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-   -   The top 3 polymer striker fired pistols (http://www.calguns.net/calgunforum/showthread.php?t=697222)

RollingCode3 02-05-2013 6:39 PM

The top 3 polymer striker fired pistols
 
I've owned multiple Glocks, XDs, Rugers, XDMs, M&Ps, and Walthers.

All of these guns are very well made. I didnít care much for the Springfield XD or Ruger SR series. In my opinion, the top 3 striker fired pistols are Glock, M&P, and Walther PPQ. I like them all. Each has unique characteristics and none are perfect.

Glock- nice factory trigger - easy to work on, very cheap ($398 blue label) - huge aftermarket support. The Glock has a much lower bore axis too which means better recoil control. Cheap mags. It takes time to fall in love with the Glock platform. I used to hate them...Now I own 4 Glocks.

M&P---Great ergonomics . Accurate and reliable. Horrible trigger out of the box but I can live with that. Low bore axis.

PPQ---super accurate, great trigger. High bore axis. That causes lots of muzzle flip and slower follow up shots. Wather mags are EXPENSIVE and very hard to find.

I can shoot my Glocks and M&P much faster than the Walther PQQ due to the low bore axis. I switched from Glock to M&P and now back to GLock. :oji:

(Out of 10)

Ergonomics:
GLock -8
M&P-9
Walther 8

Trigger:
Glock-9
M&P-8
Walther-10

Muzzle flip/bore axis:
Glock- 9
M&P-9
Walther-7


http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v1...s/IMG_1120.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v1...s/IMG_1123.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v1...25C18CACD3.jpg

chrisf 02-05-2013 6:42 PM

How could you not put the XD in? That hurts! And you rate a glock a 8 in ergos? What have you been sniffin'?

Mr310 02-05-2013 6:44 PM

Because there's no clear winner based on the points, I am curious to ask..


If you could only have one, which would it be? This is for all usage, and if you carry one for work, that too.

11011500a 02-05-2013 6:51 PM

Steyr M > sweet all around
Steyr S
?

ElvenSoul 02-05-2013 6:52 PM

HI Point is da best dog!

BoJackUSMC 02-05-2013 6:56 PM

Nice collection you got there.... very nice

Nickgt40 02-05-2013 7:01 PM

As long as everyone realizes this numbers are nothing but subjective then we'll all be OK.

Ziggy91 02-05-2013 7:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nickgt40 (Post 10438422)
As long as everyone realizes this numbers are nothing but subjective then we'll all be OK.

WE'RE NOT OK :26:




jk... but thanks for inlcuding the G34 :D

INFAMOUS762X39 02-05-2013 7:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ElvenSoul (Post 10438330)
HI Point is da best dog!

+P rated All day every day haha.

tbc 02-05-2013 7:08 PM

Nice review OP. My rating on the ergo is different though.

Glock = 7
M&P = 9
Walther = 9


And my best striker-fire pistol is HK P7M8 hands down.





Sent from iPhone

goldengate 02-05-2013 7:13 PM

I know it is your opinion, but I find it interesting on how you rank the Glock and the PPQ the same in ergonomic. Like you, I've shot all 3 handguns and agree with almost everything in the review, but not the ergonomic category. The PPQ and MP9 should be a tie, and the Glock is one level below them.

Xanatos 02-05-2013 7:20 PM

This is such a troll/obvious Glock fanboy thread. There's hardly any real unbiased information and what information is present is horribly misleading. I hope some new or soon to be gun owner doesn't read your "review" and attempt to make an intelligent decision based off of it.

daybreak 02-05-2013 7:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Xanatos (Post 10438643)
This is such a troll/obvious Glock fanboy thread. There's hardly any real unbiased information and what information is present is horribly misleading. I hope some new or soon to be gun owner doesn't read your "review" and attempt to make an intelligent decision based off of it.

lol ok dude.

RollingCode3 02-05-2013 7:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Xanatos (Post 10438643)
This is such a troll/obvious Glock fanboy thread. There's hardly any real unbiased information and what information is present is horribly misleading. I hope some new or soon to be gun owner doesn't read your "review" and attempt to make an intelligent decision based off of it.

:rolleyes: You joined the forum less than 8 months ago with less 150 posts and you called me a troll? thanks for your opinion dude. If you have nothing positive to add, please stay out of the thread. :facepalm:

Dragon 02-05-2013 7:44 PM

More glock nut swinging:rolleyes:

M&P
and i dont even own one.

RollingCode3 02-05-2013 7:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by goldengate (Post 10438567)
I know it is your opinion, but I find it interesting on how you rank the Glock and the PPQ the same in ergonomic. Like you, I've shot all 3 handguns and agree with almost everything in the review, but not the ergonomic category. The PPQ and MP9 should be a tie, and the Glock is one level below them.

