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-   -   Recommend a safe? (http://www.calguns.net/calgunforum/showthread.php?t=690999)

trex65mil 01-29-2013 1:19 AM

Recommend a safe?
 
Hey guys, with tax season coming up, I'm expecting to get a refund and I was thinking of getting a safe with the money (if I can also convince my wife that is). I was hoping some of you might be able to give me some recommendations on what you've seen out there and what you like. Something I haven't seen very much of is a waterproof/resistant gun safe. I think if I got a big ol' safe I'd want to put some important papers in there too and if, god forbid, there was a fire or anything, I know they're fireproof to an extent, but when fire crews get there, they're gonna be hosing everything down. I'm looking for something in the 15-20 gun range. I'd appreciate it if you would just share some general knowledge you might have too (good brand, bad, different warranties) since I'm just starting to look around. Thanks.

1GunLover 01-29-2013 2:24 AM

Get a Cannon they make one of the best Safes and they have a lifetime warranty. They will replace the safe if any damage is caused by a burglery,fire,water damge,etc. They will come to your house and replace within 24hrs where other safe companies take weeks. If you ever had a fire you need to open the safe within 24-48hrs otherwise everything will rust and get ruined.

Rareform 01-29-2013 6:09 AM

I just up graded from a 22x30x60 liberty to a 30x42x72 liberty and couldn't be happier. Be sure to buy one bigger than you need today because you will need a bigger one later. I upgraded not because my first one was to small per say but when you put scopes on rifles you loose a lot of space and I went 72 tall because with long guns I lost a shelf that is used for papers and cameras. I am a fan of liberty I have an old canon that I inherited and it is best used as a cabinet but I'm sure they are better today.

joetotoroto 01-29-2013 6:19 AM

I recently ordered a Sturdy Safe. It comes in 7 Gauge steel compared to 10 Gauge and up from other companies. They are not cheap but they have a great warranty and reputation. Not sure if they are water resistant though.

flyte74 01-29-2013 10:28 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by trex65mil (Post 10354853)
Hey guys, with tax season coming up, I'm expecting to get a refund and I was thinking of getting a safe with the money (if I can also convince my wife that is). I was hoping some of you might be able to give me some recommendations on what you've seen out there and what you like. Something I haven't seen very much of is a waterproof/resistant gun safe. I think if I got a big ol' safe I'd want to put some important papers in there too and if, god forbid, there was a fire or anything, I know they're fireproof to an extent, but when fire crews get there, they're gonna be hosing everything down. I'm looking for something in the 15-20 gun range. I'd appreciate it if you would just share some general knowledge you might have too (good brand, bad, different warranties) since I'm just starting to look around. Thanks.

Lots of options out there, of course a lot depends on your budget. When I was looking I looked at Liberty, Canon, American Security, Stack On, Fort Knox, Winchester, .......just saying I looked at a lot of safes. I finally settled on a Canon. I wanted one with a manual lock, but I got a great deal at one of the Crossroads gun shows in Del Mar.

As far as worrying about waterproof/water resistance, I would not sweat it too much with a well built safe. In the event it is sprayed with water during fire supression, I don't think much water would be able to intrude. Not enough to really worry about.

Some things to take into consideration while looking:
Fire ratings are different. One safe may say 30 mins at 1800 degrees, while another may say 60 mins at 1200 degrees.
Weight. The heavier the better.
Pre-drilled anchor holes are a plus.
AC outlet for dehumidifier/lights.
Do you want manual or electronic lock. I recommend manual.
Warranty. All the big names have great replacement warranties.
Can you move the shelving around to customize configuration.
What are the shelves made out of. I've seen some of the lower priced ones bowing under the weight of a few boxes of ammo.


Get a bigger safe than you think you will need. Trust me.

SDM44 01-29-2013 10:35 AM

Having looked at a lot of safes in the past few months (before ultimately ordering my Amsec safe.... I had bought a Fort Knox Defender, but it didn't fit where it was going :p)

I would have bought Big Horn or Cannon or Sentry, had I not done any research. After doing my research, I will not buy any of those unless I'm buying one of their higher end models. The main things that turned me off were the construction and composite door. Just like the guy shows in the safe video (that's posted everywhere), just feel the difference in the door when you swing a Cannon or Big Horn door open compared to an Amsec or Fort Knox safe. Likewise, rock the safe a bit and see how heavy it feels. The heavier safes usually means more steel is used used.


