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-   -   Loss/Theft During Shipping (http://www.calguns.net/calgunforum/showthread.php?t=650790)

halifax 11-30-2012 2:05 PM

Loss/Theft During Shipping
 
Who is resposible for notifying the ATF (3310.11?) if a firearm is lost or stolen during shipment, the sending FFL or the receiving FFL?

Still waiting for a handgun to show up from the USPS but it wasn't at the post office where the attempted delivery notice said it would be. Not getting too excited yet, just curious.

CS Sports 11-30-2012 2:17 PM

It's only happened to me once (thank goodness), but I reported it as the sender.

Was kind of an odd experience, really. I first called ATF to clarify the procedure, they directed me to local LE. Local LE didn't really seem too concerned, and weren't even going to take a report until I pushed the issue.

After the process was completed, I got a phone call monthly from the ATF asking if the rifle had been recovered. That lasted about a year.

I know the rifle was stolen by a postal employee, as it was scanned into the sort facility and never scanned out. Hopefully that SOB gets caught with it some day and has his day ruined.

tenpercentfirearms 11-30-2012 2:36 PM

That is an interesting one. As far as property goes, when the item is sent, it belongs to the receiver. So if a dealer tried to report you to the ATF and demand you return something that you received, tell them to pound sand (I know this from experience).

However, what happens when you never receive it? Well for insurance reasons and credit card charge backs, it is not received until the shipper can show it was delivered.

I would probably ask the sender to report it stolen with the ATF since you never received it, how can you put it in your A&D? However, I would probably cooperate with the sender and see about filing a local report about it too.

When it boils down to it unless the sending FFL can prove it was signed and delivered, it isn't your responsibility. And as the sender, it isn't their fault so legally they just call the ATF and let them know. The crappy part is insurance and covering the loss.

halifax 11-30-2012 2:47 PM

The ATF Form 3310.11 seems to be for a firearm lost or stolen once it's in your inventory. I guess if it never made it into my inventory and it's no longer in the sender's inventory, we have a conundrum. I would think it's the sender's responsibility.

paul0660 11-30-2012 2:59 PM

Quote:

I would think it's the sender's responsibility.
Yes, the person who paid for the shipping. They have contract with the shipping company.

Too bad it is a company going belly up.

halifax 11-30-2012 3:28 PM

The mailman came and went again today with no packages. I decided to go back to the post office to have them look again. The first time the guy spent about ten minutes in the back looking for it and came back empty handed. This time the woman returned in less than a minute with it. Go figure!

308fan 11-30-2012 8:02 PM

Glad to hear that you got it Jim.

edgerly779 12-01-2012 6:17 AM

I filed a [police report on a win 101 shotgun that disappeared off the ups truck on 10/26/12 from Sylmar to Oaktree guns in Newhall. The ups just completed their investigation and the lapd started the other day. So far no answers. ATF not involved unless gun found. Local leos take report and investigate.

eltee 12-01-2012 8:12 AM

If USPS is used, be sure to file a report with the USPS Inspector Services. These guys pre-date the FBI and are tenacious federal agents. They are the ones you want looking for your stuff if it was stolen while in USPS custody. They're like the NCIS of the postal services. Theft of stuff in USPS care is a federal crime.

halifax 12-01-2012 8:35 AM

Now I see there is a specific form for loss/theft during transport:

Form 3310.6.

It doesn't seem to have the 48-hour deadline in it (or any other instructions).

paul0660 12-01-2012 8:38 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by halifax (Post 9824065)
The mailman came and went again today with no packages. I decided to go back to the post office to have them look again. The first time the guy spent about ten minutes in the back looking for it and came back empty handed. This time the woman returned in less than a minute with it. Go figure!

Hehe, no comment.

kemasa 12-01-2012 10:32 AM

There was a discussion of the last FFL newsletter, November 2012.

http://www.atf.gov/publications/newsletters/

Quote:

The reporting of these incidents is not required by regulation but is strongly recommended as a best business practice.
Strange, to say the least since the shipper's bound book says that it was shipped to the other FFL, but the other FFL would not really have a record that it was lost in transit.


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