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-   -   How would I go about getting a Range Master POST cert? (http://www.calguns.net/calgunforum/showthread.php?t=642713)

stilly 11-10-2012 7:41 PM

How would I go about getting a Range Master POST cert?
 
I live in the IE and I called Ben Clark Training Center and they did not want to allow me to enroll in a class for a POST Range Master cert. It is about a week long and a few hours a day I think. They said that I was not a Peace Officer at the time so I had to go elsewhere.

Are there any other places that are close or not too far (within 50 miles or so preferrably) that I can go to get this POST cert as a civilian?

P5Ret 11-10-2012 10:28 PM

Why would you want it? Most departments do their basic firearms training/quals in house, it is cheaper than hiring someone from outside. I don't think there is a specific "Range Master" course. When I took it it was firearms instructor and it was 2 weeks long. The updates and some specialized course beyond that were anywhere from 3 days to a week long. I don't think you will find anywhere that will allow you to take the course, not that there is anything confidential it is probably more a matter of liability should someone get hurt. You'd be better off taking the NRA classes, and I think they are less expensive also.

gschoelles 11-11-2012 4:52 AM

They want POST "Certificated" to Teach/Supervise POST "Certificated" personnel which seems pretty reasonable to me.

Else, GET you NRA credentials which are G2G everywhere else...

mixicus 11-11-2012 8:27 AM

The CA POST range master/firearms instructor courses (typically 40 or 80 hours) are usually restricted. You don't have to be a sworn officer but you do need a department's backing. I don't know of any POST instructor courses that a non-affiliated person (academy or department employee) can take. The NRA LEAD (law enforcement activities division), FLETC, and FBI instructor courses are similarly restricted.

I do know of some range masters at civilian ranges used by departments for training that have been through POST or other LE instructor courses. But again those people are 'affiliated' with a dept and had the dept vouch for them.

Tallship 11-11-2012 8:37 AM

What mixicus said. I teach at our Firearms Instructor course, and we do have civilians go through the course, but generally they are volunteers with a department.

Milspec714 11-11-2012 9:44 AM

that is a tough one... But Mix is pretty much on the dot...

solanoshooter 11-11-2012 2:51 PM

There is not a POST Range Master class. There used to be a Range Officer class but I don't think anyone is still teaching it.

The basic Firearms Instructor class is between 40-80 hours depending on who you take it through. When I went through the 80 Sac County class about 4 years ago there were a few non-sworn in the class but they all had a good reason for being there. A couple were affiliated with a security guard training center, don't remember why the other guys were there.



Current post classes and presenters.
http://catalog.post.ca.gov/

stilly 11-15-2012 10:32 PM

The POST class is actually called Firearms Instructor IIRC.

That is my problem. I have been shut out from one or two and the two e-mails I sent out got me no replies so I will be calling next week maybe. Corona wanted this for their range and I figured that since it paid OKAY (hey it is a job!) and I am a gun guy with a decent track record that maybe they would hire me and then get me into the class. I have several certs under my belt already so this one should be no problems. I was hoping to already have it before I submitted my info but I guess that did not happen. I might be able to get in with SBDoo but I have to call them. My ACO contact told me to give them a call because they let anyone take the classes there. LoL. I do not know if the NRA cert is valid since the city asked for POST specifically.

Alrighty then, so it looks like they might be able to get me into a class.

I did notic that SOME places had a 40 hour and some had an 80 hour. If it is the same class why are they different? Is it like chp academy vs normal police academy?

deadcoyote 11-16-2012 12:11 PM

I've been through the POST firearms instructor course and a couple re-certs with American River College in Sacramento. we had non-sworn guys in every class I've taken so far. Most were gun range employees and one was a guy who just runs a private shooting instructor business.

cowboykenny 11-23-2012 2:34 AM

I don't want any non law enforcement (sworn) people teaching any of our officers.

sleeper2020 11-23-2012 3:46 AM

cowboy thats a pretty negative view. There are plenty of people that have more experience with firearms and shoot no shoot scenarios then some peace officers, and they have never been a peace officer. just saying broaden your mind a bit and dont lose out on someone elses knowledge and skill just because you have some preconceived notions.

noticed i said some peace officers so dont get your knickers in a twist. plus remember this guy was a sworn peace officer http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MeGD7r6s-zU

cowboykenny 11-24-2012 6:51 PM

Sorry, you feel that way, But there is a lot more that goes with it than shoot no shoot. It takes someone who understands the LE job and the duties involved, to go with it.

solanoshooter 11-24-2012 6:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sleeper2020 (Post 9775614)
plus remember this guy was a sworn peace officer http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MeGD7r6s-zU

While I understand your point, Federal Agents are not sworn peace officers in California.

vintagearms 11-24-2012 7:30 PM

Most PD's have their own designated Range Master/Firearms Instructor and armorers. Its just easier sometimes to have everything in-house. Been there. Done that.

sleeper2020 11-26-2012 12:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by cowboykenny (Post 9784297)
Sorry, you feel that way, But there is a lot more that goes with it than shoot no shoot. It takes someone who understands the LE job and the duties involved, to go with it.

If we were talking about how to conduct a traffic stop, DV interview, or the force continuem I would agree with you. But we are not talking about that portion of the job, or at least I am not. I am talking about a non-sworn person teaching basic marksmenship, fireing from cover and concealment, selection of appropriate cover, fireing while on the move, weapons retention, combat weapons courses that require mag changes and round counts. Once proper marksmenship is handled and an individual can handle thier weapon under stress then your LE sworn officer takes what the student has learned and covers the LE aspects of it. There is no reason why a Marksmenship instructor HAS to be a sworn position. There is a reason that alot of firearms instructors are prior military. Just saying....

sleeper2020 11-26-2012 12:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by vintagearms (Post 9784538)
Most PD's have their own designated Range Master/Firearms Instructor and armorers. Its just easier sometimes to have everything in-house. Been there. Done that.

Thanks for the clarification. there are similar incidents with sworn officers but this was one that was the most memorable and on youtube. Especially as he was supposed to be teaching kids about gun safety lol.

Lugiahua 11-27-2012 12:45 AM

Seems that Stoic Ventures is running one of similar course, it's 9 full days long.
http://www.stoicventures.com/trainin...master-course/

mixicus 12-03-2012 10:26 AM

To the OP:

If you need the POST cert, make sure the course you take is 'POST approved' with a CA POST control number. Some courses may claim to be 'consistent with' or 'POST curriculum' but that is not the same if a dept requires a POST cert. Some instructors (maybe even POST certified themselves) may use material from a POST course and teach it on their own but that does not make for a certified course.

You can go to the CA POST website and look in the training section to confirm if a course/organization has a control number for that course.

stilly 12-03-2012 1:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mixicus (Post 9841840)
To the OP:

If you need the POST cert, make sure the course you take is 'POST approved' with a CA POST control number. Some courses may claim to be 'consistent with' or 'POST curriculum' but that is not the same if a dept requires a POST cert. Some instructors (maybe even POST certified themselves) may use material from a POST course and teach it on their own but that does not make for a certified course.

You can go to the CA POST website and look in the training section to confirm if a course/organization has a control number for that course.

Thanks. I ended up going there and seeing it. My next chance will be after the first of the new year. I think I will be giving SBD a call though because they might let me in. Even though I do not need it for a position anymore, I still want it because I think it might make me a half notch more marketable and what could it hurt to possibly meet some new folks and maybe new employer if I do not have a job by then. If it is being offered by a police department or sheriff's department it SHOULD be a legit class right? I will double check on a POST CA control number. That is good to keep in mind.

Thanks again!


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