Ultimately, it's up to you on what you want to get. But I always facepalm when I see people say "Get Cannon because it's the best" with no really good explanations as to why. Just listing off the specs, you will see other safes with similar or better specs for a few hundred bucks more. But again, it's your choice on what to get.

CJF 01-29-2013 1:04 PM

Do you have a budget in mind? Budget dictates quite a bit in any purchase, and safes are no exception. I believe many people subsribe to the buy once, cry once theory for this purchase as you should have it a LONG time.

With the above said, I'd suggest Sturdy Safes. I have yet to read or hear of anyone being anything but satisifed with this purchase.

CHIEFone 01-29-2013 1:34 PM

westcoastsafes.com in ontario

go bigger than you think you will need! alot of misc stuff ends up in there, important papers and things, heirlooms items, other collections (if applicable) etc etc

GringoBandito6136 01-29-2013 3:42 PM

+1 for Sturdy. I got mine with 5 gauge and the fire liner. Expensive. But built like a missile silo!! I'd get another if ever I filled this one up.

Sticka 01-29-2013 3:59 PM

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ltK-bDbADa8

trex65mil 01-29-2013 4:11 PM

I'm looking at spending $1,500 not much more. I live close to west coast safes an went by there but they were closed when I went by there. I'll have to go by again. Thanks for all the info guys. It looks like I have a lot to look at. Quick question maybe some of you can answer. Since they do have different fire ratings what would be a good baseline? Because honestly, I think just having a huge safe would deter anyone from trying to break into it. I'm not too concerned with safe crackers. The fire resistance of the safe is going to be the biggest concern for me.

billped 01-29-2013 4:44 PM

If you are going to store papers, remember that the fire rating on a gun safe doesn't really apply since it will get hot enough to char paper. Just buy a second smaller safe made for papers and put it inside. I have a Browning gun safe and on a shelf I put a sub-$50 FirstAlert fireproof safe.

The fireproof safe is also waterproof and up on a shelf. I figure that the combination of the gun safe and the internal fire safe will keep birth certificates and passports free from damage in even a really big and bad fire.

trex65mil 01-29-2013 6:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sticka (Post 10361126)

Thank you! There was a plethora of information in that video that took me half an hour to watch but would have probably taken me hours to scour the web on my own.

I'm looking at the Rhino 56 safe. Right in my price range and seems really well built. I'm also going to look at the Sturdy. Caught my eye as well. I think me and the wife are going to go down to west coast safe co and talk to a guy about the 2 safes. Anyone have experience with the Rhino?

A fireproof safe within the safe is an excellent idea. I didn't think of that before and it's an excellent idea.

Good point with the shelves bowing too, didn't think of that either.

Thanks for all the info guys. If you have any more wisdom to share, I'm here listening. :D

cduff 01-30-2013 8:23 AM

I recently bought an AMSEC BF7240 (Burglary-Fire; 72" high x 40" wide). It isn't cheap, something like $3,000, but I figure it is worth it given the value of the contents. There is a recent posting here in CALGUNS about a Browning safe that was sawed-open with a Sawzall, apparently easily; I think the takeaway from that is not to leave the safe out in the open where the sides can be easily accessed for sawing. No safe is breakin-proof, but I feel confident that the AMSEC with its 1/4" thick door and heavy-gauge side-walls are better than most. It also has a good fire-rating, but I'm building a cabinet around it with extra sheets of drywall to increase the rating and make access more difficult. I am very happy with it so-far.

spetsnaz 01-30-2013 8:27 AM

Costco.com

cduff 01-30-2013 8:32 AM

Here is the link on the Browning safe sawed-into: http://www.calguns.net/calgunforum/s...light=Browning

lilharcher 01-30-2013 9:18 AM

Yep, after doing extensive research, I had to pass on the Cannons and Big Horns sold at Costco too (initially my #1 choice prior to doing my research)......those are easy to attack by non-sophisticated burglers. Ultimately settled on a 72x40 Sun Welding Safe, manufactured in Simi Valley. Went with the Pony Express model....awesome large safe for the price ($1,800 show special for base model....these guys will work with you on price too). Added a bunch of upgrades including enhanced fire protection, lockbox (welded to safe...like a safe within a safe), etc. Check them out, 10 guage steel and all continuously welded....

