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-   -   What "Non-Gun" Women Think of CCW? (http://www.calguns.net/calgunforum/showthread.php?t=636185)

SilverTauron 10-25-2012 4:28 PM

What "Non-Gun" Women Think of CCW?
 
To understand my question we must first delve into some history.

My last girlfriend was a latina from The Bronx. Yup, that Bronx. As such her exposure to firearms was limited and negative before meeting me. While she didn't tell me at the time, the girl thought that I was some kind of macho douchebag for "needing to carry a gun everywhere" .Apparently that impression went away when she observed that I was extremely safe with it, but nevertheless the fact stuck with me.

Several casual encounters since then have added to my confusion. An Obama/Biden supporter loved the fact I carried a pistol, and a first date went so bad she threatened to call the police on account of me legally carrying.

So to avoid pre-date labelling and uncomfortable encounters with LE in the future, it would help me greatly to understand what non-firearm associated women think of men who carry frequently, at least as a first impression.

Thanks in advance for intelligent contributions!;)

winnre 10-25-2012 4:31 PM

When I first met this one gal I owned no guns. Now I am married to her and own several guns and have a CCW. She asked why the change. I said, "Now I have something worth protecting."

kaligaran 10-25-2012 5:39 PM

From my personal experiences, 'non gun' women and 'non gun' men seem to have the same feelings and opinions about it.

The underlying ones being that the ccw holder is:
self-concious
afraid of the world
or
a control freak.


Obviously you want to bring up your interests when on a date to see if you mesh. BUT if you are experiencing these kinds of negative reactions, you don't have to tell them that you are carrying right this moment, if you sense a dislike for firearms. Just a thought, no offense intended. :)

Bugguts 10-25-2012 6:42 PM

Silver, I love ya' but I am gonna have to call shenanigans on you for this. This is a pro-gun forum so how many non-gun woman(or men for that matter) are you going to find on a gun forum to give an opinion? ;) LOL

Just teasin' ya' a bit.

My sister doesn't understand why I have a CCW or why I even own a gun. She's not against guns, she just doesn't get why I carry one.

safewaysecurity 10-25-2012 6:46 PM

Why do you tell girls that you carry a gun on the first date? Just don't even mention it. I wouldnt even mention it to friends. The less that know the better.

railgunner 10-25-2012 7:22 PM

Don't tell them it's a gun. Just tell them your happy to see them.

357MagGirl 10-25-2012 7:25 PM

If I met someone with one, I would be all "OMG how did you get one!?" Mostly because I would like to put my revolver in my backpack or purse once in a while without committing a felony.

Honestly though, I would feel a bit weird about my date wanting to carry everywhere. I'd love him having it if we were out for some nightlife, but for certain activities I would rather he leave it in his trunk unless he's a member of law enforcement.

winnre 10-25-2012 7:30 PM

Tackleberry is that you?

Bugguts 10-25-2012 7:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 357MagGirl (Post 9591938)
If I met someone with one, I would be all "OMG how did you get one!?" Mostly because I would like to put my revolver in my backpack or purse once in a while without committing a felony.

Honestly though, I would feel a bit weird about my date wanting to carry everywhere. I'd love him having it if we were out for some nightlife, but for certain activities I would rather he leave it in his trunk unless he's a member of law enforcement.

This is something I don't understand. A violent crime can happen any time in any place. Day, noon, night, Sunday brunch, getting your hair done etc. You can't predict it so how can you say "I'll only carry it when I THINK I'll need it" It's not like a condom that you know when you will be needing it.

movie zombie 10-25-2012 8:07 PM

Silver, imo, i think they have bought into the hype that guns all on their very own will attract bad guys. rather than thinking they are actually safer with you and your CCW, they look at it as being unsafe. they could question why you feel the necessity to conceal carry: did you wrong someone? are you LE? are you lying about having a legal permit and merely a thug?

what to do? take your time and let them get to know you. who you are and then why you carry. i think telling a woman on a first date without any discussion re self-defense is or prior friendship and knowledge is not going to work. i'm all for full disclosure. but sometimes its just better to take one's time and build trust first. i also believe that it is irresponsible to be telling people that one CCW's. it should be on a need to know basis only, imo.

don't know if that helps....probably not.