The PPQ feels like a toy gun in my hands. It is way too light and slippery. I am still waiting for someone to sell those sandpaper/rubber add on grips for the PPQ.

goldengate 02-05-2013 8:12 PM

Too light? It weighs as much as the G17. If you are complaining about it being too slippery, then get some skater tape, http://www.amazon.com/b?ie=UTF8&node=3416161

Out of curiosity, why did you rank the Glock ergonomic the same as the PPQ?

Bug Splat 02-05-2013 8:24 PM

Glock and M&P are my fav too. Its really a tie between the two for me. M&P gets the nod in ergo's but glocks holds a deep trust with me. I also love the glock trigger. After they smooth out they are just amazing. Love the super short reset.

FX-05 Xiuhcoatl 02-05-2013 8:28 PM

1. M&P
2. M&P
3. M&P

Haplo 02-05-2013 8:37 PM

What grip is that on your Glock?

Xanatos 02-05-2013 8:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RollingCode3 (Post 10438902)
:rolleyes: You joined the forum less than 8 months ago with less 150 posts and you called me a troll? thanks for your opinion dude. If you have nothing positive to add, please stay out of the thread. :facepalm:

Because my length of residency in this **** *** state dictates my knowledge of firearms. Keep trolling.

Don't get all butthurt at me because I called out your Glock fanboy propensities.

otteray 02-05-2013 8:49 PM

I just don't like the grip on the Glock. It feels too fat to me.
So I prefer the .45acp XD's grip; I can draw and get on target pretty darn quick with it. It hasn't been finicky about my money saving wheel weight cast lead SWC loads, either. These work every time; a few thousand so far.
But let's face it, just about all these modern pistols are pretty awesome. We live in some good times with reliable choices for anyone's preferences.

ExtremeX 02-05-2013 8:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by chrisf (Post 10438208)
How could you not put the XD in? That hurts! And you rate a glock a 8 in ergos? What have you been sniffin'?

^^ This

I am pretty fond of the M&P too… but the XD just does it for me.

border.bandito 02-05-2013 8:59 PM

:slap:

oh, btw...XD gets my vote. Glocks are for girls.

uhlan1 02-05-2013 9:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Xanatos (Post 10438643)
This is such a troll/obvious Glock fanboy thread. There's hardly any real unbiased information and what information is present is horribly misleading. I hope some new or soon to be gun owner doesn't read your "review" and attempt to make an intelligent decision based off of it.

Unduly and undeservedly harsh. Nice post and collection OP.
I have all three. all fine guns. The PPQ is my favorite for the range. But someone comes over the fence I'd prefer the Glock, especially, the G20, have higher confidence it will go boom when ordered.

DRAB_81 02-05-2013 9:11 PM

It's hilarious how all the haters start crying any time someone says they like Glocks more than M&P's or XD's (or just that they like Glocks in general).

All you Glock Haters constantly point out that it's subjective & all about personal preference, but when someone'e personal preference isn't yours, they're wrong. Even after guys like RC3 and myself have owned and shot 1000's of rounds through just about everything out there, we're still fanboys if we prefer Glocks.

FUBAR 02-05-2013 9:23 PM

Alot of people have issues with the ergos on the Glock. I've owned a boatload of handguns but I shoot the Glocks best. Well, actually the 1911 shoots best but it's too heavy to carry all day. I've owned and carried the M&P's as well but I felt more comfortable with Glocks. I guess after shooting it for so many years, it has become second nature to draw and place shots where I want them with good fast follow ups. I like the angle of the grip and feels natural. Don't ask why, it just does. I also have a Ruger SR9. I like this gun. Nice trigger, low bore axis makes it a good shooter. The little safety sometimes pinches my palm when I ride the slide back. The XD is nice when slow firing but once you start picking up the pace, that muzzle flip becomes a issue for me. Same thing with the HK USP's. Everyone has their preferences and opinions. If you don't agree with my opinion, so what?

SacTown 02-05-2013 9:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DRAB_81 (Post 10439851)
It's hilarious how all the haters start crying any time someone says they like Glocks more than M&P's or XD's (or just that they like Glocks in general).

All you Glock Haters constantly point out that it's subjective & all about personal preference, but when someone'e personal preference isn't yours, they're wrong. Even after guys like RC3 and myself have owned and shot 1000's of rounds through just about everything out there, we're still fanboys if we prefer Glocks.

So true. You make a comparison and claim the XD is top dog in your opinion over the Glock and no one really cares, but you mention the Glock is your favorite and booom. You get torched. LOL

Pretty much impossible to make any comparison of your own personal opinion on Glocks/M&Ps/Walthers/XD without people getting all butt hurt. LOL I think that is hilarious. Different strokes for different folks. Who really cares what handgun is MY favorite anyways? People should really care about what is best for them after they have sent thousands of rounds down range.