Quote:

Originally Posted by SDM44 (Post 10357680)
Having looked at a lot of safes in the past few months (before ultimately ordering my Amsec safe.... I had bought a Fort Knox Defender, but it didn't fit where it was going :p)

I would have bought Big Horn or Cannon or Sentry, had I not done any research. After doing my research, I will not buy any of those unless I'm buying one of their higher end models. The main things that turned me off were the construction and composite door. Just like the guy shows in the safe video (that's posted everywhere), just feel the difference in the door when you swing a Cannon or Big Horn door open compared to an Amsec or Fort Knox safe. Likewise, rock the safe a bit and see how heavy it feels. The heavier safes usually means more steel is used used.


Ultimately, it's up to you on what you want to get. But I always facepalm when I see people say "Get Cannon because it's the best" with no really good explanations as to why. Just listing off the specs, you will see other safes with similar or better specs for a few hundred bucks more. But again, it's your choice on what to get.


trex65mil 01-30-2013 9:24 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by cduff (Post 10368054)
Here is the link on the Browning safe sawed-into: http://www.calguns.net/calgunforum/s...light=Browning

Wow. I saw some safes can be upgraded for a reasonable price where the body will be 1/4 steel for a reasonable price. What would be considered a decent thickness for security for the body?

cduff 01-30-2013 3:02 PM

The Browning Prosteel referenced above has 12GA body steel; so clearly that isn't enough. I've read you need 10GA at a minimum, but I can't imagine that sawing through 10GA with a diamond blade would be too much harder than as with 12GA.

I was wrong about the AMSEC BF having a 1/4" door; I just checked and it is actually 1/2". However the body walls are only 1/8" (~11 GA). The key has got to be to make it as difficult as possible for the thief to get sawing access to those walls, and force them to enter through that 1/2" thick door, such as placing it in a tight cupboard, up against concrete walls, etc.

I may be too paranoid, but I was also leery of buying something from Costco or online, because I didn't want some unknown guys in a truck delivering the safe to my door; A) Because I wanted it kept quiet from my neighbors, and B) Disreputable delivery people would now know you have a certain type of safe into the house, and could wait until you go away for work or the weekend, and hack at it at their leisure. It cost more to deliver and setup (~$250), but I bought from an established, bonded local security company with their own dedicated delivery people; that's not perfect, but better than the alternative I guess.

musick 01-30-2013 5:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by trex65mil (Post 10354853)
Hey guys, with tax season coming up, I'm expecting to get a refund and I was thinking of getting a safe with the money (if I can also convince my wife that is). I was hoping some of you might be able to give me some recommendations on what you've seen out there and what you like. Something I haven't seen very much of is a waterproof/resistant gun safe. I think if I got a big ol' safe I'd want to put some important papers in there too and if, god forbid, there was a fire or anything, I know they're fireproof to an extent, but when fire crews get there, they're gonna be hosing everything down. I'm looking for something in the 15-20 gun range. I'd appreciate it if you would just share some general knowledge you might have too (good brand, bad, different warranties) since I'm just starting to look around. Thanks.

Id recommend putting a value on what you plan to store in it, then buy a safe that is of equal value. High quality is expensive. If your collection merits it, I could not recommend any more highly than a Graffunder. I am in the process of saving for one and hope to have enough for one in another 3 or 4 years.

Ernydog 01-30-2013 7:08 PM

Try Sportsman Steel Safes there in Long Beach and make what ever you what. www.sportsmansteelsafes.com Ask for a guy need Ernie.

Jizo 01-30-2013 7:11 PM

Just bought a Liberty fatboy jr before the price hike. Great space and security for the money. If you have the money go with a nice 5/16" plate door safe or thicker. Superior safes makes some great options.

I figure at least it wont be a smash and grab like the safes u can buy at walmart which can be defeated quickly. The idea is to buy some time and deter your average thief.

trex65mil 01-30-2013 7:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by musick (Post 10373932)
Id recommend putting a value on what you plan to store in it, then buy a safe that is of equal value. High quality is expensive. If your collection merits it, I could not recommend any more highly than a Graffunder. I am in the process of saving for one and hope to have enough for one in another 3 or 4 years.

You have a good point. Right now my collection is worth about $3,500. But I'll want to put more things into it in the future as well as birth certificates SS cards etc.

as_rocketman 01-30-2013 8:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by cduff (Post 10367953)
I recently bought an AMSEC BF7240 (Burglary-Fire; 72" high x 40" wide). It isn't cheap, something like $3,000, but I figure it is worth it given the value of the contents.

