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-   -   On Duty Back-up Gun? (http://www.calguns.net/calgunforum/showthread.php?t=633352)

SinnerBoy 10-18-2012 2:45 PM

On Duty Back-up Gun?
 
Any recommendations for a back-up gun while on duty? Ankle or pocket holster? Primary gun is 1911 in .45. Thanks.

P5Ret 10-18-2012 3:02 PM

Depends on what the department authorizes. Ankle holsters have always been a pia for me, and I never liked them. I had a holster attached to my vest that worked well for me. To me holster choice was always personal, I did have the good fortune to work for a department that allowed our personal choice of holsters within reason.

mej16489 10-18-2012 4:12 PM

Pocket carry (weak side) S&W 442/642

Ron-Solo 10-18-2012 4:30 PM

For years I carried a S&W Model 60 Chief's Special 2" in either a pocket holster or ankle holster. Ankle holster wasn't secure enough for my liking and I know too many guys that it caused circulation issues in their leg. Later I carried a S&W 669 9mm in my pocket.

Stainless is the way to go for a BUG that will be in a pocket. I know a lot of guys that had rust problems with blued revolvers in their pocket.

The S&W "J" frame revolvers are well built and reliable.

Notorious 10-19-2012 6:41 AM

Off side pocket carry of either a J frame, LCP, or Taurus Slim. All are great pocket carry guns. Not a fan of ankle carry for duty.

ak_in_ca 10-19-2012 7:55 AM

Galco Ankle Glove with a SW 642 if you dont go that way Ive seen some guys wear an IWB under their sam brown so the handle is accessible.

yzernie 10-19-2012 8:05 AM

I don't dicuss in an open forum where I have it but either a Kahr PM9 or LCP or Beretta 21A.

CalCop 10-19-2012 8:29 AM

strong side front pocket carry Glock 27. Kahr or Beretta Nano if trying to go lighter.

Notorious 10-19-2012 9:02 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ak_in_ca (Post 9548377)
Galco Ankle Glove with a SW 642 if you dont go that way Ive seen some guys wear an IWB under their sam brown so the handle is accessible.

I used the ankle glove off duty with low cut shoes but with duty boots, you have to get the boot extension strap and you have to cut your pants extra wide like bell bottoms to get access. Just ugly.

SinnerBoy 10-19-2012 9:39 AM

Thanks everyone for the valuable advice.

retired 10-19-2012 1:42 PM

Like Ron, I carried the Smith as my backup gun and in my pants pocket. I never carried it in an ankle holster on duty. The reason I did not was due to knowing of two deputies who were involved in a fight with a suspect for their duty gun. They were unable to reach their ankle gun during the fight and only after fighting to their utmost, where they able to overcome the suspect and cuff them.

That was the day they both stop carrying on their ankle and as a result, I do not recommend them. Just my 2 cents.

Calm Down 10-19-2012 6:18 PM

S&W 340pd, Speer Gold Dot .357 158gr, off side cargo pocket.

Spdjunkie 10-19-2012 6:27 PM

Another Vote for:
- S&W J Frame Airweight: 642
w/ An Extra Speed Strip

^ Lightweight, Dependable, Alum. Frm /SS Barrel/Cyl.

003 10-19-2012 7:09 PM

The baby browning in .25 cal will fit inside a second cuff case. I carried one that way for years. My second set of cuffs was in my brief case on the front seat. Worked for me.

Armed24-7 10-19-2012 7:35 PM

I carry a hammerless S&W 2", 5 shot in my back pocket in a leather sleeve. Ankle holsters are hard to get to and if you have to run, you stand a fair chance of losing that gun. I use to carry two backups and I put the other one in my vest.

If you end up in a situation where you are going to need to use your backup, it will likely be because you are in a fight for your life and if that is the case, you will probably be making a contact shot. But many different scenarios are possible.

If you have someone on top of you and your backup is your only option, you want to be able to easily get to it. Same goes if you do not have someone on top of you. Try to think of every possibility when you make a decision onn where to keep your backup and what type of gun to use.

CalCop 10-19-2012 9:05 PM

Alot of you suggest support side carry instead of strong side. What is the advantage of support side?

Aceman58 10-19-2012 11:00 PM

I use to carry a Beretta 84F in a left holster in my vest under my left arm. It's 13 shots of .380 cal. or (9mm short) and one great shooting handgun.

Then I had a Beretta Mod. 70 .32 cal. in my center vest 8 shots for close up and personnel defense.

