when we are near, we must make the enemy believe we are far away; when far away, we must make him believe we are near.

If your enemy is secure at all points, be prepared for him. If he is in superior strength, evade him. If your opponent is temperamental, seek to irritate him. Pretend to be weak, that he may grow arrogant. If he is taking his ease, give him no rest. If his forces are united, separate them. If sovereign and subject are in accord, put division between them. Attack him where he is unprepared, appear where you are not expected.

-- Sun Tzu
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Not wasting any more time and energy tilting, Don Quixote-like, on a regulatory problem that, constitutionally, should not even exist in a free state.
I cannot change the world unlike my hero Samuel Adams—but I can change my place in it.
Gone fishin' for now and soon gone from California.
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  #14  
Old 01-25-2013, 12:29 AM
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Wow. So Yee's SB47 lets us keep and register if we own a preban BB AR, but this guy comes in and swoops them all up

Checkmate! We're dealing with genius's here .. they are 2-3 moves ahead
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  #15  
Old 01-25-2013, 12:39 AM
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Originally Posted by Vlad 11 View Post
Wow. So Yee's SB47 lets us keep and register if we own a preban BB AR, but this guy comes in and swoops them all up

Checkmate! We're dealing with genius's here .. they are 2-3 moves ahead
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  #16  
Old 01-25-2013, 3:26 AM
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And now you see why we mock them. Their efforts would be rather amusing if it weren't our rights they were trying to violate.

-Brandon

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Originally Posted by Vlad 11 View Post
Wow. So Yee's SB47 lets us keep and register if we own a preban BB AR, but this guy comes in and swoops them all up

Checkmate! We're dealing with genius's here .. they are 2-3 moves ahead
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  #17  
Old 01-25-2013, 8:53 AM
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And now you see why we mock them. Their efforts would be rather amusing if it weren't our rights they were trying to violate.

-Brandon
QFT!
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  #18  
Old 01-25-2013, 1:00 AM
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Well, the budget is wrapped-up, highways are good to go, heck -all the infrastructure looks golden. Those schools, universities and all that should fix themselves right up with all those smart folks in 'em... Guess we just need to grab all those guns lying around and we can take care of all that crime right quick! Phew, this legislatin' is tough work!
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Old 01-25-2013, 3:51 AM
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The scary thing is in this communist state; ALL this crap could come true!!!
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Old 01-25-2013, 5:09 AM
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The scary thing is in this communist state; ALL this crap could come true!!!
Right. So much for the nasayers right here on calguns. .. "it'll never happen here", "we're too evolved for that to happen" etc. etc. All it takes is ONE seat on SCOTUS and they could and will gut the 2nd.
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Old 01-25-2013, 6:32 AM
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Old 01-25-2013, 3:44 PM
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Sums it up perfectly!!!
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Old 02-11-2013, 6:29 PM
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Old 01-25-2013, 4:01 AM
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There is not enough money in this state to confiscate all of the RAWs at current market value or settle the suits that would arise otherwise.
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Old 01-25-2013, 4:23 AM
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There is not enough money in this state to confiscate all of the RAWs at current market value or settle the suits that would arise otherwise.
HAH!!! Who said anything about fair market value? I think they just wanna take em and tell you F off.
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Old 01-25-2013, 7:20 AM
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There is not enough money in this state to confiscate all of the RAWs at current market value or settle the suits that would arise otherwise.
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HAH!!! Who said anything about fair market value? I think they just wanna take em and tell you F off.
Yes, and there's not enough money in this state to do lots of things they do - increasing the debt of California.

They shall simply "borrow" the resources necessary to implement their change for us, then worry about paying for the services at a later date - or not...

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Old 01-25-2013, 4:28 AM
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Originally Posted by Dutch3 View Post
There is not enough money in this state to confiscate all of the RAWs at current market value or settle the suits that would arise otherwise.
Yeah... It was called the "Stimulus package"... You'll be getting your own tax dollars back!!

Then they'll tax you on it come tax time cause its "earned income"

Last edited by HDgasser; 01-25-2013 at 4:52 AM..
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Old 01-25-2013, 4:56 AM
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I think they consistently underestimate how many hundreds of thousands of these guns are in circulation. The state does not have the money to compensate for all the "grandfathered" guns.

At least he can tell his constituents that he tried to save the beh-behs.
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Old 01-25-2013, 11:27 AM
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I think they consistently underestimate how many hundreds of thousands of these guns are in circulation. The state does not have the money to compensate for all the "grandfathered" guns.

At least he can tell his constituents that he tried to save the beh-behs.
Compensate? Who the hell thinks they are going to compensate anyone?

I foresee two options at the most.

