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Rimfire Firearms .22, .17 and other Rimfire Handguns and Rifles

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  #1  
Old 09-23-2012, 8:24 AM
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Default survival rifles.

I just can make up my mind. I want a survival rifle. I am looking at the Henry Ar7, the 10/22 td, and the Savage model 42. I really like the AR7 size break down. I like the Reliability of the Ruger. I like the duel cal of the Savage. I'm concerned with the accuracy of the Henry. It seams weak. I already have a 10/22 that is fully customized.
Any ideas or inputs? Thanx.
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Old 09-23-2012, 10:22 AM
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Just throwing another into the ring: Marlin 70PPS "Papoose"
Probably the most accurate of all of the ones listed.
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  #3  
Old 09-24-2012, 7:46 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Chaos47 View Post
Just throwing another into the ring: Marlin 70PPS "Papoose"
Probably the most accurate of all of the ones listed.
Can you find one? I couldn't for the life of me. I ended up buying the Ruger 10/22TD and no regrets. They are accurate as heck too. I can shoot a quarter sized group at 75 yards with my 2-7 power scope. Gun is more accurate than I am with the right ammo.
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Old 09-23-2012, 10:55 AM
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Originally Posted by StudioDison View Post
I just can make up my mind. I want a survival rifle. I am looking at the Henry Ar7, the 10/22 td, and the Savage model 42. I really like the AR7 size break down. I like the Reliability of the Ruger. I like the duel cal of the Savage. I'm concerned with the accuracy of the Henry. It seams weak. I already have a 10/22 that is fully customized.
Any ideas or inputs? Thanx.
StudioDison,

Regardless of which rifle you choose you still have to test it using various brands of ammo and select which one demostrates the best accuracy out that particular rifle. All the rifles you mentioned are good picks but there are others like Chaos47 had mentioned in his posting.

If you like the Henry for hardcore survival packing you can't beat it's portability. Now Ruger has it's own version that is a good competitor but the Henry is not bad in my book.

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  #5  
Old 09-23-2012, 10:56 AM
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Since you already have a 10/22, you might want to look into a decent bolt action .22 LR rifle. And put a scope on it so that it can be an accurate small game hunter.
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  #6  
Old 09-23-2012, 10:56 AM
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so you are looking for a .22 that breaks down in half?
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  #7  
Old 09-23-2012, 12:28 PM
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I have a 10/22 TD with simmons 22 mag scope and Kidd "trigger job" trigger kit, shoots REALLY well and I'm decently accurate with it offhand. I have no problems hitting targets at 50 yards which is the furthest I have shot it so far. I break it down before and after every range trip but it's held zero just fine, only thing I don't like is the front iron sight since my vision is so crappy I can barely see it.
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Old 09-23-2012, 1:25 PM
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You might look into the Sig 522. Its pretty accurate for a semiauto 22 with a 16" barrel. It doesn't exactly break down but it has a folding stock which folds to 26.1" and it is pretty light so its easy to carry around all day. You can get (in free states) 25 rd mags for it and they are VERY reliable. It has very few moving parts and its really easy to take apart and clean.
Only downside is the price. Cheapest I have ever seen them for is $450 out the door.
Good luck on your search.
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Old 09-23-2012, 1:45 PM
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I have one of these. It's pretty nice to be able to stow an extra mag in the stock. At 4 lbs it's pretty light.

http://www.keltecweapons.com/our-guns/rifles/su-22/

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  #10  
Old 09-23-2012, 8:28 PM
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I have one of these. It's pretty nice to be able to stow an extra mag in the stock. At 4 lbs it's pretty light.

http://www.keltecweapons.com/our-guns/rifles/su-22/

Those would be nice if it weren't for the fact that the standard cap magazines are considered WMD's in this sorry state. That's really the only thing that keeps me from getting one.
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  #11  
Old 09-23-2012, 1:45 PM
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Since you have a 10/22 already, you could always get a Butler Creek folding stock. The gun won't fully break in half, but when the stock is folded, the rifle is very compact (and you can still fire it!).
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Old 09-24-2012, 12:43 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Donkeypunch0420 View Post
Since you have a 10/22 already, you could always get a Butler Creek folding stock. The gun won't fully break in half, but when the stock is folded, the rifle is very compact (and you can still fire it!).
I know rimfire laws are vaguely different in our state's AWB, but are folding stocks OK with a detachable mag?
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  #13  
Old 09-24-2012, 12:55 AM
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I know rimfire laws are vaguely different in our state's AWB, but are folding stocks OK with a detachable mag?
This should help
http://www.calguns.net/calgunforum/s...d.php?t=586074
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26" minimum overall length for both the Feds and CA.

Feds measure the firearm in it's longest fire-able position (stock extended/open).