Now at my present position as a University Police, I don't carry any backup. Don't feel the need to at this present time. I hope that helps you out on making your decision, there are many good backup weapons, good luck.

chsk9 10-19-2012 11:31 PM

S&W 438 in support side cargo with reload speed strip.

ls2monaro 10-20-2012 4:15 AM

Whatever you choose please make sure you practice, practice, practice drawing and shooting your back up gun. I tried all three vest, ankle, and pocket with a stopwatch and ankle is by far the slowest and most impractical for me.

Many of us carry weak side for tactics, not sure i wanna say why on an open forum but you just have to find what works for you; Heck that's half the fun :)

SinnerBoy 10-20-2012 6:49 AM

Wow, thanks for everyone's input. Really appreciate it!

Crzy2bealive 10-20-2012 6:58 AM

Subscribed


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mej16489 10-20-2012 7:34 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CalCop (Post 9553198)
Alot of you suggest support side carry instead of strong side. What is the advantage of support side?

I'm not sure if statistics support it, but I think the most likely need for a BUG is because you're already in a retention fight over your strong-side primary.

SoCalDep 10-20-2012 7:36 AM

I''ve carried a S&W 342PD, Ruger SP101, Beretta 8045 Mini Cougar, S&W CS45, and most recently before I left patrol, a S&W M&P9C. I never ankle carried.

The smaller autos aren't too bad (especially the CS45) for backup carry in uniform pants, though I did have to move some gear around on my belt as my M&P hit my AR mag pouch when I sat in the car.

I have become a fan of Remora holsters...for both backup and off duty carry.

CalCop 10-20-2012 7:38 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mej16489 (Post 9554631)
I'm not sure if statistics support it, but I think the most likely need for a BUG is because you're already in a retention fight over your strong-side primary.

That makes sense. I was mistakenly picturing cross draw with strong hand...duh.

Notorious 10-20-2012 10:19 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CalCop (Post 9553198)
Alot of you suggest support side carry instead of strong side. What is the advantage of support side?

As already stated, if I have my strong side hand clamped on the butt of the gun to keep it inside the holster while some turd is trying to get it, my support hand is going inside the pocket to get the backup gun to shoot him to prevent that from happening.

Or if I am shooting my primary and it jams, I drop my support hand immediately to grab the backup gun so I can have it asap... my primary might still be in my right hand but I am not messing around and will want immediate access.

Also, and this is what I do the most and the most frequent use of the off side pocket carry for me, and it gives me a nice and warm and fuzzy feeling, is that when I am on a contact or backing someone up, and I feel the need to do so, I will have my support hand in my pocket, with a firm grip on the gun, ready to pull out to use immediately, but to the outside world, it just looks like I have my off hand in my pocket. Useful when you want to maintain a low key appearance but ready to go at a moment's notice, faster than you can get to your main gun sometimes.

Samuelx 10-20-2012 10:41 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ls2monaro (Post 9554241)
Whatever you choose please make sure you practice, practice, practice drawing and shooting your back up gun.

^^ THIS!!! Practice from all "regular" positions (standing, sitting, kneeling, prone, sitting in a chair, sitting in a car, etc) and freaked up positions in a fight (weapon retention, on your back, upside down, bad guy mounted, bad guy side control, bad guy in your guard, in a hallway, up against a wall, down on a couch, etc)

TrailerparkTrash 10-20-2012 12:49 PM

any S&W J-frame, but HAMMERLESS!!!!! Carry it in your pocket with a thin leather type holster to keep holes from forming in your pocket.

Also, I carry a 5-shot speedy loader on my Sam Browne too for my S&W model 642 airweight. (...that is when I am forced to wear a Sam Browne nowa days....).

A revolver can take so much more abuse than any semi auto carried in a pocket. A revolver doensn't need oil like a semi auto does. A revolver wont stop working due to pocket lint and body sweat that has accumulated dirt throughout the gun. Small semi autos are more prone to FTF's when covered in filth from being in a pocket every day.

For a revolver, if the bullet fails to fire and your primary hand is injured, your back up hand can simply pull the trigger on the wheel gun until a bullet goes bang. With a semi auto, you may need two hands to clear a malfunction/jam.

Again, for a BUG, a revolver is best. You can't beat the J-frames airweight models.

Triad 10-20-2012 4:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mej16489 (Post 9544221)
Pocket carry (weak side) S&W 442/642

Ditto

Notorious 10-20-2012 8:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TrailerparkTrash (Post 9556063)
Carry it in your pocket with a thin leather type holster to keep holes from forming in your pocket.