BTW I prefer Glocks.
:hide:

Whatisthis? 02-05-2013 9:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DRAB_81 (Post 10439851)
It's hilarious how all the haters start crying any time someone says they like Glocks more than M&P's or XD's (or just that they like Glocks in general).

All you Glock Haters constantly point out that it's subjective & all about personal preference, but when someone'e personal preference isn't yours, they're wrong. Even after guys like RC3 and myself have owned and shot 1000's of rounds through just about everything out there, we're still fanboys if we prefer Glocks.

QFT.

I'm arguably a GLOCK fanboy... and I love M&Ps, possibly more than my GLOCKs.

Totally unbiased: GLOCKs are durable, reliable, and extremely customizable. Yes, some people don't like them... and they don't have to shoot them. The earth keeps spinning.

And ya, RC3 has reviewed many firearms and clearly has shot a lot of rounds through many different handguns. This is not a GLOCK fanboy thread.

Bug Splat 02-05-2013 9:46 PM

ALRIGHT, EVERYONE FREEZE!

I'm with the internet police..... and there have been complaints :detective:

Seriously, if you feel its your duty to prove someones opinion is wrong you need to chill the flip out and take it somewhere else. Don't come into a thread and crap all over it because you disagree. Show some class and respect. Sheesh :rolleyes:

Sam 02-05-2013 9:55 PM

Funny, I originally owned a Glock, purchased a bunch of M&Ps and then sold them all and purchased a bunch of Glocks. I owned a G19 and didn't really care for it. I bought a bunch of M&Ps, Apexed them out and generally enjoyed them. I then bought a G17 to carry and so I could use all the standard capacity magazines I've got. I didn't really want to carry the G19 since it was my father's. Now I've purchased three new G34s in the last two months and haven't looked back. I think after shooting the G17 for a bit I realized that how a gun feels doesn't make as much of a difference as the other shooting characteristics of a pistol. If it does everything else well then I can put up with the fact that it is slightly less uncomfortable when just holding the thing.

In California, with standard capacity magazines, I'm happy to be sticking with the Glock. In a free state, where I could get standard capacity magazines for the M&P, I'd really have to spend some time at the range with a shot timer to figure out if one shot better than the other for me.

The one thing that I really hated about the M&P was the fact that it took a punch and a rubber hammer to detail strip and in comparison to the Glock, was complicated to switch out trigger parts. With the Glock even I can fine tune the trigger easily and quickly. With the M&P it would take hours of frustration to get the Apex trigger parts in the gun.

Bug Splat 02-05-2013 10:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sam (Post 10440266)
The one thing that I really hated about the M&P was the fact that it took a punch and a rubber hammer to detail strip and in comparison to the Glock, was complicated to switch out trigger parts. With the Glock even I can fine tune the trigger easily and quickly. With the M&P it would take hours of frustration to get the Apex trigger parts in the gun.

I was confused about this from day one. Why include a "punch" but make the pins a B**CH to get out? I really wish they spent a few more bucks and ditched the roll pins. Glock did it right IMO. You can get a punch that fits in the grip and you don't need a sledge hammer to get the pins out. Don't get me wrong I love the M&P line but they could have done a better job here.

To balance out the field I'll say that Glock should stop putting cheap plastic sights on their slides. Toughest pistol in the world and they put plastic sights on it. COME ON!

Each pistol has its Pro's and Con's. All are good in their own way.

Saym14 02-05-2013 10:18 PM

my top three inorder

1) PPQ
2) XDm
3) GLock

CA Gun Laws Suck 02-05-2013 10:21 PM

Glock
HK P7M8
XD
M&P

As always it comes down to what you like. I own them all except for the M&P which I have ran on the range and like but don't love it. From a selling stand point it goes Glock, XD, then M&P.

Born To Glock 02-05-2013 10:26 PM

1) Glock 19
2) Glock 26
3) Glock 17

Sam 02-05-2013 10:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bug Splat (Post 10440405)
I was confused about this from day one. Why include a "punch" but make the pins a B**CH to get out? I really wish they spent a few more bucks and ditched the roll pins. Glock did it right IMO. You can get a punch that fits in the grip and you don't need a sledge hammer to get the pins out. Don't get me wrong I love the M&P line but they could have done a better job here.

To balance out the field I'll say that Glock should stop putting cheap plastic sights on their slides. Toughest pistol in the world and they put plastic sights on it. COME ON!

Each pistol has its Pro's and Con's. All are good in their own way.

I'll personally take the stock plastic sights over the roll pins. No matter what night sights may come with a gun, I'll end up replacing them to my liking anyway.

