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-   -   Zeroing Iron Sight, Advice? (https://www.calguns.net/calgunforum/showthread.php?t=775553)

Raralith 06-08-2013 6:35 PM

Zeroing Iron Sight, Advice?
 
I finally took my new AR 15 to the outdoor range, and my wife and I had a hell of a hard time zeroing our iron sights. The ranges are hot for 30 minutes, and cold for 1 so by the 3rd or 4th try we were out of time. I've got a Troy rear fixed sights with an A2 front using PMC Bronze 223 for ammo. We set the target at 50 yards but my old cheapo binoculars given to me a decade ago couldn't spot anything. I'm thinking of just getting an inexpensive spotting scope (http://www.amazon.com/CO11502-20-60x...I3NJK7413VUG8W
?), but I don't know if this is the right route to take? Should I be doing this another way? Would it make sense to buy a decent $150ish scope, and use that to as a sight or somehow use that to zero in my iron sights? My thought is two birds, one stone. Honestly, not too sure what to do.

Fjold 06-08-2013 8:00 PM

Bring a second rifle with a scope on it and use it to spot the bullet holes from the iron sighted rifle.

EvolutionGSR 06-08-2013 8:01 PM

Buy shoot n c targets for a few bucks.

Raralith 06-08-2013 8:04 PM

I only have one rifle unfortunately. This is why I was thinking of buying a scope and essentially using it as a spotter until I made a second rifle. Is this the best route to take in my situation?

As for targets, are those the reactive ones? I'm going to grab a set, they are much easier on the eyes when I was at the pistol range; thanks for that.

Gromulin 06-08-2013 8:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by EvolutionGSR (Post 11542045)
Buy shoot n c targets for a few bucks.

This. Plus have someone spot you so you get real feedback.

Sheepdog1968 06-08-2013 8:22 PM

Shoot a 10 shot group. Wait till break then swap out a fresh target for yours and measure at leisure. If you need to see try zeroing at 25 yars first.

mark501w 06-09-2013 5:00 AM

Take the upper off pull bolt grp place on bags look down bore adjust sights. Buy spotting scope you'll need one anyway.

PrimaryArms 06-09-2013 7:49 AM

Bring glass and start at 25m/y
After you get irons dialed in get a compact scope. I recommend this
https://www.primaryarms.com/Primary_..._p/pa6xrbd.htm

This will allow you to zero once and never adjust again. The reticle does all the work and has proven amazingly accurate. Watch the demo video I am hitting center mass at 700 yards! People say great shooting but all I am doing is holding at 700 and 5mph wind.

Dimitri

IPSICK 06-09-2013 10:51 AM

OP, are you hitting paper at least?

Raralith 06-09-2013 11:41 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by IPSICK (Post 11545356)
OP, are you hitting paper at least?

Yes and no. There were hits on the paper, but I couldn't see from my binoculars so I don't know when or where hits were in terms of a 3 group shot. A spotting scope would probably help in this.

As far as I know, Burro Canyon doesn't allow targets less than 25 yards at the rifle range. I was hoping to do that and add in one click in elevation to get me to 50 yards, but that was a no go.

Ddar15 06-09-2013 5:13 PM

I recently sighted my new rifle and these are the steps i followed.

On 25 yards i took one shot aiming at the center and then i saw that the shot was on the paper but to the left and very low.

then I used the sighting tool to make sure that the front sight is aligned. It took me 4 shots to sight on 25 yards. then i moved to 50 yards. On 50 i took 2 shots to see if I am dead center and then moved to 100 yards.

negolien 06-09-2013 6:26 PM

It should be easy to get sighted really. Start out at 25 and see if your on paper. If not you have issues. The rear should be centered and the front should be low as possible. Shoot three shot groups and take your time shooting. Once you know you are on paper move out to 50 and make any adjustments to highth. The trajectory is pretty flat to 100 yards so you should be able to get close. The splater targets work well so use them. I also used an extra scope as a spotting scope lol.

EvolutionGSR 06-09-2013 6:45 PM

I see you are in SG. If you go up to Angeles shooting ranges you can rent a spotting scope and buy Shoot n C targets there.

Or if you happen to go on a day that I'm there I'd spot it for you.

Edit - but if you use Shoot N C's, you really don't need a spotting scope at 50 yards. http://www.amazon.com/Birchwood-Case...ords=shoot+n+c

PrimaryArms 06-09-2013 7:13 PM

Get close at 25 then
set your irons for 200 and dial in at 50 yards. 50/200 are very close.

Dimitri

Raralith 06-09-2013 7:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by EvolutionGSR (Post 11548543)
I see you are in SG. If you go up to Angeles shooting ranges you can rent a spotting scope and buy Shoot n C targets there.

Or if you happen to go on a day that I'm there I'd spot it for you.