Quote:

Originally Posted by cduff (Post 10372189)
I was wrong about the AMSEC BF having a 1/4" door; I just checked and it is actually 1/2". However the body walls are only 1/8" (~11 GA).

I too have a BF series. The front door is 1/2" plate. Sides are 11 gauge outer layer, with a 16 gauge inner that encloses a sandwich of cast material (think lightweight concrete/firebrick). This makes it rather annoying to hack into -- it's no substitute for half inch armor all round, but it's considerably stiffer than 11 gauge backed with gypsum fireboard. With respect to fire protection, it's one of the best layouts found among the consumer-grade RSC safes available.

For the value the OP is looking to protect or a bit more, this is an appropriate choice. You will pay a little extra for the AMSEC name and such but it is good quality, in the RSC class.

Other options in about this range -- there's Sturdy of course, you can get thicker metal for the same price, however theirs is not a composite and uses a different fire protection strategy (ceramic wool). Or you may be able to find a true B-rate, either used or imported, for similar cost.

Whatever you get, get it bolted down! :p

trex65mil 01-31-2013 7:12 PM

Well, I put down a deposit for a Superior Encore 22 safe. It only has the 12 gauge body but I plan on putting it in a corner so that eliminates one side and won't be able to pry the door. I'm working on the garage so when it comes in I plan on putting shelving/work bench around it to limit access to the remaining sides.

I can get the deposit back or put it towards another safe. Anything real bad to say about it before I pull the trigger all the way?

I know I'll need bigger in the future but I figure that this will do for now. When it's time to upgrade I can just sell this one or I can sell it back to West Coast Safes for 60% of the original price.

Also, I got the safe, dehumidifier, interior lighting, granite finish, taxes, shipping and installation for just under $1,700.

gwgn02 01-31-2013 9:55 PM

Amsec fills their walls with a cement/fireproof material. It not only adds weight and fire rating, but adds another layer of protection from saws and angle grinders. A Sawzal to a drywall lined safe is like a hot knife through butter.

subculture14 01-31-2013 11:14 PM

I have a Homeland Security brand safe. A small locally family owned business in Pico Rivera. After looking at dozens of companies and brands over about 6 months I went with them. I couldn't be happier. So happy I bought a second one last year. Check em out. Website is C R A P but good safes and lifetime warranty.

OC_Gunner 02-01-2013 8:48 AM

I recently went with an entry level Sun Welding safe myself. Very pleased. They will build to your specifications right here in California. Any size or feature they can accommodate. It's worth at least giving them a call to see what they can put together for you in your budget.

Also, as mentioned buy bigger than you need.

Thrashard340 02-01-2013 8:52 AM

+1 for Amsec.

I don't know where the OP is located, but if you are in the Bay Area, check out Security Safes in Hayward.

http://www.securitysafeusa.com/

This is where I bought my Amsec. They have a showroom and it's worth checking out and talking to the guys to help make an educated purchase. I checked them out a couple a times and did a lot of internet and forum research as well.

Barking Iron 02-01-2013 10:40 AM

Put one of these on it
 
Get a safe and put one of these on it. The RTD Rifle Rack is the only way to get the rifle out fast enough to make it viable for "Home Defense" Dean's safes are my favorite.

www.securerifle.com

wpage 02-01-2013 12:51 PM

Get several...
One for the garage.
One for the attic
One for the Basement

JDay 02-08-2013 9:30 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Barking Iron (Post 10391310)
Get a safe and put one of these on it. The RTD Rifle Rack is the only way to get the rifle out fast enough to make it viable for "Home Defense" Dean's safes are my favorite.

www.securerifle.com

No its not. Why would you lock your rifle on a rack in the safe?

Sent from my SGH-T999 using Tapatalk 2

Princexman 02-08-2013 9:40 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JDay (Post 10465774)
No its not. Why would you lock your rifle on a rack in the safe?

Sent from my SGH-T999 using Tapatalk 2

Lol. I was thinking the exact same thing!!


Sent from my iPhone 5 using Tapatalk

Motarded 02-08-2013 10:39 AM

I'm sure he isnt saying to mount that inside of the safe. Pretty easy to figure out guys. Seems like a pretty cool piece but without the armor plate, it looks like it would be pretty easy to remove the rifle by separating the upper and lower and sliding each piece out.


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