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Old 10-05-2012, 6:30 PM
Scuba Steve33 Scuba Steve33 is offline
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Originally Posted by tacticalcity View Post
Well I don't buy either of your arguments. You were trying to be insulting, you just didn't expect it to backfire on you. Because you know how uncool it is to insult people's military service even if they weren't in as cool a unit as yours. And my post does pertain the subject at hand. The role of women in the military is expanding. I cited first hand examples of how those roles have changed just in the past 20 years or so. 20 years ago it was pilots, subs and support staff. Soon enough, if not already, it will be special operations. 20 years ago if you told somebody the Air Force had combot controllers that did what they do people would not have believed you. As far as they were concerned the air force just flew the planes and everybody was a pilot. Even guys who served with them in the field had no idea they were Air Force and that the Air Force did those kinds of things. Now days pretty much everyone has heard of them. There is always more going on out there than most people, even those actively serving, know about. Thus it would not surprise me to find out a year or two from now that women are serving in special operations units, just we were not told about it because of the very nature of those units...and to do so would put a GIANT spot light on a soldier/sailor/airman/marine who need anonymity to do their job. Hence there is a possibility a tab could mean more than we think...if not today, then soon enough.

The problem is not the women. It is the men and our mindset when it comes to women. We see a pretty girl with her face all shot up and we freak out. We spend time trying to save a woman that cannot be saved instead of moving on to somebody we can save or continuing on with the mission as ordered. That's the only argument I've heard against women serving in combat roles that made sense to me. But it is flawed. As women in combat becomes a normal thing, the attitudes of the men serving with them will change.

As for the mental toughness issue, and the physical prowess issue, selection solves that. If they cannot hack selection with the same gender neutral standards then they shouldn't get in. If they can...then they should be allowed to. Few men can hack it. I would assume even fewer women would be able to as well. So either you have faith in the selection process to weed out those who can't do the job or you don't. And if you don't...then what does that say about the process itself and those who have passed it?

I served with women that had no business being in the military. Wrong mindset. Wrong attitude. Wrong everything. Just as I served with men who had no business being in the military for the same reasons. They get found out pretty quickly and get shuffled into role where they can do little to no harm if not kicked out all together. I also served with women I would absolutely trust to have my back in a firefight and would want by my side in a fox hole over plenty of the men in my flight. It was all about mindset and skillset...not gender. The fact that they were more fun to look at was just a bonus.
Dude if you honestly took my post as insulting you need much thicker skin. You were in the military correct? Why are you taking this as a personal attack? You should have learned to not take anything personal. Plus it looks pretty stupid for you to call me out on insults when you posted an image attempting to do the same thing. The difference is I laughed at the picture you posted because it was funny. I didn't ***** about it. I have no problem with you or your views. It's great you are in favor of women serving in combat roles but you don't need to try and turn this into a personal argument.

Have you served as a combat MOS with a deployment to a COP in the middle of nowhere? If you have then your views on women serving in those roles is unique as the guys who have been in those positions all disagree with you. I'm not asking you that in a negative way at all. It's different for someone who has never been there to say women can do it when they simply do not understand the circumstances. You claim men will not favor women more if they are serving with them regularly. That is completely false. Why? It still happens in non-infantry units today. A convoy gets hit and women are the first to be attended to. The IDF did it and it was a terrible choice.

I don't disagree with you that it will probably happen. That doesn't mean it's a good idea. You keep bringing up points that something didn't happen twenty years ago. Just because something changes doesn't mean it's the right move. How is the Army going to provide the proper living spaces for the few females in a line platoon when that platoon doesn't even have enough space for all their men?

Again, if you took anything I said as an insult I don't know what to tell you. I'm not going to apologize for something that you are taking way too seriously.
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