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-   -   Quick question on Gifting a Shotgun (http://www.calguns.net/calgunforum/showthread.php?t=653529)

BassNut 12-06-2012 10:26 PM

Quick question on Gifting a Shotgun
 
My 13 year old nephew just passed his hunter safety course. I want to buy him a shotgun for Xmas. Should I just put it in my Sisters name? and have her purchase it? (His Mom). I think that would be the easiest way for him to get it in his name when he turns 18. Thoughts?

Quiet 12-07-2012 5:56 AM

Your nephew is not considered "immediate family" under CA firearm laws [PC 16720].
Therefore, his grandparent or parent needs to be the person that gifts him the shotgun.

So, your sister (his mom) buys the shotgun and does the 4473/DROS + 10 day wait. After which she can give the shotgun to her son (your nephew), no paperwork required. [PC 27870] If she gives the shotgun to him after 01-01-2014, then he will need to be 18 or older and he will need to register it. [PC 27875]

If you buy the shotgun, then you will have to wait until he turns 18 and transfer it to him through a CA FFL dealer.



Penal Code 16720
As used in this part, "immediate family member" means either of the following relationships:
(a) Parent and child.
(b) Grandparent and grandchild.

Penal Code 27870
Section 27545 does not apply to the transfer of a firearm, other than a handgun, by gift, bequest, intestate succession, or other means from one individual to another, if both of the following requirements are satisfied:
(a) The transfer is infrequent, as defined in Section 16730.
(b) The transfer is between members of the same immediate family.
(c) This section shall remain in effect only until January 1, 2014, and as of that date is repealed, unless a later enacted statute, that is enacted before January 1, 2014, deletes or extends that date.

Penal Code 27875
Section 27545 does not apply to the transfer of a handgun, and commencing January 1, 2014, any firearm, by gift, bequest, intestate succession, or other means from one individual to another, if all of the following requirements are met:
(a) The transfer is infrequent, as defined in Section 16730.
(b) The transfer is between members of the same immediate family.
(c) Within 30 days of taking possession of the firearm, the person to whom it is transferred shall forward by prepaid mail, or deliver in person to the Department of Justice, a report that includes information concerning the individual taking possession of the firearm, how title was obtained and from whom, and a description of the firearm in question. The report forms that individuals complete pursuant to this section shall be provided to them by the Department of Justice.
(d) The person taking title to the firearm shall first obtain a handgun safety certificate, if the firearm is a handgun.
(e) The person receiving the firearm is 18 years of age or older.

BassNut 12-07-2012 9:04 AM

Thank you. I can buy it and "loan" it to him for an extended length of time though I believe. It will be like pulling teeth to get my sister to the gun store.

BassNut 12-07-2012 9:13 AM

Oh and wouldn't a brother to a sister be immediate family also? I mean WTH it's illegal to sleep with your sister. LoL

BassNut 12-07-2012 9:15 AM

So now I take it that I can buy it, give it to my Mom, his grandma, and then she can give it to him. Problem solved.

jaymz 12-07-2012 9:19 AM

Correct. For now anyway. Who knows what will change between now and his 18th birthday.

Wojtek 12-07-2012 10:46 PM

Its all about climbing up and down the family tree.

Quiet 12-08-2012 2:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BassNut (Post 9870167)
So now I take it that I can buy it, give it to my Mom, his grandma, and then she can give it to him. Problem solved.

However, your mom may like the shotgun so much that she can keep it for herself, since you gifted it to her and not your nephew.
If the gift is intend for your nephew, then gifting it this way would violate CA laws. [PC 27515]
So, gift is for your mom and not for your nephew.


Penal Code 27515
No person, corporation, or dealer shall sell, loan, or transfer a firearm to anyone whom the person, corporation, or dealer knows or has cause to believe is not the actual purchaser or transferee of the firearm, or to anyone who is not the one actually being loaned the firearm, if the person, corporation, or dealer has either of the following:
(a) Knowledge that the firearm is to be subsequently sold, loaned, or transferred to avoid the provisions of Section 27540 or 27545.
(b) Knowledge that the firearm is to be subsequently sold, loaned, or transferred to avoid the requirements of any exemption to the provisions of Section 27540 or 27545.

Quiet 12-08-2012 2:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BassNut (Post 9870099)
Thank you. I can buy it and "loan" it to him for an extended length of time though I believe. It will be like pulling teeth to get my sister to the gun store.

You can loan it to him infrequently and up to 30 days at a time. [PC 27880]


Penal Code 27880
Section 27545 does not apply to the loan of a firearm between persons who are personally known to each other, if all of the following requirements are satisfied:
(a) The loan is infrequent, as defined in Section 16730.
(b) The loan is for any lawful purpose.
(c) The loan does not exceed 30 days in duration.
(d) If the firearm is a handgun, the individual being loaned the handgun shall have a valid handgun safety certificate.

mrdd 12-08-2012 5:11 PM

There is also another law concerning the "structuring" of transfers with the intent to evade PC 27545 or the provisions of any of its exemptions:

27520. No person, corporation, or dealer shall acquire a firearm for the purpose of selling, loaning, or transferring the firearm, if the person, corporation, or dealer has either of the following:

(a) In the case of a dealer, intent to violate Section 27510 or 27540.
(b) In any other case, intent to avoid either of the following:
(1) The provisions of Section 27545.
(2) The requirements of any exemption to the provisions of Section 27545.

Moonshine 12-08-2012 10:01 PM

I remember when I was young and learning how to hunt I was always loaned a 20 gauge. But those were much more innocent times when you didn't have to worry about that 20 gauge becomming a banned "high power riot assault gun" before your 18th birthday and being barred from ever owning it :(


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