CA measure the firearm in it's shortest fire-able position (stock collapsed/closed).

Because you are in CA, you need to make sure that the firearm has a 26" or greater overall length when the firearm is in it's shortest fire-able position (stock collapsed/closed).
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  #14  
Old 09-24-2012, 6:49 AM
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Lots of great info. Thank you.
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  #15  
Old 09-23-2012, 2:49 PM
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How about a Browning SA22? It breaks down and much nicer than a 10/22.
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  #16  
Old 09-23-2012, 2:55 PM
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Chipmunk 22.....
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  #17  
Old 09-23-2012, 6:54 PM
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I have Henry AR-7. It jams now and then. Also the sight picture is very awkward due to stock design. Try shooting someone else' AR-7 before buying.
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Old 09-24-2012, 7:53 AM
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If you are really into survival, it seems you have the .22 covered with the 10/22. Perhaps you should consider a shotgun. The "circuit judge" comes to mind in that it shoots a .410 shotgun and a .45 Colt. Both these can put different game on the table if need be. In a survival situation, that is where the focus needs to be, providing game/protein for the table. Your body cannot survive for long without protein, especially if you are having to work it hard during tough times.
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  #19  
Old 09-24-2012, 8:48 AM
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One of the few guns I've ever gotten rid of was an AR7. Unless you need the floating feature, I'd go for something else. I do have a M6 but, it's on the heavy side. A 10-22 takedown isn't a bad suggestion. I like the suggestion of a Chipmunk better though. Personally, I'd go with a Winchester 1906 since, it is light enough, breaks down very easily and is a pump action repeater. Besides, I just have a thing for gallery guns in general.
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  #20  
Old 09-24-2012, 9:47 AM
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Baikal MP94, aka the cheapest 22/.410 firearm available. With the .410 and the 22, you can take down any animal in the U.S. if you put your mind to it. (available at my local gunshop for only $250, too!) Don't let the price scare ya: This is a really nice gun, it's made at Izmash for pete's sake! It's nice and compact to boot!



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Old 11-30-2012, 8:11 AM
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Baikal MP94, aka the cheapest 22/.410 firearm available. With the .410 and the 22, you can take down any animal in the U.S. if you put your mind to it. (available at my local gunshop for only $250, too!) Don't let the price scare ya: This is a really nice gun, it's made at Izmash for pete's sake! It's nice and compact to boot!



Remington used to sell them under their banner. My step son bought one and I'm pretty impressed with the quality.
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Old 09-24-2012, 10:05 AM
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Why not T/C Contender, it is a single shot, but you can have as many calibers as you want, have it as rifle or handgun and it can be stowed in a very small and light package.

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  #23  
Old 09-25-2012, 12:17 PM
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Originally Posted by MyOdessa View Post
Why not T/C Contender, it is a single shot, but you can have as many calibers as you want, have it as rifle or handgun and it can be stowed in a very small and light package.

although I dont need it as a survival rifle the T/C contender is something Im interested
want to get it in .22, .223, 50S&W, and a few others
would be a fun firearm to have
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Old 09-24-2012, 10:10 AM
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Will someone just buy one of these already so you can tell the rest of us about it.
I was about 2min. away from ordering one when something more pressing came up and gobbled up some $.
I know it's extreme but I think we all own some guns that don't make since to others.

http://www.packrifle.com/
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Old 11-30-2012, 5:02 AM
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On top of it there is a dealer in the Bay Area and they are made in Cali!
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Old 11-30-2012, 6:58 AM
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On top of it there is a dealer in the Bay Area and they are made in Cali!

They seem to be made in Utah. Mountainview is a fairly common name.

Last edited by hakenlag; 11-30-2012 at 7:01 AM..
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Old 09-24-2012, 1:52 PM
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I have a Henry Minibolt and a Papoose. The Papoose has the advantage of semi auto with a 10 round mag. The Henry can be taken down with a dime (one screw in stock) and has the advantage of feeding ANY .22, short, long, long rifle.

The Henry is locked in my wifes Jeep and I have the Papoose. Both are Stainless steel high quality American Made firearms with good reputations...
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Old 09-24-2012, 3:18 PM
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OP, if you can’t pick one then buy them all. Of the three that you listed, they all seem to have their own positive attributes. The Henry made AR-7, with its waterproof protection, would make a good option for a person who would use it for river rafting trips, canoeing and fishing. Its light weight and compact storage would also allow it to be used for backpacking trips. In addition, Henry has a reputation for standing behind its products with great customer service, if for some reason the AR-7 fails to function properly.