Mika pocket holsters FTW!

I think I had mine for more than a decade and it looks and works as good as day one.

I think he's still in business and LAPD Academy Store used to have a whole bin of them there so you don't have to order from his shop and wait forever.

SoCalDep 10-20-2012 8:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Notorious (Post 9558241)

I think he's still in business and LAPD Academy Store used to have a whole bin of them there so you don't have to order from his shop and wait forever.

That's where I got mine about ten years ago. I really like my Remora holsters, but the Mika is a really good holster as well.

CalCop 10-21-2012 10:10 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Notorious (Post 9555422)
As already stated, if I have my strong side hand clamped on the butt of the gun to keep it inside the holster while some turd is trying to get it, my support hand is going inside the pocket to get the backup gun to shoot him to prevent that from happening.

Or if I am shooting my primary and it jams, I drop my support hand immediately to grab the backup gun so I can have it asap... my primary might still be in my right hand but I am not messing around and will want immediate access.

Also, and this is what I do the most and the most frequent use of the off side pocket carry for me, and it gives me a nice and warm and fuzzy feeling, is that when I am on a contact or backing someone up, and I feel the need to do so, I will have my support hand in my pocket, with a firm grip on the gun, ready to pull out to use immediately, but to the outside world, it just looks like I have my off hand in my pocket. Useful when you want to maintain a low key appearance but ready to go at a moment's notice, faster than you can get to your main gun sometimes.

Good advice. I have been blessed to never have been in a fight for my gun (knock on wood). Your info makes great tactical sense. My favorite off-duty carry is also pocket carry, and I will keep that on my strong side. But, for the BUG, you guys have converted me to support side. I suppose I should've figured that out sooner...who knows, this forum may have just saved my life!

SinnerBoy 10-24-2012 2:34 PM

Thanks everyone! Based on your great input I'm thinking small revolver in weakside pocket.

eltee 10-24-2012 6:07 PM

If possible, go hammerless / shrouded hammer. I carried a J frame with a shrouded hammer, Model 49. On occasion, a tiny Beretta in a wallet style holster in a deep, rear pocket.

Notorious 10-24-2012 6:54 PM

I would go with the Bodyguard shrouded type instead of the Centennial hammerless type so you can still have the option of cocking it for single action if you really needed to. LAPD neutered theirs so the single action function was disabled on their Bodyguard revolvers though for liability. So sad... ruined a good pocket revolver.

d4v0s 10-24-2012 7:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SinnerBoy (Post 9543577)
Any recommendations for a back-up gun while on duty? Ankle or pocket holster? Primary gun is 1911 in .45. Thanks.

My favorite lately has been a XDS 45 in a custom kydex holster in my weak side pocket, or on my collar bone, inside my vest... Ankle holsters suck the first time you slam it on something.

But they are nice on hot days!

Notorious 10-24-2012 7:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by d4v0s (Post 9584745)
Ankle holsters suck the first time you slam it on something.

But they are nice on hot days!

Yes, ankle holsters work great with shorts!:chris:

d4v0s 10-24-2012 7:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Notorious (Post 9584754)
Yes, ankle holsters work great with shorts!:chris:

ha ha ha for me I wear pants, and a shirt on hottest days. Dont wear shorts ever if I carry!

But the kydex on my neck is nasty when its 105+. The ankle is much more comfortable in heat!

Notorious 10-24-2012 7:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by d4v0s (Post 9584792)
ha ha ha for me I wear pants, and a shirt on hottest days. Dont wear shorts ever if I carry!

But the kydex on my neck is nasty when its 105+. The ankle is much more comfortable in heat!

If I ever wore shorts, the gun either goes in the pocket or in a tuckable deep seated holster.

retired 10-24-2012 11:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by eltee (Post 9584338)
If possible, go hammerless / shrouded hammer. I carried a J frame with a shrouded hammer, Model 49. On occasion, a tiny Beretta in a wallet style holster in a deep, rear pocket.

As I said earlier, I used a S&W Model 60 bought in 1977. Some of you will probably cringe with what I say next, but I had the hammer bobbed by a gunsmith. Yes, I realized the original value is changed, but I had no intention of selling it. It never once in 15yrs. gave me any problem catching on my pants pocket. I of course kept it in a holster.

SinnerBoy 10-26-2012 8:19 AM

Man, the great advice keeps on coming. Can't thank you enough!!!


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