ShooterStymie 02-05-2013 10:56 PM

We're supposed to take seriously the opinion of someone who puts pink accents on all their guns :rolleyes: Haha, just kidding.

This is obviously a personal preference thread but for me Glocks get a major demerit for ergonomics. The angle of the grip just isn't natural to me. I've heard a lot of people say "well, you get used to it, or you just need to learn", to which my response is, exactly. If it were natural you wouldn't need to learn or get used to it...it would just be, um, how do you say it, natural.

Other than that, no complaint with Glocks (well, also because they look funny:D), but in my experience they are very reliable. Of course, the XDs I've handled have been just as reliable, and more accurate (for me) to boot. 1 week to go until I get my very first XDM out of jail. Can't wait.

Xanatos 02-05-2013 11:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RollingCode3 (Post 10438177)
Glock- nice factory trigger - easy to work on, very cheap ($398 blue label) - huge aftermarket support. The Glock has a much lower bore axis too which means better recoil control. Cheap mags. It takes time to fall in love with the Glock platform. I used to hate them...Now I own 4 Glocks.

Like most polymer striker fired handguns, the trigger is crap. Less creep than most, but it's still present. Spongy like most striker triggers as well. Also inconsistent across models. Glock 19's have different trigger feels than a Glock 20. Large enough inconsistency that it's measurable with a trigger pull gauge. Bore axis is higher than M&P. Don't know how the hell you managed to mess up that measurement. Does tend to work out well for people with large to extra large hands. Otherwise generally points high. Even worse it's the only major production firearm that has a significantly different grip angle. People with any other sized hands will benefit greatly from a Robar or at home grip reduction. HUGE selection of aftermarket parts.

Quote:

Originally Posted by RollingCode3 (Post 10438177)
M&P---Great ergonomics . Accurate and reliable. Horrible trigger out of the box but I can live with that. Low bore axis.

Lowest bore axis out of the three. Trigger is pretty horrid out of the box. Lots of creep, gritty, and takes 2000-3000 rounds to finally break in to somewhat acceptable (as compared to most guns 500-1000 rounds). Can be replaced fairly easily with an Apex trigger kit which gives you a better trigger than any aftermarket Glock trigger I've found. One of the most ergonomic firearms due in part to the interchangeable back straps. Has a stainless steel chassis inside of the polymer making it stronger. Optional safety is value added and gives more options to the end user. Decent amount of aftermarket parts.
[/QUOTE]

Quote:

Originally Posted by RollingCode3 (Post 10438177)
PPQ---super accurate, great trigger. High bore axis. That causes lots of muzzle flip and slower follow up shots. Wather mags are EXPENSIVE and very hard to find.

Just about the best stock trigger outside a 1911. Insanely crisp for what it is, short and positive reset, and a good pull weight. Ergos are extremely similar to the P30 which is hailed as just about the most ergonomic firearm on the market. Great for small handed shooters since the magazine release doesn't require them to break their grip. Does take some getting used to unless you learned how to shoot handguns on a USP. Bore axis is the highest of the three. Magazines are expensive for the gun's market price and where it's trying to position itself, but is by no means farfetched.

Quote:

Originally Posted by RollingCode3 (Post 10438177)
(Out of 10)

Ergonomics:
GLock -8
M&P-9
Walther 8

Trigger:
Glock-9
M&P-8
Walther-10

Muzzle flip/bore axis:
Glock- 9
M&P-9
Walther-7

(Out of 10)

Ergonomics:
Glock - 8 (if you have oversized hands), most people 6
M&P - adjustability gives it an 8
Walther - 9, unless you've felt a 1911 or a P30, this will pretty much be the most comfortable gun you hold

Trigger:
Glock - 8
M&P - 5
Walther -10

Muzzle flip/bore axis:
Glock - 8
M&P - 9
Walther - 7

uhlan1 02-05-2013 11:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ShooterStymie (Post 10440725)
We're supposed to take seriously the opinion of someone who puts pink accents on all their guns :rolleyes: Haha, just kidding.

This is obviously a personal preference thread but for me Glocks get a major demerit for ergonomics. The angle of the grip just isn't natural to me. I've heard a lot of people say "well, you get used to it, or you just need to learn", to which my response is, exactly. If it were natural you wouldn't need to learn or get used to it...it would just be, um, how do you say it, natural.

Other than that, no complaint with Glocks (well, also because they look funny:D), but in my experience they are very reliable. Of course, the XDs I've handled have been just as reliable, and more accurate (for me) to boot. 1 week to go until I get my very first XDM out of jail. Can't wait.

I actually like how the OP dressed them out. They look sharp and show some individuality, stand out from the herd.
Congrats on the XDM.

justjeff 02-05-2013 11:33 PM

Xdm
Fnx
M&p after apex kit


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