Even though I already own several different versions of the 10/22, I purchased a couple of the 10/22 Take Down rifles when they first came out and am glad I did. One 10/22 TD is still unfired while the other has been shot and has functioned flawlessly using the stock 10 round magazine. I would like to note that some of my older 10 round 10/22 magazines had problems fitting into my 10/22 TD because the mag well was a bit tight. Other than that, the 10/22 TD shot well with different types of ammo (Fed 550 value pack, Fed AutoMatch, Winchester 555 value pack and Blazer 525 value pack). The 10/22 TD has no problem returning to zero after breaking it down and reassembling it. I’ve shot my 10/22 TD with the stock trigger pull at 5lbs 12oz and was content with its performance using both open sights and a scope. I recently upgraded my 10/22 TD with a Kidd 10/22 “trigger job” kit which changed my trigger pull to 2lbs 8oz. After performing the modification I can see a noticeable decrease in my shot groups and I’m very happy with the Kidd trigger. The 10/22 TD is a solid gun and fun to shoot.

The Savage 42 may be a good overall option but is heavier and slow to reload compared to your other two options. However, if your purpose is to put meat in the pot then rapid fire is not necessarily required. The jury is still out on the Savage 42 since it’s still new and is only chambered for .22lr and .410. I own several Savage Model 24 combos (predecessor to the 42) which are chambered in a variety of calibers. I own several in .22lr over .410 and a .22lr over 20ga. I prefer my Model 24 with the .22lr over 20ga and it comes with me on every camping trip. On my camping trips, whenever it’s possible/legal, I’ll pull out the Model 24 to bust clay pigeons with the 20ga and plink targets with the .22lr. In general, combo guns are great for hunting because when you are looking for targets of opportunity you can decide, in a matter of seconds, which round is best for the situation. Years back I watched a program on the Discovery Channel call Out Of The Wild: The Alaska Experiment. On the program I believe the participants had a .22lr/.410 combo (most likely a Savage 24). The gun was heavy but did function well and provided the participants with “meat on the table”.

Overall, I like the option of having rifles and shotguns with a take down feature. When the gun is taken down the profile of the gun is diminished and can fit into a smaller/discreet bag. Take down guns can be cleaned from the chamber instead of the muzzle. The compact size of a take down allows it to be stored easily when not in use or when space is an issue.

Here are some pictures of my 10/22 TD, Savage 24 and others (M6 Scout, Taurus 62 and Norinco ATD).








Here is a picture of the Ruger 10/22 TD shooting open sights with stock trigger at 20 yards (10 shot groups).




Here is a picture of the Ruger 10/22 TD using a 3x-7x scope and Kidd trigger job at 20 yards (20 shot groups). Left is Federal 550 value pack and right is Fed AutoMatch.



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Old 09-25-2012, 12:42 PM
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You know, I'll second the Papoose, but only the new model. I have one of those, and one of the older models (blued steel instead of stainless), and the new one is far superior. And the case it comes in floats, if you worry about that kind of thing. I was stuck doing a prolonged move a few years back, and the only .22 I had access to was my papoose. It did everything I needed it to, and was a real tack-driver to boot. My target 10/22 will outshoot it, but is nowhere near as handy. If you can find one, I highly recommend them.

One other gun that you might consider is the Crickett. Somebody mentioned the Chipmunk. The Crickett is the same concept. A single-shot, kid-sized .22 LR bolt action. The sights are good. It is almost indestructible. It is very light weight. And even with the child-sized stock, it is still quite useable by adults. You can put a scope on it if you want. I have used my daughter's to take out rabbits and varmints. She used it to take her first rabbit. And they actually make them with adult-sized stocks now, along with a .22 WRM version. Not bad for around $120. Just something to think about.

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Old 09-25-2012, 9:03 PM
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I would probably get a Marlin Papoose if it was available and if i were you.
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Old 09-26-2012, 12:05 AM
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The AR-7 is a jam-o-matic and not that accurate. The new Ruger 10/22 Take Down is a fine rifle, but weighs about a pound too much. Same with the Savage 42, it could lose a pound and being single shot, doesn't have the firepower of some of the other options. The Marlin Papoose wins the contest IMHO. Too bad it isn't made anymore.

My choice for the best survival rifle made today is the Kel-Tec SU-16. It weighs about the same as the 10/22 TD and the Savage 42, but it's a 5.56x45 instead of a .22 LR. It'll take your pre-ban hi-cap AR-15 mags too.
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Old 09-26-2012, 8:53 AM
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The AR-7 is a jam-o-matic and not that accurate.
I kind of disagree with the AR-7 Statement. My Henry AR-7 (black honeycomb) has seen over 1000 rounds of Remington cheap bulk ammo by the brick in the past month without jamming. As far as accuracy goes, I am not a very good shot (old eyes), but when I put the $15 wallyworld scope on it, at 25 yards i am getting 1" groups, consistently.

It did not like the winchester bulk ammo, so i fed that through my revolvers.