Edit - but if you use Shoot N C's, you really don't need a spotting scope at 50 yards. http://www.amazon.com/Birchwood-Case...ords=shoot+n+c

I didn't know that they rented spotting scopes; I'm definitely going there now. Do you know what the minimum distance you can put targets in the rifle range?

EvolutionGSR 06-09-2013 8:34 PM

Ive set up a target at 10 yards to pattern a shotgun.

I still think if u just get a few sheets of shoot nc and set up at 25 first u wont need the spotting scope.

Germz 06-10-2013 2:20 AM

Won't immediately aid you in zeroing, but I'd invest in a decent adjustable rear sight. unless your range offers a 300yrd target lane, buy some 36yrd targets that simulate 300yrd. reason being, a bullet follows the same trajectory at 36yrd as it does at 300; which is good for zeroing in the sense you dont have to walk as far down range :P.

i personally advise against 25yrd zero targets. while it can be zero'd just fine at that range, at that point of the bullet's flight (specifically referring to .223/5.56) the bullet has not achieved suitable gyroscopic stabilization which can lead to mixed results. YMMV

BEST ANSWER: Get to a 300yrd range
EASY ANSWER: 25yrd targets will do just fine. Especially for weekend warrior missions :gunsmilie:
QUICK FIX FOR THE OCD:
If all you have available is 36yrd targets at a 25yrd range , this is the best way I can explain it to get a "rough" 300yrd zero.
put a 36yrd target at the 25yrd line. zero your POI to 0.75" - 1" below Center. That will produce roughly the same results as hitting dead center on a 36yrd target at 36yrd.

p.s using meters and yards interchangeably isnt providing accurate information. while negligable in short distances, it is drastic at long range. 300m = ~328.1yrds; a lot of deviation (in regards to accuracy) can occur over 84.25 feet.

HighLander51 06-10-2013 5:04 AM

36/300 yard zero is commonly used for 3 gun. It gives about a 10" window out to 350 yards. I keep this chart taped on the butt stock to refer to hold.

http://www.californiavtxriders.com/p...image35433.jpg

HighLander51 06-10-2013 5:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by PrimaryArms (Post 11544282)
Bring glass and start at 25m/y
After you get irons dialed in get a compact scope. I recommend this
https://www.primaryarms.com/Primary_..._p/pa6xrbd.htm

This will allow you to zero once and never adjust again. The reticle does all the work and has proven amazingly accurate. Watch the demo video I am hitting center mass at 700 yards! People say great shooting but all I am doing is holding at 700 and 5mph wind.

Dimitri

That is really impressive for a $200 scope. What trigger are you running on that AR? I struggle with my $800 Trijicon 3-9 at 600 yards on a full size USPSA target from a sand bagged bench. Where do you shoot 3 gun at?

Raralith 06-10-2013 6:34 PM

Thanks for the advice everyone. I bought a "Caldwell Lead Sled Solo" from Turner's since it's 35% off for Father's Day. I'm heading to Angeles this Friday, and I'm going to be buying those reactive shooting targets. If I need to, I'll rent a spotting scope too. I'll start at 25 yards, and aim roughly 0.7 inches below dead center which should be dead center for 50 yards using 55 grain 223 ammo.

ocabj 06-10-2013 6:47 PM

If you can, use a big target, e.g. 4'x4' board.

Set it at 50 yards.

Take the upper off the lower. Take out the bolt carrier group.

Set the upper on the bench with bags and/or rest and fix the upper so when you look down the bore it is lined up with the target. Adjust your sights. When the sights and bore line are both about on target, slap the upper on the lower, toss in a round and fire. You should be on paper/board. Adjust windage until center. Adjust elevation until center.

Done.

Now you can adjust for longer distance.

Raralith 06-10-2013 7:24 PM

That's a good way to start, especially since I'll probably have to wait until the range goes cold. How flat does the 223 shoot at 50 yards? Can anyone recommend me a good ballistics calculator? Been just using the Winchester general app.

SuperSet 06-10-2013 7:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Raralith (Post 11556099)
Thanks for the advice everyone. I bought a "Caldwell Lead Sled Solo" from Turner's since it's 35% off for Father's Day. I'm heading to Angeles this Friday, and I'm going to be buying those reactive shooting targets. If I need to, I'll rent a spotting scope too. I'll start at 25 yards, and aim roughly 0.7 inches below dead center which should be dead center for 50 yards using 55 grain 223 ammo.

Your verbiage is a little confusing.
You don't aim below dead center to achieve a 50y zero. Aim at the center of the 25y target and adjust your sights until your hits are 1.25" below dead center. Then move to 50y and aim at dead center again and your hits will be close to center. Fine tune from there.

yankee-pete 06-10-2013 7:41 PM

Have you tried one of those laser bore sighters? They can be found on ebay for less than $20. Use that at 25 yards to zero in. Then move to 50 yards and make slight adjustments, continue to move out to desired distance from there.


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