#1. Remove your "grandfathered" firearm from this state and store it in another.
#2. Deliver your "grandfathered" firearm into the waiting hands of your local LEO to be carted off to the foundry to be melted into re-bar to air in rebuilding CA's aging infrastructure. You will receive a hearty handshake and a thank you for your donation from the representative of our lords and masters.
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Old 01-26-2013, 7:14 AM
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Originally Posted by Dutch3 View Post
There is not enough money in this state to confiscate all of the RAWs at current market value or settle the suits that would arise otherwise.
This is no problem for the state. They just issue an IOU with the pay off date in 2063

Most of the owners will be in a box or a jar on the shelf by then. Oh and the IOU is non-transferable.
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Old 01-27-2013, 9:41 PM
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Originally Posted by Dutch3 View Post
There is not enough money in this state to confiscate all of the RAWs at current market value or settle the suits that would arise otherwise.
If we estimate that there are 1 million guns to confiscate, and they'll pay $1,000 for each one, then it comes to $1 billion.

What's another billion now that the budget has been balanced and the deficit is no longer a problem?
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Old 01-25-2013, 5:07 AM
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And people say we have pro gun demokrats here. Stupidity at its best.f
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  #33  
Old 01-25-2013, 6:52 AM
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If I had guns and ammo they wanted I would let them have my ammo 1st. jk.
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  #34  
Old 01-25-2013, 6:58 AM
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where, do these people come from??? what planet ???
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Old 01-25-2013, 7:22 AM
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4A rights violation would be a billion dollar lawsuit
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  #36  
Old 01-25-2013, 7:32 AM
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WTF do they plan to do? Knock on every door to take our guns ???
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Old 01-25-2013, 7:39 AM
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These "grandfather" clauses are not there because the legislature wants to be nice to gun owners. These clauses are there because ex post facto laws are unconstitutional.

You may as well say, I know it was perfectly legal to drive down 1st st last week, but we are making it illegal, and further anyone who in fact drove down 1st st, ever is guilty of breaking that law.

This is a non-starter. I am also dumbfounded that this would even be broached by a member of the legislature.

Disgusting.
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Old 01-25-2013, 7:51 AM
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These "grandfather" clauses are not there because the legislature wants to be nice to gun owners. These clauses are there because ex post facto laws are unconstitutional.

You may as well say, I know it was perfectly legal to drive down 1st st last week, but we are making it illegal, and further anyone who in fact drove down 1st st, ever is guilty of breaking that law.

This is a non-starter. I am also dumbfounded that this would even be broached by a member of the legislature.

Disgusting.
This guy is the reason that I propose a Constitutional Amendment permanently banning ANY author/co-author of ANY legislation found to be in violation of the Constitution.

There should be VERY SEVERE penalties for trying to violate the highest law of our land. These "servants" continually dance around the grey areas of the Constitution, and if they go too far, they just get to try again and again until the courts either allow their transgression or the people run out of money to fight in the courts.

This should be a "one and done" offense. Serving in politics is a PRIVILEDGE, not a RIGHT. Using that privilege to violate other's rights should have severe repercussions. I would even suggest that willfully violating the Constitution is a form of treason, but that's a future amendment.
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"The cases will publish forever the discouraging truth that the Supreme Court of the United States favors some laws over others, and is prepared to do whatever it takes to uphold and assist its favorites."
-Anton Scalia, Supreme Court Justice
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  #39  
Old 01-25-2013, 3:50 PM
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CBruce CBruce is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Wherryj View Post
This guy is the reason that I propose a Constitutional Amendment permanently banning ANY author/co-author of ANY legislation found to be in violation of the Constitution.

There should be VERY SEVERE penalties for trying to violate the highest law of our land. These "servants" continually dance around the grey areas of the Constitution, and if they go too far, they just get to try again and again until the courts either allow their transgression or the people run out of money to fight in the courts.

This should be a "one and done" offense. Serving in politics is a PRIVILEDGE, not a RIGHT. Using that privilege to violate other's rights should have severe repercussions. I would even suggest that willfully violating the Constitution is a form of treason, but that's a future amendment.
Make the state liable for any court costs for laws tossed out as unconstiutional by the courts and then let the legistlation police itself.

I don't expect every individual representative to be constitutional scholars, but there's enough people working to figure out what's what.
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  #40  
Old 01-26-2013, 8:03 PM
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saki302 saki302 is offline
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Would you care to run for office?

You've got MY vote!

-Dave

Quote:
Originally Posted by Wherryj View Post
This guy is the reason that I propose a Constitutional Amendment permanently banning ANY author/co-author of ANY legislation found to be in violation of the Constitution.

There should be VERY SEVERE penalties for trying to violate the highest law of our land. These "servants" continually dance around the grey areas of the Constitution, and if they go too far, they just get to try again and again until the courts either allow their transgression or the people run out of money to fight in the courts.

This should be a "one and done" offense. Serving in politics is a PRIVILEDGE, not a RIGHT. Using that privilege to violate other's rights should have severe repercussions. I would even suggest that willfully violating the Constitution is a form of treason, but that's a future amendment.
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