SilverTauron 10-25-2012 8:24 PM

Further clarification:I only told my dates about my CCW as circumstances demanded.My ex and I were Air Force,so before we left post I had to stop by the armory and sign out my carry piece.Kinda hard to avoid the topic.

Once I got out of the military,I discovered that no matter how concealed your weapon is from view,its not concealable from a frisky girl's touch."what's this...A GUN???!". From harsh experience I've discovered its a good idea to at least casually mention something about being armed before clothes start coming off.

Horton Fenty 10-25-2012 8:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kaligaran (Post 9591212)
From my personal experiences, 'non gun' women and 'non gun' men seem to have the same feelings and opinions about it.

The underlying ones being that the ccw holder is:
self-concious
afraid of the world
or
a control freak.


Obviously you want to bring up your interests when on a date to see if you mesh. BUT if you are experiencing these kinds of negative reactions, you don't have to tell them that you are carrying right this moment, if you sense a dislike for firearms. Just a thought, no offense intended. :)

Yep, agree with this. Non-gun people will give you the "Why?" and the "Well I guess, if it's important to you" looks.

Quote:

Originally Posted by SilverTauron (Post 9592406)
Further clarification:I only told my dates about my CCW as circumstances demanded.My ex and I were Air Force,so before we left post I had to stop by the armory and sign out my carry piece.Kinda hard to avoid the topic.

Once I got out of the military,I discovered that no matter how concealed your weapon is from view,its not concealable from a frisky girl's touch."what's this...A GUN???!". From harsh experience I've discovered its a good idea to at least casually mention something about being armed before clothes start coming off.

Funny but so true.

357MagGirl 10-25-2012 8:43 PM

Actually the reason I would worry about you carrying in all circumstances is because of the hassle LE will give you and by extension, myself. In some circumstances I'm more afraid of the police than the criminals. I'd worry about whether you were the type of individual who would exercise judgement in its use.
I chased away two thugs beating up my roommate outside our garage with a .22 rifle. My reward was having three officers point loaded handguns at me, kissing the concrete, being searched, handcuffed, put in the back of a police car, and questioned.

ElvenSoul 10-25-2012 8:48 PM

Ok here is my whacked out of the box idea :)

See your not connecting with women who are used to guns. Where could you find women who are used to guns. http://militarypenpal.tripod.com/

good luck

movie zombie 10-25-2012 9:04 PM

i agree re needing to disclose re the gun before the clothes come off....but perhaps the clothes coming off is happening to soon....
yeah, i know i know....
so your alternative is to disclose when you ask a woman out and if she's not ok with it you have a choice: leave it at home while with her or tell her you understand and walk away.
yeah, i know i know....
your other option is to ask women to go shooting for a first date and let the chips fall where they may.....

confusion and casual encounters were in one sentence.......i don't think its confusing at all. you CCW. casual encounters aren't working out for you because of it. you have two choices: 1-stop with the casual encounters and take your time to get to know someone who will then trust you and trust your reasons for CCW'ing when you tell her or 2-not CCW during casual encounters. choice is yours. which is more important? there is no right or wrong answer and only you can make the choice.

and i believe you've had enough "experience" to know when things are going to get frisky with a casual encounter and could stash your firearm with a simple 'excuse me, i'll be right back' before the clothing comes flying off.

Bugguts 10-25-2012 9:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by movie zombie (Post 9592732)
i agree re needing to disclose re the gun before the clothes come off....but perhaps the clothes coming off is happening to soon....
yeah, i know i know....
so your alternative is to disclose when you ask a woman out and if she's not ok with it you have a choice: leave it at home while with her or tell her you understand and walk away.
yeah, i know i know....
your other option is to ask women to go shooting for a first date and let the chips fall where they may.....

confusion and casual encounters were in one sentence.......i don't think its confusing at all. you CCW. casual encounters aren't working out for you because of it. you have two choices: 1-stop with the casual encounters and take your time to get to know someone who will then trust you and trust your reasons for CCW'ing when you tell her or 2-not CCW during casual encounters. choice is yours. which is more important? there is no right or wrong answer and only you can make the choice.

and i believe you've had enough "experience" to know when things are going to get frisky with a casual encounter and could stash your firearm with a simple 'excuse me, i'll be right back' before the clothing comes flying off.