Yes I do agree that the 10/22 is a more accurate rifle, but for a lightweight rifle that fits in an ammo can in the back of my jeep, this is perfect.

John
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Old 09-26-2012, 9:06 AM
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The AR-7 is a jam-o-matic and not that accurate.
That would be the original Arma-lite and Charter Arms rifles. Low quality control, and cheap material.

Henry now makes an awesome AR-7, which doesn't jam much at all (not any more than an actual AR-15), is accurate, and is made to a very high standard with quality material.

I personally like the rifle, except for the fact that magazines are expensive and nobody makes reliable hi-caps for them.

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Old 09-26-2012, 4:26 PM
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Evolution1974,

Nice collection!!!!!

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Originally Posted by surplus-addict View Post
That would be the original Arma-lite and Charter Arms rifles. Low quality control, and cheap material.

Henry now makes an awesome AR-7, which doesn't jam much at all (not any more than an actual AR-15), is accurate, and is made to a very high standard with quality material.

I personally like the rifle, except for the fact that magazines are expensive and nobody makes reliable hi-caps for them.
I got rid of my Henry AR-7 because, it was a POS. I hate parting with .22lrs but, the Henry is the only one which I never had any sellers remorse after parting with it. Hell, I got rid of that and still have a few RG revolvers. That should tell you something.
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Old 09-26-2012, 1:10 PM
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The Marlin Papoose wins the contest IMHO. Too bad it isn't made anymore.
Where exactly did you get that idea? It is still listed on Marlin's websight. And I still see them in stores fairly often. They changed the model number a while back, when they went to the Stainless version. But as far as I can tell, they are still making them.

-Mb
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Old 09-26-2012, 1:34 PM
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Originally Posted by gun toting monkeyboy View Post
Where exactly did you get that idea? It is still listed on Marlin's websight. And I still see them in stores fairly often. They changed the model number a while back, when they went to the Stainless version. But as far as I can tell, they are still making them.

-Mb
They are no longer being made. That's why the one's you see in stores have gone from $99 to $250+.

Marlin still has them on their website because they do in fact plan on making them again. But when Remington bought Marlin, they closed the factory in Connecticut in 2010 and moved production to New York and Kentucky. They have not yet begun producing the Papoose. Who knows when they will start up production again.

Also, the Marlin firearms being produced at the new plants are of much lower quality compared to those that were produced in CT. So even if the Papoose is manufactured again, expect a lower quality product.
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Last edited by k1dude; 09-26-2012 at 6:24 PM.. Reason: spelling
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Old 11-28-2012, 1:13 PM
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Originally Posted by k1dude View Post
They are no longer being made. That's why the one's you see in stores have gone from $99 to $250+.

Marlin still has them on their website because they do in fact plan on making them again. But when Remington bought Marlin, they closed the factory in Connecticut in 2010 and moved production to New York and Kentucky. They have not yet begun producing the Papoose. Who knows when they will start up production again.

Also, the Marlin firearms being produced at the new plants are of much lower quality compared to those that were produced in CT. So even if the Papoose is manufactured again, expect a lower quality product.
You seem to know a lot about the Papoose. Do you know what year a stainless 70PSS with a red case might be? I thought all the recent ones came with blue cases.

I've been trying to buy a mint one for a few months. Even for $300+ it's not easy.
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Old 11-29-2012, 12:22 AM
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Originally Posted by Leonidimus View Post
You seem to know a lot about the Papoose. Do you know what year a stainless 70PSS with a red case might be? I thought all the recent ones came with blue cases.

I've been trying to buy a mint one for a few months. Even for $300+ it's not easy.
Sorry. Can't help you about the red vs blue case. I was interested in buying a Papoose and began to wonder why I couldn't find any. The only one I found was $250 and I remembered about a year earlier they were all over the place for $99. So I began my research and found out what had happened with the move. So I'm not an expert on Marlin's or Papoose's, I just did a little digging to find out what was going on.
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Old 11-27-2012, 8:33 PM
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Originally Posted by k1dude View Post
The Marlin Papoose wins the contest IMHO. Too bad it isn't made anymore.
Does anyone know what a New In Box (red zippered bag) In a marlin box, never fired, Blue steel with 3 new magazines, Marlin Papoose is worth?

I haven't seen any for sale in many years.
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Old 11-30-2012, 12:38 AM
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Does anyone know what a New In Box (red zippered bag) In a marlin box, never fired, Blue steel with 3 new magazines, Marlin Papoose is worth?

I haven't seen any for sale in many years.
If you mean old Marlin 70P with a wooden stock, I've seen them much more often than 70PSS on gunbroker while I was looking for 70PSS. They're a little cheaper than 70PSS, so I guess 70P would be $250-300.
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