You SOOO did not know me in my younger years! LMAO Then again, we used to go to the drive in(dating myself here) with extra clothes and randomly throw them out the windows just to make people wonder. You'd be surprised at the reaction of your neighboring car getting a bra thrown on his car... LMAO And I wonder why my kids are as twisted as they are....

CAL.BAR 10-25-2012 9:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bugguts (Post 9592148)
This is something I don't understand. A violent crime can happen any time in any place. Day, noon, night, Sunday brunch, getting your hair done etc. You can't predict it so how can you say "I'll only carry it when I THINK I'll need it" It's not like a condom that you know when you will be needing it.

Paranoid much? In my 42 years on this planet, I have never seen, much less experienced a violent crime. Your odds of needing a gun (in most areas) are so small as to make it laughable. (really! - check the stats) Now, having said that, I've carried a knife in my pocket since I was 14. (at least a knife is useful in every day life)

Bugguts 10-25-2012 9:17 PM

Not paranoid. My son was nearly killed in an attack at 15yrs old. My sister was raped. I've had violent crime happen to my family members and I will not be a victim.

Don't judge just because YOU yourself have never had anything happen to you. I'm glad nothing has ever happened to you in 42yrs but in my 43yrs, I've nearly lost a child due to a violent attack(at school I may add), my sister was raped and my mother was killed.

You should not judge what others have been through until you have seen it happen.

SilverTauron 10-25-2012 9:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by djandj (Post 9592818)
Paranoid much? In my 42 years on this planet, I have never seen, much less experienced a violent crime. Your odds of needing a gun (in most areas) are so small as to make it laughable. (really! - check the stats) Now, having said that, I've carried a knife in my pocket since I was 14. (at least a knife is useful in every day life)

Your presumption of my circumstances is even more laughable.


In my 25 years on this planet i've experienced two instances of attempted violent crime. Thanks to the presence of my firearm matters never got past the "attempted" stage.

movie zombie 10-25-2012 9:24 PM

thought you were older, Silver!
i mean that as a compliment: you've participated here in the Ladies Forum with a maturity that is lacking by many that are older than you.

CBlacksheep 10-25-2012 9:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bugguts (Post 9592854)
Not paranoid. My son was nearly killed in an attack at 15yrs old. My sister was raped. I've had violent crime happen to my family members and I will not be a victim.

When I am given a smug look or a nasty comment from a girl for even possessing firearms, I bring up family related issue as one of my primary reasons for it. I was not going to post, but what you said hit very close to home. Bless both of them.

Bugguts 10-25-2012 9:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CBlacksheep (Post 9592952)
When I am given a smug look or a nasty comment from a girl for even possessing firearms, I bring up family related issue as one of my primary reasons for it. I was not going to post, but what you said hit very close to home. Bless both of them.

Thank you. It feels so disrespectful for someone to say "Well it has never happened to me so you're just paranoid" I am glad it's never happened to anyone. I wouldn't wish it even on my worst enemy but to be told I am paranoid based on someone else's experience, is just disrespectful to the memory of my mother, my sister and my son.

Some people will just never get it and I feel sorry for them.

winnre 10-25-2012 9:39 PM

Easy way to break the news that you are armed -- take out your extra ammo first and put it on the table with your keys, etc. That'll prepare anyone for what's next. :-)

winnre 10-25-2012 9:41 PM

By the way my mother never liked guns. Reason? She was engaged to a guy in the Navy and one day the sailor brought a gun over to show her dad.

You know the rest. "Oh this is perfectly safe. It's not loaded."

BANG.

End of relationship! He was out on his ear. Then she met my Dad.

Bugguts 10-25-2012 9:46 PM

Silver, I too thought you to be much older for the maturity you show. At least my age and now I feel old. Damn you! LOL

Turbinator 10-25-2012 10:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by djandj (Post 9592818)
Paranoid much? In my 42 years on this planet, I have never seen, much less experienced a violent crime. Your odds of needing a gun (in most areas) are so small as to make it laughable. (really! - check the stats) Now, having said that, I've carried a knife in my pocket since I was 14. (at least a knife is useful in every day life)

Are you kidding me? I've never been the victim of violent crime (God forbid, fingers crossed, and knock on wood), but I still fear becoming a victim. As Bugguts said, it could happen anytime anywhere. I think only a fool says "it won't happen to me".

Turby

d33pt 10-25-2012 10:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by djandj (Post 9592818)
Paranoid much? In my 42 years on this planet, I have never seen, much less experienced a violent crime. Your odds of needing a gun (in most areas) are so small as to make it laughable. (really! - check the stats) Now, having said that, I've carried a knife in my pocket since I was 14. (at least a knife is useful in every day life)

that statement is what's laughable. have you heard of the saying "a gun is like a parachute. if you don't have one when you need it, you won't be needing one again." to call someone paranoid for carrying a tool to protect themselves is uncalled for. i don't know of anyone that's gotten hurt in a car accident. does that mean i should make fun of you for wearing your seatbelt?

BonnieB 10-26-2012 1:06 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by movie zombie (Post 9592732)
i agree re needing to disclose re the gun before the clothes come off....

Zombie's right, as Zombie often is! One of the worst surprises a girl can get is to encounter a weapon she didn't know was there. It can really freak you out.

This happened to me. As a younger woman, a thousand years ago, I met and started to date a really nice Viet Nam vet, who was then studying criminal justice at my college. I really should have guessed, but I was young and a little unworldly. On our first date, he reached out to kiss me, and I slid my arms around his waist, and whack ! right into his SOB carry gun. I jumped about 3 feet straight back, in one step, and came down yelling.

I think it would have gone much better if he would have mentioned carrying over cofee, when he asked me out the first time. Or if when he picked me up, he said, "You know, I'm carrying a gun tonight. It's legal and I want to be able to protect you if I have to, when we're downtown".

True story, really happened. I dated him for several years, and we wrangled about the carry piece all the time. For instance, when I wouldn't let him take it into the bedroom....:cool2:

If you didn't warn your girl, it's your fault. If you warned her and she still freaked out, it's her fault.

safewaysecurity 10-26-2012 2:16 AM

I think i have a solution. Ankle carry. I doubt she'll be feeling you up there. If the clothes come off then I'm sure youll be able to hide it. Keep it concealed and avoid the issue.

Horton Fenty 10-26-2012 6:44 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by djandj (Post 9592818)
Paranoid much? In my 42 years on this planet, I have never seen, much less experienced a violent crime. Your odds of needing a gun (in most areas) are so small as to make it laughable. (really! - check the stats) Now, having said that, I've carried a knife in my pocket since I was 14. (at least a knife is useful in every day life)

Seriously? You must be joking. That or at 42 you really need to get out more....oh and don't forget your pocket knife. :rolleyes:

Sunday 10-26-2012 8:35 AM

Some people more than others like to be victims.

jdogg2000 10-26-2012 8:47 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Horton Fenty (Post 9594506)
Seriously? You must be joking. That or at 42 you really need to get out more....oh and don't forget your pocket knife. :rolleyes:

I personally have not been the victim of violent crime... I grew up and have lived in areas that area considered to be good areas... But I have witnessed so many fights (the last was only a few weeks ago), our house was broken into when I was a kid, our car stolen another time and there have been multiple thefts from our cars over the years, 2 of my friends were raped, a different friend was assaulted in an attempted robbery in West LA, and a roommate of mine when I was living in La Jolla was attacked With a pipe when he got back to his car and found a perp trying to steal his radio. Oh, I forgot about my female coworker who has been robbed at gunpoint on the streets of NYC, had her parents' house in the Bay Area robbed while they locked her in the laundry room, and recently had her newly purchased condo in West LA burglarized by people who broke down her front door... I can only shake my head when the people I think would need CCWs the most are the biggest antis. Actually, my coworker wants to go to Front Sight now...

minichnk 10-26-2012 3:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by winnre (Post 9590674)
When I first met this one gal I owned no guns. Now I am married to her and own several guns and have a CCW. She asked why the change. I said, "Now I have something worth protecting."

How sweet!!

Well just the fact that your dating "frisky girl's touch" means that if she isnt aware she could end up pulling the trigger or something crazy. I would say the best way to solve this issue is talk about it honestly and openly. It is true that you never know when something is going to happen. Its not living in fear its living prepared in my opinion. If she dosent like guns you can 1) offer to teach her about them 2) dump her a**... :) Girls that are so quick to judge you may not be the best person to be with.

kaligaran 10-26-2012 4:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by djandj (Post 9592818)
Paranoid much? In my 42 years on this planet, I have never seen, much less experienced a violent crime. Your odds of needing a gun (in most areas) are so small as to make it laughable. (really! - check the stats) Now, having said that, I've carried a knife in my pocket since I was 14. (at least a knife is useful in every day life)

Checked the stats from the DOJ:
http://bjs.ojp.usdoj.gov/content/pub/pdf/cv11.pdf
(edited to update the link to 2011)

Apparently women (all races and ages included) have a 19.8% chance of being the victim of a violent crime in their lifetime... and that percentage is higher in the west of the country.
(edited to remove the stats from the older document)

What stats are you referring to?

Bugguts 10-26-2012 5:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kaligaran (Post 9597662)
Checked the stats from the DOJ:
http://bjs.ojp.usdoj.gov/content/pub/pdf/cv11.pdf
(edited to update the link to 2011)

Apparently women (all races and ages included) have a 19.8% chance of being the victim of a violent crime in their lifetime... and that percentage is higher in the west of the country.
(edited to remove the stats from the older document)

What stats are you referring to?

Thank you!

BonnieB 10-26-2012 6:52 PM

Slightly off topic, but just in case anyone is still unsure about carrying and whether that is paranoid: Please read the very first sticky in the Women's Forum "Almost carjacked" - by MrsKitty.

It's the first sticky for a reason. There have been endless posts here about carjacks, Walmart snatch-and-grabs, personal assaults, you name it. It's all real world, personal experiences.

And as we used to say in the 70's:

"It's not paranoia if they're really after you."

vision1214 10-27-2012 2:06 PM

djandj - I could probably go on for pages about your comments but I won't waste the time. You are a fool thinking crime some how passes you by and will never harm you.

Tell that to the 82 year old woman that lived alone and was brutally beated and raped. I believe that was the first time, in 82 years, crime ever touched her. You, my friend, live in a dream world.

What do you want to bet, he will be in line buying a gun the first time crime touches him? Wow, don't hurt me with that big bad pocket knife. lol

SilverTauron 10-27-2012 3:48 PM

Back to topic, what is it about an undisclosed firearm which upsets the ladyfolk?

Speaking from my own perspectives, if I found an M&P Shield on my lady friend's thigh I'd be rejoicing that she took responsibility for her defense , not upset that she never told me about being armed beforehand.

BonnieB 10-27-2012 4:13 PM

Silver, it's just being startled by something you didn't expect, on a relative stranger. Women are trained to be cautious from the time we are toddlers. It's hard enough to get in a car with a man you barely know. Then to bump into a weapon unexpectedly? Not reassuring.

It may be a gender thing, if so, so be it.

The best I can do for a simile is this: Suppose you asked a woman out, she agreed and then later in the heat of the moment you discovered that she was in the middle of transgender operations (male to female) that were not entirely complete. That is, if you suddenly and unexpectedly discovered a piece of anatomy you totally weren't expecting. Most men would flip, I think.

If you had been told beforehand, you might have chosen not to go on the date and that's your privilege, but you would have been in full command of the facts.

Give her the right to make an informed decision. Ask her out, if she agrees, then before the date say "Oh, by the way...". She may back out, maybe not, but you've let her make an informed decision, and no surprises.

movie zombie 10-28-2012 8:54 AM

in concurence with Bonnie: the woman has already put herself into a compromising situation with someone she doesn't know that well when she isolated herself with you, started getting frisky and the clothes started flying. finding your firearm makes her question.....no, makes her decide....that she made a bad decision and that despite your manners and good looks and obvious sex appeal that you may be the next serial killer. while you may rejoice, Silver, to find a holster strapped to her leg, she will not reciprocate because you're either a mobster or a criminal of one type or another and she is at risk of more than just a STD. conditioning in her experience of the world, urban myths, news stories, family advise all come into play that she is now in dangerous territory and needs to get out now. that is her self-defense mechanism.

either need to be upfront re the CCW status and perhaps not get dates, or run into a woman that freaks and calls the cops on you. find a way to handle it before the clothes start flying.


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